If the SEC was run by a genius...

[Dawson Rental]

If the SEC was run by a genius... 
They would try to go to 16 schools by issuing the following invitations:
1. North Carolina
2. Oklahoma
3. Texas
4. Texas A&M

They'd instantly be numero uno in both basketball and football.  That's a TV package I couldn't screw up selling.
And all the schools are in a natural expansion area for the league. 

[ChicosBailBonds]

If the SEC was run by a genius... 
They would try to go to 16 schools by issuing the following invitations:
1. North Carolina
2. Oklahoma
3. Texas
4. Texas A&M

They'd instantly be numero uno in both basketball and football.  That's a TV package I couldn't screw up selling.
And all the schools are in a natural expansion area for the league. 

But you would have UNC fans screaming bloody murder about not being in a conference with Duke, NC State and Wake.   The other three might work, though they presents other internal issues as well.

[bma725]

If the SEC was run by a genius... 
They would try to go to 16 schools by issuing the following invitations:
1. North Carolina
2. Oklahoma
3. Texas
4. Texas A&M

They'd instantly be numero uno in both basketball and football.  That's a TV package I couldn't screw up selling.
And all the schools are in a natural expansion area for the league. 

There's just no way the TX legislature is going to let UT go without taking at least Tech and probably Tech and Baylor with them.

[chapman]

There's just no way the TX legislature is going to let UT go without taking at least Tech and probably Tech and Baylor with them.

Same with OK and OK State it seems.  And with the exception of maybe Wake the four NC schools are almost certainly a package deal as well.

Given the SEC's current state it already looks like they're being run by a genius.  I'll let that person call the shots on how they deal with their conference membership.

[GGGG]

I know some A&M people who wouldn't mind going to the SEC and leaving Texas behind.

[Aughnanure]

If the SEC expands like the Pac-10 and Big-Ten seem like they will --that is based on gaining TV markets-- I think this is much more likely (assuming its impossible to get Texas and just Texas A&M b/c of Texas politics):

Virginia Tech
North Carolina
Florida State
Miami

You cut off Florida for good from any other conference, and no ACC team will be in position to turn down an offer into the SEC. You add more markets and very good teams with Virginia Tech being the best ACC football school in the past decade or so along with a basketball machine in North Carolina and all the talent in that state. Miami technically adds a market also.

I dont get it when I hear sports talk guys and columnists throwing out the idea of the SEC adding Clemson and Georgia Tech. Does that really increase any television revenue?

[avid1010]

If the SEC was run by a genius... 
They would try to go to 16 schools by issuing the following invitations:
1. North Carolina
2. Oklahoma
3. Texas
4. Texas A&M

They'd instantly be numero uno in both basketball and football.  That's a TV package I couldn't screw up selling.
And all the schools are in a natural expansion area for the league. 

You don't have to be a genius to know why that idea isn't possible. 

[karavotsos]

I know some A&M people who wouldn't mind going to the SEC and leaving Texas behind.

Mike Sherman?

[Dawson Rental]

I dont get it when I hear sports talk guys and columnists throwing out the idea of the SEC adding Clemson and Georgia Tech. Does that really increase any television revenue?

They're not tuned in to the reasons for expanding.  They just see the geography and think; "Oh, there's two ACC schools that are in SEC territory."  I'm only surprised that they didn't think to mention Southern Mississippi. 


(Yes, I know that Florida State and Miami are in the ACC).

[GGGG]

They're not tuned in to the reasons for expanding.  They just see the geography and think; "Oh, there's two ACC schools that are in SEC territory."  I'm only surprised that they didn't think to mention Southern Mississippi. 

Yes...thank you.  They think, "Well, they're close and they're decent."  That's what drove the last round of expansion.

[Aughnanure]

They're not tuned in to the reasons for expanding.  They just see the geography and think; "Oh, there's two ACC schools that are in SEC territory."  I'm only surprised that they didn't think to mention Southern Mississippi. 


(Yes, I know that Florida State and Miami are in the ACC).

Haha, thanks. Miami at least adds a big TV market.  Hell, you could even argue adding Kansas instead of Florida State. But Clemson and Georgia Tech make absolutely no sense.

[texaswarrior74]

But you would have UNC fans screaming bloody murder about not being in a conference with Duke, NC State and Wake.   The other three might work, though they presents other internal issues as well.

Truth be told, UNC would not want to lose the the dook rivalry, would not be concerned about Wake,and in reality, the State rivalry is one that matters far more to State fans than UNC fans.

If the SEC expands like the Pac-10 and Big-Ten seem like they will --that is based on gaining TV markets-- I think this is much more likely (assuming its impossible to get Texas and just Texas A&M b/c of Texas politics):

Virginia Tech
North Carolina
Florida State
Miami

Miami can't even draw a decent crowd for home games, they won't bring any "big market" TV with them either....not that attractive from a TV perspective...their alumni base is more along the east coast and northeast than in Florida.

After the way the Virginia legislature forced VT down the throats of the ACC (over Syracuse) during the last expansion, VT isn't going anywhere unless the ACC totally collapses, or UVA goes with them.

