kind of worries me can anyone else score when MH is taken away
Koby. Sacar. Ed.
Hes been heat checking it lol. Calm down
Ahhh, scoop at its finest, it's good to be back.
I stand corrected.. I am concerned on who else is gonna score. Jeez come on someone
yep we will see next week when purdue has athletes that can stay with MH and bump him or force him to give it up. This should be a great game for him to work on getting others involved and building confidence. I want to see what happens when teams force him to give it up like they did down the stretch last year
Just enjoy his last year.
Quote from: injuryBug on November 05, 2019, 07:44:26 PM
yep we will see next week when purdue has athletes that can stay with MH and bump him or force him to give it up. This should be a great game for him to work on getting others involved and building confidence. I want to see what happens when teams force him to give it up like they did down the stretch last year
Sure would like to see others step up
Dont worry i will just posing a question
Not sure Sacar should be chucking 3's from a foot farther out. Jamal has looked about the best of anyone else boy has he had some ugly moments. Hopefully Dawson isnt watching
I've seen this movie before. And it has a very sad ending.
Up 44-15 at half. Markus Howard just tied the all time MU scoring record. And this is the thread we get.
God Bless MUScoop.
Quote from: GarciasWorld on November 05, 2019, 08:02:18 PM
Up 44-15 at half. Markus Howard just tied the all time MU scoring record. And this is the thread we get.
God Bless MUScoop.
So just to be clear: Markus setting the all time scoring record means more than a successful season? Got it. Good to know.
Only on Scoop can people be bitching and moaning about a 44-15 halftime lead.
Not one mention about the defense and rebounding in this game from anyone. Quite impressive even in a buy game.
I choose to enjoy Markus and hope he can get better with his overall game as the season goes on. You guys can wallow in your misery if you so choose.
Quote from: jonny09 on November 05, 2019, 08:00:46 PM
I've seen this movie before. And it has a very sad ending.
Did the plane crash and everyone died? If not, it wasn't that sad.
Quote from: Cheeks on November 05, 2019, 08:07:11 PM
Did the plane crash and everyone died? If not, it wasn't that sad.
That's actually exactly what occurred. So I guess it's sad ??
Quote from: jonny09 on November 05, 2019, 08:08:45 PM
That's actually exactly what occurred. So I guess it's sad ??
Sure, if you want to compare a basketball team's first game of the year to a plane crash where hundreds of people die....by all means don't let any of us stop the analogy.
Quote from: jonny09 on November 05, 2019, 08:04:25 PM
So just to be clear: Markus setting the all time scoring record means more than a successful season? Got it. Good to know.
Wut?
Quote from: Cheeks on November 05, 2019, 08:11:17 PM
Sure, if you want to compare a basketball team's first game of the year to a plane crash where hundreds of people die....by all means don't let any of us stop the analogy.
Ok. So it's sad right??
Quote from: Cheeks on November 05, 2019, 08:11:17 PM
Sure, if you want to compare a basketball team's first game of the year to a plane crash where hundreds of people die....by all means don't let any of us stop the analogy.
Weird. Pretty sure you did that.
Quote from: GarciasWorld on November 05, 2019, 08:02:18 PM
Up 44-15 at half. Markus Howard just tied the all time MU scoring record. And this is the thread we get.
God Bless MUScoop.
I think it's great. Love Howard. Just need others involved.
If Markus is 7-8 to open a game I pray he does not look to get others involved.
Quote from: PuertoRicanNightmare on November 05, 2019, 08:15:36 PM
Weird. Pretty sure you did that.
LOL. In an effort to argue, Chicos quotes himself and attributes it to the other guy in order to prolong the argument.
Congrats to Howard! Well deserved! However the point remains. This team will need a consistent second and third scoring option if this they're going to make any noise. It's only the first game, so it will be interesting to see how the first month of the season unfolds.
Quote from: GarciasWorld on November 05, 2019, 08:02:18 PM
Up 44-15 at half. Markus Howard just tied the all time MU scoring record. And this is the thread we get.
God Bless MUScoop.
This is a very meaningful game for Markus and it is historic effort. It is not meaningful, however, for the MU team. It is great to have a national level shooter in Markus but I think some of us want a team effort which is necessary to beat top tier teams. If we beat Purdue there will be plenty of cheering from all, even if Markus scores 60 or 0. Our focus on team wins is first while individual accomplishments are a distant second. Experience shows teams win, not individuals.
