Guarding Kaminsky

[GGGG]

I have to ask, is 20-14 that bad?

Since Al McGuire, who has done better at Marquette?

It's 50th on the all time winning percentage list.  Some context...  Adolph Rupp is 45...Lute Olson is 46...Jim Boeheim is 42...Bobby Knight is 39. 

[Lennys Tap]

I have to ask, is 20-14 that bad?

Since Al McGuire, who has done better at Marquette?

Buzz Williams. He was 9-6 (.600) total and 8-4 (.667) with his own players, both better than 20-14 (.588).

[mu-rara]

2002: 8 beats 9 loses 1 Maryland (No upset)
2003: 5 beats 12 & 13 loses 1 seed Kentucky that MU beats to go to Final Four but no upset (would've killed for Wisconsin to be the team we beat instead 6pts from happening)
2004: 6 beats 11 loses 3 Pittsburgh. (No upset)
2005: 6 beats 11, 14, 10 loses 1 North Carolina. (No upset)
2006: 9 loses to 8 Arizona. (No upset)
2007: 2 beats 15 loses 7 UNLV. (Upset)
2008: 3 beats 14 & 11 loses 10 Davidson (Upset but keep in mind Stephen Curry is on Davidson)
2009: 12 beats 5 loses 4 Xavier. (UW Upsets)
2010: 4 beat 13 loses 12 Cornell. (Upset)
2011: 4 beats 13 & 5 loses 8 Butler. (Upset but keep in mind Shelvin Mack is on this Butler)
2012: 4 beats 13 & 5 loses 1 Syracuse. (No upset)
2013: 5 loses 12 Mississippi (Upset)
2014: 2 beats 15, 7, 6, 1 loses 8 Kentucky. (UW upsets then gets upset)

I see five upsets. I'd barely call a Curry led Davidson team winning an upset. I'd barely call last year's Kentucky team winning an
Upset same with the Mac led Butler team that took down a 1 Pitt and 2 Florida an upset. But that's a judgement call I guess either way it's not abysmal they don't upset a lot and pretty much do exactly what they're seeded to do.

BB,  I would expect a post like this from a Vadger fan.    I'll dissect this later.

[JWags85]

Agreed.  If you look at season stats as a whole, Dekker last year at least matches Heyward's last year and in some cases exceeds it.

Here is the difference.  In the six game run in the NCAA tournament, Heyward scored 13, 12, 17, 22, 19, 12 and was clearly the alpha-dog on that team.  In the five games UW played last year, Dekker scored 11, 12, 7, 7, 15 and was behind Kaminsky.

That was kind of my point.  Hayward wasn't drafted based on his regular season, it was based on that impressive tourney run.  The Horizon league is poor competition to be sure, but Hayward was among the leader in basically every major category in the conference.  Dekker was only top 10 in the B10 in rebounds.  Again, partially due to better competition and a better team, but still.

Nobody is arguing Dekker is a bad player, like nobody is arguing Bo Ryan isn't a good coach, I just dont think Dekker passes the eye test as a lottery pick yet.  He has a great chance to prove me wrong this year on a great team.  If he averages 12 and 6 again, with Kaminsky being the lead man, I don't see how he is still considered a lottery pick.

[Galway Eagle]

I have to ask, is 20-14 that bad?

Since Al McGuire, who has done better at Marquette?

This is why we hate you I'm actually here defending your coach's tourny record and yet a badger fan still comes over to call out mu. Meanwhile if it was on the reverse there wouldn't be one badger fan on your board defending any MU coach (even if it was bill chandler who played at UW and was an assistant coach there)

[GGGG]

That was kind of my point.  Hayward wasn't drafted based on his regular season, it was based on that impressive tourney run.  The Horizon league is poor competition to be sure, but Hayward was among the leader in basically every major category in the conference.  Dekker was only top 10 in the B10 in rebounds.  Again, partially due to better competition and a better team, but still.

Nobody is arguing Dekker is a bad player, like nobody is arguing Bo Ryan isn't a good coach, I just dont think Dekker passes the eye test as a lottery pick yet.  He has a great chance to prove me wrong this year on a great team.  If he averages 12 and 6 again, with Kaminsky being the lead man, I don't see how he is still considered a lottery pick.

You snipped a bunch of my post though.  NBA scouts aren't going to look at a handful of games and say "that guy is a lottery pick."  They are also smart enough to look at those games and see someone who took a lot of shots.