Florida doesn't want FSU or Miami in the SEC.....makes recruiting more difficult for them.

[Aughnanure]

Truth be told, UNC would not want to lose the the dook rivalry, would not be concerned about Wake,and in reality, the State rivalry is one that matters far more to State fans than UNC fans.

Miami can't even draw a decent crowd for home games, they won't bring any "big market" TV with them either....not that attractive from a TV perspective...their alumni base is more along the east coast and northeast than in Florida.

After the way the Virginia legislature forced VT down the throats of the ACC (over Syracuse) during the last expansion, VT isn't going anywhere unless the ACC totally collapses, or UVA goes with them.

Florida doesn't want FSU or Miami in the SEC.....makes recruiting more difficult for them.

Gonna have to disagree on some points, especially your Miami one. It does not matter AT ALL how much their home crowds are. Miami is another direct television market you can have to put your games on and receive revenue from because it will be on the cable package automatically. Miami, furthermore, is a HUGE name in college football and their name, tradition, national reach and presence in the NFL are all so positive that it makes total sense.

FSU may be another matter, but Florida is such a rich state talent-wise and you basically corner that market for one conference with this move. It makes it that much harder for Texas and California to move into the state and I guarantee they add enough of a name and national following for it to still be a boom in TV contract revenue for the SEC. Plus Florida is such a heavily populous state, you do add TV markets and definitely lock up every single television in Florida to the SEC deal and future television network.

My other issue is that you are arguing that the Virginia legislature will keep Va Tech from going to the SEC but that the Florida legislature would not object to the SEC expanding without the other two main schools in Florida and all but assuring those schools get left out in the cold of the most powerful conferences. There is A LOT of money to be made off of those rivalries every year. FSU may be debatable, but Miami is a perfect fit.

On Va Tech? Yeah, I know thats the biggest reach. I still dont buy that the legislatures will have that much power to stop some school moving, or to push for some school to move. This is a different landscape then it was in the early 2000s and mid 1990s, and everyone is much more aware that there are a limited number of spots available--and that being in the 4th 16-team conference is basically surviving out b/c of no other options, not thriving.

If the Big Ten and Pac-10 move to 16, I dont think the Big12, Big East or ACC team will be in any position to turn down an invitation to the SEC.

[ChicosBailBonds]

Truth be told, UNC would not want to lose the the dook rivalry, would not be concerned about Wake,and in reality, the State rivalry is one that matters far more to State fans than UNC fans.

The UNC - State football game is big.

[GGGG]

Gonna have to disagree on some points, especially your Miami one. It does not matter AT ALL how much their home crowds are. Miami is another direct television market you can have to put your games on and receive revenue from because it will be on the cable package automatically. Miami, furthermore, is a HUGE name in college football and their name, tradition, national reach and presence in the NFL are all so positive that it makes total sense.

FSU may be another matter, but Florida is such a rich state talent-wise and you basically corner that market for one conference with this move. It makes it that much harder for Texas and California to move into the state and I guarantee they add enough of a name and national following for it to still be a boom in TV contract revenue for the SEC. Plus Florida is such a heavily populous state, you do add TV markets and definitely lock up every single television in Florida to the SEC deal and future television network.

It's all about increasing "per team revenue."  I'm sorry but I don't think Miami would do that.  Miami is way more of a national name than it is local.  It is by far and away the least popular of the "big 3" within the state of Florida.  If the goals is to get a SEC Network into the cable homes of Florida, you can do it without either Miami or Florida State.

They would need new markets.  Virginia Tech is a new market.  North Carolina is a new market.  Texas is a new market.  Florida State isn't.  Miami isn't.  Clemson isn't.  Georgia Tech isn't.  Honestly, the SEC is pinned in a little, but that may be OK...they do pretty well with 12.

[Mayor McCheese]

Maybe if every conference were being run by geniueses, they would just leave everything alone, exactly what is going to happen.

[Aughnanure]

It's all about increasing "per team revenue."  I'm sorry but I don't think Miami would do that.  Miami is way more of a national name than it is local.  It is by far and away the least popular of the "big 3" within the state of Florida.  If the goals is to get a SEC Network into the cable homes of Florida, you can do it without either Miami or Florida State.

They would need new markets.  Virginia Tech is a new market.  North Carolina is a new market.  Texas is a new market.  Florida State isn't.  Miami isn't.  Clemson isn't.  Georgia Tech isn't.  Honestly, the SEC is pinned in a little, but that may be OK...they do pretty well with 12.

So the Big Ten is adding Nebraska for the Omaha market? No, they are adding them because when people see Nebraska playing on TV they will stop and watch. Same goes for Miami. I cannot disagree with you more about Miami not being able to add enough per-team revenue. The increase in automatic cable subscribers and its ratings would be significant by itself. Gainesville is not close to Miami, and the SEC has nothing in South Florida. Basically, Florida is sitting their all alone in-between Miami and Atlanta-- there is enough of a market to add.

