collapse

* 2021-2022 SOTG Tally


2021-22 Season SoG Tally
Lewis7
Morsell5
Kolek2
Kuath2
Elliott1
Ighodaro1
Mitchell1

'20-21 * '19-20
'18-19 * '17-18 * '16-17
'15-16 * '14-15 * '13-14
'12-13 * '11-12 * '10-11

* Big East Standings

* Recent Posts

Recruiting as of 5/15/22 by PJDunn
[June 27, 2022, 10:23:25 PM]


2022-23 Non-Con Schedule by MuggsyB
[June 27, 2022, 08:41:00 PM]


Justin by Herman Cain
[June 27, 2022, 05:42:39 PM]


[Cracked Sidewalks] Who Will Score? by bilsu
[June 27, 2022, 04:48:55 PM]


Scholarship or walk-on? by Herman Cain
[June 27, 2022, 04:30:43 PM]


Justin Lewis -- 1st-round draft pick? by Jay Bee
[June 27, 2022, 10:32:27 AM]

Please Register - It's FREE!

The absolute only thing required for this FREE registration is a valid e-mail address.  We keep all your information confidential and will NEVER give or sell it to anyone else.
Login to get rid of this box (and ads) , or register NOW!

* Next up: The long cold summer

Marquette
Marquette

Madness

Date/Time: Oct 1, 2022, 7:00 pm
TV: NA
Schedule for 2021-22
19-13

Author Topic: What makes a program a destination job vs. a stepping stone?  (Read 4098 times)

deep vacuum

  • Scholarship Player
  • **
  • Posts: 71
What makes a program a destination job vs. a stepping stone?
« on: March 15, 2011, 09:09:32 PM »
I understand why someone would want to coach at II II, Kansas, NC, etc.   I'm wondering about all the other programs that weren't a destination job a hundred years ago.  What changed to make them a destination program?  Is it a simple matter of a coach deciding to stay forever for some reason?  What made that coach decide to put down roots?

Why couldn't Marquette become more than a stepping stone for up and coming young coaches?  What changes would have to be made either in reality or perception?  Are those changes possible or even required?

Blackhat

  • All American
  • *****
  • Posts: 3652
Re: What makes a program a destination job vs. a stepping stone?
« Reply #1 on: March 15, 2011, 09:12:50 PM »
consistent winning, tradition.   Recruits want to be in the limelight, can your program get them the fame?   Excellent resources, facility and otherwise.  Would help if we had some hot chicks on campus.

Niv Berkowitz

  • All American
  • *****
  • Posts: 1302
Re: What makes a program a destination job vs. a stepping stone?
« Reply #2 on: March 15, 2011, 09:17:21 PM »
There's NOTHING Marquette can do about this other than get lucky and keep a coach for a decade, while one of the other Big East schools lose their coach and fall off (UConn, 'Nova, Pitt, Syracuse).

MU is a destination job, but like Parrish said, if the choice is MU vs. another top-conference's top-five jobs, then, what can you do?

Also, if Buzz really wants to eventually be in the south, there's nothing anybody can do to stop that. Money or not-more-money.

HoopsMalone

  • All American
  • *****
  • Posts: 1821
Re: What makes a program a destination job vs. a stepping stone?
« Reply #3 on: March 15, 2011, 09:25:56 PM »
A destination job depends on the person.  MU is likely Brian Wardle's destination job. 


We all knew Crean deep down wanted to get back to MSU.  When Izzo turned down NBA jobs and rumors came around that he didn't want Crean to replace him, Crean waited for the best job he could have gotten.  He wanted Billy G's job at Kentucky and took IU.  He was never going anywhere else but a top job. 

Like Crean, Buzz probably has a destination.  Who knows what it is, but it would do him no good to be a mercenary and change jobs all the time.  He could be an Al who seems like an odd fit but turns out to be perfect.

deep vacuum

  • Scholarship Player
  • **
  • Posts: 71
Re: What makes a program a destination job vs. a stepping stone?
« Reply #4 on: March 15, 2011, 09:43:02 PM »
There's NOTHING Marquette can do about this other than get lucky and keep a coach for a decade, while one of the other Big East schools lose their coach and fall off (UConn, 'Nova, Pitt, Syracuse).

MU is a destination job, but like Parrish said, if the choice is MU vs. another top-conference's top-five jobs, then, what can you do?

Also, if Buzz really wants to eventually be in the south, there's nothing anybody can do to stop that. Money or not-more-money.
This questions goes a lot farther back than just Buzz Williams.  If MU is a destination job that the problem could be perception.  Facilities are top notch.  MU's commitment to the program is very good. NBA arena to play your games in.  Alcohol being served in said arena to make MU coeds appear hotter than they are.   A decent winning BB tradition including 6 straight NCAA appearances.  Playing in the Big East with plenty of national exposure.

Crean left for BB royalty.  Was Duke a destination job before coach K?  What are Butler, Xavier & Gonzaga doing differently than MU?
« Last Edit: March 15, 2011, 09:44:45 PM by deep vacuum »

Niv Berkowitz

  • All American
  • *****
  • Posts: 1302
Re: What makes a program a destination job vs. a stepping stone?
« Reply #5 on: March 15, 2011, 09:51:26 PM »
Few is one of the only, if not THE only big name, coach who has decided to stay where he's at because he's happy and gets paid well. Gonzaga is very similar to MU...only MU plays in a beast of a conference.

