Probable Scenario on Newbill !

[Marquette84]

Exactly.  He was under contract with MU to cease being recruiting elsewhere.  MU gave him back his rights.  Newbill didn't have to grant MU its release from the NLI since they were under no obligations.

You and Pakuni both ignore one key piece of information--MU had to coerce Newbill into signing the request for release first.

If there was no obligation for MU to honor the NLI, why did they need Newbill's signature on the request for release?  

Did they NEED to do it or did they do it so DJ could open up his recruitment again?  Also, it would prevent potential negative fallout for MU from actually having to reject him.  It seems to me that having DJ opt out is best for both parties.  Okay, maybe not BEST.  Best for DJ would be to attend MU in th fall, but you get my point.

Why would Newbill want to open up his recruiting again?  Marquette was his dream school.

And do you really think that there is less potential negative fallout from the way Newbill was handled as compared to say, Saunders? 

I cannot believe people are now trying to spin this as a magnanimous move on Marquette's part as if we're taking a hit to allow a kid to pursue his dream school elsewhere.

[GGGG]

You and Pakuni both ignore one key piece of information--MU had to coerce Newbill into signing the request for release first.

If there was no obligation for MU to honor the NLI, why did they need Newbill's signature on the request for release?  

Where did you hear that they had to coerce Newbill into signing anything?

If that's the case, they probably had him sign a hold harmless agreement in return for releasing him from his NLI immediately.  (Because MU could have simply waited until Newbill applied and was rejected by the University before getting his release.)

[MUSF]

Why would Newbill want to open up his recruiting again?  Marquette was his dream school.

And do you really think that there is less potential negative fallout from the way Newbill was handled as compared to say, Saunders? 

I cannot believe people are now trying to spin this as a magnanimous move on Marquette's part as if we're taking a hit to allow a kid to pursue his dream school elsewhere.

Newbill would want to open up his recruiting again because the alternative might be to wait until the deadline and get rejected by MU.

There wouldn't have been more negative fallout from the Newbill situation if he would have quietly agreed to ask for his release and not cried foul.  He and MU could have spun it a number of ways at that point.  There still would have been whispers of wrong doing, but not the meltdown that we are seeing here.

If DJ refuses to ask for his release and gets rejected by the University, there will certainly be more of a fallout than Saunders case.  Of course, doing that would probably also screw him over because he would lose time to latch on somewhere else.  I think MU is banking on DJ cooling down a little bit and realizing that if he doesn't opt out, he will only be hurting himself.

Finally, I am not trying to spin this as a magnanimous move by MU and I don't think I ever have.  I think MU is trying to cover their a**es and banking on DJ trying to cover his.

[GGGG]

Why would Newbill want to open up his recruiting again?  Marquette was his dream school.

And do you really think that there is less potential negative fallout from the way Newbill was handled as compared to say, Saunders? 

I cannot believe people are now trying to spin this as a magnanimous move on Marquette's part as if we're taking a hit to allow a kid to pursue his dream school elsewhere.

He probably doesn't want to open up his recruiting again, but he sees the writing on the wall.  He is no longer wanted by MU, and if he sends in his application, it is likely to be rejected.  This means if he wants to play basketball anywhere in 2010-11, it's better just to move on right now.

And this isn't a magnanimous gesture by MU.  It's hardball and it sucks.

[ATWizJr]

I think that Newbill was aware, all along, that MU had another iron in the fire and if that option was realized he would not be offered a schollie.   

Publicly, his camp may be in denial.  Privately, I believe they are not really surprised and, yes, I do think that having  been an MU target will enhance his chances elsewhere.

[mu_hilltopper]

I do think that having  been an MU target will enhance his chances elsewhere.

Hard to say if that's right.  It's one thing to be a "Marquette target" .. it's another to be a "Marquette discard," which he now is.

[Lennys Tap]

Hard to say if that's right.  It's one thing to be a "Marquette target" .. it's another to be a "Marquette discard," which he now is.

He was at best a 2 star recruit (maybe low major) before he became an "MU target". Can't imagine him dropping lower than that. Marquette's (and his insistence of West Virginia's) interest can only enhance his status.

[GGGG]

He was at best a 2 star recruit (maybe low major) before he became an "MU target". Can't imagine him dropping lower than that. Marquette's (and his insistence of West Virginia's) interest can only enhance his status.

Plus, he really blew up after he signed with MU.  Reports are that Temple wants him.  That's a high mid-major program.

He'll be fine.

[Marquette84]

Where did you hear that they had to coerce Newbill into signing anything?

Quote from: bradforster on June 29, 2010, 11:51:52 PM
5) Scott tells Stan that Buzz has decided to go another direction and he needs DJ to sign a form requesting his release from Marquette.  (Remember, DJ had already signed on the dotted line)

If that's the case, they probably had him sign a hold harmless agreement in return for releasing him from his NLI immediately. 

