The Puerto Rican national team qualified for the Olympics
https://www.fiba.basketball/en/events/fiba-olympic-qualifying-tournament-2024-san-juan-puerto-rico
Markus is on the roster and is expected to be in Paris, but he did not play in the qualifying tournament. He was otherwise occupied:
https://www.instagram.com/p/C8m1nRfPj9a/?hl=en&img_index=1
Quote from: warriorchick on July 08, 2024, 04:04:01 PM
The Puerto Rican national team qualified for the Olympics
https://www.fiba.basketball/en/events/fiba-olympic-qualifying-tournament-2024-san-juan-puerto-rico
Markus is on the roster and is expected to be in Paris, but he did not play in the qualifying tournament. He was otherwise occupied:
https://www.instagram.com/p/C8m1nRfPj9a/?hl=en&img_index=1
Congrats to Markus and his family! Awesome news for one of the legends of Marquette
Congratulations and best of luck with both.
Congrats to Markus, but do we want 17 year olds having babies?
Quote from: lawdog77 on July 08, 2024, 04:18:46 PM
Congrats to Markus, but do we want 17 year olds having babies?
He doesn't turn 17 until next month.
We've had a pretty good run of Marquette guards going to Olympics. Wade of course, now Markus, but also David Cubillan (Venezuela), and famously Butch Lee (also with PR).
Quote from: Uncle Rico on July 08, 2024, 04:05:42 PM
Congrats to Markus and his family! Awesome news for one of the legends of Marquette
And for Markus too
Matthew 13:53-58
Hopefully, the day will come when the Big East's all time leading scorer is appreciated in his own backyard.
Quote from: tower912 on July 08, 2024, 05:54:31 PM
Matthew 13:53-58
Hopefully, the day will come when the Big East's all time leading scorer is appreciated in his own backyard.
You can say that again!
Quote from: warriorchick on July 08, 2024, 04:04:01 PM
The Puerto Rican national team qualified for the Olympics
https://www.fiba.basketball/en/events/fiba-olympic-qualifying-tournament-2024-san-juan-puerto-rico
Markus is on the roster and is expected to be in Paris, but he did not play in the qualifying tournament. He was otherwise occupied:
https://www.instagram.com/p/C8m1nRfPj9a/?hl=en&img_index=1
A fellow alumni from my high school, Tremont Waters, made the Puerto Rican team also.
Good for him.
Quote from: warriorchick on July 08, 2024, 04:04:01 PM
The Puerto Rican national team qualified for the Olympics
https://www.fiba.basketball/en/events/fiba-olympic-qualifying-tournament-2024-san-juan-puerto-rico
Markus is on the roster and is expected to be in Paris, but he did not play in the qualifying tournament. He was otherwise occupied:
https://www.instagram.com/p/C8m1nRfPj9a/?hl=en&img_index=1
going for gold with his brother Jordan must be great. Going for gold with Wisconsin Badger Aleem Ford? Priceless.
Quote from: SaveOD238 on July 08, 2024, 04:38:11 PM
We've had a pretty good run of Marquette guards going to Olympics. Wade of course, now Markus, but also David Cubillan (Venezuela), and famously Butch Lee (also with PR).
I guess gold medalist Jimmy Butler is easier to forget than David Cubillan 🤣
Quote from: Viper on July 08, 2024, 08:46:19 PM
going for gold with his brother Jordan must be great. Going for gold with Wisconsin Badger Aleem Ford? Priceless.
Obsessed.
Quote from: Viper on July 08, 2024, 08:46:19 PM
going for gold with his brother Jordan must be great. Going for gold with Wisconsin Badger Aleem Ford? Priceless.
Go cheer for Red over there.
Quote from: We R Final Four on July 08, 2024, 09:17:28 PM
Go cheer for Red over there.
...if you only knew. The HATE runs deep. All consuming. Never ends.
HS coach...hey Viper, pass the ball to JJ Weber. Pass it to JJ. Why are you shooting?...pass it to JJ. JJ will be All Big Ten at Wisconsin...pass it to him! Why are you shooting when JJ is open? Pass it to JJ. Pass it. Pass it. Pass it.
Momma!
Understand?
Quote from: Viper on July 08, 2024, 09:24:57 PM
...if you only knew. The HATE runs deep. All consuming. Never ends.
HS coach...hey Viper, pass the ball to JJ Weber. Pass it to JJ. Why are you shooting?...pass it to JJ. JJ will be All Big Ten at Wisconsin...pass it to him! Why are you shooting when JJ is open? Pass it to JJ. Pass it. Pass it. Pass it.
Momma!
Understand?
There are therapists for this.
Quote from: wadesworld on July 08, 2024, 09:27:09 PM
There are therapists for this.
I'm seeing two, in fact. Notre Dame and Wisconsin alums respectively. It's going great, btw.
Quote from: Viper on July 08, 2024, 09:34:14 PM
I'm seeing two, in fact. Notre Dame and Wisconsin alums respectively. It's going great, btw.
Time for a third opinion
Markus to the Olympics is not happening, not with the Puerto Rican Olympic team. The twelve players at the pre olympic tournament will be the Olympic team. It's absurd to bring somebody else three weeks from the Olympics and disrupt the team chemistry.
Quote from: guerrero on July 09, 2024, 01:12:38 PM
Markus to the Olympics is not happening, not with the Puerto Rican Olympic team. The twelve players at the pre olympic tournament will be the Olympic team. It's absurd to bring somebody else three weeks from the Olympics and disrupt the team chemistry.
"We're a family, Herb"
Quote from: guerrero on July 09, 2024, 01:12:38 PM
Markus to the Olympics is not happening, not with the Puerto Rican Olympic team. The twelve players at the pre olympic tournament will be the Olympic team. It's absurd to bring somebody else three weeks from the Olympics and disrupt the team chemistry.