[GGGG]

So the Big Ten is adding Nebraska for the Omaha market? No, they are adding them because when people see Nebraska playing on TV they will stop and watch. Same goes for Miami. I cannot disagree with you more about Miami not being able to add enough per-team revenue. The increase in automatic cable subscribers and its ratings would be significant by itself. Gainesville is not close to Miami, and the SEC has nothing in South Florida. Basically, Florida is sitting their all alone in-between Miami and Atlanta-- there is enough of a market to add.

I just don't think Miami is the local draw that you think it is.  Hell, you make some good points, and I could very well be wrong.

[T-Bone]

What about a SEC/BigEast/ACC split?

SEC East (10) - Florida, Miami, Clemson, Georgia Tech, NC, SC, NC State, Duke, USF,  Rutgers.
SEC West (10) - Kentucky, Tennessee, bama, Auburn, LSU, Ole Miss, MSU, Arkansas, Lousiville, Georgia.

BE North (10) - BC*, Prov, SJU, Syracuse*, Marquette, DePaul, ND**, Pitt*, Seton Hall, UConn*.
BE South (10) - Cinci*, G-Town, Maryland*, Wake*, VA*, VA Tech*, WVU*, FSU*, Vandy*, Nova.

* - Football (Nova's a stretch).
** - elitist bastards.

That dissolves the ACC and puts them in with the others (league names aren't important - as long as it's not the Great Midwest).  Keeps some rivalries intact.  Maybe balance the football schools in the BE alignment to go 6 vs 6.

I'd be happy with that realignment. 

[Aughnanure]

I just don't think Miami is the local draw that you think it is.  Hell, you make some good points, and I could very well be wrong.

And I guess my point is that it doesn't matter what the local TV ratings are. With Miami you are automatically on the cable packages of the entire South Florida region, which helps in negotiating for future TV deals. People argue the same thing about no one caring about Rutgers football in New Jersey and New York...but you still get the market advantage off having them in your TV deal.

[Dawson Rental]

What about a SEC/BigEast/ACC split?

SEC East (10) - Florida, Miami, Clemson, Georgia Tech, NC, SC, NC State, Duke, USF,  Rutgers.
SEC West (10) - Kentucky, Tennessee, bama, Auburn, LSU, Ole Miss, MSU, Arkansas, Lousiville, Georgia.

BE North (10) - BC*, Prov, SJU, Syracuse*, Marquette, DePaul, ND**, Pitt*, Seton Hall, UConn*.
BE South (10) - Cinci*, G-Town, Maryland*, Wake*, VA*, VA Tech*, WVU*, FSU*, Vandy*, Nova.

* - Football (Nova's a stretch).
** - elitist bastards.

That dissolves the ACC and puts them in with the others (league names aren't important - as long as it's not the Great Midwest).  Keeps some rivalries intact.  Maybe balance the football schools in the BE alignment to go 6 vs 6.

I'd be happy with that realignment. 

Suggested Name: The Unwieldy Conglomeration Conference

[T-Bone]

Suggested Name: The Unwieldy Conglomeration Conference

Totally agree.  But the trend is to get bigger. 

From http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/college/ct-spt-0610-pac-10-expansion--20100609,0,6699488.story:
"Southeastern Conference Commissioner Mike Slive said at April's Bowl Championship Series meetings that he was not going to stand back and let any conference become bigger and stronger than his powerhouse.

The SEC could raid the Atlantic Coast Conference, the remaining six schools from the Big 12 could align with teams from the Big East, and college football could end up with four, 16-team conferences.

And then there's the Mountain West, which has long sought automatic-qualifier status in the BCS. It could bolster its position by adding Big 12 leftovers."

Granted, it's a reporter's view and speculation, but it's a possibility.

[Dawson Rental]

Totally agree.  But the trend is to get bigger. 

From http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/college/ct-spt-0610-pac-10-expansion--20100609,0,6699488.story:
"Southeastern Conference Commissioner Mike Slive said at April's Bowl Championship Series meetings that he was not going to stand back and let any conference become bigger and stronger than his powerhouse.

The SEC could raid the Atlantic Coast Conference, the remaining six schools from the Big 12 could align with teams from the Big East, and college football could end up with four, 16-team conferences.

And then there's the Mountain West, which has long sought automatic-qualifier status in the BCS. It could bolster its position by adding Big 12 leftovers."

Granted, it's a reporter's view and speculation, but it's a possibility.

Bigger, yes, but 40!  At that size, the conference commissioner job becomes herding cats.

[T-Bone]

Bigger, yes, but 40!  At that size, the conference commissioner job becomes herding cats.

Well 20 per conference (each conference with 2 divisions) with the merger of SEC, ACC, and BE is what I was speculating.  Yeah, it's huge, but...

[Aughnanure]

Well 20 per conference (each conference with 2 divisions) with the merger of SEC, ACC, and BE is what I was speculating.  Yeah, it's huge, but...

I actually really like the idea of four 20 team conferences. You really don't leave anyone out and basically we all go back to the classic 10 team conferences because you will barely play the other division (especially in football).

Its a natural playoff system also. 8 Division Champions play for Conference Championships, those 4 Champions then play for the overall championship.