The whole Free throw issue...

[MR.HAYWARD]

Wow some of you guys just go crazy over some of this stuff.  how do you sleep at night.  Was there a second shooter in Dallas?  From Chicos and Murf it can be expected, but please be rational. 

Practice time as dictated by the NCAA is rather limited during the season.  In addition a game is counted as 3 hours against that time.  Therefore, in most cases and I do not care where you are, free throws are not shot "during practice".  It is a players job to get to practice early or stay late and work on them himself with another player or with an assistant.  Please stop making a mountain out of a mole hill leave those threads to chicos and Murph the conspiracy theorists extraordinaire. 

the anology I would use is if the Department of Labor mandated you could only be in your office 40 hours a week and you chose to for 5 hours each week practice signing your signature.  Sure it is a vital part of your jib but you could use those 40 hours better in a nother manner and possibly practice your signature at home.  Nor would your boss think 5 hours on that would be productive. 

What i find more than refreshing is the fact that we are getting to the FT line with tremendous regularity.  One of my biggest gripes with tommy naismith is we rarely got to the line, rarely got the other team into foul difficaulty.  this team is getting to the line.  Wes is leading the nCAA in Ft made per game.  If not prectiving them is the ticket then keep "not practicing them". 

Addtionally i thought our defense was much much improved last night.  the first 5 minutes were bad and the last 5 were sloppy and not so good but the middle 30 we really played well.

Jerel was the worst player on the court last night. himm leading a break is like watching a trainwreck.

[ChicosBailBonds]

the anology I would use is if the Department of Labor mandated you could only be in your office 40 hours a week and you chose to for 5 hours each week practice signing your signature.  Sure it is a vital part of your jib but you could use those 40 hours better in a nother manner and possibly practice your signature at home.  Nor would your boss think 5 hours on that would be productive. 

Terrific analogy.  Dead on.  I am definitely sold.  Writing your signature at work is definitely on par with practicing an element to the game which contributes 20 to 30% of your scoring on a nightly basis. 


We get the time constraints, we get him wanting the players to do it on their own.   Makes perfect sense, but don't make a silly comment about not needing to practice riding your bike.  It just opens Buzz up to ridicule.  He's a 2nd year coach and the next time MU shoots like crap from the line, or the game is lost at the end because our guys can't make free throws, it's comments like this that the press, other fans, other recruiters will latch on to.  His comments sounded like something out of Shaq's mouth, not a coach.

I've been around too many KU practices under Roy Williams, Knight's practices at IU and my share of MU practices and it's hard to remember free throws not being a part of at least one drill.  Times have changed due to rules with time limits, but the comment was still strange in my opinion.

I'm sure he made the comments for a few laughs, I'm glad he got them.


Now, I need to go practice my signature over and over again as it will certainly improve one's job performance.  Right Hayward?  I mean, writing your signature for a white collar worker is certainly on the same plain as practicing free throws for a basketball player.

[dwaderoy2004]

here's the thing...right now, MU is 75th in the country in free throw %.  That's right around top 20% in the country.  pretty good.  Also, right now, we have the 2nd most free throws made by a team.  currently, we have a better free throw percentage then EVERY OTHER TEAM in the big east with the exception of Georgetown and Villanova.  This is a non-issue.

[Ready2Fly]

Chicos, you've really been around practices with Bob Knight and Roy Williams?  You're the man!!!  Can I have your autograph when you're done practicing those signatures?  Or at least a discount on some DirecTV programming?

[Pakuni]

Sure. Rival recruiters are really going to nail Buzz hard over free-throw shooting in practice. It could cost MU a top 100 player or two every year. Cause if there's one thing a teenage boy looks forward to, it's practicing free throws.

Now who's being silly?

I'm pretty sure that the inability to hit free throws by some MU players isn't a new development under the Buzz regime, caused apparently by the fact he doesn't spend enough time practicing it.

By and large, Mr. Hayward is correct. Free-throw shooting need not be an essential part of practice. The guys who need the work should, and can, get it before and after practice, during warmups, etc. It's something that can be accomplished outside the limited amount of time the team can practice as a team.
And, really, do you believe that 15 minutes of shooting free throws during practice is going to make DJ a better free throw shooter than he's been the past 3+ years? If it were that simple, there'd be no such thing as the Hack-a-Shaq.

