MUScoop
MUScoop => Hangin' at the Al => Topic started by: 1SE on March 07, 2020, 11:20:02 AM
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This is awful. If the team has quit on him might as well give Stan a chance to in NCAA with these players.
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Not worthy to get in Dance.
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I love Stan. He’s coaching his tail off, talking to Koby, coaching in huddles, he’s got my vote over the current
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Yes!!
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I love Stan. He’s coaching his tail off, talking to Koby, coaching in huddles, he’s got my vote over the current
What could it possibly hurt right?
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If giving Stan the job meant keeping our recruits I’d sign up for that experiment. A change in leadership is needed end of story. Wojo has never been a good coach. Now he’s a mediocre coach who doesn’t even have the command of his team. Change is needed.
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Really hoping the team loses the bid at this point its just beating a dead horse out there. Time to have mercy and end the season with some dignity
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I must be very difficult for Stan to have to watch this train wreck!
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Really hoping the team loses the bid at this point its just beating a dead horse out there. Time to have mercy and end the season with some dignity
You've said some mighty stupid things. This may be the dumbest
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Really hoping the team loses the bid at this point its just beating a dead horse out there. Time to have mercy and end the season with some dignity
Ban dis guy
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We all want win. Wojo has given his best effort. It isn't good enough to be successful in the BE. Wish it weren't so, but it's time for a change.
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Team is a complete disaster. Kinda feel bad for Howard, what a crap way to end. Has all these scoring records, but lack of winning throughout his career, I don't think he will ever be considered an all time MU great. After the last few games, is he even an All America? The team is just so bad....
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I also feel bad for Howard. Sad way to finish a career.
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Looked like Stan was the assistant with the scout assignment for this game. :-\
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Team is a complete disaster. Kinda feel bad for Howard, what a crap way to end. Has all these scoring records, but lack of winning throughout his career, I don't think he will ever be considered an all time MU great. After the last few games, is he even an All America? The team is just so bad....
He is an all-time great at Marquette, but we never had a team during his tenure. Those two facts aren't mutually exclusive.
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Back to back epic collapse ends to seasons. Unbelievable. Incredulous
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If giving Stan the job meant keeping our recruits I’d sign up for that experiment. A change in leadership is needed end of story. Wojo has never been a good coach. Now he’s a mediocre coach who doesn’t even have the command of his team. Change is needed.
At this point what does it matter? This has turned real bad real quick. To think 3 Freshman will salvage further decline is wishful. Wholesale changes needed quickly. I’m willing to give up on the next class to get rid of this joker.
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Looked like Stan was the assistant with the scout assignment for this game. :-\
Speculation. However even if that were the case, nothing Stan can really do when Wojo calls the shots on playing time/subs.
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At this point what does it matter? This has turned real bad real quick. To think 3 Freshman will salvage further decline is wishful. Wholesale changes needed quickly. I’m willing to give up on the next class to get rid of this joker.
Oh totally agree. I’ve been in the Wojo must go camp for a while. I was just responding to the idea of Stan getting the reigns.
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Did anyone stop and think Stan may be part of the problem?
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Speculation. However even if that were the case, nothing Stan can really do when Wojo calls the shots on playing time/subs.
You could tell from the timeouts.
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Did anyone stop and think Stan may be part of the problem?
Was Buzz part of a problem as assistant? We really don’t know what Stan is all about. I like what I see really don’t know how good he is. But I like the guy and gut feeling is he would do well
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Did anyone stop and think Stan may be part of the problem?
After hearing Stan in the timeouts in each of the last two games, I’m even more convinced he is 100% NOT the problem, and 100% a great and viable solution.
The contrast of content/coaching between he and Wojo in those segments was illuminating AF.
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You could tell from the timeouts.
We’ve seen Stan active during timeouts several times recently. I’ve never seen another asst running the huddles, but maybe I’ve missed it. Are we sure this is because Stan prepped the gameplan or is there something else going on?
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Yes. He will be a great head coach because of what they show on TV during timeouts.
🙄🙄🙄
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Yes. He will be a great head coach because of what they show on TV during timeouts.
🙄🙄🙄
I agree but you have to admit, Wojo's timeouts on TV have been telling of his coaching ability. ;D
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Really hoping the team loses the bid at this point its just beating a dead horse out there. Time to have mercy and end the season with some dignity
Hit eject.
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After hearing Stan in the timeouts in each of the last two games, I’m even more convinced he is 100% NOT the problem, and 100% a great and viable solution.
The contrast of content/coaching between he and Wojo in those segments was illuminating AF.
I think the Hauser family would disagree with your assessment.
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I think the Hauser family would disagree with your assessment.
Dave Hauser and his opinions can get the unnatural carnal knowledge out of here.
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I think the Hauser family would disagree with your assessment.
LMAO. Pure fiction. But go ahead, and share with all of us what you've heard...
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Stan Johnson has shown to be a good recruiter. The fact that someone has not tried to hire him as a head coach should probably tell you something.
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Yes. He will be a great head coach because of what they show on TV during timeouts.
🙄🙄🙄
Well Fluff - I said 10 games into Buzz's tenure that he'd likely take us to Elite 8s/Final Fours if he stayed here 10 years....and some here (perhaps you were in that camp), ridiculed me.
I also told this board 7 games into Wojo's tenure that he didn't have it...and got banned here multiple times over for sounding the alarm.
As it relates to Stan? Sure..you can ridicule these in the huddle segments..but..if what we hear out of Wojo is his best (which it should be during games), it is embarrassing - particularly when measured against Stan's messaging. Stan is much more on point, coherent, and astute in his messaging.
Stan would retain all the recruits, not command a massive salary, provide continuity, and is a good recruiter. No reason to not give him a 3-4 year deal to see what he can do.
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Stan Johnson has shown to be a good recruiter. The fact that someone has not tried to hire him as a head coach should probably tell you something.
Yep. Stan or Wojo or both will not be here next year. My money is on Stan.