I guess someone wrote a letter.
Quote from: guerrero on July 09, 2024, 01:12:38 PM
Markus to the Olympics is not happening, not with the Puerto Rican Olympic team. The twelve players at the pre olympic tournament will be the Olympic team. It's absurd to bring somebody else three weeks from the Olympics and disrupt the team chemistry.
It's my understanding he was on the team in May for qualifiers, left because he had a baby. I think he'd be welcomed back, they are already familiar with him and it'd be an easy integration.
Not sure if he goes back but I don't think PR would say no.
Quote from: BM1090 on July 09, 2024, 01:47:51 PM
It's my understanding he was on the team in May for qualifiers, left because he had a baby. I think he'd be welcomed back, they are already familiar with him and it'd be an easy integration.
Not sure if he goes back but I don't think PR would say no.
Exactly. They aren't gonna say no to the third best player on the team, at worst...especially since its not like he's an outsider.
"It's my understanding he was on the team in May for qualifiers, left because he had a baby. I think he'd be welcomed back, they are already familiar with him and it'd be an easy integration.
Not sure if he goes back but I don't think PR would say no."
This is from the team's GM, Carlos Arroyo, mouth:
https://www.primerahora.com/deportes/baloncesto/notas/puerto-rico-esta-capacitado-para-avanzar-de-ronda-en-paris-2024/?utm_source=Social&utm_campaign=primera_hora&utm_medium=Facebook&fbclid=IwZXh0bgNhZW0CMTEAAR0k3ALFme_xqnyamXodTlXp4LZ3IuiiLApsUfMVYdZZYUOk4fCjYETo67o_aem_3slLyIS8kxoEyuWjXa4Y8w
"el gerente general de la Selección, Carlos Arroyo, dijo que los 12 jugadores del Preolímpico serán los 12 que jugarán en París 2024, porque "se ganaron" el derecho a ser olímpicos luego de la demostración en el Preolímpico."
It seems to me it's a done deal for the existing 12 players. I am as much of a fan of Markus as anybody here, but I understand their decision. The team played flawless defense and kept Italy and Lithuania under 70 points. Why mess with something that is working? BTW Alvarado was the tournament MVP with Waters being a close second. Their bench guards were also outstanding including Markus brother.
I get it, but it seems like a mistake if Markus is willing to play.
If you're worried about disrupting the defensive chemistry then bring him on with the understanding that his role is an off-the-bench microwave scorer, which is a role that he thrives in.
Drop your 12th guy, or just drop the kid from UW 😂, and bring on Markus.
When you go down by 15 to Serbia and USA send him on to see if he can score 20 in 10 mins to at the very least bring some excitement into the game/crowd.
You'll still lose by 25+, but at least you've given it a fighters chance with one of the best shooters on the planet.
The kid from UW IS the 12th guy.
Quote from: BrewCity83 on July 09, 2024, 03:21:00 PM
The kid from UW IS the 12th guy.
Then we definitely want Markus to replace him!
PR knows what we all know - Markus just isn't a team player.
Quote from: DoctorV on July 09, 2024, 03:09:40 PM
I get it, but it seems like a mistake if Markus is willing to play.
If you're worried about disrupting the defensive chemistry then bring him on with the understanding that his role is an off-the-bench microwave scorer, which is a role that he thrives in.
Drop your 12th guy, or just drop the kid from UW 😂, and bring on Markus.
When you go down by 15 to Serbia and USA send him on to see if he can score 20 in 10 mins to at the very least bring some excitement into the game/crowd.
You'll still lose by 25+, but at least you've given it a fighters chance with one of the best shooters on the planet.
I really want to see Markus play the usa team....
Quote from: #UnleashSean on July 09, 2024, 09:50:17 PM
I really want to see Markus play the usa team....
Me, too. Would be great for Marquette to have one of their alum playing against Team USA
Great to see Markus back at Marquette
https://x.com/painttouches/status/1816117089641419117?s=46&t=QSiaGcOIKZrrpw0ciZkI5Q
Don't tell the dentist.
guess he won't be in Paris
Quote from: Uncle Rico on July 24, 2024, 09:57:04 AM
Great to see Markus back at Marquette
https://x.com/painttouches/status/1816117089641419117?s=46&t=QSiaGcOIKZrrpw0ciZkI5Q
Weird he waited to visit until Marquette's greatest passer left for the NBA ?-(
Quote from: Uncle Rico on July 24, 2024, 09:57:04 AM
Great to see Markus back at Marquette
https://x.com/painttouches/status/1816117089641419117?s=46&t=QSiaGcOIKZrrpw0ciZkI5Q
Put 0 in the rafters already.
Amen
Quote from: Hards Alumni on July 24, 2024, 03:42:13 PM
Put 0 in the rafters already.
Should've raised his framed jersey right into the rafters on his Senior Day/Night.
Quote from: wadesworld on July 24, 2024, 04:49:47 PM
Should've raised his framed jersey right into the rafters on his Senior Day/Night.
I suppose there were a few nice moments during the Wojo era — like Wally Ellenson proudly earning a full track scholarship, or DJ Carton's mom getting in Twitter fights with fans, or all the times Theo John curled his biceps in celebration after committing an offensive foul — but, generally speaking, I'm glad they didn't do this. I think the best thing to do is just bury those years and let them stay buried.
Quote from: Biggie Clausen on July 24, 2024, 06:25:04 PM
I suppose there were a few nice moments during the Wojo era — like Wally Ellenson proudly earning a full track scholarship, or DJ Carton's mom getting in Twitter fights with fans, or all the times Theo John curled his biceps in celebration after committing an offensive foul — but, generally speaking, I'm glad they didn't do this. I think the best thing to do is just bury those years and let them stay buried.