[MR.HAYWARD]

and waht is really funny and waht is completely lost on the people that just want a reason to attack Buzz is the vary fact that as dwaderoy2004 points out Free throws as it pertains to us winning games is better than is was under our last coach.  However the people that subliminally want to attack Buzz attack him becuase of what is said but are so focused on attacking him they fail to mention that we have actually improved in the area!!!  keep not practicing the free throws. 

Also, name dropper Chicos boy does that get old.  I too have seen many top choaches but i want drop them ad nauseum and I again say that free throws are most often shot in opractice as part of a drill hwere they might get a few at a crack or after running if at all.  mostly you wiull see the guys spread out over the six baskets or however many rebounding for therir partner or working with an asst.  before and fter practice.  spending 15- 20 minutes to shoot 30-40 Ft's during practice time is an absolute waste of time  akin to precticing your signature for 1/8 of your time.  nothing gained for the time spent.  Now shooting 200-300 with an assistant or a gun machine over an hour before or after practice is not a total wast of time and is where you will improve. 

chicos stick with the name dropping and stay away from the "basketball insight"

[Big Papi]

This team has other issues that are way more concerning than improving their free throw percentage from 72% to 74%.  Heck all we have to do is bench DJ whenever we are in the bonus and not play Burke at all and that percentage would sky rocket to 80% at least.  Would that make everyone happy?   

Yes we will miss a free throw somewhere along the way that will cost us a game, and all the Buzz haters will attack Buzz and the team for their suppossed lack of practicing free throws.  At this point in time, this is a non-issue to everyone except those that have an agenda.

[Pakuni]

Yes we will miss a free throw somewhere along the way that will cost us a game, and all the Buzz haters will attack Buzz and the team for their suppossed lack of practicing free throws.  At this point in time, this is a non-issue to everyone except those that have an agenda.

What's funny in all this is that Marquette is now on pace to have its best free-throw shooting performance since '05-'06, when some guy named Steve Novak was knocking down 97.4 percent of his attempts.

2008-09: 72.4 percent
2007-08: 70.6 percent
2006-07: 66.9 percent
2005-06: 73.2 percent (69.3 percent w/out Novak)
2004-05: 71.0 percent

[RawdogDX]

here's the thing...right now, MU is 75th in the country in free throw %.  That's right around top 20% in the country.  pretty good.  Also, right now, we have the 2nd most free throws made by a team.  currently, we have a better free throw percentage then EVERY OTHER TEAM in the big east with the exception of Georgetown and Villanova.  This is a non-issue.

Keep those stats close at hand.  This is something the grass is always greener fans will continue to say is a problem and will act like we are a bottom third team.

[MR.HAYWARD]

it is also clearly another flaw in the hiring process,  the stupidity and lack of insight by the "commitee" to not dig deep into how much time Buzz Willimas will spend practicing FT's, or the horror that he might not practice them at all!!!!

[Pardner]

I've been around too many KU practices under Roy Williams, Knight's practices at IU and my share of MU practices and it's hard to remember free throws not being a part of at least one drill.  Times have changed due to rules with time limits, but the comment was still strange in my opinion.

So at 231th in the nation in FT %, should CTC not be calling in the General rather than spending time with his posse teaching his young team how to throw a pass, a curve or a chop?

MOOM

[Murffieus]

Some guys need supervised FT practice others don't----DJ obviously does.

[Marquette84]

What's funny in all this is that Marquette is now on pace to have its best free-throw shooting performance since '05-'06, when some guy named Steve Novak was knocking down 97.4 percent of his attempts.

2008-09: 72.4 percent
2007-08: 70.6 percent
2006-07: 66.9 percent
2005-06: 73.2 percent (69.3 percent w/out Novak)
2004-05: 71.0 percent

Not only is the percentage up there--but the number of attempts is WAY up as well--and before somebody tries to say that we don't go to the line as much against conference play, the number of FT attempts in conference play doesn't typically differ by much from the overall number attempted.