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Well Fluff - I said 10 games into Buzz's tenure that he'd likely take us to Elite 8s/Final Fours if he stayed here 10 years....and some here (perhaps you were in that camp), ridiculed me.
I also told this board 7 games into Wojo's tenure that he didn't have it...and got banned here multiple times over for sounding the alarm.
As it relates to Stan? Sure..you can ridicule these in the huddle segments..but..if what we hear out of Wojo is his best (which it should be during games), it is embarrassing - particularly when measured against Stan's messaging. Stan is much more on point, coherent, and astute in his messaging.
Stan would retain all the recruits, not command a massive salary, provide continuity, and is a good recruiter. No reason to not give him a 3-4 year deal to see what he can do.
Slight correction: you got banned multiple times because you’re a tool.
Stan might be a good coach. I have no idea. But I know enough not to base my opinion on how he conducts televised huddles. Just like I wouldn’t compare a player to Magic Johnson based on their performance versus Grambling.
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Stan makes a nice salary at MU. Good recruiter, maybe, maybe not. Good coach, not sure. No big program is going to risk hiring him. Only chance is if Wojo leaves, but who is hiring him? Salary is pretty nice at MU
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I think Wojo quits. Assuming he is gone isn't Stan the best we are going to do? Keep the recruits etc give him a couple years. No chance in hell Mu actually hires an experienced coach.
Brian wardle time?
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Slight correction: you got banned multiple times because you’re a tool.
Stan might be a good coach. I have no idea. But I know enough not to base my opinion on how he conducts televised huddles. Just like I wouldn’t compare a player to Magic Johnson based on their performance versus Grambling.
Look. You can call me a tool...don't really care. Truth of the matter is, is that I was right about Buzz, right about Larry Williams de-railing Buzz/the program (while before it came to light - you called me a tin-foil hat guy), and right about Wojo not having it.
Feel free to continue on with the "funny" joke about Magic Dawson. Saying someone made passes that were Magic Johnson-esque, isn't saying he's Magic Johnson. Funny the guy is good enough to make the G-League 3 years in a row. But hey...no doubt Derrick Wilson was a better option.
As for Stan - my perception is based on his being our best recruiter, interviews I've seen, and the from the recent in the huddle segments. Of course you will never know what an assistant can be until he becomes a head coach. Duh. But...it is pretty f'in easy to see Stan is sharper and far more charismatic.
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Who recruited Garcia, Osa and Lewis? If Stan, he's the new head coach. Let's give him a chance and keep the recruits.
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I think Wojo quits. Assuming he is gone isn't Stan the best we are going to do? Keep the recruits etc give him a couple years. No chance in hell Mu actually hires an experienced coach.
Brian wardle time?
You mean he like quits, stays at home to complete some hobbies and lose millions, or resigns to take another position?
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Yep. Stan or Wojo or both will not be here next year. My money is on Stan.
So, based on your previous post and this one... Are you saying Stan is part of the problem and he's going to leave? (Either because he wants out or because Wojo is thinks he's a problem)
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So, based on your previous post and this one... Are you saying Stan is part of the problem and he's going to leave? (Either because he wants out or because Wojo is thinks he's a problem)
Stan did recruit these guys...
They don't fit together...
There's a lot to be said there.
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Stan did recruit these guys...
They don't fit together...
There's a lot to be said there.
They don't fit together because the head coach has major limitations. There is only so much an assistant can do. You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink applies.
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Who recruited Garcia, Osa and Lewis? If Stan, he's the new head coach. Let's give him a chance and keep the recruits.
Killings for Lewis. Stan for a Osa and more of the crew for Garcia. Tread lightly here.
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Team is a complete disaster. Kinda feel bad for Howard, what a crap way to end. Has all these scoring records, but lack of winning throughout his career, I don't think he will ever be considered an all time MU great. After the last few games, is he even an All America? The team coaching is just so bad....
FIFY
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Stan did recruit these guys...
Clueless per usual.
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I think Wojo quits. Assuming he is gone isn't Stan the best we are going to do? Keep the recruits etc give him a couple years. No chance in hell Mu actually hires an experienced coach.
Brian wardle time?
There is zero chance he quits.
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Assuming he is gone isn't Stan the best we are going to do?
Wow, is this how badly the Wojo era has devalued perception of this program??
It hasn’t for me. This program can and should be very strong year in and year out. Find the right guy. They’re out there. Scholl’s job to figure it out and start cleaning up this mess
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You think there is ZERO chance he leaves and takes another job?
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Clueless per usual.
Coming from the guy who carries Wojo on his shoulders. Next please!
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You think there is ZERO chance he leaves and takes another job?
I think he’s coached himself out of any P6 openings, even the worst ones. He definitely would no longer be a candidate for Wake. They ain’t paying Danny Manning a $15 million buyout to hire Wojo.
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I wouldn't think we would hire another white guy
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I wouldn't think we would hire another white guy
What are you talking about and more importantly, what does it have to do with anything?
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I love Stan. He’s coaching his tail off, talking to Koby, coaching in huddles, he’s got my vote over the current
I mean, I think Stan is a very valuable part of THIS staff. However, if he was really helping the players more than Wojo, don't you think we'd be winning more. Stan has always been active with the players, IMO, it hasn't helped much when it comes to the 2nd half of conference seasons.
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I mean, I think Stan is a very valuable part of THIS staff. However, if he was really helping the players more than Wojo, don't you think we'd be winning more. Stan has always been active with the players, IMO, it hasn't helped much when it comes to the 2nd half of conference seasons.
Stan has had to spend most all of his “coaching” time, keeping guys heads right, bolstering confidence, talking kids out of transferring - largely due to Wojo’s in-game coaching. He’s largely in damage control and preservation mode.
Beyond that, assistant coaches do not make substitutions. Let me know the next time you see an assistant coach call for one of our bench players to check in. Stan cannot at his discretion make substitutions.