FFS, people act like it was the Dukiet era or something.
Cannot imagine another fanbase arguing their all time scorer, as well the league's all time leading scorer, should be dead and buried. Always astonishing.
Quote from: wadesworld on July 24, 2024, 04:49:47 PM
Should've raised his framed jersey right into the rafters on his Senior Day/Night.
After Markus' final game versus Villanova, Coach Jay Wright commented that he was happy that VU would never have to face Howard again.
Respect earned - respect given.
I don't blame Markus, I blame Wojo for that team falling apart.
Markus was doing what was asked of him.
Quote from: Skatastrophy on July 24, 2024, 08:38:35 PM
I don't blame Markus, I blame Wojo for that team falling apart.
Markus was doing what was asked of him.
100%
Quote from: The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole on July 24, 2024, 06:27:42 PM
FFS, people act like it was the Dukiet era or something.
For anyone who came to their Marquette fandom in the last 30 years, it was.
Quote from: brewcity77 on July 25, 2024, 07:08:03 AM
For anyone who came to their Marquette fandom in the last 30 years, it was.
And fans are generally stupid
Quote from: Uncle Rico on July 25, 2024, 07:22:09 AM
And fans are generally stupid
The word fan is actually short for infant
Quote from: brewcity77 on July 25, 2024, 07:08:03 AM
For anyone who came to their Marquette fandom in the last 30 years, it was.
Then they're just spoiled morons.
Quote from: The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole on July 25, 2024, 07:44:42 AM
Then they're just spoiled morons.
I think this is just condescending BS. You live in the context of the world around you.
Since 1993, we have gone to 19/30 NCAA tournaments. Every coach except one has won a tourney game. Every coach except one has no more than 1 losing season.
Wojo had zero NCAA wins, is tied for fewest NCAA appearances despite the second longest tenure, and is the only coach in that stretch with multiple losing seasons. For pretty much everyone under the age of 40, Wojo is the least successful coach in their living memory.
Being honest enough to acknowledge that for probably half the fanbase his tenure was rock bottom for the program isn't being spoiled, it's simply acknowledging the reality of the past 30 years.
Quote from: brewcity77 on July 25, 2024, 08:08:42 AM
I think this is just condescending BS. You live in the context of the world around you.
Since 1993, we have gone to 19/30 NCAA tournaments. Every coach except one has won a tourney game. Every coach except one has no more than 1 losing season.
Wojo had zero NCAA wins, is tied for fewest NCAA appearances despite the second longest tenure, and is the only coach in that stretch with multiple losing seasons. For pretty much everyone under the age of 40, Wojo is the least successful coach in their living memory.
Being honest enough to acknowledge that for probably half the fanbase his tenure was rock bottom for the program isn't being spoiled, it's simply acknowledging the reality of the past 30 years.
They're spoiled morons.
"The context of the world around you" doesn't mean looking only at Marquette and only at the time you were following the program. Anybody looking around college basketball can find examples of once proud programs whose "rock bottom" was a hell of a lot worse than making a couple NCAA tournaments. There's examples IN OUR OWN CONFERENCE FFS.
So yeah...I will be condescending to people who don't want to acknowledge Markus' accomplishments because they had to live through the horrors the Wojo-era. Boo-f*cking-hoo.
I expect more from our fans. You should too.
Quote from: brewcity77 on July 25, 2024, 08:08:42 AM
I think this is just condescending BS. You live in the context of the world around you.
Since 1993, we have gone to 19/30 NCAA tournaments. Every coach except one has won a tourney game. Every coach except one has no more than 1 losing season.
Wojo had zero NCAA wins, is tied for fewest NCAA appearances despite the second longest tenure, and is the only coach in that stretch with multiple losing seasons. For pretty much everyone under the age of 40, Wojo is the least successful coach in their living memory.
Being honest enough to acknowledge that for probably half the fanbase his tenure was rock bottom for the program isn't being spoiled, it's simply acknowledging the reality of the past 30 years.
But it's their fault they weren't around for Al
Signed,
2010 grad
Quote from: brewcity77 on July 25, 2024, 08:08:42 AM
I think this is just condescending BS. You live in the context of the world around you.
Since 1993, we have gone to 19/30 NCAA tournaments. Every coach except one has won a tourney game. Every coach except one has no more than 1 losing season.
Wojo had zero NCAA wins, is tied for fewest NCAA appearances despite the second longest tenure, and is the only coach in that stretch with multiple losing seasons. For pretty much everyone under the age of 40, Wojo is the least successful coach in their living memory.
Being honest enough to acknowledge that for probably half the fanbase his tenure was rock bottom for the program isn't being spoiled, it's simply acknowledging the reality of the past 30 years.
I think that this is a good post. In addition to the losing seasons, Wojo had a couple seasons that were going really well and then the wheels fell off completely. As someone who started my Marquette fandom during the Dukiet days, in some ways I felt that the Wojo years were even worse. Objectively? Admittedly not. But subjectively, I was far, far more disappointed by a couple of those Wojo teams than I ever was with a team under Dukiet. A couple of those seasons were just soul-crushingly disappointing.
Quote from: The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole on July 25, 2024, 08:16:51 AM
They're spoiled morons.
"The context of the world around you" doesn't mean looking only at Marquette and only at the time you were following the program. Anybody looking around college basketball can find examples of once proud programs whose "rock bottom" was a hell of a lot worse than making a couple NCAA tournaments. There's examples IN OUR OWN CONFERENCE FFS.
So yeah...I will be condescending to people who don't want to acknowledge Markus' accomplishments because they had to live through the horrors the Wojo-era. Boo-f*cking-hoo.
I expect more from our fans. You should too.
