Trevor Powell---Where is he now?

[ChicosBailBonds]

So this begs the question . . .

Why would you send your son to his camp in the first place?  Seriously--you hate the man.  You claim he's both a lousy coach and a lousy person. 

Yet, you send YOUR SON--who apparently has options as a player an a "pretty elite" AAU league-- to attend TOM CREAN'S BASKETBALL CAMP???  Of all the basketball camps across the country, you choose the camp run by the one guy you hate more than anyone else in basketball?

I'm sorry, but I don't get it.  You hate the guy, and there are plenty of other options--yet  send your kid to his camp?   

Classic.  He hates Crean, he can't coach or recruit so he sends his own son to a Crean camp.  Incredible.

[CrimsonNCrean]

Classic.  He hates Crean, he can't coach or recruit so he sends his own son to a Crean camp.  Incredible.

That is funny......

[MR.HAYWARD]

So this begs the question . . .

Why would you send your son to his camp in the first place?  Seriously--you hate the man.  You claim he's both a lousy coach and a lousy person. 

Yet, you send YOUR SON--who apparently has options as a player an a "pretty elite" AAU league-- to attend TOM CREAN'S BASKETBALL CAMP???  Of all the basketball camps across the country, you choose the camp run by the one guy you hate more than anyone else in basketball?

I'm sorry, but I don't get it.  You hate the guy, and there are plenty of other options--yet  send your kid to his camp?   

you obviosly did not read my post about the camp itself.  the camp is not very strong but my boys are huge Marquette fans and they love to go.  Therefore they go, i do not put my feeling towards Crean as a person in front of their wanting to go to an Mu basketball camp.  They went during Crean and they went last year too.  I will always support Mu even though i disliked Crean and I would never stand in the way of my kids going to a camp that they wanted to go to.  that is pretty silly what do you want me to do show my disaffection for the guy by not sending my kids.....now thats a statement. 

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

you obviosly did not read my post about the camp itself.  the camp is not very strong but my boys are huge Marquette fans and they love to go.  Therefore they go, i do not put my feeling towards Crean as a person in front of their wanting to go to an Mu basketball camp.  They went during Crean and they went last year too.  I will always support Mu even though i disliked Crean and I would never stand in the way of my kids going to a camp that they wanted to go to.  that is pretty silly what do you want me to do show my disaffection for the guy by not sending my kids.....now thats a statement. 

I want you to use reasonable punctuation and grammar. That would be a statement.

[Lennys Tap]

So this begs the question . . .

Why would you send your son to his camp in the first place?  Seriously--you hate the man.  You claim he's both a lousy coach and a lousy person. 

Yet, you send YOUR SON--who apparently has options as a player an a "pretty elite" AAU league-- to attend TOM CREAN'S BASKETBALL CAMP???  Of all the basketball camps across the country, you choose the camp run by the one guy you hate more than anyone else in basketball?

I'm sorry, but I don't get it.  You hate the guy, and there are plenty of other options--yet  send your kid to his camp?   

I guess Hayward should have "showed" TC by punishing his kids and keeping them away from the Marquette camp (and their heroes - the MU players). Just like Jimmy Carter "showed" the Russians by punishing our athletes and denying them an opportunity to compete. That certainly would have sent an effective message to his kids.

[ChicosBailBonds]

I guess Hayward should have "showed" TC by punishing his kids and keeping them away from the Marquette camp (and their heroes - the MU players). Just like Jimmy Carter "showed" the Russians by punishing our athletes and denying them an opportunity to compete. That certainly would have sent an effective message to his kids.

No, he should have sent his kid(s) to a camp not run by a douche bag (his words), not pouring more money into said douche bag's pockets, and given his kid(s) a chance to improve their basketball prospects as it's clear that Crean can't coach (his words), is a horrible human being (his words), etc, etc.

For all of his bitching incessantly for years about Crean, the fact that he sends his kids to Crean's camps is unbelievably PRICELESS on ANY and EVERY LEVEL.

[PE8983]

If my son wanted to go to an MU camp, be on the floor at the AL, converse with the MU players, etc..., I would send him in a minute regardless of what I thought of TC. 

