Let me know please if I'm forgetting one here

[Dr. Blackheart]

How about the first 34 minutes of the Louisville game and the 40 minutes of the ND game before that?

Laughable...got news for you, 1-9 gets coaches fired. Close games are won at the end...and this team was AGAIN broken down at the end of one of these close games when one stop matters.  Not a blow out win where we controlled the tempo to our favor like UND and had Frozena in there at the end.    

[Tugg Speedman]

I expect to be .500 (5-5)....I don't expect to be 1-9 against them when we are .500 if we score more than 70 points.  

IF MU was .500 less than 70 points, and .500 more than 70 points.  We would be a ranked team now.

I agree our defense is lacking.  That said, we are an elite level offense.  Maybe it was our offense that let us down the last 5:44?  We only scored 5 points.  Even with the defensive collapse, we should have been able to score more than 5 points down the stretch and keep Louisville out of reach.

Lastly, what is easier to teach ... offense or defense?  I would argue it is defense.  

Buzz has recruited high quality offensive players and it shows in the stats.  None of these guys have had to play defense before, and certainly not with each other.  Give it time and they will figure it out.  Defense has been steadily getting better all year.

Maybe we should look at the defensive stats of the players we are recruiting?  What are Wilson and Anderson's defensive abilities?  We certainly do not need more offense.

[tower912]

Nailed it,84.   If MU simply runs its offense the last 5 minutes, this discussion isn't happening.   I don't know if the offense ground to a halt because that is what Buzz called or if the guys out there looked at the clock and thought they could milk it.   I've seen enough and coached enough to know that it could be either.  Although it does seem with MU it is more on Buzz.    But if the guys on the floor simply made better decisions (Bucks layup and dumb pass ahead to Butler, Cadougan with a bad throw away) and run the offense to score rather than take time off of the clock, MU wins.   

[Tugg Speedman]

Laughable...got news for you, 1-9 gets coaches fired. Close games are won at the end...and this team was AGAIN broken down at the end of one of these close games when one stop matters.  Not a blow out win where we controlled the tempo to our favor like UND and had Frozena in there at the end.    

I think you'll find that when most BE teams play a style that does not suit them, they do not do well. (With MU that is slowdown to prevent us from scoring less than 70 points a game as our offense is so good)  I'll bet 10 to 12 BE coaches would get axed per your criteria (off the top of my head, Georgetown, ND, Prov, WVU, Cincy, 'ville and Uconn will probably fit your criteria to be fired).

This morning on ESPN radio some New England fans are noting that Brady is o-3 in his last three playoff games.  They are asking if he "is done" and if they should move on.  Yes, please Pats, cut Brady!

Not sure who demands a more impossible standard, Pats fan or you demanding MU be able to win against ranked teams in all styles right now.

Be patient.  Buzz has the offense going and the defense is coming around.  Too many prima donna offense scoring machines that never thought about defense and too many guys that have never played with each other before this year (like Jae, VB, Junior, Outle, DG and JJ).  This is why we have such a high ceiling.  Offense is a natural talent and team defense can be taught.

[Dr. Blackheart]

I am not irrational on this to be clear which is hard to convey on the internet. The hard fact is, Buzz's teams are great offensively--if not elite, but this is a tough league with great, long-standing coaches.  Failure to play great team defense is a pattern with Buzz...not good, not very good, but great.  BE coaches will take away what a team does well--great teams overcome this by playing tough defense as it is the one thing they can rely on in these ugly games.

Ten straight possessions without a stop to finish a game when all you needed was one to win it.  One stop.  And folks are blaming Buzz for going to the spread offense when MU was already in the double bonus.  Got news, Coach K did the same thing against Maryland and won it. One defensive stop and Pitino is fouling -- game, set, match MU.  

[brewcity77]

It's a half-dozen of one, six of the other. If we get one stop against Louisville we win. If we score one more basket we win. We ran into the absolute perfect storm of a collapse. That's the only possible way we lose that game. Arguing which was more of screw-up, the offense or the defense, is about as rational as trying to legitimately argue the chicken or the egg.

[Henry Sugar]

It's a half-dozen of one, six of the other. If we get one stop against Louisville we win. If we score one more basket we win. We ran into the absolute perfect storm of a collapse. That's the only possible way we lose that game. Arguing which was more of screw-up, the offense or the defense, is about as rational as trying to legitimately argue the chicken or the egg.

Disagree on many levels.  I'd agree that this was the absolute perfect storm if this was the first time MU had either failed to get stops or given up a big lead.

Further, I've found the back and forth about defense and offense in the final five minutes to be really interesting.  At least then it's an attempt to understand why the breakdown occurred instead of just chalking it up to bad luck.

[brewcity77]

Disagree on many levels.  I'd agree that this was the absolute perfect storm if this was the first time MU had either failed to get stops or given up a big lead.

