Can someone enlighten me?

[timinatorx3]

I am just wondering what the advantage is of letting Notre Dame (or any team for that matter) shoot the three in the last seconds when they are down by three? Why wouldn't MU foul someone, anyone, before the shot? Put them on the line for two. Worst case scenario MU is up 1 with the ball and a few seconds left. What are the advantages of letting them tie it?

Also, anyone else think it's weird MU has lost the last 3 senior days in OT??

[NersEllenson]

I am just wondering what the advantage is of letting Notre Dame (or any team for that matter) shoot the three in the last seconds when they are down by three? Why wouldn't MU foul someone, anyone, before the shot? Put them on the line for two. Worst case scenario MU is up 1 with the ball and a few seconds left. What are the advantages of letting them tie it?

Also, anyone else think it's weird MU has lost the last 3 senior days in OT??

You can make a case for fouling sooner..but most coaches will only do that when the game is under 7 or 5 seconds.  When ND started that last possesion in regulation, there were 16 seconds left.  Given some of our late game Free Throw shooting adventures..not sure the wise thing to do is turn the game into a free throw shooting contest.  When Abromitis took the first 3 it was well defended..and he launched with 6 seconds on the clock.  By the time the ball came off for the rebound, was deflected to Hansborough and passed to Carelton...we didn't really have a chance to foul..you could say Lazar could have hacked Nash on the rebound..I guess.  The difference when ND did it to us was we got the ball inbounded with 6 seconds left in the game.

[77ncaachamps]

Doing that would be, for ND, following GumbyPokey's strategy: MU fouls your shooter, shooter hits the first, misses the second on purpose so your player can try to make a two to tie the game.

[timinatorx3]

It doesn't really matter how much time there is on the clock when the ball is inbounded. It only matters how much time there is on the clock when the foul happens.  We could have had the ball for 30 seconds and Notre Dame still could have fouled us with 6 seconds left.  In the situation we were in, we could have fouled anyone on Notre Dame with under 6 seconds before that shot when off.  Foul Hansborough when he passes the ball to Carelton! Foul Carelton when he turns and has his back to the basket! Foul someone else underneath the basket! Anyone with "under 7 or 5 seconds" left!  

[timinatorx3]

Doing that would be, for ND, following GumbyPokey's strategy: MU fouls your shooter, shooter hits the first, misses the second on purpose so your player can try to make a two to tie the game.

But wouldn't it be a lot less likely that they do this successfully than make a three?

[NersEllenson]

It doesn't really matter how much time there is on the clock when the ball is inbounded. It only matters how much time there is on the clock when the foul happens.  We could have had the ball for 30 seconds and Notre Dame still could have fouled us with 6 seconds left.  In the situation we were in, we could have fouled anyone on Notre Dame with under 6 seconds before that shot when off.  Foul Hansborough when he passes the ball to Carelton! Foul Carelton when he turns and has his back to the basket! Foul someone else underneath the basket! Anyone with "under 7 or 5 seconds" left!  

As I've thought about this...I guess I'm going to reverse course and say it probably is the best play to foul..Too many things need to happen in the oppositions favor in order for them to win (they have to either make 2 free throws, choose to intentionally miss..get a rebound, and a make a 2 point shot etc.), as opposed to just 1 thing happening (making the 3 point shot)  I still think time of game matters, and this strategy should only be executed under 7 seconds left in a game at most. 

[Mike Deane's Seat Belt]

absolutely timinator,   how often do you see a game end with a made front end and then the offensive team gets the board and makes a two or even worse a three...

hardly ever.... which is why you freaking foul the team and you get some balls and make the free throws.

you all witnessed exactly the reason for fouling when up three when ND did it to us and crippled our chances for DJO to get a decent look for three, and we didnt even use this mentioned strategy of missing the second free throw on purpose, wow

[ChicosBailBonds]

absolutely timinator,   how often do you see a game end with a made front end and then the offensive team gets the board and makes a two or even worse a three...

hardly ever.... which is why you freaking foul the team and you get some balls and make the free throws.

you all witnessed exactly the reason for fouling when up three when ND did it to us and crippled our chances for DJO to get a decent look for three, and we didnt even use this mentioned strategy of missing the second free throw on purpose, wow

+1

I watched Kevin O'Neill blow the same thing yesterday. Up 3 points at Arizona and he didn't foul right away either.  Instead, his team actually challenged the shot too closely and they were called for a phantom foul with 0.2 seconds.  USC got totally jobbed.  UA made all three free throws to send it into OT where they won.

KO should have fouled a few seconds before that.

[The Man in Gold]

If we rebound the miss, like we should have, none of this is relevant.  We played great D until the very end.  The only time it would have made sense to foul was after we failed to grab a rebound, and even then ND scrambling for a kick out 3.  If you foul, you give the team a chance to reset themselves and anything could happen.  It didn't work out for us this time, and that sucks.

If we would have tried to foul anytime earlier when ND was working it around the perimeter, there is a chance that he puts up a 3 and gets 3 shots, and then its DJ vs. GU deja vu.

[Marquette84]

If we rebound the miss, like we should have, none of this is relevant.  We played great D until the very end.  The only time it would have made sense to foul was after we failed to grab a rebound, and even then ND scrambling for a kick out 3.  If you foul, you give the team a chance to reset themselves and anything could happen.  It didn't work out for us this time, and that sucks.

If we would have tried to foul anytime earlier when ND was working it around the perimeter, there is a chance that he puts up a 3 and gets 3 shots, and then its DJ vs. GU deja vu.

Actually, we shouldn't have tried for the rebound at all.  When the first shot went up every one of our players should have made a beeline for the 3 point zone, and guarded any open man and prevented the outlet pass. 

In fact, we should have left the paint completely empty and tempted ND with a wide-open putback.  Two points gave them nothing, and no defenders eliminates the possibility of a foul on the shot with resulting free throw.

[The Man in Gold]

Actually, we shouldn't have tried for the rebound at all.  When the first shot went up every one of our players should have made a beeline for the 3 point zone, and guarded any open man and prevented the outlet pass. 

In fact, we should have left the paint completely empty and tempted ND with a wide-open putback.  Two points gave them nothing, and no defenders eliminates the possibility of a foul on the shot with resulting free throw.

Have you ever seen that happen?  Hindsight is 20/20.

[IAmMarquette]

Have you ever seen that happen?  Hindsight is 20/20.

I was thinking the same thing. It's a decent idea, but it goes against basically everything you're taught at every level of basketball.

[jsglow]

I think this just fits into the category of "stuff happens".  We played great D; the ball got knocked away after the rebound; and a pass to an open look 3 resulted in a tie.  It took all of a couple of seconds.  Folks react as best they can in that situation.

By the way, I had a great angle on the shot from my cheap seats.  I knew it was good as soon as the shooter let it go.

Anyway, sometimes a loss at this time of the year is actually healthy.  If MU wins an NCAA game (or even two), we'll quickly forget the ND game.

And let's all remember, its been a GREAT year.