Hayward stood out as a 6'9" forward who can shoot, plays smart, and is generally a good athlete.  Dekker isn't as tall and I don't think is as athletic.  And that is going to hurt him and those are the main reasons I don't think he is a lottery pick yet.  But I think his game is just as good.

[MU62]

Sad to see all this waste of time and thought process as to playing the Badgers.  We have a lot of games to play this season and this sure gives glee to Bucky.  In a few years I would love to see a Badger board give so much attention to our great team.  That would never happen.  Wisconsin fans have lots of teams they obsess over.  Lets talk about Nova and other teams in our conference and not a big 14 team. 

[OnWisconsin]

Agreed.  If you look at season stats as a whole, Dekker last year at least matches Heyward's last year and in some cases exceeds it.

Here is the difference.  In the six game run in the NCAA tournament, Heyward scored 13, 12, 17, 22, 19, 12 and was clearly the alpha-dog on that team.  In the five games UW played last year, Dekker scored 11, 12, 7, 7, 15 and was behind Kaminsky.

But Heyward did that by shooting only 37.3% (25/67).  Dekker played a smaller role but was more efficient shooting 44.7% (17/38).

I actually think Dekker's game is a little better than Heyward's.

Thanks for the unbiased response. To be fair to JEllenson, while watching Hayward at Butler, he always looked impressive. The percentages weren't what I thought they would be before I looked them up. Hayward has turned out to be a really solid pro, he does a nice job of creating his own shot, and he's actually a pretty good athlete.

I love Bo as a coach, but as an earlier posted eluded to, I think Dekker will perform better in a system with more freedom. Jackson is a good point guard, but he isn't a great passer.

As for the UW/MU game, I obviously favor UW. Regardless of who has won in the past, the game is rarely ever a blowout.

[MU Buff]

Sad to see all this waste of time and thought process as to playing the Badgers.  We have a lot of games to play this season and this sure gives glee to Bucky.  In a few years I would love to see a Badger board give so much attention to our great team.  That would never happen.  Wisconsin fans have lots of teams they obsess over.  Lets talk about Nova and other teams in our conference and not a big 14 team. 

You are 100% wrong. The Badger board always has threads about Marquette.

[mu-rara]

2003: 5 beats 12 & 13 loses 1 seed Kentucky that MU beats to go to Final Four but no upset (would've killed for Wisconsin to be the team we beat instead 6pts from happening)whom MU UPSET  as a 3 seed
2007: 2 beats 15 loses 7 UNLV. (Upset) 2 seed losing to a 7.
2008: 3 beats 14 & 11 loses 10 Davidson (Upset but keep in mind Stephen Curry is on Davidson) Davidson is a 10 seed. Bo lost to a 10 seed as a 3 seed.
2009: 12 beats 5 loses 4 Xavier. (UW Upsets) One COULD argue that 12 beating a 5 is barely an upset.  3 of those in 2014.
2010: 4 beat 13 loses 12 Cornell. (Upset) Another Big Bo Flameout
2011: 4 beats 13 & 5 loses 8 Butler. (Upset but keep in mind Shelvin Mack is on this Butler) Shelvin Mack BFD.  8 beating a 4. 
2013: 5 loses 12 Mississippi (Upset) Are you finally seeing a pattern?

I see five upsets. I'd barely call a Curry led Davidson team winning an upset. I'd barely call last year's Kentucky team winning an
Upset same with the Mac led Butler team that took down a 1 Pitt and 2 Florida an upset. But that's a judgement call I guess either way it's not abysmal they don't upset a lot and pretty much do exactly what they're seeded to do.

I cleared away all the noise you used to hide Bo's craptacular NCAA record.  I am shocked that a Marquette fan would minimize this.  Badger fans wish they had this much to shove down our throats.

[Galway Eagle]

  I cleared away all the noise you used to hide Bo's craptacular NCAA record.  I am shocked that a Marquette fan would minimize this.  Badger fans wish they had this much to shove down our throats.

(Palms forehead) some people... Read what you wrote "3 seed upset 1 seed" does that mean that the 5 seed should have upset them? No

12 beat 5.  Sure it happens often Does that mean that it's not an upset? I mean 2s are losing to 15s very frequently these past few years is it suddenly not an upset?

Like I said the Davidson and butler teams are up to you but when those teams have upset as many higher teams as they did that year I wouldn't just put that on bo. 