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Stan has had to spend most all of his “coaching” time, keeping guys heads right, bolstering confidence, talking kids out of transferring - largely due to Wojo’s in-game coaching. He’s largely in damage control and preservation mode.
Beyond that, assistant coaches do not make substitutions. Let me know the next time you see an assistant coach call for one of our bench players to check in. Stan cannot at his discretion make substitutions.
Oh good God. ::) :o
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Stan has had to spend most all of his “coaching” time, keeping guys heads right, bolstering confidence, talking kids out of transferring - largely due to Wojo’s in-game coaching. He’s largely in damage control and preservation mode.
And if he was as good at that as people believe, we'd have won a few more of the last 9 games.
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Oh good God. ::) :o
Your pride and ego really aren’t serving you well.
Sorry you went all in in the guy from Day 1, and have continued for 6 years, only to be left eating a big sh$t burger.
Time to let it go Wades. Stan may not be the answer, but, any, objective fan can realize Wojo sure as hell isn’t.
The most die hard of Wojo backers tried to suggest that Butler and Xavier were rebuilding faster and better than Wojo because they hired from within. But now when I suggest doing the same?
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Your pride and ego really aren’t serving you well.
Sorry you went all in in the guy from Day 1, and have continued for 6 years, only to be left eating a big sh$t burger.
Time to let it go Wades. Stan may not be the answer, but, any, objective fan can realize Wojo sure as hell isn’t.
The most die hard of Wojo backers tried to suggest that Butler and Xavier were rebuilding faster and better than Wojo because they hired from within. But now when I suggest doing the same?
Shockingly, none of this has to do with the hysterically stupid claim you made that I replied to. You’ve made some really, really hilariously stupid claims here. That one topped it all.
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And if he was as good at that as people believe, we'd have won a few more of the last 9 games.
Sure. But Stan wasn’t the coach putting Koby and Brendan back into the game in second half. I (and others) were incredulous in the game thread when we were on a run and Wojo brought Koby and Brendan back at 8 minute mark.
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Hey listen to Ners. The only thing stopping Stan Wooden from achieving his rightful place at the pinnacle of of the college coaching is pyramid is Wojo.
Just like Wojo cramped the development of Magic Johnson / Oscar Dawson.
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Shockingly, none of this has to do with the hysterically stupid claim you made that I replied to. You’ve made some really, really hilariously stupid claims here. That one topped it all.
Dude. You have absolutely zero room to talk. You’ve been the biggest f’in Wojo cheerleader on this board for six years. And over and over and over again you just fail. You have ZERO credibility to suggest I make hilariously stupid claims.
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Just stunned over all the mental mistakes Koby makes from the traveling, to wild passes, to stepping out if bounds on that breakaway for a 3 (I understand it when crowded in tight half court but not on an open court like that.) Bailey is just feast or famine.
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Dude. You have absolutely zero room to talk. You’ve been the biggest f’in Wojo cheerleader on this board for six years. And over and over and over again you just fail. You have ZERO credibility to suggest I make hilariously stupid claims.
You’re right. This team would be so much better if Stan could just coach the players on the team. Sadly he has to spend all of his time re-recruiting the players on the team to play for the coach they want to leave.
Lol. I tried. But no. Still absolutely hilariously stupid. And that’s understating how stupid it is.
But good take! No surprise you’d actually put that out there.
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Hey listen to Ners. The only thing stopping Stan Wooden from achieving his rightful place at the pinnacle of of the college coaching is pyramid is Wojo.
Just like Wojo cramped the development of Magic Johnson / Oscar Dawson.
I don’t know how good of coach Stan can be. What I do know, is that he’s got a hell of a lot more charisma, presence, and potential than our current coach.
And I do know that promoting him into the slot would be the least disruptive to the program, and would be more feasible economically than trying to land a whale.
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I don’t know how good of coach Stan can be. What I do know, is that he’s got a hell of a lot more charisma, presence, and potential than our current coach.
And I do know that promoting him into the slot would be the least disruptive to the program, and would be more feasible economically than trying to land a whale.
Yep. Just gotta turn it over to Stan Auerbach and all will be well.
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You’re right. This team would be so much better if Stan could just coach the players on the team. Sadly he has to spend all of his time re-recruiting the players on the team to play for the coach they want to leave.
Lol. I tried. But no. Still absolutely hilariously stupid. And that’s understating how stupid it is.
But good take! No surprise you’d actually put that out there.
Yep. Pretty sure Sacar, Bailey, Cain all needed to be re-recruited last spring and Stan was the one charged with salvaging.
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Yep. Pretty sure Sacar, Bailey, Cain all needed to be re-recruited last spring and Stan was the one charged with salvaging.
Is this sarcasm or actually true?
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Yep. Pretty sure Sacar, Bailey, Cain all needed to be re-recruited last spring and Stan was the one charged with salvaging.
And you know this how?
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And you know this how?
link=topic=60210.msg1219337#msg1219337 date=1583639868]
Is this sarcasm or actually true?
[/quote]
Was widely discussed here shortly after Hausers left.
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Yep. Pretty sure Sacar, Bailey, Cain all needed to be re-recruited last spring and Stan was the one charged with salvaging.
Yep, until Joey was hurt too much and Dave thought they were a good package, players wanted to leave.
Once the over played vanilla soft serve departed, no one was leaving. Stan didn’t have to do anything.
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link=topic=60210.msg1219337#msg1219337 date=1583639868]
Is this sarcasm or actually true?
Was widely discussed here shortly after Hausers left.
Oh so you read it on the Internet. Must be true then.
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And you know this how?
He doesn’t.
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I love Stan. He’s coaching his tail off, talking to Koby, coaching in huddles, he’s got my vote over the current
So, that would mean he’s just as responsible for the meltdown.
The cult of Stan never fails to amuse. Classic backup quarterback syndrome here.
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Yep, until Joey was hurt too much and Dave thought they were a good package, players wanted to leave.
