Gardner says...

[Lennys Tap]

I am sorry, but this is immoral.  If you offer a kid a scholarship and he accepts, and he is qualified and does we has to do, end of discussion.  he is coming.  You don't tell a kid to go to prep school because you have a better kid (and whose to say this gardener kid is any better) waiting in the wings.  "Hey, sweetie, I know i invited you to junior prom, but I just asked out this hotter girl and she accepted.  Why don't you go with steve urkel, than hit the gym, maybe the treadmill, do some ab work, and stand out in the sun and get a little tan.  Then when senior prom comes around, you will be a lock no questions asked."  Buzz may be upfront and honest about him wanting to go to prep school, but just because your honest doesn't make ir right.  (side note: this is all speculation, just as most of the last 20 or so posts on this thread have been )

Speculating that our coach is "immoral" and that he 86ed Newbill because a better(?) player came along is pretty serious. Why go there before we know the facts?

[KipsBayEagle]

Well, as i said in my original post this all based off speculation, so there ya go.

[Golden Avalanche]

Okay so you have a bunch of unconfirmable (by anyone but you, apparently) reports that Newbill is going the prep route, not because of grades, but to trim the roster.  And we are supposed to just eat that up and pat you on the back?  I'm sorry, but I was raised, and educated better than to just accept heresay, and conjecture.  I full apologize for asking for concrete facts, my bad.

I am taking you to task for you misrepresenting (considering the lack of evidence) your BELIEFS as FACT.

This isn't difficult to understand.

Additionally, how do you KNOW that Markus Kennedy has qualified to play at Villanova?  It is too early to tell, is it not?

There are 15 informed opinions that are taken as fact on this board every day. Hell, there are some posters whose words are taken as gospel; they never write falsehoods in the eyes of many and are never questioned.

I'm not sure why my informed opinion on this matter is so contentious for you -- especially since two other posters in this thread have the same opinion as me and spelled it out pretty well.

[MuMark]

So you have no problem with speculating that someone is "immoral" with out any evidence to support your charge?  

[KipsBayEagle]

So you have no problem with speculating that someone is "immoral" with out any evidence to support your charge?  

I can speculate anything I want.  And I was speculating that if DJ newbill was signed to a scholarship and is now being asked to go to prep school even though he qualified that that is immoral.

[Hards Alumni]

There are 15 informed opinions that are taken as fact on this board every day. Hell, there are some posters whose words are taken as gospel; they never write falsehoods in the eyes of many and are never questioned.

I'm not sure why my informed opinion on this matter is so contentious for you -- especially since two other posters in this thread have the same opinion as me and spelled it out pretty well.

So basically, I'm a dick for calling you out.  Okay.  I'm cool with that.

I don't anyone's word as gospel.  In fact, I scrutenize most posts here.  Some posters, over time, have proven themselves reliable... others, not so much.

You haven't really posted any insider information that you can back up with other than naming 'private sources'.  Who are you, Mark Halperin?

[LON]

So basically, I'm a dick for calling you out.  Okay.  I'm cool with that.

I don't anyone's word as gospel.  In fact, I scrutenize most posts here.  Some posters, over time, have proven themselves reliable... others, not so much.

You haven't really posted any insider information that you can back up with other than naming 'private sources'.  Who are you, Mark Halperin?

+1

[Lennys Tap]

I can speculate anything I want.  And I was speculating that if DJ newbill was signed to a scholarship and is now being asked to go to prep school even though he qualified that that is immoral.

You're right. It's a free country and you can speculate anything you want. And whether the scenario you present amounts to immorality is a point worthy of discussion. But to call people immoral without knowing if the scenario is true is reckless speculation. And that's unfair.

[damuts222]

You're right. It's a free country and you can speculate anything you want. And whether the scenario you present amounts to immorality is a point worthy of discussion. But to call people immoral without knowing if the scenario is true is reckless speculation. And that's unfair.

 Especially when, to this point, Buzz has done nothing but been a great ambassador for MU basketball as well as the university. The answer to our questions will come, you can speculate all you want but what good does that do. Assumptions make an a$$ out of you and me.

[KipsBayEagle]

You're right. It's a free country and you can speculate anything you want. And whether the scenario you present amounts to immorality is a point worthy of discussion. But to call people immoral without knowing if the scenario is true is reckless speculation. And that's unfair.

I said THIS IS IMMORAL, NOT HE

[Golden Avalanche]

So basically, I'm a dick for calling you out.  Okay.  I'm cool with that.

I don't anyone's word as gospel.  In fact, I scrutenize most posts here.  Some posters, over time, have proven themselves reliable... others, not so much.

You haven't really posted any insider information that you can back up with other than naming 'private sources'.  Who are you, Mark Halperin?

Hey, I understand being skeptical about the internet. That's cool. It shouldn't be this serious. Just an informed opinion on the particular matter. We'll see what happens.