Quote from: Class71 on November 05, 2019, 08:53:42 PM
This is a very meaningful game for Markus and it is historic effort. It is not meaningful, however, for the MU team. It is great to have a national level shooter in Markus but I think some of us want a team effort which is necessary to beat top tier teams. If we beat Purdue there will be plenty of cheering from all, even if Markus scores 60 or 0. Our focus on team wins is first while individual accomplishments are a distant second. Experience shows teams win, not individuals.
Bingo!! Well said.
Quote from: Class71 on November 05, 2019, 08:53:42 PM
This is a very meaningful game for Markus and it is historic effort. It is not meaningful, however, for the MU team. It is great to have a national level shooter in Markus but I think some of us want a team effort which is necessary to beat top tier teams. If we beat Purdue there will be plenty of cheering from all, even if Markus scores 60 or 0. Our focus on team wins is first while individual accomplishments are a distant second. Experience shows teams win, not individuals.
Thankfully Markus is part of this team.
If Markus is cooking there's no better recipe for a win for Marquette than to have Markus shoot early and often.
Quote from: Class71 on November 05, 2019, 08:53:42 PM
This is a very meaningful game for Markus and it is historic effort. It is not meaningful, however, for the MU team. It is great to have a national level shooter in Markus but I think some of us want a team effort which is necessary to beat top tier teams. If we beat Purdue there will be plenty of cheering from all, even if Markus scores 60 or 0. Our focus on team wins is first while individual accomplishments are a distant second. Experience shows teams win, not individuals.
Exactly i will be the first to be all excited when markus goes for 50 in a win, but my entire point is he will not score 50 every game and in order to have a good year for the team we need others to step up
"The others" scored 52 points tonight. Markus averaged 25 last season. Even if he just holds steady there 77 points will win us most games.
The only wart from tonight was turnovers.
Quote from: GarciasWorld on November 05, 2019, 09:01:38 PM
Thankfully Markus is part of this team.
If Markus is cooking there's no better recipe for a win for Marquette than to have Markus shoot early and often.
We will need more than Markus to beat top tier teams. It takes more than a one man show. Purdue will be the first test. Pistol Pete could not carry LSU against the top tier field of the day. Dean Meminger individually crushed the all time gun. I want more for/from our team and I expect the coach to work for that objective.
Quote from: TSmith34 on November 05, 2019, 08:28:31 PM
LOL. In an effort to argue, Chicos quotes himself and attributes it to the other guy in order to prolong the argument.
?? Still waiting for investor link by the way
Quote from: Class71 on November 05, 2019, 09:14:38 PM
We will need more than Markus to beat top tier teams. It takes more than a one man show. Purdue will be the first test. Pistol Pete could not carry LSU against the top tier field of the day. Dean Meminger individually crushed the all time gun. I want more for/from our team and I expect the coach to work for that objective.
Dude, he might average in the mid-20s.. not the 40's.
It's OK to think Markus is a great player and we're lucky to have him, and also to hope that others will be able to score when the better opponents inevitably make it difficult for Markus to score.
I was encouraged to see McEwen and Elliott make some 3s in the second half.
It was a little concerning how often one of our guards tried to break down his man and get into the lane only to lose the basketball. As wades said, too many TOs overall. Also out of position defensively and a step slow the first part of the second half. But it's the first game. A lot of butterflies, no doubt, for the likes of McEwen and Torrence. And even Elliott.
Wojo has a lot of good film to show -- big win with a lot of good stuff but also plenty to improve upon. Can't wait to see us take down Purdue.
We are Marquette!
Quote from: Jay Bee on November 05, 2019, 09:19:51 PM
Dude, he might average in the mid-20s.. not the 40's.
Exactly my point.
A lot of the usual trolls in this thread.
Rarely seen after a 35 point win.
Scoop gonna Scooop.
You'd think people might be pleased that we shot 60% from 3..... I mean Markus made 7 for 10 but the rest of the squad made 7 out of 13......from the new deeper distance too.......
It was the first game......it wasn't always pretty but we did win by over 30 with Markus taking pretty much the last 10 minutes off......rough spots for sure but to be expected.
Theo was pretty impressive.......big negatives were the turnovers from Sacar, Markus and Koby.......and the fouls in the 2nd half.....good to see Greg knock down some 3s and get sole good run after a long layoff.
I was delighted to see Markus dominate and have such an effective game.
Okay, I'm kinda amazed no one here picked up on the game plan. First half was all about Marcus getting the record. Every time down his teammates were looking to get him the ball and when he touched it, he shot it.
Once he hit 33 at the start of the 2nd half I told my friend he would only score about 6 more points in the game. Sure enough, he finished with 38.
