DePaul Purchasing Riverfront Property

[RJax55]

If its so darned important to have a strong Chicago presence in the Big East, why not just invite Loyola?  They could be just as much a sleeping giant as DePaul.

DePaul has a good conference, but needs a new on-campus facility--which could be years away.
Loyola has an on-campus facility, but needs a better conference, which could be fixed much faster.

--Like DePaul, Loyola is located in Chicago, and has a large body of influential local alums.
--Like DePaul, Loyola has struggled on court for years.
--Like DePaul, Loyola has a strong basketball history and is a former NCAA champion
--Similar to DePaul, is the 3rd largest Catholic University in the US (behind only DePaul & St. Johns)
--Per US News, Loyola is rated slightly better and has a larger endowment.

Because they already have an on-campus facility that could be used for at least some of their games, they may well have a faster path to relevance that DePaul--the only thing they lack is a quality confererence.  A Big East invitation could fix that.

You have to believe that the Big East would provide an immediate recruiting boost to Loyola, immedeately raise their stature, and enable them to hire a better coach.  Thus they might offer the league a much faster path to success than the 3 to 5 years it would take to get a new facility built for DePaul.

And the worst that could happen is that they match DePaul in terms of futility.

Loyola doesn't have a strong basketball history. In the modern era, they have made the tournament once (1985). For the most part, they have struggled in the Horizon league, even though they should be at advantage being in Chicago.

Secondly, their new on-campus facility is not a suitable place for Big East games. It's nice, but in the renovating it, they cut the overall seating capacity.

Lastly, Loyola doesn't have the fan base to support such a move. Even though DePaul's attendance has been poor, their season ticket base is still much, much larger than Loyola's.   

[Hitman]

Really, Erie PA has it beat.

hahaha, I'm not sure anyone else got this, but that's pretty funny. The mistake by the lake!

[dpucane]

It would be maybe a decade before Loyola could even be in the conversation. Their lakefront campus is great, but it is  still in a "dull" area to say the least. Most Loyola students go to Lincoln Park at night and even live their. However, there is talk of renovating the area north of Wrigleyville up to the Loyala area (Edgewater, Rogers Park, Andersonville).   That would take a while, but Loyola could have a chance if it happened

[The Equalizer]

Loyola doesn't have a strong basketball history. In the modern era, they have made the tournament once (1985). For the most part, they have struggled in the Horizon league, even though they should be at advantage being in Chicago.

I think you confuse history with present.  I didn't say Loyola was strong now.  But they can build on the heritage that includes a national championship.

The glory days of both Loyola (1963 championship) and DePaul (1979 final four through early 1980's) occurred long before today's students were born.

Secondly, their new on-campus facility is not a suitable place for Big East games. It's nice, but in the renovating it, they cut the overall seating capacity.

Their facility is simliar in nature and only slightly smaller than St. John's Carnesecca Arena and Villanova's Pavillion.  They could always move big games to the United Center, like St. John's and Villanova do.

Lastly, Loyola doesn't have the fan base to support such a move. Even though DePaul's attendance has been poor, their season ticket base is still much, much larger than Loyola's.   

Do you think that might have something to do with the conference affiliation of each team? 

DePaul gets to sell UConn, Villanova, Georgetown, Marquette, and Notre Dame.  Loyola gets to sell Youngstown State, Wright State and Cleveland State, UWM and Butler.

Something tells me that if Loyola had DePaul's schedule, they just might be able to grow that season ticket base.

[damuts222]

  My fiance goes to Loyola and we live in Edgewater. There has been no interest in Loyola basketball for decades. I would guarantee that Loyola alums don't have fond memories of their program nor have any interest in it.
  Most Loyola students, as stated previously, live away from campus in Lincoln Park because there's no nightlife and its not the safest area. Depaul has a much better shot and with an inkling of life back in the program will rise quickly IMO.

[GGGG]

It is really grasping at straws to suggest that Loyola could be a better, much less equal alternative to DePaul in Chicago.  MU spent $10.3 million on basketball last year.  DePaul, who is considered "cheap," spent $6.4 million.  Loyola spent $1.7 million.

They just aren't going to make the investment.  It's not as important to them.

[Ellenson Guerrero]

Equalizer reaffirming my conclusion that he is the dumbest person on this board. I'm actually hoping that he is just trying to see what reactions he can get out of people on this board, and not actually out in the world destroying the reputational value of my MU degree.

Your supposed logic in making this argument was that if the BEast wanted a strong Catholic school in Chicago we should go after Loyola. Yet, in making your case for Loyola you were unable to point to one advantage that Loyola has over DePaul. Right now DePaul doesn't even deserve its seat at the table, and Loyola is still 5 rungs below them.