Xavier is no different than us. They lost their coach two years ago.

ErickJD08

  • All American
  • *****
  • Posts: 1598
    • Professor Crass
Re: What makes a program a destination job vs. a stepping stone?
« Reply #6 on: March 15, 2011, 10:46:04 PM »
What about Notre Dame?  They are second fiddle to the football program, play in a tough conference, and have STEEP recruiting competition from in state programs.  I have never heard Brey rumors.
Wanna learn how to say "@#(@# (@*" in a dozen languages... go to Professor Crass www.professorcrass.com

Tugg Speedman

  • All American
  • *****
  • Posts: 8836
Re: What makes a program a destination job vs. a stepping stone?
« Reply #7 on: March 15, 2011, 10:52:27 PM »
What about Notre Dame?  They are second fiddle to the football program, play in a tough conference, and have STEEP recruiting competition from in state programs.  I have never heard Brey rumors.

No one wants Brey.  And given his age, and the Coach K tree, he'll be on a short list when (if?) the coach K era ends in Durham.

brewcity77

  • All American
  • *****
  • Posts: 24082
  • SJW is a badge of honor, not a pejorative.
    • Cracked Sidewalks
Re: What makes a program a destination job vs. a stepping stone?
« Reply #8 on: March 15, 2011, 10:57:49 PM »
Basically, we need Buzz (or another coach) to become the next Al McGuire, or in more modern terms, Mike Krzyzewski. If it were Buzz, I think he would have to get Marquette a couple Final Fours in the next 6-8 years, and a couple National Championships or within 15 years. Then he'd have to stay for another 15 years, consistently getting this team to the tournament and making runs. A Final Four here, an Elite Eight there, and a sizable handful of Sweet Sixteens. Eventually, he'd have to retire from Marquette, never leaving for the "better job".

That's essentially what Coach K did. After a pretty good spell in the 1960s that featured a few Final Fours, Duke was an up-and-comer. But then they went more than a decade before their next NCAA appearance. A couple appearances, then Coach K shows up. In less than a decade, he started his run of 7 Final Fours in 9 years. Duke had officially become a top-level program, but the reason they are now elite is because Coach K stayed. I wonder, if Bobby Knight had left Indiana sooner, might Coach K have wanted to follow in his mentor's footsteps? We'll never know. It didn't happen, and now some 31 years later he's still at Duke, going to Final Fours and winning titles. Safe to say Duke is now a destination job, and when Coach K leaves, they'll have their pick of top coaches.

That's what Marquette would need. One coach (maybe Buzz) to earn his spurs, then stay for 25-30 years before retiring. It would help if a few of his proteges took jobs elsewhere, which would strengthen the brand as his coaching tree grew. Add in some NBA players and you could create a juggernaut. The only question is if we can find a coach with the integrity and dedication to Marquette to make it happen. Could Buzz be that guy? I hope so.

As far as why it didn't happen here after Al...well, Hank kept it up, but going to Majerus and then Dukiet likely killed all the momentum we had built up from the McGuire era. Of course, if Buzz does become that figure, we'll probably need to give credit to Crean as much as anyone. If not for his arrival and unearthing Dwyane Wade, we probably never join the Big East, and who knows if Buzz ever ends up here. Regardless, I think that to truly become a destination it will take at least 20 years.
Why won't Kur Kuath answer my DMs?
.
He blocked me.

JerryWizig

  • Walk-On
  • *
  • Posts: 46
Re: What makes a program a destination job vs. a stepping stone?
« Reply #9 on: March 15, 2011, 11:33:25 PM »
I think it's all relative.

Would you consider Gonzaga a destination job? I wouldn't, but that's basically what it has become under Mark Few. He used to be thrown out for every coaching opportunity out there, but he seems to be a guy that is fine playing at the level he's at.

Marquette could be a destination job to many people out there. Maybe Buzz Williams is one of them, maybe not. It has a lot of things going for it, but it also has other things going against it. It all depends on the coach.

downtown85

  • Registered User
  • All American
  • *****
  • Posts: 1386
  • Ad majoram Dei gloriam.
Re: What makes a program a destination job vs. a stepping stone?
« Reply #10 on: March 16, 2011, 02:36:05 AM »
I think it's all relative.

Would you consider Gonzaga a destination job? I wouldn't, but that's basically what it has become under Mark Few. He used to be thrown out for every coaching opportunity out there, but he seems to be a guy that is fine playing at the level he's at.

Marquette could be a destination job to many people out there. Maybe Buzz Williams is one of them, maybe not. It has a lot of things going for it, but it also has other things going against it. It all depends on the coach.

Mark Few has very little pressure on him since he plays in a much easier conference.  The Big East is a whole different kettle of fish.  The pressure is much higher and coaches are given less and less time to build programs (look at Keno Davis).  Also, listen to what Buzz said at the Providence game (BET) press conference. He basically said the Big East ages coaches prematurely.  Coaching in this conference is bad for ones health and you put on unnecessary weight.  I though he was going to tender his resignation after hearing that.   

The question is, with all the competition, can any BE program be a dream job?  Every one will be a grind no matter who takes over.