Quote from: Ruby on November 05, 2019, 11:10:29 PM
Okay, I'm kinda amazed no one here picked up on the game plan. First half was all about Marcus getting the record. Every time down his teammates were looking to get him the ball and when he touched it, he shot it.
Once he hit 33 at the start of the 2nd half I told my friend he would only score about 6 more points in the game. Sure enough, he finished with 38.
Yea I'm about 99% sure that this is exactly what happened. By my unofficial count he took three shots in the 10ish minutes after he broke the record. One was a missed layup where he was fouled (so technically doesn't count as a shot), one was a three point play, and and one was a missed mid range. He also had (by my unofficial count) 2 boards, one steal and two dimes, and at least one should have been assist if it hadn't been fumbled out of bounds. Get all of the "record" stuff out of the way as quickly as possible, don't want to have it in the back of your mind during Purdue. Just my opinion, but I think he will look a lot more like scrimmage and exhibition Markus than 1st half Loyola Markus the rest of the year.
Quote from: Its DJOver on November 05, 2019, 11:36:39 PM
Yea I'm about 99% sure that this is exactly what happened. By my unofficial count he took three shots in the 10ish minutes after he broke the record. One was a missed layup where he was fouled (so technically doesn't count as a shot), one was a three point play, and and one was a missed mid range. He also had (by my unofficial count) 2 boards, one steal and two dimes, and at least one should have been assist if it hadn't been fumbled out of bounds. Get all of the "record" stuff out of the way as quickly as possible, don't want to have it in the back of your mind during Purdue. Just my opinion, but I think he will look a lot more like scrimmage and exhibition Markus than 1st half Loyola Markus the rest of the year.
I like this theory, and it makes a lot of sense.
Listening to his postgame comments also lend at least partially to this theory/observation.
Quote from: MuMark on November 05, 2019, 10:22:49 PM
You'd think people might be pleased that we shot 60% from 3..... I mean Markus made 7 for 10 but the rest of the squad made 7 out of 13......from the new deeper distance too.......
It was the first game......it wasn't always pretty but we did win by over 30 with Markus taking pretty much the last 10 minutes off......rough spots for sure but to be expected.
Theo was pretty impressive.......big negatives were the turnovers from Sacar, Markus and Koby.......and the fouls in the 2nd half.....good to see Greg knock down some 3s and get sole good run after a long layoff.
This. The shooting was absolutely fine. The turnovers and some shoddy second half D, not so much.
Quote from: MuMark on November 05, 2019, 10:22:49 PMTheo was pretty impressive.......big negatives were the turnovers from Sacar, Markus and Koby.......and the fouls in the 2nd half.....good to see Greg knock down some 3s and get sole good run after a long layoff.
Some credit to the opponent as well, LUM was 7th in the country in steal percentage last year. Their steals accounted for half the turnovers. The Greyhounds certainly didn't perform very well (though they were better in the second half) but turning teams over is a strength of theirs, and probably something good for us to face early.
Also...Golden Dike looked like a man. Much bigger than I expected. He will be very good for them, and if Santi Aldama is the better of the two recruits, they might have something special as the season goes on.
Quote from: injuryBug on November 05, 2019, 07:44:26 PM
yep we will see next week when purdue has athletes that can stay with MH and bump him or force him to give it up. This should be a great game for him to work on getting others involved and building confidence. I want to see what happens when teams force him to give it up like they did down the stretch last year
We already know the answer from last year when we crapped the bed down the stretch. Wash, rinse, repeat.
Quote from: Its DJOver on November 05, 2019, 11:36:39 PM
Yea I'm about 99% sure that this is exactly what happened. By my unofficial count he took three shots in the 10ish minutes after he broke the record. One was a missed layup where he was fouled (so technically doesn't count as a shot), one was a three point play, and and one was a missed mid range. He also had (by my unofficial count) 2 boards, one steal and two dimes, and at least one should have been assist if it hadn't been fumbled out of bounds. Get all of the "record" stuff out of the way as quickly as possible, don't want to have it in the back of your mind during Purdue. Just my opinion, but I think he will look a lot more like scrimmage and exhibition Markus than 1st half Loyola Markus the rest of the year.
I'm not exactly sure what was wrong with first half Markus anyway. When he's not hitting his shots, I get why you don't want him to bomb away. But when he's hot, why wouldn't you want him shooting? They scored 44 points and were up by nearly 30 at half.
