Is this a fireable offense?

[KipsBayEagle]

I'm at the point where I'd like to start throwing punches when it comes to some of these posts.  

This post nails down something else we need to remember.  THIS IS A MESSAGE BOARD!  Its a plae where different ideas should be thrown out there, and different opinions should be heard.  To misrepresent facts is one thing, but opinions are fine.  You just got worked up by me, a person who has an eagle about to kill a rabbit as my picture.  And within this thread, i have been rebuked by the HBO power agent Ari gold, and the well trimmed mustache of Scott Merrit.  this is not stuff to get that worked up over!  These posts maybe complete bull crap, you might completely disagree with them, but I hope they are interesting, at least entertaining, and if that doesn't cut it, hopefully comical.  And think all of us, including myself, need to remember that we come to this board for enjoyment and to have fun, and that believe it or not, none of us are taken that seriously.

[groove]

Please, can we give all these threads there own section on the board. This is getting ridiculous. Enough already. This site will soon be just a board dedicated to the discussion of one issue.

[bma725]

If I'm not mistaken, there is, under certain circumstances, a  process by which Newbill still could attend a Big East school. He would first have to get his NLI to Marquette declared "null and void," which, it would seem, probably would not be too difficult at this point.
So this business about him never being able to go to a Big East school may not be accurate.

Actually, getting it declared null and void is a very specific thing for very specific reasons, several of which wouldn't come into play here because they are based upon waiting until classes start, which isn't likely to happen.

[77ncaachamps]

Is it a fireable offense? Maybe to some...

But as long as the Big East and the NCAA allow this to happen, programs across the nation have the latitude to continue to do so.

Take it up with those bodies.
Hope that Buzz does what is best from here on.

And you're not gonna gear anything until th legal eagles at the athletic dept let them

[Litehouse]

This is also a place where, whether you like it or not, you're representing yourself as part of the Marquette community.  For better or worse, a college sports message board isn't the same as some other random board like fans of collector cars, video games, or even pro sports.  A college sports fan base is always associated with the school, particularly for a place like MU where alumni make up the vast majority of the fan base, as opposed to a place like Texas or Ohio State.  This entire fiasco, from the handling of everything by the coaching staff, to the reaction of our fans on message boards, hasn't reflected well on the Marquette community, and personally, I'm embarrassed by the whole thing.

[MUHoopsfan6]

Did you read IWB's response?  Why would you write this after seeing that?

[Norm]

I do not like how Buzz handled this situation but I don't think it is a fireable offense.

[KipsBayEagle]

Did you read IWB's response?  Why would you write this after seeing that?

??

[Litehouse]

Did you read IWB's response?  Why would you write this after seeing that?

Just curious, but who are you referring to with that post?

[ATL MU Warrior]

This is also a place where, whether you like it or not, you're representing yourself as part of the Marquette community.  For better or worse, a college sports message board isn't the same as some other random board like fans of collector cars, video games, or even pro sports.  A college sports fan base is always associated with the school, particularly for a place like MU where alumni make up the vast majority of the fan base, as opposed to a place like Texas or Ohio State.  This entire fiasco, from the handling of everything by the coaching staff, to the reaction of our fans on message boards, hasn't reflected well on the Marquette community, and personally, I'm embarrassed by the whole thing.

I think a rodent reading all of this holier than thou morale high horse BS on here the last couple of days could only reach the conclusion that they were correct in their assumptions of MU.  Makes me sick. 

[Pakuni]

Actually, getting it declared null and void is a very specific thing for very specific reasons, several of which wouldn't come into play here because they are based upon waiting until classes start, which isn't likely to happen.

Not necessarily. At least no by my reading of thje NLI provisions:

Admissions Requirement. This NLI shall be declared null and void if the institution named in this document notifies me in writing that I have been denied admission or, by the opening day of classes in fall 2010, has failed to provide me with written notice of admission, provided I have submitted a complete admission application.  It is my obligation to provide, by request, my academic records and an application for admission to the signing institution.  If I fail to submit the necessary academic credentials and/or application to determine an admission decision prior to September 1, the NLI shall be declared null and void.

http://www.ncaa.org/wps/wcm/connect/nli/NLI/NLI+Provisions/Letter+Becomes+Null+and+Void

So, by my reading at least, if MU sends Newbill a letter denying him admission - as the school is entitled to do at any time - the NLI would be declared null and void.

[79Warrior]

I never said we knew the whole story, and i never said we should fire buzz.  I mentioned many times that this story is based on speculation, and should only be considered if the worst scenario that has been written about on this board and others is true.