I agree. If Wojo is our bottom (which I think his tenure and Deane's are pretty close), we should feel lucky.
If thinking Wojo was a mediocre coach not up to the standard of what Marquette basketball is cool then call me Miles Davis.
Quote from: Frenns Liquor Depot on July 25, 2024, 08:33:37 AM
If thinking Wojo was a mediocre coach not up to the standard of what Marquette basketball is cool then call me Miles Davis.
I don't think anyone is arguing against that. I think people are arguing against the notion that we should destroy all evidence of Wojo being here.
Quote from: The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole on July 25, 2024, 08:16:51 AM
They're spoiled morons.
"The context of the world around you" doesn't mean looking only at Marquette and only at the time you were following the program. Anybody looking around college basketball can find examples of once proud programs whose "rock bottom" was a hell of a lot worse than making a couple NCAA tournaments. There's examples IN OUR OWN CONFERENCE FFS.
So yeah...I will be condescending to people who don't want to acknowledge Markus' accomplishments because they had to live through the horrors the Wojo-era. Boo-f*cking-hoo.
I expect more from our fans. You should too.
It's possible to both acknowledge how great Howard was and what a failure the Wojo era was.
Strong "old man yells at cloud" vibes from you this morning.
Quote from: brewcity77 on July 25, 2024, 08:46:59 AM
It's possible to both acknowledge how great Howard was and what a failure the Wojo era was.
I never said his era wasn't a failure. He was fired after all. But Marquette's "failures" are a lot better than other's. People need to put things in proper context. You don't refuse to acknowledge your leading scorer...the conference's leading scorer...because of the coach. That's just silliness.
Quote from: brewcity77 on July 25, 2024, 08:46:59 AM
Strong "old man yells at cloud" vibes from you this morning.
Weird. Not doing that at all.
Quote from: Skatastrophy on July 24, 2024, 08:38:35 PM
I don't blame Markus, I blame Wojo for that team falling apart.
Markus was doing what was asked of him.
I generally agree with this analysis. However, I also feel Markus could have independently chosen to play more team oriented basketball - as in not launch step back 27 footers less than 10 seconds into the shot clock, as he could get that shot pretty much anytime he wanted. That aside, he was an incredible talent, yet I can understand why his other capable offensively talented offensive players grew tired of the style, and tired of Wojo.
But Markus is a great rep for MU, and I feel certainly worthy of having his number in the rafters despite not having any postseason success - Wojo was simply a poor coach and hard to overcome poor coaching.
Also, Markus gave the current team a phenomenal speech the other day - one of the most impressive I have seen by any former MU player. Great message for our current players to hear.
With Dukiet Marquette was spending like they were considering going DIII.
With Wojo Marquette was spending near the top 10 schools in the country.
You tell me who's the bigger failure.
Quote from: The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole on July 25, 2024, 08:16:51 AM
They're spoiled morons.
"The context of the world around you" doesn't mean looking only at Marquette and only at the time you were following the program. Anybody looking around college basketball can find examples of once proud programs whose "rock bottom" was a hell of a lot worse than making a couple NCAA tournaments. There's examples IN OUR OWN CONFERENCE FFS.
So yeah...I will be condescending to people who don't want to acknowledge Markus' accomplishments because they had to live through the horrors the Wojo-era. Boo-f*cking-hoo.
I expect more from our fans. You should too.
I can imagine what will be, unburdened by what was.
Markus was a great warrior.
At the end of his speech yesterday he said he's gonna be around for a few days and mentioned getting in the gym. I hope #mubb Twitter releases some clips of him hoopin with the fellas. Would be fun to see
Quote from: lawdog77 on July 25, 2024, 08:27:38 AM
I agree. If Wojo is our bottom (which I think his tenure and Deane's are pretty close), we should feel lucky.
We went 10 years without a tourney win. We spent more on basketball that anyone but 8-10 schools. The Wojo era was an absolute failure. I don't how bad Georgetown or DePaul is. They don't invest in basketball we did and saw nothing.
Quote from: The Lens on July 25, 2024, 10:22:17 AM
We spent more on basketball that anyone but 8-10 schools.
Can we please stop throwing this out? Its not an apples to apples comparison because Marquette's figures include the Fiserv lease.
Regardless, of course it was a failure. Not one is saying otherwise.
Quote from: StillAWarrior on July 25, 2024, 08:23:22 AM
I think that this is a good post. In addition to the losing seasons, Wojo had a couple seasons that were going really well and then the wheels fell off completely. As someone who started my Marquette fandom during the Dukiet days, in some ways I felt that the Wojo years were even worse. Objectively? Admittedly not. But subjectively, I was far, far more disappointed by a couple of those Wojo teams than I ever was with a team under Dukiet. A couple of those seasons were just soul-crushingly disappointing.
Dukiet was rock bottom. I mean, we got scolded by Digger Phelps on the PA during a game...in Milwaukee, for crying out loud!! Wojo did some good things here...recruited well, had some decent wins, beat RED more than he lost to RED, and rep'd the University at a high level. I think we all agree on this. And unlike Mike Deane, for example, Wojo was asked to fix a clogged toilet courtesy of Buzz. But, I do understand the disappointment. Gotta win, and Wojo didn't win enough.
Quote from: Viper on July 25, 2024, 10:37:01 AM
Dukiet was rock bottom. I mean, we got scolded by Digger Phelps on the PA during a game...in Milwaukee, for crying out loud!! Wojo did some good things here...recruited well, had some decent wins, beat RED more than he lost to RED, and rep'd the University at a high level. I think we all agree on this. And unlike Mike Deane, for example, Wojo was asked to fix a clogged toilet courtesy of Buzz. But, I do understand the disappointment. Gotta win, and Wojo didn't win enough.