Yes, moving to the BEast would help Loyola increase alumni interest... but it would also help Chicago State. The question is what the program offers to the Big East, not vice versa.

I think when referencing possible conference additions, the appropriate question to ask is how many students will show up on Tuesday night the week before mid-terms to see the game. That way we can preemptively fight off blow ups on this board.

[77fan88warrior]

Not to mention that it would be a nice venue for concerts and other events that would find the United Center to be too large.  As a suburbanite, I would find the location just off the Kennedy to be quite attractive.

A 10k seat arena would be great for that area and suburbanites could easily make trip for Sat. afternoon games. People would also be willing to hang downtown and go to games after work.
DePaul will be relevant again if they pull this off. They sold out the Horizon when they they first moved out there. The UCLA-DePaul was one of the biggest games every season and DePaul was the reason Rosemont was able to build the Horizon.
A stronger DePaul only helps the rivalry and strengthens our position with all this conference jumping. DP strengthening wouldn't hurt our recruiting as long as we have someone like Buzz. It could actually strengthen our recruiting if the Big East becomes more attractive to Chicago kids if DePaul re-awakened. They could be near home but not at home.

[Lennys Tap]

Someone really suggested Loyola to the Big East? Really? Doubt anybody can top that one.

[wyzgy]

I heard from a strong source that DePaul is close to purchasing riverfront property from Morton Salt Co. The property is near Lincoln Park and the Clybourn Metra stop and the Kennedy. It is perfect for an on campus basketball facility. Near transportation hubs, river, Lincoln Park and Bucktown. A sleeping giant may be stirring from its slumber.

Those are the only details I have.

sorry but the facility does not a team make.  just as the school building does not teach da kids

[jsglow]

It is really grasping at straws to suggest that Loyola could be a better, much less equal alternative to DePaul in Chicago.  MU spent $10.3 million on basketball last year.  DePaul, who is considered "cheap," spent $6.4 million.  Loyola spent $1.7 million.

They just aren't going to make the investment.  It's not as important to them.

Agree Sultan.  If Loyola increased their commitment modestly, they might be able to be somewhat competitive in the Horizon.  And back 15 years ago it might have been a decent place for Mike Deane to take his 'occasional tournament' conversation.

[MarsupialMadness]

DePaul needs a lot more than a new facility to resurrect it's program... but it's a start.

[The Equalizer]

Equalizer reaffirming my conclusion that he is the dumbest person on this board. I'm actually hoping that he is just trying to see what reactions he can get out of people on this board, and not actually out in the world destroying the reputational value of my MU degree.

So, your best counterargument amounts to little more than a personal attack.  Speaks volumes about your lack of character and intellect.  You're destroying your reputational value all on your own.

Let's go back to the original argument--others are suggesting that the only thing that DePaul needs to begin bringing something to the Big East is a new arena.

I'm merely pointing out that if an on-campus arena were sufficient, then we can get there a lot faster by bringing in Loyola.  Otherwise both programs have a similar profile.

Your supposed logic in making this argument was that if the BEast wanted a strong Catholic school in Chicago we should go after Loyola. Yet, in making your case for Loyola you were unable to point to one advantage that Loyola has over DePaul. Right now DePaul doesn't even deserve its seat at the table, and Loyola is still 5 rungs below them.

I very specifically pointed to the on-campus arena, which Loyola currently has, and DePaul has lacked for over 30 years.

I'm not going to dispute that Loyola is 5 rungs below DePaul--I'm suggesting that all five rungs of that are due to them being in the Horizon and DePaul in the Big East.  Change the league affilliations, and that difference is elimanted. 

[GGGG]

I'm not going to dispute that Loyola is 5 rungs below DePaul--I'm suggesting that all five rungs of that are due to them being in the Horizon and DePaul in the Big East.  Change the league affilliations, and that difference is elimanted.   

So you are going to ignore the fact that I pointed out that DePaul currently spends 3-4 times more on basketball than Loyola does each year?  And that DePaul spends only about 60% what Marquette does?

It is more than conference affiliation that matters.  Its about the investment into the program.

[RJax55]

So, your best counterargument amounts to little more than a personal attack.  Speaks volumes about your lack of character and intellect.  You're destroying your reputational value all on your own.

Let's go back to the original argument--others are suggesting that the only thing that DePaul needs to begin bringing something to the Big East is a new arena.

I'm merely pointing out that if an on-campus arena were sufficient, then we can get there a lot faster by bringing in Loyola.  Otherwise both programs have a similar profile.

I very specifically pointed to the on-campus arena, which Loyola currently has, and DePaul has lacked for over 30 years.