Once the over played vanilla soft serve departed, no one was leaving. Stan didn’t have to do anything.
“Overplayed vanilla soft serve.” GTFOH with that.
You think Brendan Bailey is tough? Think Bailey was better than Joey? Please. Bailey was awful last year.
Hausers bailed because their eyes were wide open to Wojo’s inability to reign in Markus, and control the locker room.
Looks like the same movie this year. Sacar largely checked out. Koby clearly had a rough year. Team imploded down the stretch.
Who’s to blame for that this year, now that “vanilla soft serve” ain’t here?
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“Overplayed vanilla soft serve.” GTFOH with that.
You think Brendan Bailey is tough? Think Bailey was better than Joey? Please. Bailey was awful last year.
Hausers bailed because their eyes were wide open to Wojo’s inability to reign in Markus, and control the locker room.
Looks like the same movie this year. Sacar largely checked out. Koby clearly had a rough year. Team imploded down the stretch.
Who’s to blame for that this year, now that “vanilla soft serve” ain’t here?
You speak with no substance. Shh.
Joey Hauser may be the worst recruit in MU history, that’s on Wojo. Over promised an overrated talent due to injury. Hope he can find the game that made him hyped in the first place, if not, it’ll be an interesting career.
Sam would still be with his former best friend Markus if Joey went to Izzo in the first place.
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You speak with no substance. Shh.
Joey Hauser may be the worst recruit in MU history, that’s on Wojo. Over promised an overrated talent due to injury. Hope he can find the game that made him hyped in the first place, if not, it’ll be an interesting career.
Sam would still be with his former best friend Markus if Joey went to Izzo in the first place.
Agree on the Sam part, but I suspect Joey will prove you far wrong over time.
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Agree on the Sam part, but I suspect Joey will prove you far wrong over time.
He very well could, he wasn’t playing full strength. Family demanded those minutes and the shots regardless. That’s on Wojo.
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“Overplayed vanilla soft serve.” GTFOH with that.
You think Brendan Bailey is tough? Think Bailey was better than Joey? Please. Bailey was awful last year.
Hausers bailed because their eyes were wide open to Wojo’s inability to reign in Markus, and control the locker room.
Looks like the same movie this year. Sacar largely checked out. Koby clearly had a rough year. Team imploded down the stretch.
Who’s to blame for that this year, now that “vanilla soft serve” ain’t here?
More of a refusal.
Markus is not a winner. He’s about stats.
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More of a refusal.
Markus is not a winner. He’s about stats.
#M2N
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Joey Hauser will be a solid player in turkey or a perennial g leaguer. Nothing more
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Is this sarcasm or actually true?
I don't know about Bailey but Anim and Morrow were headed out the door last April. Stan convinced them both to stay.
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More of a refusal.
Markus is not a winner. He’s about stats.
A big part of me doesn't want to believe that. But then there's a very logical part of me that puts myself in his shoes and can see the perspective of "they can't get it done consistently, so I might as well do it myself."
Honestly, this is a super weird team. Tons of experience, and experience against top competition, but still very unsure of their roles. Most years in March, announcers would be drooling over our level of experience, but for some reason, it's just not translating on the floor. Plus, we lost one of our most experienced players about 6 weeks ago. How should a fan interpret all of this?
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A big part of me doesn't want to believe that. But then there's a very logical part of me that puts myself in his shoes and can see the perspective of "they can't get it done consistently, so I might as well do it myself."
Honestly, this is a super weird team. Tons of experience, and experience against top competition, but still very unsure of their roles. Most years in March, announcers would be drooling over our level of experience, but for some reason, it's just not translating on the floor. Plus, we lost one of our most experienced players about 6 weeks ago. How should a fan interpret all of this?
My remarks are about markus the player and not the person.
I think he’s very fortunate to go to MU and have Steve as his coach. Steve allowed him to do whatever he wanted, and showcase himself as a player, while his teammates had to play 4,5,6th fiddle. I say 4,5, and 6 because Markus was always options 1-3.
That is solely on Wojo. Steve never reeled Markus in. In my opinion, that has caused players to transfer, and straight up leave the team because they didn’t appreciate hero ball every single game.
Again, I think MH is extremely lucky to have Wojo as a coach because he was able to showcase himself for 4 years. I also think he’s unfortunate because he could have developed into a better ball handler, passer, defensive player with another coach.
I miss team basketball. I saw a few rare glimpses of it this year, more so in the non-conference cupcake games, which was nice to see. I don’t see anything changing if Wojo is here next year with Garcia. It’ll be the same wash, rinse, repeat as it was with Howard, and Henry.
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My remarks are about markus the player and not the person.
I think he’s very fortunate to go to MU and have Steve as his coach. Steve allowed him to do whatever he wanted, and showcase himself as a player, while his teammates had to play 4,5,6th fiddle. I say 4,5, and 6 because Markus was always options 1-3.
That is solely on Wojo. Steve never reeled Markus in. In my opinion, that has caused players to transfer, and straight up leave the team because they didn’t appreciate hero ball every single game.
Again, I think MH is extremely lucky to have Wojo as a coach because he was able to showcase himself for 4 years. I also think he’s unfortunate because he could have developed into a better ball handler, passer, defensive player with another coach.
I miss team basketball. I saw a few rare glimpses of it this year, more so in the non-conference cupcake games, which was nice to see.
Then you don't watch Markus much. If guys on this team could finish, his assist rate would be closer to 40%. He creates for others regularly but they can't finish. Koby, Sacar, Bailey, John, who else in that starting lineup do you trust to score, ever?
Markus failed to reach 20 points in 6 of the first 9 games this year. The opportunity was there for others to step up, often because Markus himself was creating those opportunities. And no one could do it. So he takes the load because he has to.
Same with the stretch last year. Yes, Markus was bad at the end, but it's not like the rest of the roster was tearing it up. Joey was awful. Sacar wasn't good. Sam was inconsistent.
