NY Times: Imagine the Big East, Coast to Coast

[Coleman]

Big East will expand before its contract with Fox expires. I'm almost 100% certain of this. We don't have to expand this second however. There are many reasons why it is good for the BEast to bide its time.

1. There are basketball first schools with football programs who are bleeding money. They've been treading water praying that they will one day get invited to a power 5 conference with their lucrative TV deals, but schools can't hold out forever. UConn, the poster child for this, is losing $20 million a year on football. Eventually, these schools will either need to get the invite they've been praying for, or drop football (or downgrade to fcs). Some scoff at this. We haven't had a FBS football program drop since the Ivies did it in the 80s I think. UAB was going to do it, and then got cold feet. It's scary to be the first one to do something. Eventually one of these schools will and more and more schools will follow their lead. When these schools drop their football, they will be looking for new homes.

2. Realignment will happen again. It always does. The Big 10 will raid the ACC. The Big 12 and SEC might join them and take a few ACC teams of their own. The ACC will react by raiding the AAC, the AAC will raid Conference USA.....and so on and so forth. First of all, I'm not convinced UCONN gets picked up by the ACC in next round of realignment. I don't think they are the shoe-in they think they are. Second of all, when the ACC of the future looks like the AAC of today, they will not be making the same TV money they are now. A lot of the schools left behind the ACC, the Boston Colleges and Wake Forests of the world will go from making money to losing money on football. Notre Dame may no longer wish to affiliate with a weakened ACC and go back to being a true independent. These are all teams that could be potentially brought into the fold.

3. Years ago, you would have never imagined Butler or Creighton being added to the Big East, yet here they are. The next generation of Butlers and Creightons are out there. The key is finding basketball first schools with healthy endowments who are willing to make investments in their basketball programs. The University of Denver sucks at basketball. But they have a very large endowment and have shown a willingness to invest in winning sports programs. They are dominant in hockey, lax, and soccer. With the possibility of a future  Big East invite, they might be willing to make investments in their basketball program and get it to a point where it can compete in the Big East. Maybe a school like UMass or Boston U can be convinced to make the same kinds of investments. They may seem like terrible adds now but give them some time and they might develop into strong additions. Key is finding schools willing to invest (the opposite of Depaul).

4. The teams that we are kicking around now, Dayton, SLU, Gonzaga, St. Mary's, BYU, etc. They will all still be available and begging to get in (maybe BYU isn't begging) to the Big East from now until the end of time. If none of the above scenarios come to pass, we can still get them later.

College athletics will look very different 10 years from now. The BEast has put themselves in a position to be takers instead of taken. No sense in rushing into anything now.

I have been one of the people clamoring for the Big East to expand to 12 basically since the current conference formed in 2013. But I'm not so stubborn as to never be swayed by a good argument. This is an excellent post. I'm swayed. I'm ok with sitting at 10 for now.

I'd still like to end up at 12 or 14. But your case for waiting makes sense.

[Coleman]

One of the strengths of the current Big East is that it is a bunch of similar schools that all want to be there.  None of them have any desire to go anywhere else.  That has not always been the case with these schools.  Creighton was dying to get out of the Valley for years.  Butler has to be thrilled with where it is.  Could they have even imagined it ten years ago?  Xavier is in probably the best conference it ever has been.

So when you talk about the domino effect of conferences raiding each other, who is going to raid the Big East, and who wants to leave?  Right now, it is the best non-football conference out there and it is concentrating on men's basketball.  Maybe the league expands eventually.  I am not at all sure.  The schools and the commissioner seem perfectly happy at ten, and it does not seem that Fox is putting any pressure on them.  I see no need to expand just to expand, and some of the ideas getting thrown around are pretty crazy.  It's not broke.  Don't fix it.

Georgetown is probably the only exception. They would bolt for the ACC in a heartbeat, and clearly were the least enthusiastic about the conference formation. Luckily for the rest of us, there's no way the ACC wants them right now. And its probably not a terrible thing for the conference if GTown remains in the bottom half of the Big East for the foreseeable future, just to prevent interest from suitors.

[GGGG]

Georgetown is probably the only exception. They would bolt for the ACC in a heartbeat,

I think Marquette would too.

[CTWarrior]

I think Marquette would too.

And just about every one else given the opportunity.  I liked Goatherders post very much, though, because I hadn't thought of it that way before.  While its true most schools would like to move to a P5 conference, the invitations are not forthcoming so nobody's likely to leave anytime soon and we are a very desirable destination for ANY non-football playing school.

[GoldenWarrior11]

Georgetown is probably the only exception. They would bolt for the ACC in a heartbeat, and clearly were the least enthusiastic about the conference formation. Luckily for the rest of us, there's no way the ACC wants them right now. And its probably not a terrible thing for the conference if GTown remains in the bottom half of the Big East for the foreseeable future, just to prevent interest from suitors.

It was Georgetown and Marquette that led the charge into the basketball-first conference after the original Big East collapsed.  They, as much as anyone, got fed up with football schools leading the charge and making demands at the expense of non-football schools.  They aren't going to regulate themselves to the backseat again to the football schools.

There's something to be said about conference unity and strength.  For the first time possibly ever, the Big East is stable and committed to growing with one another - not looking to bolt for a superior football conference at a moment's notice.