For you imply Hayward should have stood in his kid's way and taken a stand on his opinion of TC is a joke.

[Lennys Tap]

No, he should have sent his kid(s) to a camp not run by a douche bag (his words), not pouring more money into said douche bag's pockets, and given his kid(s) a chance to improve their basketball prospects as it's clear that Crean can't coach (his words), is a horrible human being (his words), etc, etc.

For all of his bitching incessantly for years about Crean, the fact that he sends his kids to Crean's camps is unbelievably PRICELESS on ANY and EVERY LEVEL.

Actually, your ally on this and most other subjects (2002 mualum) was the one who called TC a douche and he did it more than once. Check the tape.

[ChicosBailBonds]

Actually, your ally on this and most other subjects (2002 mualum) was the one who called TC a douche and he did it more than once. Check the tape.

Excuse me, but Hayward has called Crean a douche and worse on 100's of threads here, I wasn't using just this thread as a reference point for Hayward's opinions.  Check the tapes

[ChicosBailBonds]

If my son wanted to go to an MU camp, be on the floor at the AL, converse with the MU players, etc..., I would send him in a minute regardless of what I thought of TC. 

For you imply Hayward should have stood in his kid's way and taken a stand on his opinion of TC is a joke.

I wonder why the kid wanted to go to a MU camp and play on the Al (a building that didn't exist until Crean got to MU and took them to the Final Four).  And why would he want to converse with MU players, the ones that are such poor players because Crean couldn't recruit and didn't recognize talent....why would his kid want to play with such total rejects when his father has pounded us for years telling us how terrible they are?   

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

Actually, your ally on this and most other subjects (2002 mualum) was the one who called TC a douche and he did it more than once. Check the tape.

You're right. I called him a douche. I've never said the guy was a saint, which I think is lost on you guys some times. Tom Crean is not perfect. NOBODY HAS EVER SAID THAT. But, people have clearly stated cases of how he was good for MU, and that he's a good D1 coach.

On a personal note, I also think that Bill Belicheck (sp) is a douche, but I'd love it if he coached my football team. Same goes for Thad Motta, who left Xavier after he claimed he wouldn't. Pat Riley also appears to be a huge douche, but has won a lot of games in 3 different cities. Same can be said for Larry Brown.

A lot of top coaches are under the microscope and end up looking "douchey" because they have big egos and are usually just looking out for #1.

My neighbor down the street is the exact opposite of "a douche". He's a great guy. However, I wouldn't want him coaching MU's basketball team.

As far as Hayward's use of the word "douche", he can rightfully deny that. But, he can't deny that he uses poor grammar and hates Tom Crean. Those are indisputable.

[PE8983]

"I wonder why the kid wanted to go to a MU camp and play on the Al (a building that didn't exist until Crean got to MU and took them to the Final Four).  And why would he want to converse with MU players, the ones that are such poor players because Crean couldn't recruit and didn't recognize talent....why would his kid want to play with such total rejects when his father has pounded us for years telling us how terrible they are?"

He didn't say his kid had those opinions - he said he did.  Maybe his kid has a favorable opinion of the players and TC as a coach.  Or maybe his kid just loves the players and could care less about the coach.  Maybe he lets his kid form his own opinion of the coach and players, rather than imposing his beliefs.

Again - who is he to step in the way of his child wanting to go to the camp???  If you didn't like TC, but your child wanted to go to the camp, would you prevent him from doing so???  If so, that's pretty lame.

[Lennys Tap]

He gave his son an award as an elite camper, much like other fathers who coach do this all the time in Little League, AYSO, etc.  Case in point, my son's Little League team just had the All-Stars voted on.  My son made it, as he should of (being honest, he was one of the best players in the league) but the coach put his own son on the team as well and voted him in, not a chance in the world his kid is one of the top 14 kids in the league, he wasn't even top 10 on our own team.

But this stuff happens all the time in the real world and the anti-Crean folks basically tacked that up as another reason he's the anti-Christ.  Should he have done it?  Nope.  But parents do silly things sometimes to boost confidence in their kids, show them their love or whatever their thought process is.  Sometimes emotion makes you do silly things for your kids.

