OT: Superbowl

[IAmMarquette]

BTW, that first full season argument is nothing but bogus, desperate rationalization/wishful thinking on the part of Bears fans. Rex Grossman just finished his fourth season in the league. What's he been doing the past three years while he was hurt, sitting on a beach somewhere? Favre's "first full season" was his 2nd year on the league when he played 15 games - 3227 yds, 18 TD's and 13 Int's, 85.3 QB rating. Peyton Manning's "first full season," was his rookie season.

I couldn't disagree more.  There is nothing that will develop a player as much as pure playing time....in a game.  Grossman was injured and rehabilitating....not practicing.  So, by watching film and holding a clipboard for two years he should've somehow come into his own and stepped on the field as a 4th year veteran? 

Tom. Brady.

[dwaderoy2004]

great example buddy.  because he is a once in a lifetime anomaly, not the rule.  rex grossman is the norm, i guy who in his first full season had some really great moments and some really poor moments, just like any other QB not named tom brady.  this qb just happened to take his team to the super bowl in his first full season...

[CWSKeith]

People exalted the Bears team the whole NFL season...they were nothing but a sham offense with a great defense in a weak NFC. They're lucky enough to get this far.

Sham offense?  If their offense is a sham, what does that say the rest of the NFC's offenses who all averaged less PPG than the Bears?  

I'm not putting the Bears up there with Indy, mind you, but it's far from inept.  The running back combo of Benson & Jones is one of the better duos in all of football, and that should improve next year with Benson getting more and more carries.  The offensive line is above average, although aging, and the wide receiver core is decent (nothing special, but good enough).  

Tom. Brady.

He's an exception, not the rule.

Mind you, I'm not 100% behind Grossman.  I don't know what to think at this point.  Grossman did some real nice things this season, but he still has a lot of weaknesses.  He locks on to one receiver way too often, his footwork and overall mechanics are poor -- this is taken to the nth degree when he's not given enough time in the pocket -- and he's very, very slow, much slower than I remember him being while at Florida (and that makes some sense, with the injuries he's had while in a Bears uni).  He throws a pretty good deep ball most of the time, but I question his decision making a lot of the time, too.  For example, there was one play during the game where Grossman got bumped around in the pocket and rolled out, but rather than running for the first down (it was a third down and he had PLENTY of room), he tried to force a ball into Desmond Clark (?), and the ball was nearly picked off.

There's nobody in the draft who could step in in six months and take over, unless the Bears were to trade up (which they won't -- Angelo loves his picks).  So an 'upgrade' would have to come through a trade (Byron Leftwich?), because I don't view Griese as much of an upgrade.

[NavinRJohnson]

So, by watching film and holding a clipboard for two years he should've somehow come into his own and stepped on the field as a 4th year veteran? 

Quite certain that's not what I said, of course game experience is the most valuable thing you can have as a player. But there is a far cry between that and this notion many are clinging too, that those early years count for nothing or that Grossman's situation is somehow similar to Favre or Peyton Manning in particular.

BTW, he did more than hold a clip board and watch film. He went through training camp and started and played actual games in each of his first three seasons - including playoffs.

Tom. Brady.

He's an exception, not the rule.

great example buddy.  because he is a once in a lifetime anomaly, not the rule.  rex grossman is the norm, i guy who in his first full season had some really great moments and some really poor moments, just like any other QB not named tom brady.

Tom Brady, Phillip Rivers, Tony Romo, Drew Brees, Mark Bulger, Jake Delhomme, Matt Hasselback - all had similar experience with little or no playing time their first year or two (Grossman had three). Rex's QB rating in his "first full season" was 73.9. The average "first full season" QB rating of the others listed - 85.8. BTW, all of their individual "first full seasons" were significantly better than Peyton Manning's 71.2 passer rating, who was thrown straight into the fire from day one. Hmmmm.

I like Grossman and think he has potential to be slightly above average. I think that's about as high as his ceiling goes however.

[IAmMarquette]

great example buddy.  because he is a once in a lifetime anomaly, not the rule.  rex grossman is the norm, i guy who in his first full season had some really great moments and some really poor moments, just like any other QB not named tom brady.  this qb just happened to take his team to the super bowl in his first full season...

I think Brady took the Pats to the Super Bowl in his first full season too, right? That's an honest question. I'm trying to remember which year the Pats didn't make the Super Bowl (aside from this one). I know he took over for Bledsoe the year they beat the Rams, and kept the starting job the following season. Did they repeat that year, or was that the one season they didn't make the playoffs?

I'm simply using Brady as the most prominent example of how taking the starting job after a few years on the bench is certainly not the same as starting as a rookie, which seems to be the argument. I don't buy the "first full season" argument. Someone above listed Romo (granted, up & down, and should NOT have made the Pro Bowl...another debate), Hasselbeck, etc as other examples of guys who didn't play full seasons their first few years, but did well once they took the starting job. Grossman certainly had his ups and downs, and played very well in some games, but I don't believe that another year under center (after playing QB his entire life) will keep Rex from fumbling snaps and tripping over his own two feet while dropping back to pass. That's pretty basic stuff for any QB, especially for someone who played QB for a big-time college program and is now 3 years into his NFL career.