Well stated.
Quote from: brewcity77 on July 25, 2024, 08:46:59 AM
It's possible to both acknowledge how great Howard was and what a failure the Wojo era was.
No.
One is the product of the other.
I like Markus and he was a great ballplayer. But he reminded me of the late Gary Rosenberger. Tremendous shot, tremendous offense but could not play defense to save his life. Gary never started and Al went after Jim Boylan because he knew this. Markus was a great complement who was called on to lead because of bad coaching.
I've said it before and I'll say it again -- I want to remember people in the rafters who transformed the program. That's why Jimmy B, Jae Crowder, Big Mac, Tyler and Oso all belong in the rafters, with Jim Chones. Markus didn't transform the program.
I'm probably never going to be convinced on Markus.
Quote from: dgies9156 on July 25, 2024, 10:48:30 AM
No.
One is the product of the other.
I like Markus and he was a great ballplayer. But he reminded me of the late Gary Rosenberger. Tremendous shot, tremendous offense but could not play defense to save his life. Gary never started and Al went after Jim Boylan because he knew this. Markus was a great complement who was called on to lead because of bad coaching.
I've said it before and I'll say it again -- I want to remember people in the rafters who transformed the program. That's why Jimmy B, Jae Crowder, Big Mac, Tyler and Oso all belong in the rafters, with Jim Chones. Markus didn't transform the program.
I'm probably never going to be convinced on Markus.
Silliness. Honestly comparing Markus Howard to....Gary Rosenberger? Cmon...
Quote from: dgies9156 on July 25, 2024, 10:48:30 AM
No.
One is the product of the other.
I like Markus and he was a great ballplayer. But he reminded me of the late Gary Rosenberger. Tremendous shot, tremendous offense but could not play defense to save his life. Gary never started and Al went after Jim Boylan because he knew this. Markus was a great complement who was called on to lead because of bad coaching.
I've said it before and I'll say it again -- I want to remember people in the rafters who transformed the program. That's why Jimmy B, Jae Crowder, Big Mac, Tyler and Oso all belong in the rafters, with Jim Chones. Markus didn't transform the program.
I'm probably never going to be convinced on Markus.
I see Cardinals' fans attitudes carry over to their other favorite sports teams. ::)
Quote from: swoopem on July 25, 2024, 10:13:26 AM
At the end of his speech yesterday he said he's gonna be around for a few days and mentioned getting in the gym. I hope #mubb Twitter releases some clips of him hoopin with the fellas. Would be fun to see
The whole team standing around waiting for a pass watching Markus shoot. Kam in the corner writing a letter.
Quote from: dgies9156 on July 25, 2024, 10:48:30 AM
No.
One is the product of the other.
I like Markus and he was a great ballplayer. But he reminded me of the late Gary Rosenberger. Tremendous shot, tremendous offense but could not play defense to save his life. Gary never started and Al went after Jim Boylan because he knew this. Markus was a great complement who was called on to lead because of bad coaching.
I've said it before and I'll say it again -- I want to remember people in the rafters who transformed the program. That's why Jimmy B, Jae Crowder, Big Mac, Tyler and Oso all belong in the rafters, with Jim Chones. Markus didn't transform the program.
I'm probably never going to be convinced on Markus.
Wildly selling Markus short(maybe a pun) defensively.
Good? No.
Rowsey? Hell no.
Legit played together
If you don't wanna be a fan of the all time leading scorer. Fine I guess. But let's try and be objective. This post was not that.
I would compare Markus at MU to Matthew Stafford with Detroit, or to Mike Trout.
Quote from: dgies9156 on July 25, 2024, 10:48:30 AM
No.
One is the product of the other.
I like Markus and he was a great ballplayer. But he reminded me of the late Gary Rosenberger. Tremendous shot, tremendous offense but could not play defense to save his life. Gary never started and Al went after Jim Boylan because he knew this. Markus was a great complement who was called on to lead because of bad coaching.
I've said it before and I'll say it again -- I want to remember people in the rafters who transformed the program. That's why Jimmy B, Jae Crowder, Big Mac, Tyler and Oso all belong in the rafters, with Jim Chones. Markus didn't transform the program.
I'm probably never going to be convinced on Markus.
Saying that Jimmy Butler was transformative at Marquette is absolute nonsense.
Markus is a two time all american, and is our all time leading scorer, and the all time leader in Big East scoring.
And it isn't remotely close in the last two.
To not have him, and suggest that Jimmy Butler (who was a Big East Honorable Mention twice) is one of the strangest takes I have seen on this board... which is routinely filled with memeable takes.
Quote from: dgies9156 on July 25, 2024, 10:48:30 AM
No.
One is the product of the other.
I like Markus and he was a great ballplayer. But he reminded me of the late Gary Rosenberger. Tremendous shot, tremendous offense but could not play defense to save his life. Gary never started and Al went after Jim Boylan because he knew this. Markus was a great complement who was called on to lead because of bad coaching.
I've said it before and I'll say it again -- I want to remember people in the rafters who transformed the program. That's why Jimmy B, Jae Crowder, Big Mac, Tyler and Oso all belong in the rafters, with Jim Chones. Markus didn't transform the program.
I'm probably never going to be convinced on Markus.
Nobody cares what some coach that died two decades ago did when he was coaching plumbers and tax adjusters
Quote from: tower912 on July 25, 2024, 11:01:13 AM
I would compare Markus at MU to Matthew Stafford with Detroit, or to Mike Trout.
Mike Trout was the best player in all of baseball for many years and whoever was #2 wasn't particularly close. Comparing a guy who had a cup of coffee in his sport's Major League to him is a huge stretch.