Congrats on your son's stellar little league career. Is this chapter 1 in the sequel? How about we call it "Chicos Part Deux: The Next Generation"?

[ChicosBailBonds]

You're right. I called him a douche. I've never said the guy was a saint, which I think is lost on you guys some times. Tom Crean is not perfect. NOBODY HAS EVER SAID THAT. But, people have clearly stated cases of how he was good for MU, and that he's a good D1 coach.

On a personal note, I also think that Bill Belicheck (sp) is a douche, but I'd love it if he coached my football team. Same goes for Thad Motta, who left Xavier after he claimed he wouldn't. Pat Riley also appears to be a huge douche, but has won a lot of games in 3 different cities. Same can be said for Larry Brown.

A lot of top coaches are under the microscope and end up looking "douchey" because they have big egos and are usually just looking out for #1.

My neighbor down the street is the exact opposite of "a douche". He's a great guy. However, I wouldn't want him coaching MU's basketball team.

As far as Hayward's use of the word "douche", he can rightfully deny that. But, he can't deny that he uses poor grammar and hates Tom Crean. Those are indisputable.

+1

[ChicosBailBonds]

Congrats on your son's stellar little league career. Is this chapter 1 in the sequel? How about we call it "Chicos Part Deux: The Next Generation"?

That wasn't the point of the post, but rather to show that coaches put their kids onto teams, give them awards, etc all the time when they shouldn't get it.  How many times in AYSO, Little League, Pop Warner, softball, PONY, high school, etc teams across the country is the coach's kid playing when he probably shouldn't be?  Happens all the damn time.  When I was at IU, Bob was putting Pat into the games when he often had no business being in there. 

Coaches are people, too, and they do things sometimes out of emotion or love that is not in concert with the reality.

As for my son, he'll play a few more years of ball, maybe high school...his choice.  He's good, not great, but he tries hard and is a great kid.  If he continues to play, great.  If he wants to do something else, that's fine, too.  Either way, I'll be there to support him.  But rest assured if I thought a coach was a complete douche, a descpicable human being and felt so compelled in those feelings that I would state them publicly for YEARS, I certainly wouldn't send my son to that coach's camp.  It makes no sense.  You do what you feel is best for your children.  Sending them to someone you find contemptable as a human being, how is that helping your children?

[Robyrd5]

Yes, parents do silly things for their kids, but parents who are coaches should know the position they're in and how their decisions will be scrutinized by other parents. My dad coached me for years, and I never got special treatment. If anything he was harder on me, which I appreciate now. Will Riley look back on those awards believing he honestly deserved them or wonder if he received them for being the coach's kid?

And I applaud Mr. Hayward's decision to put his opinions aside and let his kids go to TC's basketball camp. I'm definitely no Michael Vick fan, but I'd let my kids go to a camp of his if that's what they really wanted, provided there were no seminars on how to be a responsible pet owner or something.

[ChicosBailBonds]

Again - who is he to step in the way of his child wanting to go to the camp???  If you didn't like TC, but your child wanted to go to the camp, would you prevent him from doing so???  If so, that's pretty lame.

This just in....it's called being a parent.  My son may want to go to a rated R movie, too, because it looks cool.  But at his age I'm going to say no.   If my son wanted to go to a baseball camp where the guy is a complete jerk, a turd, doesn't know what he's doing, etc, etc....I'm going to likely say no and put him in a camp where the coach knows what he is doing, where he's going to learn and not be exposed to someone I would feel is a terrible person that is going to harm him in some way as a mentor, etc.

Or, maybe, just maybe the father in this case has overstated just how poor of a coach he is and how descipable a person he is over the last few years.  Just maybe.     More than likely the case because I can't imagine sending someone I love (my child) to a man that is such a douche, such a terrible coach, such a terrible human being, such a poor representative of the human race whether my kid wanted to go or not.   

[ChicosBailBonds]

Yes, parents do silly things for their kids, but parents who are coaches should know the position they're in and how their decisions will be scrutinized by other parents. My dad coached me for years, and I never got special treatment. If anything he was harder on me, which I appreciate now. Will Riley look back on those awards believing he honestly deserved them or wonder if he received them for being the coach's kid?