Either way your post is Sh##.

[Daniel]

We have hit rock bottom with this thread being posted.  None of us know the details.  This is the end of the story.   Really. . . let's end this madness and over the top reaction. I'm done.

[KipsBayEagle]

Either way your post is Sh##.

Then its sh##.  At least its something different to read.

[4everwarriors]

Then maybe Fr. Wild should fire himself also.

[Litehouse]

I think a rodent reading all of this holier than thou morale high horse BS on here the last couple of days could only reach the conclusion that they were correct in their assumptions of MU.  Makes me sick. 

I didn't write that as some holier than thou BS, I wrote it in response to some of the "Hey, it's just a message board" excuses for making all these ridiculous posts.  I'm embarrssed by the over-reactions of fans on both sides, from the fire Buzz threads, to the threads drawing comparisons to schools like FSU and USC.  Even if the IWB version is 100% true, I'm not thrilled we took a conditional NLI knowing the kid might not end up here because I think the negatives outweigh the positives.  I tend to believe events were closer to IWB's account and Newbill knew this was a possibility.  I questioned why we signed Newbill in the first place since he would be our 6th guard and we had a much bigger need up front.  I'm happy we have Wilson now, but we should have never let Newbill sign the NLI in the first place.

[bma725]

Not necessarily. At least no by my reading of thje NLI provisions:

Admissions Requirement. This NLI shall be declared null and void if the institution named in this document notifies me in writing that I have been denied admission or, by the opening day of classes in fall 2010, has failed to provide me with written notice of admission, provided I have submitted a complete admission application.  It is my obligation to provide, by request, my academic records and an application for admission to the signing institution.  If I fail to submit the necessary academic credentials and/or application to determine an admission decision prior to September 1, the NLI shall be declared null and void.

http://www.ncaa.org/wps/wcm/connect/nli/NLI/NLI+Provisions/Letter+Becomes+Null+and+Void

So, by my reading at least, if MU sends Newbill a letter denying him admission - as the school is entitled to do at any time - the NLI would be declared null and void.

Problem is that only comes into play if the NLI is still in effect prior to it being declared null and void, meaning that the player has not yet requested or been granted a release.  If he/she has already been released then that is no longer an option.  

[ATL MU Warrior]

I didn't write that as some holier than thou BS, I wrote it in response to some of the "Hey, it's just a message board" excuses for making all these ridiculous posts.  I'm embarrssed by the over-reactions of fans on both sides, from the fire Buzz threads, to the threads drawing comparisons to schools like FSU and USC.  Even if the IWB version is 100% true, I'm not thrilled we took a conditional NLI knowing the kid might not end up here because I think the negatives outweigh the positives.  I tend to believe events were closer to IWB's account and Newbill knew this was a possibility.  I questioned why we signed Newbill in the first place since he would be our 6th guard and we had a much bigger need up front.  I'm happy we have Wilson now, but we should have never let Newbill sign the NLI in the first place.

I wasn't necessarily referring to you or the entirety of your post (which I happen to agree with) but the section about how it reflected on the MU community.  Should have bolded that poart of your statement.  my bad.

[KipsBayEagle]

I didn't write that as some holier than thou BS, I wrote it in response to some of the "Hey, it's just a message board" excuses for making all these ridiculous posts.  I'm embarrssed by the over-reactions of fans on both sides, from the fire Buzz threads, to the threads drawing comparisons to schools like FSU and USC.  Even if the IWB version is 100% true, I'm not thrilled we took a conditional NLI knowing the kid might not end up here because I think the negatives outweigh the positives.  I tend to believe events were closer to IWB's account and Newbill knew this was a possibility.  I questioned why we signed Newbill in the first place since he would be our 6th guard and we had a much bigger need up front.  I'm happy we have Wilson now, but we should have never let Newbill sign the NLI in the first place.

Thats the whole thing though.  This is a message board.  This is where you can venture into the ridculous arguments.  This is where you can throw out controversial, maybe even radical ideas/opinions.  I don't even nessicarrily agree with my post on this issue, but I think its an interesting take on the situation thus far.  My post, whether you disagree with it or not, cited no incorrect information, misquoted no one, and from the very beginning was represented as a piece that was meant to be interpreted in the context of a worst case scenario, and at its heart was never meant to be taken that seriously.  If someone were to base their opinions on Marquette from a message board, do you really want a person like that to be part of the Marquette community?