Quote from: Lennys Tap on July 25, 2024, 11:22:45 AM
Mike Trout was the best player in all of baseball for many years and whoever was #2 wasn't particularly close. Comparing a guy who had a cup of coffee in his sport's Major League to him is a huge stretch.
I think he was merely suggesting that he was a bright spot during a poor era. No more, no less.
Quote from: The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole on July 25, 2024, 11:24:18 AM
I think he was merely suggesting that he was a bright spot during a poor era. No more, no less.
Forget it Sultan, this is Scoop
Quote from: Lennys Tap on July 25, 2024, 11:22:45 AM
Mike Trout was the best player in all of baseball for many years and whoever was #2 wasn't particularly close. Comparing a guy who had a cup of coffee in his sport's Major League to him is a huge stretch.
Oh, Lenny, with the lack of reading comprehension again.
Markus at MU.
Like Stafford, the first name on the scout and usually the only one who could really win a game on what was ultimately an average at best team. Could do things that opponents and other QBs appreciated far more than fans.
Trout, an amazing, transcendant player on ultimately mediocre teams.
Stafford and Trout are going to their hall of fames. Markus is the all time leading scorer in the Big East. Retiring his jersey is the least MU should do.
Stop talking about Detroit stuff. Nobody cares about Detroit stuff.
https://x.com/marquettembb/status/1816512165484109920?s=61&t=6XPB8f4sAKmJIzxgMcsCjw
Did Gary Rosenberger show up yet?
tower
Serious question, why do you think his jersey not been retired yet?
Time
Quote from: tower912 on July 25, 2024, 11:45:31 AM
Time
Yep, when it happens, Wojo will be there. The more time that passes and the more success that Shaka has, the more people (i.e. the average fan that's not on The Scoop during the offseason and the student that's never even heard of Wojo) will be less likely to boo him. I'm sure the last thing Wojo would want is to be a distraction when Markus is honored.
Quote from: Skatastrophy on July 25, 2024, 11:39:52 AM
Stop talking about Detroit stuff. Nobody cares about Detroit stuff.
More interesting to talk about when they made cars there.
https://x.com/marquettembb/status/1816512165484109920?s=46&t=OJ8v5OSYAchdmCLDsa-Kgw
Markus shooting with Stevie and Kam
Quote from: Skatastrophy on July 25, 2024, 10:53:18 AM
The whole team standing around waiting for a pass watching Markus shoot. Kam in the corner writing a letter.
The worst part was end-of-half situations where everyone on both teams and benches knew Markus was going to hoist the shot no matter how many people were covering him.
Amazing offensive talent, hated watching that offense.
Quote from: tower912 on July 25, 2024, 11:01:13 AM
I would compare Markus at MU to Matthew Stafford with Detroit, or to Mike Trout.
Stafford is an excellent comp.
Quote from: dgies9156 on July 25, 2024, 10:48:30 AM
No.
One is the product of the other.
I like Markus and he was a great ballplayer. But he reminded me of the late Gary Rosenberger. Tremendous shot, tremendous offense but could not play defense to save his life. Gary never started and Al went after Jim Boylan because he knew this. Markus was a great complement who was called on to lead because of bad coaching.
I've said it before and I'll say it again -- I want to remember people in the rafters who transformed the program. That's why Jimmy B, Jae Crowder, Big Mac, Tyler and Oso all belong in the rafters, with Jim Chones. Markus didn't transform the program.
I'm probably never going to be convinced on Markus.
Jimmy, Jae, Mac, Oso? They were good, not great college players worthy of that honor. Markus? He won nothing for MU. Kolek should absolutely be up there based on his individual and team accomplishments over his entire career at MU.
Quote from: MuMark on July 25, 2024, 11:42:07 AM
https://x.com/marquettembb/status/1816512165484109920?s=61&t=6XPB8f4sAKmJIzxgMcsCjw
Great form on those shots
Stevie's release looks quicker.
For me, Markus was worth the price of a ticket. Team success aside, I loved watching him shoot. Quick release. Step back 3's. That 10 minute barrage vs Buffalo? Good stuff.
Quote from: TSmith34, Inc. on July 25, 2024, 12:11:52 PM
The worst part was end-of-half situations where everyone on both teams and benches knew Markus was going to hoist the shot no matter how many people were covering him.
except at least one time at Creighton that comes to mind
That was a terrible scheme because Markus passed it to Sam.
Quote from: tower912 on July 25, 2024, 01:21:18 PM
That was a terrible scheme because Markus passed it to Sam.
Don't agree.......they knew with the lack of time ( 8 tenths) that Sam was the guy they wanted to get it to......Markus was the guy he trusted most to deliver the pass.......and it worked perfectly.
Quote from: Spotcheck Billy on July 25, 2024, 01:20:16 PM
except at least one time at Creighton that comes to mind
Wojo's best coaching job of his entire tenure--having Markus inbound the ball!
Quote from: TSmith34, Inc. on July 25, 2024, 01:31:49 PM
Wojo's best coaching job of his entire tenure--having Markus inbound the ball!
Not according to Ners.
Quote from: MuMark on July 25, 2024, 01:30:23 PM
Don't agree.......they knew with the lack of time ( 8 tenths) that Sam was the guy they wanted to get it to......Markus was the guy he trusted most to deliver the pass.......and it worked perfectly.
Sorry. Should have put it in teal. At the time, it caused quite a kerfluffle.
Quote from: The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole on July 25, 2024, 01:39:39 PM
Not according to Ners.
100%.
Watching the replay of the play there was very little about the design/execution of the play that was intelligent. Chartouney ran his defender right into the area of Hauser's shot. Markus should have had Joey's role in the play, and Joey should have been the inbounder. Period.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sk9_IA5-rD8
Quote from: Elonsmusk on July 25, 2024, 02:02:45 PM
100%.