2009-09:  34.1 FTA per game
2007-08:  22.4 (20.8 in conference games)
2006-07:  23.0 (23.6 in conference games)
2005-06:  17.7 (16.9 in conference games)

As for James--he has never been a stellar FT shooter--this season is no exception. 

What is amazing is that for all the crap he's taking over his FT shooting, nobody has given him props for improving his 3 point percentage.  Last year he shot 31% from three--this year he's 36% overall, and 42.9% over the last five games (9 - 21).

[MUSF]

I pretty much agree that this is a non-issue but using our team FT% after 7 games doesn't really sell your argument.

One, that could easily change and get tossed back in your face at the end of the year.  Two, it doesn't really have anything to do with the point of Buzz making silly comments that could obviously lead to criticism.  I think this is a question where some coach speak would have been more prudent.  Remember when Calipari kept saying that free throws wouldn't be an issue down the stretch for his team.  That comment sounded a litlle arrogant and pretty dumb the minute Memphis started struggling at the line in the national championship game.  Cal probably would have been better served with something like, "We know that is an area we have to work on and we continue to address it in practice."  Is that so hard?

Wow, I said a lot for calling it a non-issue.  Alright, a minor issue.

[MUBasketball]

Chicos, you've really been around practices with Bob Knight and Roy Williams?  You're the man!!!  Can I have your autograph when you're done practicing those signatures?  Or at least a discount on some DirecTV programming?

That was hilarious!

[MUBasketball]

Terrific analogy.  Dead on.  I am definitely sold.  Writing your signature at work is definitely on par with practicing an element to the game which contributes 20 to 30% of your scoring on a nightly basis. 


We get the time constraints, we get him wanting the players to do it on their own.   Makes perfect sense, but don't make a silly comment about not needing to practice riding your bike.  It just opens Buzz up to ridicule.  He's a 2nd year coach and the next time MU shoots like crap from the line, or the game is lost at the end because our guys can't make free throws, it's comments like this that the press, other fans, other recruiters will latch on to.  His comments sounded like something out of Shaq's mouth, not a coach.

I've been around too many KU practices under Roy Williams, Knight's practices at IU and my share of MU practices and it's hard to remember free throws not being a part of at least one drill.  Times have changed due to rules with time limits, but the comment was still strange in my opinion.

I'm sure he made the comments for a few laughs, I'm glad he got them.

Wow, are you a crybaby. Personally, I thought the comment was humorous...and true. These guys know how to shoot free throws, it's a mindset.

Rather than hiding in the shadows watching others do it, have you ever played the game? Freaking out that they don't spend much time on free throws is one of the dumbest things I've ever heard.

[Pakuni]

I pretty much agree that this is a non-issue but using our team FT% after 7 games doesn't really sell your argument.

I'm not really sure I'm trying to sell an argument, so much as point out that this non-controversy controversy over free throws is kind of odd given that the team is shooting free throws at a slightly better clip than past seasons.
And it seems to me that the gripes are the result of the first seven games, so I don't know what I else I could point out to illustrate why this isn't an issue.

[ChicosBailBonds]

Chicos, you've really been around practices with Bob Knight and Roy Williams?  You're the man!!!  Can I have your autograph when you're done practicing those signatures?  Or at least a discount on some DirecTV programming?

Not a chance in hell for you.   


But you're right, when Wooden, Knight, Williams, et al all utilize(d) free throw shooting in their practices it's definitely not something to learn from for other coaches.   


Pakuni, recruiters use all kinds of tactics.  Are you telling me if MU craps the bed in a few games due to free throws they wouldn't use that kind of stuff.  "Look X, the guy can't coach.  He doesn't even think free throws are that big a deal so they don't practice them, they lost the A, B, and C games because they didn't hit more than 55% from the line.  You'll get solid coaching from our program.  Fundamentals, etc, etc"

You're kidding if you don't think everything and the kitchen sink is used to sully one coach and pump another.

It remains a REALLY strange thing for him to say.  The fact that Hayward came up with the worst analogy known to man only helps solidify that for me.