[pbiflyer]

Not necessarily. At least no by my reading of thje NLI provisions:

Admissions Requirement. This NLI shall be declared null and void if the institution named in this document notifies me in writing that I have been denied admission or, by the opening day of classes in fall 2010, has failed to provide me with written notice of admission, provided I have submitted a complete admission application.  It is my obligation to provide, by request, my academic records and an application for admission to the signing institution.  If I fail to submit the necessary academic credentials and/or application to determine an admission decision prior to September 1, the NLI shall be declared null and void.
http://www.ncaa.org/wps/wcm/connect/nli/NLI/NLI+Provisions/Letter+Becomes+Null+and+Void

So, by my reading at least, if MU sends Newbill a letter denying him admission - as the school is entitled to do at any time - the NLI would be declared null and void.

Except that he never sent in a complete admission application, which is, according to the NLI (in the Chico style) HIS responsibility.

[Chili]

Thats the whole thing though.  This is a message board.  This is where you can venture into the ridculous arguments.  This is where you can throw out controversial, maybe even radical ideas/opinions.  I don't even nessicarrily agree with my post on this issue, but I think its an interesting take on the situation thus far.  My post, whether you disagree with it or not, cited no incorrect information, misquoted no one, and from the very beginning was represented as a piece that was meant to be interpreted in the context of a worst case scenario, and at its heart was never meant to be taken that seriously.  If someone were to base their opinions on Marquette from a message board, do you really want a person like that to be part of the Marquette community?

Did you live under power lines as a kid, or something?

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

I know that coming to a conclusion about any of this is premature.  We do not have all the facts, either side of the story, or any conditions that were put in place before newbill was signed.  But for arguments sake, lets say this plays out in the worst case scenario that has been mentioned on this board and other sources.  Is this a fireable offense, and if so, should Coach Williams be fired for it.  If this scenario has played out as it has, I have to say yes.  

The number one source of pride for me in watching in marquette hasn't been the winning or success our players have had in the pros, its really been the way the program and the school have handled themselves with class.  I remember 2 years ago during March madness, wesley matthews had an interview with greg gumbel that my brother watched, and he commented "Wow, he was very articulate and handled himself really well."  programs like Kentucky may win, but they do their university at times a great disservice in how they do it.  Constantly recruiting one and dones, and hiring a coach of moral ambiguity have led to constant pot shots not just towards the basketball program, but at the university as a whole.  If this event is as bad as some have imagined and speculated, this is an offense that I believe can not be overlooked.  To ruin a young mans (some would say still a kid) life in the hopes of improving your basketball program is not something that I want roaming around in Marquettes closet, and while it may be an action taken simply by a coach, it is an action that permeates through more than just the basketball team and its staff, but rather through the whole university.  

Coach Williams silence on this issue has also not done the University any favors.  By keeping quiet, he has allowed this story to linger, fester, and to allow heresay and rampant spectulation grab ahold of it like a run away train, making any explanation now feel more like a cover job rather than a truthful representation of the facts.  You can knock Calipari all you want for the controversy surronding him, but if anything, he has always gotten in trouble for trying to help his players.  Pitinos actions a year ago were highly immoral, but does it have anywhere near the implications or effect on anyone on the Louisville team that our staffs has had on one of our own?  I mention again at the end of this that this is a story done on speculation and is only to be considered if the worst scenario that has been mentioned, or one close to it is true.  We could find out in some time that this was done was not anything like we have come to think of it as.  But if it is, it would be a blackeye on this program that can never be fully healed, and in my opinion, action mus than be taken.

No. This is not a "fireable" offense.

Mistake? Probably.

Miscommunication? Yes.

Fireable? Nope.

[leftcoast warrior]

This is one of the dumber posts I have read in a long while.  You have got to have better things to do with your time

[KipsBayEagle]

Look i'll just end this thread right here.  I think that if you push a recruit you have signed to a nli out the door at the drop of a hat without any notice to the player because someone better became available after the signing deadline 2 months before school starts, making it impossible for him to sign with another big east school which he has offers from, that is a fireable offense.  In no way did I ever mention that this is what happened.  In no way did i advocate the firing of Buzz Williams. If you disagree with this that is fine.  If you agree with it, that is fine.  This is what the first post said in less verbose language.  We can all stop talking about this since it clearly has upset everyone far too much.

[bilsu]

I do not think it is a fireable offense. However, I can see the Fr. Wild telling Buzz to never do it again. Given that, a repeat of this would be a fireable offense.