Quote from: Class71 on November 05, 2019, 08:53:42 PM
This is a very meaningful game for Markus and it is historic effort. It is not meaningful, however, for the MU team. It is great to have a national level shooter in Markus but I think some of us want a team effort which is necessary to beat top tier teams. If we beat Purdue there will be plenty of cheering from all, even if Markus scores 60 or 0. Our focus on team wins is first while individual accomplishments are a distant second. Experience shows teams win, not individuals.
I completely agree. I have no idea what this has to do with last night's game though.
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on November 06, 2019, 07:45:35 AM
I'm not exactly sure what was wrong with first half Markus anyway. When he's not hitting his shots, I get why you don't want him to bomb away. But when he's hot, why wouldn't you want him shooting? They scored 44 points and were up by nearly 30 at half.
Yeah, this is a funny discussion. I get it's loyola-MD, but he made a lot of well-contested shots last night. When Markus is in god-mode (and he will be some nights) no one else should touch the ball. But we already knew that.
The big question mark is what happens when he's "ordinary". Can the other guys step up? Will Markus share it with them? That's why the Hauser's left and what will determine the course of the season. We didn't learn anything more about that last night, but we probably will soon.
Since I could not watch the game, in the first half, did anybody throw their hands in the air or obviously pout when they didn't get the ball?
Quote from: tower912 on November 06, 2019, 08:54:19 AM
Since I could not watch the game, in the first half, did anybody throw their hands in the air or obviously pout when they didn't get the ball?
No. They marveled at the fact that Markus was in 'can't miss' mode. He did have 1 or 2 possessions where he needed to get rid of the ball to teammates and turned it over when he didn't in a timely fashion. He wasn't hogging. He just wasn't creating for others. It's something he continues to need to improve on.
Here's one thing that I really, really liked. MU had multiple guys start the offense. Often, Markus was in the corner as the designated shooter. Now admittedly they need to clean up the turnovers.
Quote from: 1SE on November 06, 2019, 08:33:25 AM
Yeah, this is a funny discussion. I get it's loyola-MD, but he made a lot of well-contested shots last night. When Markus is in god-mode (and he will be some nights) no one else should touch the ball. But we already knew that.
The big question mark is what happens when he's "ordinary". Can the other guys step up? Will Markus share it with them? That's why the Hauser's left and what will determine the course of the season. We didn't learn anything more about that last night, but we probably will soon.
The bolded above is the topic of the thread. And it's a fair point after last night. This was a big question mark coming into the season, and after last night's game, the question remains.
As usual, we saw flashes of good things from several guys, but overall there were definitely a lot of kinks that were in the process of being worked out. I love Theo's confidence and ability to own the paint. Koby had some nice passes and seems to have good vision. Greg's outside shot looked pretty good. But we had way too many turnovers, a few ugly possessions/bad passes, some bad stretches of defensive effort.
So all in all, pretty typical first game, but with a big matchup coming next week, we'll need to have a more balanced output from the guys who aren't on the All American list.
I also don't think we showed much of our offensive sets last night. Lots of dribble weave at the top with a high screen. Rightfully so, less for our opponents next week to scout.
How did Symir look? I see TOs and PFs in the box, but curious of the overall assessment for those that could watch the game. He is the only real PG on the team IMO so hoping he can develop quickly.
Symir looked good in small doses but he's not going to be a point guard on this team. Maybe next year.
Symir has, by far, the tightest handle of Koby, Markus, and Symir (and Sacar, but I don't think he'll play much, if any, point guard this season). He has good court vision. But he's not really a threat to score at all. He'll have limited minutes. Other than Symir the guards were so loose with the ball I was at times wondering if the ball was overinflated. Marquette's guards dribble very high, and the ball just bounces away from them at times.
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on November 06, 2019, 07:45:35 AM
I'm not exactly sure what was wrong with first half Markus anyway. When he's not hitting his shots, I get why you don't want him to bomb away. But when he's hot, why wouldn't you want him shooting? They scored 44 points and were up by nearly 30 at half.
Just to clarify, I didn't have a problem with most of his 1st half shots. If he's hitting he should and does have the ultimate green light. I do however think that kind of workload is unsustainable, and even if he's hitting he'll eventually wear down as the season progresses.
Quote from: Its DJOver on November 06, 2019, 09:44:08 AM
Just to clarify, I didn't have a problem with most of his 1st half shots. If he's hitting he should and does have the ultimate green light. I do however think that kind of workload is unsustainable, and even if he's hitting he'll eventually wear down as the season progresses.