Right now the team is shooting decent but those comments from her were strange and do no good whatsoever.  They can ONLY bite him in the ass so don't even say them.  There is NO good that can come from them.

[NYWarrior]

out of a

[ChicosBailBonds]

 

I'm wondering if Crean said it how many nanoseconds before Haywire would go ...well...haywire. 

Let's hope we shoot this well the rest of the way....oh, and that our defense improves since we're spending so much time in those areas.   

[Pakuni]

Pakuni, recruiters use all kinds of tactics.  Are you telling me if MU craps the bed in a few games due to free throws they wouldn't use that kind of stuff.  "Look X, the guy can't coach.  He doesn't even think free throws are that big a deal so they don't practice them, they lost the A, B, and C games because they didn't hit more than 55% from the line.  You'll get solid coaching from our program.  Fundamentals, etc, etc"

A. That's the worst recruiting pitch ever.
B. So we've gone from an offhand comment to MU losing multiple games because they shoot 55 percent or less from the line? You must be a yoga master to stretch that far.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

I'm wondering if Crean said it how many nanoseconds before Haywire would go ...well...haywire. 

Let's hope we shoot this well the rest of the way....oh, and that our defense improves since we're spending so much time in those areas.   

#1 I agree that if coach Crean had said the same comment, several people would be going nuts over it. Oh well. That's just the way some people are.

#2 But, I do think you are reaching a little bit. If Buzz had UNLIMITED time to practice, I'm sure he'd have free throws included. The fact of the matter is that they don't. They can practice free throws without the coaches. (With A senior led team, I think you can trust that they will get their work in when the coaches aren't there.)

The coaches need to be working on specific things when they have time with the players, not just fundamentals.

I understand that other coaches have different approaches, but given that Buzz is still a relatively new coach with a new system, it's not unreasonable to think that the team's time is better spent on things besides free throws.

Also, this is all based off of one "quip" from Buzz. If anything, maybe he's just guilty of a poor choice of words.

[Big Papi]

They have a new defensive and offensive philosophy that they need to implement and work on this year that has far greater importance.  I know I am way more concerned about our defense than our free throw shooting and frankly rightfully so.  So considering that we are a good free throw shooting team, practicing free throws takes a backseat in practice.  Especially since free throws can be easily done individually before and after practice. 

If most of the team was shooting below 60% and they had major issues with shooting form, I could see the coaching staff taking time out of practice to address the issue.  ITS NOT AN ISSUE AT THIS POINT IN TIME!

As far as coachspeak goes.  Wasn't it last year, that a lot of posters blasted TC because he was doing to much coach speak and wasn't really saying anything?  Now it seems like we have the opposite.  Buzz is brutally honest and frank when answering questions.  He probably needs to improve on that somewhat but then again he is praised for being honest by his players and he sure can recruit so I don't see the harm at this point in time.

oh and one final thing, Buzz brings in a top 10 recruiting class and someone here has the gall to bring up an example of other coaches using Buzz's free throw quote as a way to negatively recruit against Buzz. Wow.  Thanks for the laugh.  I needed the 5 minute laugh to brighten my rather dull morning.  That example more than anything else proves that deep down you probably want Buzz to fail even though you will adamantly plead the opposite and how much you really love MU.  Get over the hiring process already. 

I highly doubt the Roy Williams and the Bob Knights and who ever else was name dropped will bring up the free throw shooting quote as the game changer hammer that will sway a recruit away from here.  And if they do, Buzz would be doing a lot of things right to nitpick on something like that.      

And to those Memphis fans out there.  LOOK OUT!!!!!!!  Its going to be extremely difficult for one Calipari to recruit anyone to Memphis now.  Just look at their free throw shooting last year and Calipari's comments about how its not a big deal. 

That my friend is a far far worse comment to make than what Buzz said. Buzz didn't say it was not important, just that it should be done outside of practice and anyone who wants to get better must have the motivation to strive to get better in and out of practice.  I don't see Memphis falling to a mid-major program with Cal at the helm over his free throw comment anytime soon and I don't see recruits crossing us of their lists because we don't practice free throws.