[bilsu]

I think realignment is mostly done unless schools come to the correct conclusion that big conferences are not a good idea. Look at UW football in the Big 10. They use to play Michigan and Ohio St almost every year. Now they are not likely to play either one of them unless they can get to the Big 10 Championship. It was a better conference when there were only 10 teams and that also goes for basketball. Having added Rutgers, Nebraska and Penn St has just water down their basketball conference and the addition of Maryland does not offset this.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

I think realignment is mostly done unless schools come to the correct conclusion that big conferences are not a good idea. Look at UW football in the Big 10. They use to play Michigan and Ohio St almost every year. Now they are not likely to play either one of them unless they can get to the Big 10 Championship. It was a better conference when there were only 10 teams and that also goes for basketball. Having added Rutgers, Nebraska and Penn St has just water down their basketball conference and the addition of Maryland does not offset this.

That's funny. You think conference realignment is about creating quality competition on the court.

[GGGG]

It's all about the $$$. That's the only reason expansion occurs.

[Groin_pull]

It's about expanding its footprint and adding more eyeballs for its cable network. It's about money. Has nothing to do with the quality of competition. And spare me the nonsense about it being about education.

The Big 10 (or is it 14? I've lost count) wants to take over the college sports world and get added to as many cable packages as possible. That's their mission.

It's a pure money grab, which is the name of the game in today's college sports world. Makes me gag when I hear the term "student-athlete." As if the NCAA gives a damn about academic integrity.

[keefe]

Georgetown is probably the only exception. They would bolt for the ACC in a heartbeat, and clearly were the least enthusiastic about the conference formation. Luckily for the rest of us, there's no way the ACC wants them right now. And its probably not a terrible thing for the conference if GTown remains in the bottom half of the Big East for the foreseeable future, just to prevent interest from suitors.

Not sure about this. Georgetown was in the vanguard of forming the breakaway conference. They are not interested in having to eat the sh1t of the football schools.

[GGGG]

Not sure about this. Georgetown was in the vanguard of forming the breakaway conference. They are not interested in having to eat the sh1t of the football schools.

Everything I have heard suggests that, while they were out front when everything was made public, that they were quite reluctant participants when things started happening behind the scenes. 

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Everything I have heard suggests that, while they publicly were out front when everything was made public, that they were quite reluctant participants when things started happening behind the scenes.

That's matches everything I've ever heard about it. Georgetown was publicly supporting the Catholic 7 while subtly lifting its skirt at the acc. ACC didn't bite so Georgetown stayed here.

[jsglow]

Everything I have heard suggests that, while they were out front when everything was made public, that they were quite reluctant participants when things started happening behind the scenes.

Yep.  I don't have much 'real' info here on scoop but on this you can take it to the bank.

[Coleman]

Everything I have heard suggests that, while they were out front when everything was made public, that they were quite reluctant participants when things started happening behind the scenes.

That's what I heard too. They were pulled in kicking and screaming, at least when it was still 7 teams before things got finalized.

[rocky_warrior]

That's what I heard too. They were pulled in kicking and screaming, at least when it was still 7 teams before things got finalized.

A couple years have past -- Hey Matt V how about an off-season in-depth about how the new Big East *really* got pulled together?? 

(I don't know that he reads here, but I have a suspicion he takes a gander every now and then)

[keefe]

A couple years have past -- Hey Matt V how about an off-season in-depth about how the new Big East *really* got pulled together?? 

(I don't know that he reads here, but I have a suspicion he takes a gander every now and then)

He reads here

[MUMountin]

Not sure about this. Georgetown was in the vanguard of forming the breakaway conference. They are not interested in having to eat the sh1t of the football schools.

My feeling is that G'town was totally fine eating football-school sh1t as long as it was from schools like Pitt, Louisville, Syracuse, ND, etc.  But when it was Tulane, Houston, etc. sh1t, they turned their noses up at it (and rightfully so).

In other words, as others have alluded, they'd be fine (and maybe desire) being a basketball affiliate in a football power conference so long as the level of competition/"peer schools" was to their liking. 

[Babybluejeans]

2. Realignment will happen again. It always does. The Big 10 will raid the ACC. The Big 12 and SEC might join them and take a few ACC teams of their own. The ACC will react by raiding the AAC, the AAC will raid Conference USA.....and so on and so forth. First of all, I'm not convinced UCONN gets picked up by the ACC in next round of realignment. I don't think they are the shoe-in they think they are. Second of all, when the ACC of the future looks like the AAC of today, they will not be making the same TV money they are now. A lot of the schools left behind the ACC, the Boston Colleges and Wake Forests of the world will go from making money to losing money on football. Notre Dame may no longer wish to affiliate with a weakened ACC and go back to being a true independent. These are all teams that could be potentially brought into the fold.

Excellent point. Teams we're not even thinking about now may make a lot of sense after the debris of the next realignment clears. As good a reason as any to wait to expand (if at all).

[Groin_pull]

Don't quite understand all the Georgetown bashing going on here. They would jump at the chance to join the ACC? Of course. Just like MU would fall all over itself to join the Big 10.

If any of the P5 conferences started adding hoops-only schools, all current Big East would be racing for the door.

[DFW HOYA]

Don't quite understand all the Georgetown bashing going on here. They would jump at the chance to join the ACC? Of course.

Um, not so fast. The ACC is chafing at the idea that the Washington media market is being ceded to the Big 10, and are concerned of a longer term strategy to extend the Big 10 south to Virginia and North Carolina. The ACC does not want to even consider Georgetown without getting a commitment to upgrade football, and Georgetown has shown no inclination to do so.

[rocky_warrior]

Um, not so fast. The ACC is chafing at the idea that the Washington media market is being ceded to the Big 10, and are concerned of a longer term strategy to extend the Big 10 south to Virginia and North Carolina. The ACC does not want to even consider Georgetown without getting a commitment to upgrade football, and Georgetown has shown no inclination to do so.

He said Georgetown would jump at the chance to join the ACC, not that the ACC wanted Georgetown.