If it's a one man team, it's not because of what Markus is doing, it's because of what everyone else isn't.
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Then you don't watch Markus much. If guys on this team could finish, his assist rate would be closer to 40%. He creates for others regularly but they can't finish. Koby, Sacar, Bailey, John, who else in that starting lineup do you trust to score, ever?
Markus failed to reach 20 points in 6 of the first 9 games this year. The opportunity was there for others to step up, often because Markus himself was creating those opportunities. And no one could do it. So he takes the load because he has to.
Same with the stretch last year. Yes, Markus was bad at the end, but it's not like the rest of the roster was tearing it up. Joey was awful. Sacar wasn't good. Sam was inconsistent.
If it's a one man team, it's not because of what Markus is doing, it's because of what everyone else isn't.
Understand where you’re coming from, but he’s also a reason Sam, Joey and others left. Well, maybe that’s not fair. I guess Wojo is the reason.
No doubt Markus helps provide open looks for others, but if Cain, Koby, etc miss a few shots, or turn the ball over, Wojo has a short leash with them and pulls them out of the game. That would never happen with Markus, and you can’t tell me that would be a mind-f*** after a while with other players?
I don’t want to argue Alan, but look at St. John’s today. Do you believe they had a fraction of the talent Marquette has? I certainly don’t. St. John’s won today by flying high, passing the ball around, and playing as a team.
Just like Willard said the other night “let Howard get his, well still win by 20.”
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You think there is ZERO chance he leaves and takes another job?
He May leave for another job. He is not quitting and walking away without a gig.
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Stan has had to spend most all of his “coaching” time, keeping guys heads right, bolstering confidence, talking kids out of transferring - largely due to Wojo’s in-game coaching. He’s largely in damage control and preservation mode.
Beyond that, assistant coaches do not make substitutions. Let me know the next time you see an assistant coach call for one of our bench players to check in. Stan cannot at his discretion make substitutions.
Ok, Stan, or Stan’s agent. Assistants do make those calls...if they’re a good assistant. They often tell the coach who to sub and when. They put together the game plan for the head coach. You act like they do nothing except recruit and babysit.
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I don’t want to argue Alan, but look at St. John’s today. Do you believe they had a fraction of the talent Marquette has? I certainly don’t. St. John’s won today by flying high, passing the ball around, and playing as a team.
Just like Willard said the other night “let Howard get his, well still win by 20.”
I feel like I could write a novel on this right now. Also not looking to argue it. I'll try to keep my response somewhat organized.
They don't, but that wasn't because of Markus. Koby and Bailey weren't good and by the time they were mostly taken out the damage was done. But MU started 10-2 when Howard scored 30+. When other guys are doing their job & Howard goes off, we win. When they aren't (like the last 3) he can only carry us so far.
I'm really struggling with the recruiting aspect right now. Koby & Sacar are fine roleplayers, but more sixth men than second scorers. The only interior scoring is Jayce Johnson putbacks. The athletic three stars we hoped would blossom as upperclassmen have yet to do so.
As you note (or at least infer), St John's was better coached. I don't think the talent is up to snuff, but it should've been enough to win the last two. I think it's painfully obvious to anyone watching or digging into the metrics that our best lineups right now include less Koby, Bailey, & John and more Elliott, Cain, & Jayce. Wojo is way too stubborn about starters. It cost us when Markus was bad last year & it's costing us now. Five players have started 29+ games this year. FFS, when it's not working, let the guys on the bench earning it get a chance.
Howard makes mistakes, sure, but even when he's off, he's still pretty good. He's had a sub-100 offensive rating just 8 times & of those 8, 5 were still 90+. If players can't understand him earning a longer leash, that's a them problem. What irks me is the guys that play like crap and still get a long leash. Koby has been bad for a month and is still getting 20 or 30 minutes most nights. Sacar has been up and down, but still gets 30+ when he is down. Bailey is similar. We finally switch up the lineup yesterday and almost pull off the miracle comeback. Why did it take so long?
I put the Hausers on Wojo. He needed to sit Howard when he clearly wasn't healthy last year. Maybe then they stay, but more than anything, I think back to the comments about Sam's experience and how if he had a negative experience, that would also impact Joey's decision, so having a brother wasn't only an advantage. I think the staff misevaluated the fit of Joey from a personality perspective.
If this is TL;DR I totally get it. I'm all over the place and incredibly frustrated by this team and staff. The only thing not frustrating me is watching the best player in the country, though in a way that makes me more frustrated because even with this guy Wojo can't win.
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Then you don't watch Markus much. If guys on this team could finish, his assist rate would be closer to 40%. He creates for others regularly but they can't finish. Koby, Sacar, Bailey, John, who else in that starting lineup do you trust to score, ever?
Markus failed to reach 20 points in 6 of the first 9 games this year. The opportunity was there for others to step up, often because Markus himself was creating those opportunities. And no one could do it. So he takes the load because he has to.
Same with the stretch last year. Yes, Markus was bad at the end, but it's not like the rest of the roster was tearing it up. Joey was awful. Sacar wasn't good. Sam was inconsistent.
If it's a one man team, it's not because of what Markus is doing, it's because of what everyone else isn't.
Agree. You're spot on 100% correct.
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I feel like I could write a novel on this right now. Also not looking to argue it. I'll try to keep my response somewhat organized.
They don't, but that wasn't because of Markus. Koby and Bailey weren't good and by the time they were mostly taken out the damage was done. But MU started 10-2 when Howard scored 30+. When other guys are doing their job & Howard goes off, we win. When they aren't (like the last 3) he can only carry us so far.
I'm really struggling with the recruiting aspect right now. Koby & Sacar are fine roleplayers, but more sixth men than second scorers. The only interior scoring is Jayce Johnson putbacks. The athletic three stars we hoped would blossom as upperclassmen have yet to do so.