Watching the replay of the play there was very little about the design/execution of the play that was intelligent. Chartouney ran his defender right into the area of Hauser's shot. Markus should have had Joey's role in the play, and Joey should have been the inbounder. Period.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sk9_IA5-rD8
This is just so funny.
Quote from: Elonsmusk on July 25, 2024, 02:02:45 PM
100%.
Watching the replay of the play there was very little about the design/execution of the play that was intelligent. Chartouney ran his defender right into the area of Hauser's shot. Markus should have had Joey's role in the play, and Joey should have been the inbounder. Period.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sk9_IA5-rD8
The most important part of that clip is that those uniforms are not the best.
Quote from: Elonsmusk on July 25, 2024, 02:02:45 PM
100%.
Watching the replay of the play there was very little about the design/execution of the play that was intelligent. Chartouney ran his defender right into the area of Hauser's shot. Markus should have had Joey's role in the play, and Joey should have been the inbounder. Period.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sk9_IA5-rD8
Pavlov's fan.
Quote from: Hards Alumni on July 25, 2024, 12:41:07 PM
Great form on those shots
Quote from: tower912 on July 25, 2024, 12:57:38 PM
Stevie's release looks quicker.
It's crazy seeing these shooters back to back. As quick as Kam and Stevie have gotten, Markus' release is like 50% faster yet. You can tell his shot is next level.
Quote from: Lennys Tap on July 25, 2024, 11:22:45 AM
Mike Trout was the best player in all of baseball for many years and whoever was #2 wasn't particularly close. Comparing a guy who had a cup of coffee in his sport's Major League to him is a huge stretch.
He's comparing what Markus was in college basketball (a First Team All American, so one of the very best players in that level who put up ginormous numbers but didn't have the team success other great players have) to Mike Trout, who has done the same at the MLB level.
Quote from: The Lens on July 25, 2024, 10:22:17 AM
We went 10 years without a tourney win. We spent more on basketball that anyone but 8-10 schools. The Wojo era was an absolute failure. I don't how bad Georgetown or DePaul is. They don't invest in basketball we did and saw nothing.
Just feel like it needs to be stated that in that 10yrs
3 of them were::
Buzz's last year
No tournament, likely don't get a win but can't say definitively
Shaka's first year.
Wojo's time was not a passing grade (I wouldn't say complete failure) but to say "we went 10yrs without a tourny win" with your ultimate take away being Wojo's era was a failure misrepresents how many attempts there were. In excusable in 2019, toss up whether we deserved a win in 2017, missed a prime chance in 2018, poor scheduling in 2016. Flat out terrible teams & coaching in 2015 and 2021.
Quote from: lawdog77 on July 25, 2024, 02:25:51 PM
The most important part of that clip is that those uniforms are not the best.
Better than what we currently have.
Quote from: Elonsmusk on July 25, 2024, 02:02:45 PM
100%.
Watching the replay of the play there was very little about the design/execution of the play that was intelligent. Chartouney ran his defender right into the area of Hauser's shot. Markus should have had Joey's role in the play, and Joey should have been the inbounder. Period.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sk9_IA5-rD8
Chartouney's defender wasn't anywhere near Sam before Markus threw the pass. And of course his defender then ran to Sam. Just like everyone's defender did. There was 0.8 second left on the clock. You think the defenders were going to stay glued to their man in that situation?
🤌🏼
Quote from: wadesworld on July 25, 2024, 03:06:06 PM
Better than what we currently have.
(https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/001/483/348/bdd.jpg)
Sam sent it to OT. Markus scored 14 of his 53 in OT.
Quote from: tower912 on July 25, 2024, 01:43:38 PM
Sorry. Should have put it in teal. At the time, it caused quite a kerfluffle.
Sorry for not picking up the sarcasm........my bad.....👍
Quote from: tower912 on July 25, 2024, 03:26:43 PM
Sam sent it to OT. Markus scored 14 of his 53 in OT.
He shoulda scored 15 of his 54. He sucked.
Quote from: MuMark on July 25, 2024, 11:42:07 AM
https://x.com/marquettembb/status/1816512165484109920?s=61&t=6XPB8f4sAKmJIzxgMcsCjw
What an a-hole!
Quote from: MuMark on July 25, 2024, 11:42:07 AM
https://x.com/marquettembb/status/1816512165484109920?s=61&t=6XPB8f4sAKmJIzxgMcsCjw
Thanks for posting enjoyed watching Markus helping Kam and Stevie. Three excellent young men.
Quote from: Elonsmusk on July 25, 2024, 08:59:39 AM
However, I also feel Markus could have independently chosen to play more team oriented basketball - as in not launch step back 27 footers less than 10 seconds into the shot clock, as he could get that shot pretty much anytime he wanted.
Actually that's the only time you can get that shot.
Markus shoulda passed more to Joey. That team needed more turnovers.
Quote from: The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole on July 25, 2024, 02:18:25 PM
This is just so funny.
Standard fare weak offering Sultan. But I guess if you found my take "funny," then you must believe Joey being in the action was better than Markus - which is funny given all the Joey Vanilla Soft Serve Hauser hate club, that you and the defenders of this inbounds play are proud members. Now that's funny.
Quote from: MU82 on July 25, 2024, 02:35:48 PM
Pavlov's fan.
100% - Always will be a dog on the bone on this topic and the faction of Wojo apologists that thought that inbound play was good coaching, and well conceived. The reality is, is that you too no it was idiotic but are too prideful to concede the idiocy of that inbound concept. Just like Sultan. And Wades. And Rico.
This turning into the scoopiest of the scoop arguments.
Back on topic, great for Markus to be back on campus, and hoping the young ones are soaking up all of Markus' knowledge.
Indeed. He has wisdom to impart.
