'13 PG - Bronson Koenig down to two

[Eye]

I like North Carolina's chances.

If he goes to Wisconsin, it's because he knows UNC will get better players while he's there.

Talked to an Aquinas assistant last week. I'd agree with Mark Miller on this one. And if there's a third team still involved, it'd be Virginia.

[Canadian Dimes]

While you dont know how to quote I was still able to read and understand your point. 

Ahhhhhh...ya I know how recruiting and HS and AAU ball work.  I have been involved coaching basketball at the AAU level for about 8 years.  Thanks for the update.

I am not going to deny anything, I am not going to deny that reps are made on the AAU level.  Although I will add when an AAu team plays at a slower pace one can look good within a system.  Many may not realize that all AAu programs are not the same.  Some of the guys just meet at tourneys and rarely is ever practice together, might have a basic motion offense if anything and go play.  Other practice alot, will run alot of sets, offenses, quik hitters etc.  I am not making any assumptions here just saying a really well practiced AAU team can win alot of games and make the players look good. 

I have no idea how many points he scored in HS or AAU or how good the kid the kid is.  I was at one tourney the Playground was at and never watched them play. 

It is all besides the point.  My only point is for 50 years Wisconsin High school basketball has had it's annual "Great White Hope".  And many of those years the player was quite highly recruited.  Every single year almost without fail that player has turned into a huge failure relative to his ranking and hype.    

Now some have countered with Diener, Pieper, one guy countered that Scott Christopherson was all B12 ( i will add that he shot the ball a ton for a really bad team and would rarely play on a top 25 team...again IMHO)...others have thrown in Joe wolf...Ok whatever the guy averaged 9 points a game in college and was a journeyman in the NBA that avergaed 4 points a game, and much due to his size stuck around a s a back up center.  Todays version of Scott Pollard or Erick Dampier.   Great 4-5-6 examples.

Am I lumping them all together? Am I discriminating?...Yes.  But it is my beleif that the weakness of Wisconsin hinterland basketball has cuased and will continue to cause these cuase the ability to shine early yet fade when pressed to play against the best players in college in a different type of system.

Kudos to Bo Ryan for being able to take not yet ready for primetime players and put together the program that he has.

[MuMark]

If you are going to criticize a kid for being the latest "great white hope" shouldn't he at least be....I don't know.....white? 

[Canadian Dimes]

sorry i dont know his race or care....my generalization of great white hope really refers to basketball from the hinterland vacuum of wisconsin.... that is all of wisconsin sans SE wisconsin and madison.  color makes no diffrence... we can agree to call it "hinterlands great hope"

[TedBaxter]

It is all besides the point.  My only point is for 50 years Wisconsin High school basketball has had it's annual "Great White Hope".  And many of those years the player was quite highly recruited.  Every single year almost without fail that player has turned into a huge failure relative to his ranking and hype.    

Now some have countered with Diener, Pieper, one guy countered that Scott Christopherson was all B12 ( i will add that he shot the ball a ton for a really bad team and would rarely play on a top 25 team...again IMHO)...others have thrown in Joe wolf...Ok whatever the guy averaged 9 points a game in college and was a journeyman in the NBA that avergaed 4 points a game, and much due to his size stuck around a s a back up center.  Todays version of Scott Pollard or Erick Dampier.   Great 4-5-6 examples.

I never said Joe Wolf was the greatest player to come out of Wisconsin, but at the time of his high school graduation, he was the best high school player I had seen from about 1970 until today.  I never saw Jim Chones play in high school at St. Catherine's as that was in 1969.

Joe Wolf averaged 9.6 points a game at North Carolina and if you look at that stat, it would be a disappointment until you consider he played with Michael Jordan, Sam Perkins and Matt Doherty as a freshman and played with Brad Daugherty for 3 years. He also teammed up with Kenny Smith for 4 years and J.R. Reid was his sidekick in Joe's senior year. Very good college career and if he had come to MU, my guess is we would have never had Dukiet.  The single biggest recruiting loss for MU because of his potential impact on the program at a time when it was really needed.

[94Warrior]

He is going to Wisconsin. It's not even a question. As Mark Miller said a few weeks back, this is the worst kept secret of the summer.

The Urinal-Sentinel better reserve a good chunk of space on the front page!

[Canadian Dimes]

The Urinal-Sentinel better reserve a good chunk of space on the front page!