As you note (or at least infer), St John's was better coached. I don't think the talent is up to snuff, but it should've been enough to win the last two. I think it's painfully obvious to anyone watching or digging into the metrics that our best lineups right now include less Koby, Bailey, & John and more Elliott, Cain, & Jayce. Wojo is way too stubborn about starters. It cost us when Markus was bad last year & it's costing us now. Five players have started 29+ games this year. FFS, when it's not working, let the guys on the bench earning it get a chance.
Howard makes mistakes, sure, but even when he's off, he's still pretty good. He's had a sub-100 offensive rating just 8 times & of those 8, 5 were still 90+. If players can't understand him earning a longer leash, that's a them problem. What irks me is the guys that play like crap and still get a long leash. Koby has been bad for a month and is still getting 20 or 30 minutes most nights. Sacar has been up and down, but still gets 30+ when he is down. Bailey is similar. We finally switch up the lineup yesterday and almost pull off the miracle comeback. Why did it take so long?
I put the Hausers on Wojo. He needed to sit Howard when he clearly wasn't healthy last year. Maybe then they stay, but more than anything, I think back to the comments about Sam's experience and how if he had a negative experience, that would also impact Joey's decision, so having a brother wasn't only an advantage. I think the staff misevaluated the fit of Joey from a personality perspective.
If this is TL;DR I totally get it. I'm all over the place and incredibly frustrated by this team and staff. The only thing not frustrating me is watching the best player in the country, though in a way that makes me more frustrated because even with this guy Wojo can't win.
Nice rebuttal. I agree
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Yep, until Joey was hurt too much and Dave thought they were a good package, players wanted to leave.
Once the over played vanilla soft serve departed, no one was leaving. Stan didn’t have to do anything.
+1000
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Then you don't watch Markus much. If guys on this team could finish, his assist rate would be closer to 40%. He creates for others regularly but they can't finish. Koby, Sacar, Bailey, John, who else in that starting lineup do you trust to score, ever?
Markus failed to reach 20 points in 6 of the first 9 games this year. The opportunity was there for others to step up, often because Markus himself was creating those opportunities. And no one could do it. So he takes the load because he has to.
Same with the stretch last year. Yes, Markus was bad at the end, but it's not like the rest of the roster was tearing it up. Joey was awful. Sacar wasn't good. Sam was inconsistent.
If it's a one man team, it's not because of what Markus is doing, it's because of what everyone else isn't.
Completely agree, especially this year.
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If it's a one man team, it's not because of what Markus is doing, it's because of what everyone else isn't.
Agree 100%.
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I'm incredibly frustrated by this team and staff. The only thing not frustrating me is watching the best player in the country, though in a way that makes me more frustrated because even with this guy Wojo can't win.
Agree 200%!
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I feel like I could write a novel on this right now. Also not looking to argue it. I'll try to keep my response somewhat organized.
They don't, but that wasn't because of Markus. Koby and Bailey weren't good and by the time they were mostly taken out the damage was done. But MU started 10-2 when Howard scored 30+. When other guys are doing their job & Howard goes off, we win. When they aren't (like the last 3) he can only carry us so far.
I'm really struggling with the recruiting aspect right now. Koby & Sacar are fine roleplayers, but more sixth men than second scorers. The only interior scoring is Jayce Johnson putbacks. The athletic three stars we hoped would blossom as upperclassmen have yet to do so.
As you note (or at least infer), St John's was better coached. I don't think the talent is up to snuff, but it should've been enough to win the last two. I think it's painfully obvious to anyone watching or digging into the metrics that our best lineups right now include less Koby, Bailey, & John and more Elliott, Cain, & Jayce. Wojo is way too stubborn about starters. It cost us when Markus was bad last year & it's costing us now. Five players have started 29+ games this year. FFS, when it's not working, let the guys on the bench earning it get a chance.
Howard makes mistakes, sure, but even when he's off, he's still pretty good. He's had a sub-100 offensive rating just 8 times & of those 8, 5 were still 90+. If players can't understand him earning a longer leash, that's a them problem. What irks me is the guys that play like crap and still get a long leash. Koby has been bad for a month and is still getting 20 or 30 minutes most nights. Sacar has been up and down, but still gets 30+ when he is down. Bailey is similar. We finally switch up the lineup yesterday and almost pull off the miracle comeback. Why did it take so long?
I put the Hausers on Wojo. He needed to sit Howard when he clearly wasn't healthy last year. Maybe then they stay, but more than anything, I think back to the comments about Sam's experience and how if he had a negative experience, that would also impact Joey's decision, so having a brother wasn't only an advantage. I think the staff misevaluated the fit of Joey from a personality perspective.
If this is TL;DR I totally get it. I'm all over the place and incredibly frustrated by this team and staff. The only thing not frustrating me is watching the best player in the country, though in a way that makes me more frustrated because even with this guy Wojo can't win.
Very well thought out and stated post.
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More of a refusal.
Markus is not a winner. He’s about stats.
Bullcrap. Maybe last year. Definitely not this year. He should be shooting more, if anything.
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Whatever our problems are, Stan is part of them. Willard did not get to the dance until year 6 at SH. Give Wojo another crack in the post Marcus era. His biggest failure imo is in not finding us a stud point guard in 6 years
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Ok, Stan, or Stan’s agent. Assistants do make those calls...if they’re a good assistant. They often tell the coach who to sub and when. They put together the game plan for the head coach. You act like they do nothing except recruit and babysit.
He has been proven wrong on this time and time again.
At the end of the day, the likelihood that next year’s class stays if Wojo leaves is not good. The best chance they stay happens if Stan becomes head coach even though their staying still isn’t very good. Most high ranking recruits don’t want to play for an unknown. Because of this desire to fire Wojo yet somehow maintain the class, we need to bend reality and somehow make Stan completely absolved of the losing record. We now hear the same story of evil Wojo picking on not just the players but his assistant coaches causing them to be on a losing team and it’s not their fault even though they stayed on said job for multiple years, game planned, recruited many of the players, and were major part of the program.