I'm not going to dispute that Loyola is 5 rungs below DePaul--I'm suggesting that all five rungs of that are due to them being in the Horizon and DePaul in the Big East.  Change the league affilliations, and that difference is elimanted. 

84, DePaul has the McGrath on-campus arena, it was built in 2000.

http://www.depaulbluedemons.com/facilities/depa-facilities.html#wbbvb

Also, it is going to a lot more than simply a switch in conference affiliation for Loyola to equal DePaul.

[warriorchick]

84, DePaul has the McGrath on-campus arena, it was built in 2000.

http://www.depaulbluedemons.com/facilities/depa-facilities.html#wbbvb

From the pictures, it looks like that facility might be about the size of the arena in The Al.  Not a place to play men's BEast basketball.

[Avenue Commons]

From the pictures, it looks like that facility might be about the size of the arena in The Al.  Not a place to play men's BEast basketball.

Did you read the title of the thread? No one is saying Big East games would be played at McGrath.

[The Equalizer]

So you are going to ignore the fact that I pointed out that DePaul currently spends 3-4 times more on basketball than Loyola does each year?  And that DePaul spends only about 60% what Marquette does?

It is more than conference affiliation that matters.  Its about the investment into the program.

No, I'm not ignoring you.

You tell me first,
How much of the funding difference is based on the difference in league money available.  I'm pretty sure MU gets a bigger check from the Big East than Loyola gets from the Horizon.

How much is based on revenue difference by having better opponents to market?  Do you think you'd be able to sell more season tickets at a higher price if you were offering Notre Dame, Marquette, UConn, etc., or Youngstown State, Cleveland State and UWM?

How much of it is willingness to invest based on current league affiliation?  Think about it.  MU wouldn't spend $10 million/year if we were in the Horizon, nor would DePaul spend $6 million.

Loyola's spending is directly tied to their revenue, which is directly tied to their conference affililation.  Its not worth it to them to increase their spending as long as they're in the Horizon. 

It would be a different story if they had a chance to be in the Big East.

[RJax55]

From the pictures, it looks like that facility might be about the size of the arena in The Al.  Not a place to play men's BEast basketball.

Correct, I too wouldn't consider it to be a facility to play Big East basketball in.

I brought it up to counter 84's argument that Loyola has an on-campus arena and DePaul doesn't. That's not true. Loyola has the Gentile Center and DePaul has the McGrath arena.

[GGGG]

I think these are ridiculous assumptions.  Yes, the Big East is more lucrative than the Horizon and yes you could probably sell tickets at a higher price.  However, you theory seems to be that conference affiliation can lift any program from the doldrums and thrust them into the top level of college basketball.  

It doesn't work that way.  DePaul is part of the Big East BECAUSE it has dedicated to spend $6.4 million on basketball.  Yeah, some of that is provided by their membership, but mostly its because it allocates the resources to do so.  Loyola, for whatever reason, doesn't want to make that commitment.  Perhaps it doesn't have the resources...perhaps it doesn't feel its in its mission to do so...perhaps their constituents don't really care.

I mean, according to your theory, UWM could be substituted for MU in the Big East, and the two schools would simply trade places.

[The Equalizer]

Also, it is going to a lot more than simply a switch in conference affiliation for Loyola to equal DePaul.

Clearly Loyola would have to be committed.  But I disagree that if they were they couldn't ultimately be as strong if not stronger than DePaul.  

Depaul has been struggling for over 20 years, and has had every conference affiliation advantage we have.  They've squandered it all and yet people still talk like they're just one step away from relevance.  

[wildbill sb]

Equalizer reaffirming my conclusion that he is the dumbest person on this board. I'm actually hoping that he is just trying to see what reactions he can get out of people on this board, and not actually out in the world destroying the reputational value of my MU degree.[/color]

It seems to me that any poster that resorts to name-calling cheapens only his degree from MU.

[77ncaachamps]

I'll believe it when I see it.

[warriorchick]

Did you read the title of the thread? No one is saying Big East games would be played at McGrath.

I was pointing out that to the person who posted that info that the fact that they currently have an onsite facility is irrelevant.

Correct, I too wouldn't consider it to be a facility to play Big East basketball in.

I brought it up to counter 84's argument that Loyola has an on-campus arena and DePaul doesn't. That's not true. Loyola has the Gentile Center and DePaul has the McGrath arena.

The difference is that Loyola plays their games in the Joe Gentile.

[Blue Horseshoe]

I heard from a strong source that

Since this thread is now 3 pages deep, can we get anymore information about this "strong source." Under what circumstances is this person is this person qualified to be giving information.