Further, I've found the back and forth about defense and offense in the final five minutes to be really interesting.  At least then it's an attempt to understand why the breakdown occurred instead of just chalking it up to bad luck.

I've said it's endemic of Buzz's tenure, and I stick by that. Once is chance, twice is coincidence, this is the third time, which makes it a trend. And I'm not saying it's bad luck, but I do think that we were peeing the bed on offense at the same time as we were throwing up in our mouths on defense. And I think that the two work together.

Maybe it's defense first. We give up a bucket, Louisville can set up the press. It lets them get back to their game, and of course the combination of confidence and the crowd allows them to keep scoring. Because of our flagging defense, our offense can't get into rhythm because they have shifted the style back to their own.

Maybe it's offense first, we slow the game down, struggle to get it across the timeline, and lose our rhythm because we're used to attack-attack-attack and instead we're in bleed-bleed-bleed mode. That lack of rhythm carries over to the defensive end, we get slower on switches (just as we're slower attacking)

One thing I will say is while the circumstances are similar, this loss is significantly different from the others. This happened in the blink of an eye. The other times we lost a double-digit second-half lead it happened over the course of 12-15 minutes. This was under 6 minutes. That doesn't happen without a complete breakdown. Someone else pointed out that we were 44 seconds away from a record collapse. So maybe it's not the absolute perfect storm, but it's about as close as college basketball has ever seen. I think that this is most likely one of the five biggest collapses in college basketball history. That doesn't happen without some pretty-close-to-perfect storming.

[Dr. Blackheart]

Buzz mentioned the 12 straight possessions tonight on his radio show (the 10 shots + 2 Jennings offensive rebounds with fouls) among other things.  While this is a perfect storm (at our high water mark lead, Pomeroy had us at a 98% chance to win), the defensive break-downs are consistent in these close games where we score below our average in quality games (70 or less). We are 11th in the BE in defense.

The spread offense was the right strategy with UL in the double bonus (see Pomeroy's 98%). Execution was horrible but attrition was the name of the game. Take it to the hoop and get fouled, use most of the time clock, don't launch threes too early. Buycks shot when he should have dribbled is without mention. Great teams finish, especially for an elite offensively efficient team. Could Buzz have used timeouts more effectively?  Perhaps, but there were plenty of stops between media and Pitino (want him to burn them) to settle the troops and that didn't work.  

I keep going back to team defense--10 offensive sets (12 technical possessions) and the 2% odds become a "perfect tornado".  Mind boggling but time to climb back on the "Buycks" tomorrow night.

[willie warrior]

Yeah, Buycks is certainly due for a breakout game--maybe he can reduce his TO's from 5 to 4.

[Dr. Blackheart]

In the last two seasons under Buzz and with primarily Buzz's recruits, MU is 1-9 against ranked/NCAA teams when MU scores 70 points or less, only beating Gtown at home last year. When MU cannot outscore a top opponent, they cannot outdefend you.  

2010-11: Louisville, Wisconsin, Zags

2009-10: Wisconsin, WVU, Gtown (W), Pitt, ND, Gtown (BET), Edit: forgot FSU (L)

MU was 4-1 when this occurs versus lesser opponents the last two seasons, all from last season:  DePaul (L), UCONN (W), USF (W), SJU (2 W's).

In Buzz's first season, MU was 3-1 vs. top talent (Wisconsin, Tenn (L), NCSU, Utah St.).  And 4-2 overall--add in (IPFW and USF (L).  "Three Amigos + Zar" or Dale Layer on the bench?

Updating this, to add the Connecticut and Nova losses this season in these grinder games vs. "ranked/NCAA teams" when MU scores 70 or less points a game:  1-11 over the past two season now in these.  Again, this is related to our tempo discussion I flushed out in the CS post.  The 70 points came about as our BE average per game last season was 70.5.

[GGGG]

Dr. Blackheart...I agree with you completely.  And MU84 is wrong that it is the "style of play."  The UL loss had nothing to do with pace.  The Vandy loss had nothing to do with pace.  They lost both because of fundamental defensive problems.  Duke runs at a high tempo...kempom has them 26th in adjusted tempo.  And they are still the 12th best defensive team in the country.

It isn't too much to ask for to have them be an "elite" offensive team and at least average defensively.  Right now, they are 13th in defense in the BE - behind Providence, South Florida and DePaul.  (They have the #2 offense behind Pitt.)  This is simply a coaching weakness by Buzz.

[Dr. Blackheart]

Updating this, to add the Connecticut and Nova losses this season in these grinder games vs. "ranked/NCAA teams" when MU scores 70 or less points a game:  1-11 over the past two season now in these.  Again, this is related to our tempo discussion I flushed out in the CS post.  The 70 points came about as our BE average per game last season was 70.5.

Now 1-12 in these "grinder" games against these top teams. Can MU win in the half court?