Quote from: lawdog77 on July 25, 2024, 06:15:10 PM
This turning into the scoopiest of the scoop arguments.
Back on topic, great for Markus to be back on campus, and hoping the young ones are soaking up all of Markus' knowledge.
It's amazing but that's what Caymus drinkers do
Quote from: Elonsmusk on July 25, 2024, 06:12:16 PM
Standard fare weak offering Sultan. But I guess if you found my take "funny," then you must believe Joey being in the action was better than Markus - which is funny given all the Joey Vanilla Soft Serve Hauser hate club, that you and the defenders of this inbounds play are proud members. Now that's funny.
I will defend an inbounds play, run down three with .8 on the clock, that was successful. It's beyond silly that you choose this hill to die on...but it's so very Ners.
Quote from: Billy Hoyle on July 25, 2024, 12:13:34 PM
Jimmy, Jae, Mac, Oso? They were good, not great college players worthy of that honor. Markus? He won nothing for MU. Kolek should absolutely be up there based on his individual and team accomplishments over his entire career at MU.
TIL that Jae Crowder, 2012 Big East Player of the Year and All-American, was a good-not-great college player.
The league was soft that year. Otherwise, Jae wouldn't have won anything.
Quote from: Elonsmusk on July 25, 2024, 06:12:16 PM
Standard fare weak offering Sultan. But I guess if you found my take "funny," then you must believe Joey being in the action was better than Markus - which is funny given all the Joey Vanilla Soft Serve Hauser hate club, that you and the defenders of this inbounds play are proud members. Now that's funny.
100% - Always will be a dog on the bone on this topic and the faction of Wojo apologists that thought that inbound play was good coaching, and well conceived. The reality is, is that you too no it was idiotic but are too prideful to concede the idiocy of that inbound concept. Just like Sultan. And Wades. And Rico.
Woof!
Quote from: lawdog77 on July 25, 2024, 06:15:10 PM
Back on topic, great for Markus to be back on campus, and hoping the young ones are soaking up all of Markus' knowledge.
Brother Dog:
While I don't agree with rafters treatment for Markus, I firmly agree with you and think all of our basketball alumni who can make it back to campus, should. We have an incredible legacy that should be told often.
This whole playcall argument feels ridiculous, but for that play to work, it needed two things to be perfect. First, the pass, second, the shot. The only way Sam gets the look he gets is with an inch-perfect pass. I too would not trust Joey to make that pass in that moment. The only other acceptable option was having Sam inbound to Markus, but it would have been harder for Markus to get a shot over a defender at 5'11" than for Sam at 6'7".
Ultimately, there's no rationale for saying it was a poor play call for two reasons. First, you needed two parts to be perfect and those two things (pass and shot) were put in the hands of the two most competent players on the team. Second, it worked and for better or worse, results matter. Had Wojo pulled off more of those moments, he might still be coach here, but because those big highlight moments were too few and far between, he isn't.
And actually, if I remember right, weren't inbounds plays one of the things that Wojo actually did pretty well?
Quote from: Skatastrophy on July 25, 2024, 08:52:00 PM
TIL that Jae Crowder, 2012 Big East Player of the Year and All-American, was a good-not-great college player.
The league was soft that year. Otherwise, Jae wouldn't have won anything.
Jimmy & Oso probably are the names to focus on of those 4, maybe Mac, idk if the GMWC POY was viewed as a big deal back then.
I had no idea this post would kick off a scoop argument at the time lol
Quote from: Spotcheck Billy on July 25, 2024, 01:20:16 PM
except at least one time at Creighton that comes to mind
Quote from: Spotcheck Billy on July 26, 2024, 10:47:13 AM
I had no idea this post would kick off a scoop argument at the time lol
I think wishing someone good morning could start a Wojo debate.
Quote from: cheebs09 on July 26, 2024, 11:00:18 AM
I think wishing someone good morning could start a Wojo debate.
Also, a Hauser debate, a Crean debate, a Hank debate, a jump shot debate and a NIL debate
Quote from: Uncle Rico on July 26, 2024, 11:03:57 AM
Also, a Hauser debate, a Crean debate, a Hank debate, a jump shot debate and a NIL debate
That sounds like something dopey cowboy Buzz would have said after he lost his happy.
Quote from: The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole on July 26, 2024, 10:24:35 AM
And actually, if I remember right, weren't inbounds plays one of the things that Wojo actually did pretty well?
Only if you considering inbounding it into the corner against a press a good thing. Ugh.
I am guessing the Puerto Rican Basketball team wishes Markus had taken them up on their offer.
They got beat by South Sudan 90-79.
Suprisingly, South Sudan has a decent squad.
Formed and developed by ex Chicago Bull Luol Deng. They took the US team to the wire a couple weeks ago. Losing by one on a LeBron bucket in the closing seconds. I think they led by about 15 at half.
Hopefully the US team won't be surprised a second time in the Olympic game on Wednesday.
Quote from: brewcity77 on July 26, 2024, 10:19:24 AM
This whole playcall argument feels ridiculous, but for that play to work, it needed two things to be perfect. First, the pass, second, the shot. The only way Sam gets the look he gets is with an inch-perfect pass. I too would not trust Joey to make that pass in that moment. The only other acceptable option was having Sam inbound to Markus, but it would have been harder for Markus to get a shot over a defender at 5'11" than for Sam at 6'7".
Ultimately, there's no rationale for saying it was a poor play call for two reasons. First, you needed two parts to be perfect and those two things (pass and shot) were put in the hands of the two most competent players on the team. Second, it worked and for better or worse, results matter. Had Wojo pulled off more of those moments, he might still be coach here, but because those big highlight moments were too few and far between, he isn't.
Exactly.......with that short amount of clock.... to get any legitimate shot off is a great play.