We also hear now that Stan the savior convinced all the players to stay when the Hausers left (except the Hausers). This narrative doesn’t actually align to previous narratives. First, the Hausers announced when they heard Markus was coming back. Stan was heard talking to Markus about why he needed to stay just a few days prior so Stan has to be part of the reason the Hausers left. He chose Markus over them too.
The other narrative formulating is that other players were all going to leave without Stan; however; prior to needing this narrative the story was had the Hausers stayed we would have lost Bailey, Cain and Anim. This makes more sense as those three lose playing time if the Hausers stay. The new narrative is that Stan convinced Markus to stay knowing that would get the Hausers to leave so that he would keep Anim, Cain, and Bailey. He was able to do this without speaking to Wojo and maintaining that he has no direct impact on the team’s current performance. All the players still currently love him though he would have sold them a bag of goods.
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He has been proven wrong on this time and time again.
At the end of the day, the likelihood that next year’s class stays if Wojo leaves is not good. The best chance they stay happens if Stan becomes head coach even though their staying still isn’t very good. Most high ranking recruits don’t want to play for an unknown. Because of this desire to fire Wojo yet somehow maintain the class, we need to bend reality and somehow make Stan completely absolved of the losing record. We now hear the same story of evil Wojo picking on not just the players but his assistant coaches causing them to be on a losing team and it’s not their fault even though they stayed on said job for multiple years, game planned, recruited many of the players, and were major part of the program.
We also hear now that Stan the savior convinced all the players to stay when the Hausers left (except the Hausers). This narrative doesn’t actually align to previous narratives. First, the Hausers announced when they heard Markus was coming back. Stan was heard talking to Markus about why he needed to stay just a few days prior so Stan has to be part of the reason the Hausers left. He chose Markus over them too.
The other narrative formulating is that other players were all going to leave without Stan; however; prior to needing this narrative the story was had the Hausers stayed we would have lost Bailey, Cain and Anim. This makes more sense as those three lose playing time if the Hausers stay. The new narrative is that Stan convinced Markus to stay knowing that would get the Hausers to leave so that he would keep Anim, Cain, and Bailey. He was able to do this without speaking to Wojo and maintaining that he has no direct impact on the team’s current performance. All the players still currently love him though he would have sold them a bag of goods.
The need to build self-reinforcing narratives is a powerful one because admitting you were wrong on a message board is a very dishonorable thing to do.
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He has been proven wrong on this time and time again.
At the end of the day, the likelihood that next year’s class stays if Wojo leaves is not good. The best chance they stay happens if Stan becomes head coach even though their staying still isn’t very good. Most high ranking recruits don’t want to play for an unknown. Because of this desire to fire Wojo yet somehow maintain the class, we need to bend reality and somehow make Stan completely absolved of the losing record. We now hear the same story of evil Wojo picking on not just the players but his assistant coaches causing them to be on a losing team and it’s not their fault even though they stayed on said job for multiple years, game planned, recruited many of the players, and were major part of the program.
We also hear now that Stan the savior convinced all the players to stay when the Hausers left (except the Hausers). This narrative doesn’t actually align to previous narratives. First, the Hausers announced when they heard Markus was coming back. Stan was heard talking to Markus about why he needed to stay just a few days prior so Stan has to be part of the reason the Hausers left. He chose Markus over them too.
The other narrative formulating is that other players were all going to leave without Stan; however; prior to needing this narrative the story was had the Hausers stayed we would have lost Bailey, Cain and Anim. This makes more sense as those three lose playing time if the Hausers stay. The new narrative is that Stan convinced Markus to stay knowing that would get the Hausers to leave so that he would keep Anim, Cain, and Bailey. He was able to do this without speaking to Wojo and maintaining that he has no direct impact on the team’s current performance. All the players still currently love him though he would have sold them a bag of goods.
The problem here is that your last 2 paragraphs are WHY Stan can take no blame in the team's struggles. After all, he has had no time to do anything but re-recruit the kids who wanted to leave because of Wojo to stay. No time to do anything but that, which means all the team's struggles are solely on Wojo.
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The problem here is that your last 2 paragraphs are WHY Stan can take no blame in the team's struggles. After all, he has had no time to do anything but re-recruit the kids who wanted to leave because of Wojo to stay. No time to do anything but that, which means all the team's struggles are solely on Wojo.
Yep. He convinced all of the players things would be different. Wojo has changed but when they haven’t he still needed to tell them that Wojo loves them and he has changed.
At the end of the day, Stan is either part of Wojo’s team who produced the results or he is not part of the team. If he wasn’t part of team then he created a divided locker room which would have driven the same results.
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The need to build self-reinforcing narratives is a powerful one because admitting you were wrong on a message board is a very dishonorable thing to do.
Lol. It took you 5.5 seasons to admit Wojo wasn’t a good coach. Some of us called it within 7 games of his time at MU.
As for assistant coaches making subs - that is asinine. The closest that comes to happening is an assistant telling the head coach a guy is in foul trouble. Head coach then specifies who goes in game.
It is pure ignorance to believe that Stan Johnson is calling the shots as to in-game substitutions, and the lineup combinations. They give input. That’s it.
You, pettysworld, and BallBoy continue to provide comedic and moronic analysis. Carry on.
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The fact that you "called it" after 7 games says more about you than anyone else.
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Lol. It took you 5.5 seasons to admit Wojo wasn’t a good coach. Some of us called it within 7 games of his time at MU.
As for assistant coaches making subs - that is asinine. The closest that comes to happening is an assistant telling the head coach a guy is in foul trouble. Head coach then specifies who goes in game.
It is pure ignorance to believe that Stan Johnson is calling the shots as to in-game substitutions, and the lineup combinations. They give input. That’s it.
You, pettysworld, and BallBoy continue to provide comedic and moronic analysis. Carry on.