True, and I think that is why I was encouraged to see so many sets where Markus was not the primary ball handler. That shuold help with load management as the year goes on. Like many here the turnovers concern me still as too many times our guards drove into the lane out of control. Credit to Loyola-MD for having quick hands in there, but we need to do a better job of recognizing that and driving under control to a jump stop before trying to kick it out. It is game 1, the coaching staff and players will learn from the film and we will see improvement.
Yeah I was hoping to see a little more action toward the basket. But we will see as the season progresses.
I think it's reasonable that even those who love watching Markus and appreciate everything he does can legitimately wonder if we will get enough scoring from guys not named Markus Howard.
Last night's game provided some encouraging signs -- Elliott's shot looked smooth, McEwen confidently stepped into a couple, Bailey hit one, etc. I agree the offense was fairly vanilla; no need to show a whole lot against LoyMd.
When Markus is in Insanity Mode, I want him to shoot every time. When there is a 75% probability that he'll hit a 3 and a 33-50% probability that any other Warrior will score from anywhere, it's pretty easy to do the math. But, as others have said, it's not humanly possible for him to be in that mode very often.
Most surprising thing to me was the two times Markus was left wide-open in the corner (after he already had hit a bunch of 3s). He missed the first and drained the second.
So I am hopeful, but still have the normal "fanly" concerns given how unproven (as consistent scorers) most of the players are.
These next two games will tell a lot, as Markus will be dogged by good defensive players both games, and Purdue and Wisconsin no doubt will dare every other Warrior to beat them.
As for Symir, I liked the way he stepped in to take two charges. Got one call, didn't get the other; frankly, I thought he should have gotten both. His handle looked good. Still, he's a freshman, and at this point he's clearly behind several others in the rotation.
KenPom has ranked Marquette among the Top 3 most efficient offenses in the Big East during each of the past three seasons. But that's only gotten us so far: 2 NCAA bids, but 2 early exits from the tournament.
Scoring is about the last thing I'm worried about. Turnovers were a big concern last season; MU was 7th in the Big East in taking care of the ball. That's got to improve if this team is going to take the next step. And while Marquette made a huge jump defensively, there's a big difference between having a Top 50 defense and one that ranks in the Top 25 or better.
If the defense improves and we can cut down on turnovers, this should be Wojo's best team yet.
Quote from: jsglow on November 06, 2019, 07:14:07 AM
This. The shooting was absolutely fine. The turnovers and some shoddy second half D, not so much.
The 2FG shooting was not fine. Gotta be better. We weren't good last year.. last night was rough. Would love to see us at 51-52% for the year, but not sure it's doable
Quote from: Jay Bee on November 06, 2019, 12:20:14 PM
The 2FG shooting was not fine. Gotta be better. We weren't good last year.. last night was rough. Would love to see us at 51-52% for the year, but not sure it's doable
This was my big concern after watching last night. I was hoping that adding McEwen/Elliott/Symir plus growth from Sacar/Bailey/Cain would mean better slashing. Shooting under 50% inside the arc against the Greyhounds is not ideal. On the flip side, three point shooting looked better than I think most expected. Defense and rebounding were excellent. Some of that is on the opponent but I didn't see them getting many clean looks other than one ugly stretch in the second half. Excited what Jayce can add to this already solid unit.
Jay Bee, are you doing another preseason preview like you did last year? I really enjoyed that one.
Quote from: Marcus92 on November 06, 2019, 12:40:42 PM
Jay Bee, are you doing another preseason preview like you did last year? I really enjoyed that one.
Thanks... with this lag between games I may get to it
Poorly worded question. Everyone CAN score. Will there be a consistent second option this year? Or, who will fill Sam's role?
Quote from: tower912 on November 06, 2019, 01:50:02 PM
Poorly worded question. Everyone CAN score. Will there be a consistent second option this year? Or, who will fill Sam's role?
I have confidence that it will be Koby. Some teams have one lockdown perimeter defendet. Very few have two
I had no issues with the shots Koby took last night. He was driving aggressively, and got good looks, but they just weren't falling. Led to several offensive boards and put-backs. Sacar took more shots than Koby. We'll have to see how that develops.
The offense should look a lot different once Jayce is back. Assuming he's fully healthy, I think he's our strongest option down low. Ed and Theo did some good work inside, especially Theo's pick and roll dunks. But from what I've seen, Jayce looks to be a stronger post-up player. Adding him to the mix could help open things up for drivers and outside shooters.
I'm not sure who's the best candidate for #2 scorer. Could be any one of those 3 (Koby, Sacar or Jayce), depending on matchups.