MU cannot grant a release unless the the player first requests it.  Once the player requests it, the school has the option of granting the release.

(Because MU could have simply waited until Newbill applied and was rejected by the University before getting his release.)

Which brings us back to my question--why didn't they just follow this course of action?  If they just waited:
--MU would have been able to save some face for both sides by claiming they really wanted the player, but it was purely and academic issue.  Newbill moves on, just as Saunders did.
--It would not have created the perception that MU plays loose with its scholarship offers and commitments.
--It would not have created material that other coaches will use in recruiting against MU.
--It would not have resulted in the bad press which has appeared in the  Philly papers, Rivals.com, ESPN, the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel and other publications.
--It would have avoided all controversy over whether MU treated Newbill fairly.

All of this controversy could have been very easily avoided if the MU coaching staff had just let the admissions process run its due course.

But they didn't.  Why?

[GGGG]

Quote from: bradforster on June 29, 2010, 11:51:52 PM
5) Scott tells Stan that Buzz has decided to go another direction and he needs DJ to sign a form requesting his release from Marquette.  (Remember, DJ had already signed on the dotted line)

MU cannot grant a release unless the the player first requests it.  Once the player requests it, the school has the option of granting the release.

I think you are misinterpreting here.  Newbill has to sign a form requesting MU release Newbill from his obligations under the NLI.  Newbill only has to sign this form if he wants to being the process of finding another school immediately.  Otherwise he is still bound by the NLI...and now has to wait for MU to accept his application, which everyone knows they won't.

Newbill isn't signing a form granting MU release from its scholarship obligations, because those obligations didn't fully exist because all conditions had yet to be fulfilled.  (Newbill's admission to the University.)

And the reason they just didn't wait for the application IMO is because they wanted to just let Newbill go.  Fresh start.

[Lennys Tap]

Quote from: bradforster on June 29, 2010, 11:51:52 PM
5) Scott tells Stan that Buzz has decided to go another direction and he needs DJ to sign a form requesting his release from Marquette.  (Remember, DJ had already signed on the dotted line)


MU cannot grant a release unless the the player first requests it.  Once the player requests it, the school has the option of granting the release.


Which brings us back to my question--why didn't they just follow this course of action?  If they just waited:
--MU would have been able to save some face for both sides by claiming they really wanted the player, but it was purely and academic issue.  Newbill moves on, just as Saunders did.
--It would not have created the perception that MU plays loose with its scholarship offers and commitments.
--It would not have created material that other coaches will use in recruiting against MU.
--It would not have resulted in the bad press which has appeared in the  Philly papers, Rivals.com, ESPN, the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel and other publications.
--It would have avoided all controversy over whether MU treated Newbill fairly.

All of this controversy could have been very easily avoided if the MU coaching staff had just let the admissions process run its due course.

But they didn't.  Why?

Because it would have been much worse for the kid. Trying to find a school in early July is certainly easier than trying to find one in late August. Add to that that the kid would carry the additional stigma of being rejected by MU for alleged academic reasons. So in essence you're saying that this is an example of how the present coaching staff worries less about perceptions and more about the student athlete than the previous one. I wholeheartedly agree and share what I am sure is your happiness over this welcome change from the past regime.

[Marquette84]

Because it would have been much worse for the kid. Trying to find a school in early July is certainly easier than trying to find one in late August. Add to that that the kid would carry the additional stigma of being rejected by MU for alleged academic reasons. So in essence you're saying that this is an example of how the present coaching staff worries less about perceptions and more about the student athlete than the previous one. I wholeheartedly agree and share what I am sure is your happiness over this welcome change from the past regime.

Wrong on both counts.

By August, schools will have new openings for players that they didn't know about in July.  Players that simply didn't return after the summer, were injured over the summer and won't play in the fall, who didn't pass their summer school courses and are no longer eligible, who decided to transfer, who didn't pass their last chance on the SAT/ACT to qualify, players that didn't pass the NCAA clearinghouse, etc. 

Think about this this way . . . Oregon has an opening now that they didn't a  just a few weeks ago.  Plus, as we saw, neither Roseboro nor Saunders had much trouble finding a home.

Second, there is no more stigma of being rejected by MU than there is about being turned down for admission by Harvard, Stanford, Villanova, Georgetown, Notre Dame, or any other highly regarded institution.  Some schools are acknowledged to have higher academic standards--MU is one of them.

I think you are misinterpreting here.  Newbill has to sign a form requesting MU release Newbill from his obligations under the NLI.  Newbill only has to sign this form if he wants to being the process of finding another school immediately.  Otherwise he is still bound by the NLI...and now has to wait for MU to accept his application, which everyone knows they won't.

How do you know they won't?

What if they would have found his application compelling and worthy of the type of person they want to attend MU?

[GGGG]

How do you know they won't?

What if they would have found his application compelling and worthy of the type of person they want to attend MU?

There is constant communication between admissions and athletics.  They will make sure it isn't accepted.