And I applaud Mr. Hayward's decision to put his opinions aside and let his kids go to TC's basketball camp. I'm definitely no Michael Vick fan, but I'd let my kids go to a camp of his if that's what they really wanted, provided there were no seminars on how to be a responsible pet owner or something.

Yes, I agree that many coaches that are parents are very tough on their own kids.  Happens all the time, perhaps that's why the guilt comes in when rewarding them with starting positions, all star teams, rewards at camps, or whatever.

And I guess everyone parents differently.  There isn't a chance in hell I would let my son go to a Michael Vick camp.  I'd be endorsing Michael Vick which I'm not doing with my money.  Not a chance in hell.

[reinko]

This just in....it's called being a parent.  My son may want to go to a rated R movie, too, because it looks cool.  But at his age I'm going to say no.   If my son wanted to go to a baseball camp where the guy is a complete jerk, a turd, doesn't know what he's doing, etc, etc....I'm going to likely say no and put him in a camp where the coach knows what he is doing, where he's going to learn and not be exposed to someone I would feel is a terrible person that is going to harm him in some way as a mentor, etc.

Or, maybe, just maybe the father in this case has overstated just how poor of a coach he is and how descipable a person he is over the last few years.  Just maybe.     More than likely the case because I can't imagine sending someone I love (my child) to a man that is such a douche, such a terrible coach, such a terrible human being, such a poor representative of the human race whether my kid wanted to go or not.   

+1,000

[StillAWarrior]

Yes, I agree that many coaches that are parents are very tough on their own kids.

This was one of the most frustrating things I experienced when coaching.  I tried so hard to not look like I was favoring my kids, they sometimes got the short end of the stick.  I wouldn't change things, but it was frustrating.

I was, at best, a good baseball player.  I stopped playing after I was 15 because I found other things I liked to do.  However, I'll never forget that in my last year -- the best season I ever had -- hearing my coach say at the awards banquet, "I think there were several kids on the team who deserved the MVP award.  I couldn't decide, so I gave it to my son."

If I were the coach, I would have resolved that situation in exactly the opposite way.  I know that experience definitely influenced how I handled coaching my kids.  And I'm convinced I did the right thing.

[PE8983]

Perhaps you're exaggerating the situation a little to fit your aggenda.  Sure, Hayward may not like the guy, but you insinuating that he thinks TC's a: 1) "despicable human being" and a 2) "poor representative of the human race" - that's quite a reach.

[Robyrd5]

And I guess everyone parents differently.  There isn't a chance in hell I would let my son go to a Michael Vick camp.  I'd be endorsing Michael Vick which I'm not doing with my money.  Not a chance in hell.

Understandable. Just chalk it up to a silly thing I would do for my kids. 

[reinko]

Perhaps you're exaggerating the situation a little to fit your aggenda.  Sure, Hayward may not like the guy, but you insinuating that he thinks TC's a: 1) "despicable human being" and a 2) "poor representative of the human race" - that's quite a reach.

No, he despises him that much.  I would venture to say that 75% of all MR.HAYWARD's posts on this board involve some kind of jab at Crean.

[PuertoRicanNightmare]

Aren't we losing sight of the fact that the awards ceremony in question happened at the end of the camp?

Perhaps Hayward had a strong personal dislike (I know I did) for Crean beforehand but it reached a fever pitch only after his son attended the camp?

By the way, I encouraged my nephews to attend Marquette Basketball Camp. They idolize Dominic James (and Barro, by the way) and hoped to meet him.

Also, to be perfectly clear, I personally have never said I thought Crean was a horrible coach. I thought his teams were well prepared. I thought he was a totally overrated recruiter and a loathsome person, but I can't say I thought he was a bad coach. I can't think of another person in the public eye who I dislike more, however.

[PE8983]

I think Bob Knight's not the greatest of human beings.  But, if he were coaching MU, and my son wanted to go to his camp at the AL, get instruction from what I assume is a variety of coaches, meet and talk with MU players, I would pay for him to go in a heartbeat.  It's not like Hayward was sending his kid for one-on-one basketball instruction with TC at a local playground.  Quite an over-exaggeration on your part to blast him, all in your support for TC (whom I neither like or dislike).