Coming from a guy who claims Stan has no time to do anything to help the team besides re-recruit players who want to quit because of the head coach, this is awesome. Stan would have developed every single one of the guys on this roster into all time greats at MU...had he had even a single free minute available to do anything besides re-recruit the players on the roster. Unfortunately, zero time for anything but that, so the players couldn't develop at all. Oh, that and he would've petitioned for Marquette games to last 104 minutes each so he could've granted all 13 players 40 minutes of playing time. I mean, how else can these players develop? The fact that Wojo hasn't done that is just complete incompetence.
Not to mention wanting to fire the head coach...and promote the assistant coach.
Now, can you imagine co-coaches, where Stan handles the huddles and Wardle handles the post game interviews? SHEESH! Talk about a dynamic duo!
Comedic and moronic analysis defined.
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Lol. It took you 5.5 seasons to admit Wojo wasn’t a good coach. Some of us called it within 7 games of his time at MU.
As for assistant coaches making subs - that is asinine. The closest that comes to happening is an assistant telling the head coach a guy is in foul trouble. Head coach then specifies who goes in game.
It is pure ignorance to believe that Stan Johnson is calling the shots as to in-game substitutions, and the lineup combinations. They give input. That’s it.
You, pettysworld, and BallBoy continue to provide comedic and moronic analysis. Carry on.
He's an average coach. 3 NCAA tournaments in 4 years. Lots of power conference schools would kill for that. He's just not very good and MU can do better.
Stop stating your opinion as fact.
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Lol. It took you 5.5 seasons to admit Wojo wasn’t a good coach. Some of us called it within 7 games of his time at MU.
As for assistant coaches making subs - that is asinine. The closest that comes to happening is an assistant telling the head coach a guy is in foul trouble. Head coach then specifies who goes in game.
It is pure ignorance to believe that Stan Johnson is calling the shots as to in-game substitutions, and the lineup combinations. They give input. That’s it.
You, pettysworld, and BallBoy continue to provide comedic and moronic analysis. Carry on.
That's actually the job of the DOBO, not the assistant coach. Did you not see the video of Stan coaching in the huddle during a time out during the SJU game? I guess that was just to tell the guys who was in foul trouble, right?
You Standinistas are hilarious. "Stan does nothing on the sidelines during games. We need to hire Stan stat."
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If Stan's main job is re-recruiting players to stay on the team, he didn't do that very well since the Hausers transferred anyways.
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Lol. It took you 5.5 seasons to admit Wojo wasn’t a good coach. Some of us called it within 7 games of his time at MU.
As for assistant coaches making subs - that is asinine. The closest that comes to happening is an assistant telling the head coach a guy is in foul trouble. Head coach then specifies who goes in game.
It is pure ignorance to believe that Stan Johnson is calling the shots as to in-game substitutions, and the lineup combinations. They give input. That’s it.
You, pettysworld, and BallBoy continue to provide comedic and moronic analysis. Carry on.
Oh Little Chihuahua - You are only making yourself look worse. You are still unable to comprehend that high level basketball is nothing like your junior varsity basketball team. This is a big time business. Even ex-D1 players have told you as much but you have to keep arguing the same incorrect points ad nauseam.
Part of the pre-game scout is to come up with the game plan which means you are specifying where the mismatches are and could be based on lineups. Those big swings you think are unfair to the players are directly connected to that. There is a reason that Jayce gets more time in some games versus others.
Gus Macker season is back. You can relive your glory days and make all the head coaching substitutions that you want. Might be too high level for you.
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That's actually the job of the DOBO, not the assistant coach. Did you not see the video of Stan coaching in the huddle during a time out during the SJU game? I guess that was just to tell the guys who was in foul trouble, right?
You Standinistas are hilarious. "Stan does nothing on the sidelines during games. We need to hire Stan stat."
The Hire Stan clique would hire anyone articulate and engaging. In essence, they're picked apart by any half decent car salesman.
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Lol. It took you 5.5 seasons to admit Wojo wasn’t a good coach. Some of us called it within 7 games of his time at MU.
You were not here back then so how would we know?
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You were not here back then so how would we know?
Sure he was: https://www.muscoop.com/index.php?action=profile;u=3504
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I like what little I have seen from Stan but the fact of the matter is that NO ONE has a clue about what kind of a head coach he would be. Just like we had no clue about Buzz when he was on TC's staff. In fact, I think we saw less of Buzz than Stan.
Let's agree to disagree on Stan, especially since it doesn't matter because Wojo will remain coach until such time that donations start to drop - the only thing that seems to get the attention of the BOT and administration.
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Oh Little Chihuahua - You are only making yourself look worse. You are still unable to comprehend that high level basketball is nothing like your junior varsity basketball team. This is a big time business. Even ex-D1 players have told you as much but you have to keep arguing the same incorrect points ad nauseam.
Part of the pre-game scout is to come up with the game plan which means you are specifying where the mismatches are and could be based on lineups. Those big swings you think are unfair to the players are directly connected to that. There is a reason that Jayce gets more time in some games versus others.
Gus Macker season is back. You can relive your glory days and make all the head coaching substitutions that you want. Might be too high level for you.
So now we're going the other direction: Wojo is a bball genius, but he's being held back by inept assistants.
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So now we're going the other direction: Wojo is a bball genius, but he's being held back by inept assistants.
No. That you don’t hire the assistant coach of a coach that you just fired because they were part of the problem. If you fire the head coach you fire the group. Either they were aligned on who to recruit, who to play, the approach or they weren’t. If they were then expect the same. If they weren’t then the assistant was undercutting the head coach and creating division. Either way no bueno.
Assistants have their hands in every part of the program from recruiting, player development, gaming planning etc. so they have to be part of the problem as well
The only reason you would hire the assistant is if there were off the court issue the head coach created and the firing was disciplinary.
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The fact that you "called it" after 7 games says more about you than anyone else.
That he has solid analytical abilities?
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You were not here back then so how would we know?
LOL