[bilsu]

If it is Newbill than he was recruited with the idea he was going to prep school. Buzz would have told him we really like you, but we need to use our last scholarship on a bigman. Would you be willing to sign with us and go to prep school for a year. That is a very good offer for a player who was not at the time being recruited by anyone of significance. Outside of that, I believe the people that rather have Smith than Newbill are wrong. All Smith is a player with great atleticism. Newbill is better than Smith.

[Marquette84]

Apparently a lot of you are not aware of the recruiting rules...and that is understandable as it is confusing. But...Once the recruit signs a LOI with MU(or any school) there is a "recruiting ban" in place, even if he doesn't enroll in that school for a year. So, NO ONE can contact any of the recruits until November of next year. Which means, they are going to prep with full intentions of returning to MU in 2011. It's a heck of a smart strategy by Buzz, as it is essentially "stashing" players, and it will also take care of 2011's recruiting class, sans for Mr. Dawson.

Right from the NCAA handbook:

RECRUITING BAN AFTER SIGNING: The NLI Recruiting Ban remains in effect until the prospective student-athlete enrolls at the signing institution or if the prospective student-athlete does not enroll at the signing institution, the recruiting ban will be lifted after the signing institution's next academic year has elapsed. For example, the prospective student-athlete signs in 2009-10 and does not subsequently enroll at that institution for the 2010-11 academic year, the recruiting ban would be lifted at the end of the 2010-11 academic year. Once a student enrolls at the signing institution he or she is governed by applicable NCAA recruiting bylaws.

You're missing a couple of key provisions.  If the player goes prep because they don't meet MU's admission requirements, or because they don't meet the NCAA's minimums, the NLI no longer applies:

Letter Becomes Null and Void. This NLI shall be declared null and void if any of the following occur:

a.             Admissions Requirement.  This NLI shall be declared null and void if the institution named in this document notifies me in writing that I have been denied admission or, by the opening day of classes in fall 2010, has failed to provide me with written notice of admission, provided I have submitted a complete admission application.  It is my obligation to provide, by request, my academic records and an application for admission to the signing institution.  If I fail to submit the necessary academic credentials and/or application to determine an admission decision prior to September 1, the NLI shall be declared null and void.

b.             Eligibility Requirements.  This NLI shall be declared null and void if, by the opening day of classes in fall 2010, I have not met (1) the institution’s requirements for admissions; (2) its academic requirements for financial aid to student-athletes; or (3) the NCAA requirements for financial aid (NCAA Bylaw 14.3) or the two-year college transfer requirements, provided I have submitted all necessary documents for eligibility determination.

There are a few others, such as the school dropping the sport, recruiting violations, service in the military, or serving in a church mission.

[Hards Alumni]

Hey, I understand being skeptical about the internet. That's cool. It shouldn't be this serious. Just an informed opinion on the particular matter. We'll see what happens.

maybe an informed opinion

[Lennys Tap]

I said THIS IS IMMORAL, NOT HE

OK, this thing you speculate he is doing (without a scintella of evidence) is immoral (in your opinion). You think that's fair. I don't.

[Litehouse]

You're missing a couple of key provisions.  If the player goes prep because they don't meet MU's admission requirements, or because they don't meet the NCAA's minimums, the NLI no longer applies:

But the point of the discussion is that the player would meet MU admission's requirements and the NCAA minimums and still go to prep school.

[bilsu]

I think the other point to take into consideration is that MU cannot force a player to go to prep school. The player is guaranteed a one year scholarship (assuming he meets the admission standards) at MU once he signs the LOI. Therefore, the player would have to make the choice to go to a prep school and prep schools cost money. Whatever happens I think you can be very sure the agreement between Buzz and the player was worked out before the player signed.

[Benny B]

Application of the words 'probable,' 'possible' and 'NFW'.

It is possible that one of the incoming freshman is going to prep school.

It is possible that prep school was the plan all along.

It is possible that prep school is now plan B because someone didn't or is not going to qualify.

It is probable that if there was a chance said recruit may not qualify, Buzz knew this when the NLI was signed.

It is possible that when Gardner signed his NLI, Buzz already knew it was probable that said recruit was not going to qualify.

It is probable that if the plan was to go to prep school first then join the team in 2011-12, it was already discussed, agreed upon and in-place when the NLI was signed.

The aforementioned scenario is possible, but not necessarily probable.

It is not probable that Buzz recruited said recruit, and signed Gardner any way without knowing first that it was probable that someone was either transferring, not qualifying or going to prep school.

NFW that any of us actually know what is going on.  It is probable that those who do know are keeping their mouths shut so as to not breach the privacy of any recruit or player.

[KipsBayEagle]

OK, this thing you speculate he is doing (without a scintella of evidence) is immoral (in your opinion). You think that's fair. I don't.

So other people speculating what I speculated is fine, but if I say what they speculated is immoral if it holds true, I am out of bounds?

[pbiflyer]

I said THIS IS IMMORAL, NOT HE

Well, I think Marquette basketball and Buzz will be around a long time, but to call them immortal is a bit overboard.