I will be as excited as I was when Okey, Anderson, Bronson, Mader, The Polar Bear, Gavinski, Wilkinson, and so on and so on for the last 30 years.  The "pipeline" to the hinterlands remains open for Bucky....wipety s#!+

[Pakuni]

I never said Joe Wolf was the greatest player to come out of Wisconsin,

Actually, that is what you said. May not have been what you meant, but it's what you said.

Just remember, the best player out of a Wisconsin high school the last 50 years may be Joe Wolf

[texaswarrior74]

To denigrate Koenig is to not know basketball. Cat can hoop.

Agree...kid has great handle, amazing floor vision, is a terrific passer (think Jason Kidd) and has a knock down three that is a thing of beauty.

Whatever program gets him will be far better for it.

[Pakuni]

Agree...kid has great handle, amazing floor vision, is a terrific passer (think Jason Kidd) and has a knock down three that is a thing of beauty.

Whatever program gets him will be far better for it.

Wow ... Jason Kidd with range. Why's he even bothering to go to college?

[brewcity77]

Wow ... Jason Kidd with range. Why's he even bothering to go to college?

Yeah...the J-Kidd comparisons might be a touch premature 

[Earl Tatum]

If Koenig is so darn good, why did UNC get Marcus Paige? I admit he is a good player but not on UNC Level. He'll find out at Duke also. Probably will fit in Ryan's boring offense.

[Canadian Dimes]

Wow Jason kidd left early with no J......2013 must be one of the most talented classes ever.  I have not seen Koenig listed in the top 50 of any recruiting lists...so to be Jason kidd WITH a JUMPER says alot about the top 50!!!

BTW Jason Kidd...that is the one without a jumper was a top 10 recruit and the top 1-2 pg's in his class not a top 100 kid and a top 10-15 pg like Koenig.

Excited to watch him walk the ball up for Bucky when i watch him 1 time a year, maybe we will all get lucky and get to watch him more than once ..... if he stays for his soph. year.

[Pakuni]

Wow Jason kidd left early with no J......2013 must be one of the most talented classes ever.  I have not seen Koenig listed in the top 50 of any recruiting lists...so to be Jason kidd WITH a JUMPER says alot about the top 50!!!

BTW Jason Kidd...that is the one without a jumper was a top 10 recruit and the top 1-2 pg's in his class not a top 100 kid and a top 10-15 pg like Koenig.

Top 10 player is an understatement. Kidd was Naismith, USA Today and Parade high school player of the year, and two-time California player of the year.
The bar for young Mr. Koenig has been set pretty high.
Not that he isn't a quality young player. Just seems that there's some undeserved drooling (and bashing) over the kid.

[brewcity77]

CD, we get it, you don't expect much out of Koenig. No need to slam the kid every post. I'm not saying he'll be a stud, but save some of that venom for once he actually gets to UW.

[wadesworld]

If Koenig is so darn good, why did UNC get Marcus Paige? I admit he is a good player but not on UNC Level. He'll find out at Duke also. Probably will fit in Ryan's boring offense.

Haha that question is pretty simple to answer...because Marcus Paige is the #1 rated point guard in the country.  Nobody is saying that Bronson Koenig is the best point guard in the nation.  I am making the claim that if Roy Williams (and Coach K, and Bill Self, and Buzz) offered the kid, he is probably something more than a "Great White Hope" (which MuMark pointed out...he's not even white) or some kid from the "hinterlands" who will be a bust in college.

By the way, you're telling me if the #2 center in the 2013 class had us on his list and the #1 center in the class of 2013 suddenly came to Buzz and told him he wanted to attend Marquette to play basketball, all of the sudden the #2 center isn't that good because the #1 center chose to come here and we accepted him?  Or that Buzz would not take both the #2 and #1 centers?  Just because some other point guard chose to go to UNC does not mean it makes all other point guards who were considering UNC bad.  What a joke.

[Canadian Dimes]

CD, we get it, you don't expect much out of Koenig. No need to slam the kid every post. I'm not saying he'll be a stud, but save some of that venom for once he actually gets to UW.

No venom here...just saying I think history will repeat itself.  I really could  not care less...unless he was going to MU....then I would be disappointed that he was to be our new PG.

What I do think is funny though is your sense of self worth and your need to tell me how to act and feel.  Your deconstruction ...on almost a phrase by phrase basis...of my post on the athletic director situation is as pathetic as it is troubling.  the way you see my opinions as irrelavent ( to you , I guess).   The way that you attack my opinions with yours and how you see your opinions as fact... is frankly pretty pathetic.

Welcome to ignore...your constant bloviating has worn me out.   