You can't just take away all the stuff that doesn't support your side thats not the way the world works.  As far as minimalizing his record I don't know why you're trying to. Maybe you'd prefer to have our major rival be at the crap level they were before the late 90s but I prefer to play and beat the best. I also refuse to minimize accomplishments.  I'll insult bo for Jared uthoff, for never being a super erupting team in March but I won't say that he's done terribly and anyone with integrity and respect to the enemy wouldn't either. Badger fans minimalize buzz, crean, deane, Oneil, Raymonds and Al all the time perhaps you are just not of a bigger person mindset.

[OnWisconsin]

Buzz Williams. He was 9-6 (.600) total and 8-4 (.667) with his own players, both better than 20-14 (.588).

Nevermind this post.

[MU62]

You are 100% wrong. The Badger board always has threads about Marquette.

Not about how good we are. 

[mu-rara]

(Palms forehead) some people... Read what you wrote "3 seed upset 1 seed" does that mean that the 5 seed should have upset them? No

12 beat 5.  Sure it happens often Does that mean that it's not an upset? I mean 2s are losing to 15s very frequently these past few years is it suddenly not an upset?

Like I said the Davidson and butler teams are up to you but when those teams have upset as many higher teams as they did that year I wouldn't just put that on bo. 

You can't just take away all the stuff that doesn't support your side thats not the way the world works.  As far as minimalizing his record I don't know why you're trying to. Maybe you'd prefer to have our major rival be at the crap level they were before the late 90s but I prefer to play and beat the best. I also refuse to minimize accomplishments.  I'll insult bo for Jared uthoff, for never being a super erupting team in March but I won't say that he's done terribly and anyone with integrity and respect to the enemy wouldn't either. Badger fans minimalize buzz, crean, deane, Oneil, Raymonds and Al all the time perhaps you are just not of a bigger person mindset.

Whatever.

[MU Buff]

Not about how good we are.  

That's because Marquette isn't good right now.

If Wisconsin was not predicted to make the NCAA tournament and Marquette was a preseason top 5 team, a thread just like this would be on the Badgers board.

[MU62]

That's because Marquette isn't good right now.

If Wisconsin was not predicted to make the NCAA tournament and Marquette was a preseason top 5 team, a thread just like this would be on the Badgers board.

I admit I have never looked at a Badger board (who cares) and none of the MU fans I know would bother with it. Could you give me the web site and also something from the past I might be able to see to confirm what you are saying?  As a season ticket holder for over 50 years, it always drove me nuts when fans would say " I don't care what happens with our season as long as we beat the Badgers".  I bleed blue and gold and a Warrior for ever.     

[Galway Eagle]

I admit I have never looked at a Badger board (who cares) and none of the MU fans I know would bother with it. Could you give me the web site and also something from the past I might be able to see to confirm what you are saying?  As a season ticket holder for over 50 years, it always drove me nuts when fans would say " I don't care what happens with our season as long as we beat the Badgers".  I bleed blue and gold and a Warrior for ever.    

Venture around a bit but careful people get swallowed up in this place (suggest you look at threads regarding Levin, Ellenson, buzzcutting, Shaka smart, buzz leaving, crean leaving, sexual assault, Todd mayo, vander blue, Jerone maymon, etc)

http://mbd.scout.com/mb.aspx?s=193&f=2565

[MU Buff]

I admit I have never looked at a Badger board (who cares) and none of the MU fans I know would bother with it. Could you give me the web site and also something from the past I might be able to see to confirm what you are saying?  As a season ticket holder for over 50 years, it always drove me nuts when fans would say " I don't care what happens with our season as long as we beat the Badgers".  I bleed blue and gold and a Warrior for ever.     

Also, the buckyville forums. I stop over there and read what they have to say about Marquette once in a while for a cheap laugh, never have posted. Some Wisconsin fans might try and tell you Marquette isn't a rival and it's just another game for them but they are just trying to get under your skin. Every time anything happens to Marquette good or bad they have a strong opinion about it.

[JakeBarnes]

Dekker did something to his ankle today. Sounds like we won't be the only ones on #bootwatch2k14

[Galway Eagle]

Dekker did something to his ankle today. Sounds like we won't be the only ones on #bootwatch2k14

I pray it'll last till our game then he miraculously gets better after making our win look good the rest of the year.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Dekker did something to his ankle today. Sounds like we won't be the only ones on #bootwatch2k14

Most likely nothing, but even if it was serious, Bucky will still be pretty damn good.