Wait ... so we might play Norfolk again?

[nathanziarek]

If we beat Ole Miss and Norfolk takes out TCU, we would end up playing Norfolk St. twice in 7 days? That seems ... odd to me. Am I not reading this right?

http://www.paradisejam.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/2011-mens-bracket-paradise-jam1.pdf

[brewcity77]

You're reading it right. No one really expected Norfolk would beat Virginia, so the odds of us playing them twice didn't seem very likely.

[nathanziarek]

Are there other tournaments set up like this? Where the loser of the opening round games re-enters the tournament for payback?

Instead of the NCAA tournament expending to 4 opening round games, they should have followed this model. After the sweet 16, randomly re-seed 8 teams that already lost to give them another shot

[tower912]

So is Norfolk actually pretty good, or is Virginia bad?    I hope this means that Norfolk is a mid-major beast and that WE are that good.

[muguru]

You're reading it right. No one really expected Norfolk would beat Virginia, so the odds of us playing them twice didn't seem very likely.

Norfolk didn't beat Virginia, they beat Drexel. But either way, no one expected that either.

[Jay Bee]

Are there other tournaments set up like this? Where the loser of the opening round games re-enters the tournament for payback?

Instead of the NCAA tournament expending to 4 opening round games, they should have followed this model. After the sweet 16, randomly re-seed 8 teams that already lost to give them another shot

They don't "re-enter" the tournament.  Preliminary games are part of the tourney, but not bracket play.  If a school doesn't play in a qualifying regular season multiple-team event, they can schedule a max of 29 games.
If a school plays in an qualifying event, they can schedule 27 games + the games in the event, up to a max of four.  Because bracket play is only 3 games, adding a prelim game (which has certain requirements, including that the event can't last longer than 14 days) gets teams up to their absolute maximum scheduled games.  

Is it silly?  Yep.  But, it's not uncommon. Marquette and Norfolk State's situation is not at all unique.

[brewcity77]

Norfolk didn't beat Virginia, they beat Drexel. But either way, no one expected that either.

Erm...all the more reason Norfolk beating UVa would be unexpected? LOL. Too many upsets yesterday, couldn't keep them all straight

[Brewtown Andy]

They don't "re-enter" the tournament.  Preliminary games are part of the tourney, but not bracket play.  If a school doesn't play in a qualifying regular season multiple-team event, they can schedule a max of 29 games.
If a school plays in an qualifying event, they can schedule 27 games + the games in the event, up to a max of four.  Because bracket play is only 3 games, adding a prelim game (which has certain requirements, including that the event can't last longer than 14 days) gets teams up to their absolute maximum scheduled games.  

Is it silly?  Yep.  But, it's not uncommon. Marquette and Norfolk State's situation is not at all unique.

Not entirely unlike the CBE games that Marquette played at the BC last year that didn't affect their trip to Kansas City.

[T-Bone]

Posted in another thread:
http://kenpom.com/blog/index.php/weblog/maui_invitational_and_paradise_jam_log5s/

           Semis  Final  Champ
Marquette   95.1   75.5   56.9
Drexel          89.6   50.6   17.1
Virginia        79.2   42.6   14.2
Mississippi   66.0   17.9    8.9
Drake           34.0    5.8    2.0
TCU             20.8    5.3    0.7
Norfolk St.   10.4    1.5    0.1
Winthrop     4.9    0.9    0.1

So Winthrop should, based on Pomeroy's numbers, be the worst, with Norfolk St being the second worse.  Drexel was listed as second best.

[Brewtown Andy]

Posted in another thread:
http://kenpom.com/blog/index.php/weblog/maui_invitational_and_paradise_jam_log5s/

           Semis  Final  Champ
Marquette   95.1   75.5   56.9
Drexel          89.6   50.6   17.1
Virginia        79.2   42.6   14.2
Mississippi   66.0   17.9    8.9
Drake           34.0    5.8    2.0
TCU             20.8    5.3    0.7
Norfolk St.   10.4    1.5    0.1
Winthrop     4.9    0.9    0.1

So Winthrop should, based on Pomeroy's numbers, be the worst, with Norfolk St being the second worse.  Drexel was listed as second best.

That's just odds of winning the tournament, not an assessment of the teams. Based on KenPom's rankings, Winthrop's just a shade better than Norfolk State.

[bamamarquettefan]

The encouraging thing is that Norfolk stat beat the caa preseason favorite, and their defense was so good they were shutting them out for the first six minutes. I believe they will win the meac, and there center will be conference poy, but I'm more impressed that they could beat the best of the caa, which has been battling the a10 as the top midmajor, after we hung 99 on them.

Our offense could be really, really good.

[Henry Sugar]

Our offense could be really, really good.

Our offense is always good.

[MuMark]

Or maybe Drexel won't be the Caa's best? Just because they were predicted to be doesn't mean it will turn out that way.

Too early in the year to make any big conclusions about these results.

[nathanziarek]

Not entirely unlike the CBE games that Marquette played at the BC last year that didn't affect their trip to Kansas City.

Except the teams we played in Kansas City weren't also part of the preliminary games. I guess that's the part I've need seen before: teams playing a preliminary game, then seeding the winner and loser into bracket play. I'll trust that I just don't watch enough basketball, though.

[MUMac]

Except the teams we played in Kansas City weren't also part of the preliminary games. I guess that's the part I've need seen before: teams playing a preliminary game, then seeding the winner and loser into bracket play. I'll trust that I just don't watch enough basketball, though.

I admit this is new territory to me, as well.  The CBA when MU played two games at home then went to KC and it did not matter if they won one, two or none, they still would be in KC, was new as well.