[tower912]

No venom here...just saying I think history will repeat itself.  I really could  not care less...unless he was going to MU....then I would be disappointed that he was to be our new PG.

What I do think is funny though is your sense of self worth and your need to tell me how to act and feel.  Your deconstruction ...on almost a phrase by phrase basis...of my post on the athletic director situation is as pathetic as it is troubling.  the way you see my opinions as irrelavent ( to you , I guess).   The way that you attack my opinions with yours and how you see your opinions as fact... is frankly pretty pathetic.

Welcome to ignore...your constant bloviating has worn me out.   

The irony of you making the above statement is astounding.    Your rant makes me miss chico keeping you in line.   And I will take your advice and put you on ignore.

[NersEllenson]

The irony of you making the above statement is astounding.    Your rant makes me miss chico keeping you in line.   And I will take your advice and put you on ignore.

Personally, I like the controversy Canadian Dimes brings to the board, and his unvarnished/unglossed, candid opinions.  Fun to read at minimum, and he's provoking for sure - and at least a real MU fan (compared to the poser that Chicos was).  Don't get me wrong - I think the attack on BrewCity 77 was unwarranted..but Dimes is colorful to say the least.

[Hards Alumni]

Personally, I like the controversy Canadian Dimes brings to the board, and his unvarnished/unglossed, candid opinions.  Fun to read at minimum, and he's provoking for sure - and at least a real MU fan (compared to the poser that Chicos was).  Don't get me wrong - I think the attack on BrewCity 77 was unwarranted..but Dimes is colorful to say the least.

Ehhhhhhhhhhhhh.... I can honestly say I don't miss MR. HAYWARD, and I don't miss Dimes when he is away.

[Aughnanure]

Personally, I like the controversy Canadian Dimes brings to the board, and his unvarnished/unglossed, candid opinions.  Fun to read at minimum, and he's provoking for sure - and at least a real MU fan (compared to the poser that Chicos was).  Don't get me wrong - I think the attack on BrewCity 77 was unwarranted..but Dimes is colorful to say the least.

Watch it Ners, you are getting just as bad in some ways as Chicos. And for the record, he was a real fan...just not as enjoyable and fun to deal with as most would like.

But seriously, how does a Wisky recruit get to 2+ pages? We should be embarrassed. It makes us look like we are obsessed.

[Earl Tatum]

Hey wadesworld-----It's lack of playing time. All players want to play minutes.

[wadesworld]

Hey wadesworld-----It's lack of playing time. All players want to play minutes.

Like I said in the JP thread, UNC is nothing like MU in that if you're not in the top 7, you're out of the rotation.  UNC plays extremely up tempo and rotates players in and out.  Not a single player averaged over 30 minutes per game, and the player who was 10th in minutes per game averaged 10 minutes per game.  The 9th player in their rotation averaged 15 minutes per game.  You get 13 scholarships, so chances are by the time you're a sophomore you're seeing at least fairly regular minutes at UNC.  UNC is not a team like Marquette where 4 guys average 28+ minutes per game.  I hope one day we have a rotation like Marquette, because then everyone is playing and everyone is fresh and we are very balanced.  If you go to UNC on scholarship, you pretty much get a good opportunity to play even if you aren't the best player at your position.

And if it's lack of playing time like you just suggested, then why would you suggest that Koenig must not be all that good simply because they're accepting a different point guard in the same class (who happens to be the #1 rated point guard in the nation)?  You're the one who asked the question, I'm just answering it for you.

[texaswarrior74]

Wadesworld nailed it.

Roy often had two PGs on the floor at the same time while at KU and he has done it occasionally at UNC. He said he sees Koenig as a Kurt Heinrich like player who can play either the 1 or 2 which means he and Paige would coexist nicely.

[brewcity77]

No venom here...just saying I think history will repeat itself.  I really could  not care less...unless he was going to MU....then I would be disappointed that he was to be our new PG.

What I do think is funny though is your sense of self worth and your need to tell me how to act and feel.  Your deconstruction ...on almost a phrase by phrase basis...of my post on the athletic director situation is as pathetic as it is troubling.  the way you see my opinions as irrelavent ( to you , I guess).   The way that you attack my opinions with yours and how you see your opinions as fact... is frankly pretty pathetic.

Welcome to ignore...your constant bloviating has worn me out.

Wow...what I find hilarious is that it was such a tame, tongue-in-cheek comment that drove you to ignore me. I realize sarcasm doesn't always come over well on these Internets we frequent, but wow...skin so thin it's translucent.