The season isn't over, I get that. But as we close out a second decade of 2000s, where do you think this team holds up to the other 2000s teams? (at their peak, so 05 with Diener, 09 with James). I'd go:
1. 2003 (27-6, NCAA)
2. 2009 (25-10, NCAA)
3. 2012 (27-8, NCAA)
4. 2019 (18-3, NCAA)
5. 2002 (26-7, NCAA)
6. 2013 (26-9, NCAA)
7. 2008 (25-10, NCAA)
8. 2007 (24-10, NCAA)
9. 2010 (22-12, NCAA)
10. 2005 (19-12, NIT)
11. 2006 (20-11, NCAA)
12. 2011 (22-15, NCAA)
13. 2018 (21-13, NIT)
14. 2017 (19-13, NCAA)
15. 2016 (20-13)
16. 2004 (19-12, NIT)
17. 2014 (17-15)
18. 2015 (13-19)
19. 2001 (15-14)
20. 2000 (15-14, NIT)
I didn't realize we missed 3 years in a row 14-16 and 4 out of last 5 NCAA's. Needless to say I'm hungry
You have 2009 ranked too high. Sure if DJ would have been healthy it would have been better, but he wasn't and the team tanked down the stretch and lost in the second round.
Also you have 2013 ranked too low. That team won the BE and got to the E8.
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on January 30, 2019, 08:04:04 AM
You have 2009 ranked too high. Sure if DJ would have been healthy it would have been better, but he wasn't and the team tanked down the stretch and lost in the second round.
Also you have 2013 ranked too low. That team won the BE and got to the E8.
He mentioned ranking at their peak. Which I would agree. That team had almost no depth, but that starting five was really tough.
Thought 09 team could make the Final 8 and maybe more until DJ got hurt. Even after DJ got hurt, level of play in that game against UConn was really high.
One season under .500 and 3 seasons (if you include the two 15-14 seasons) out of 20 where we were 1 game over or under .500.
And that is under 3 different coaches. Goes to show that this program can achieve success regardless of who is wearing the fancy suit on the sideline. Speaks to the support of the school and the administration and gives hope that if and when Wojo leaves for any reason, we should be just fine.
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on January 30, 2019, 08:04:04 AM
You have 2009 ranked too high. Sure if DJ would have been healthy it would have been better, but he wasn't and the team tanked down the stretch and lost in the second round.
Also you have 2013 ranked too low. That team won the BE and got to the E8.
honestly I think that team really punched above its weight. I don't recall them being that impressive. And as Cheebs said this is at their peak which is why the 05 team is ranked so high
Ranking teams based on their actual accomplishments (regular and post season) is an interesting exercise. Ranking teams "at their peak" doesn't make any more sense to me than ranking them "at low ebb".
This year's team might end up being #1 in the 2000s. Or much lower. Enjoy the ride and hope they're "at their peak" in March when the games matter most.
Quote from: Eye on January 30, 2019, 08:16:21 AM
Thought 09 team could make the Final 8 and maybe more until DJ got hurt. Even after DJ got hurt, level of play in that game against UConn was really high.
My favorite team in a long while. Was a huge huge fan of dom james, simply loved that kid's toughness. Was at that uconn game, season that could have been...
Quote from: Lennys Tap on January 30, 2019, 09:40:42 AM
Ranking teams "at their peak" doesn't make any more sense to me than ranking them "at low ebb".
Makes perfect sense to me (and others in this thread). I hope you are able to find something in the >1000 pages of other threads that makes sense to you so you can contribute.
Quote from: Lennys Tap on January 30, 2019, 09:40:42 AM
Ranking teams based on their actual accomplishments (regular and post season) is an interesting exercise. Ranking teams "at their peak" doesn't make any more sense to me than ranking them "at low ebb".
Yeah this is where I am as well. I could argue that this team peaked during the second half v. Buffalo. But that doesn't mean much.
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on January 30, 2019, 10:09:47 AM
Yeah this is where I am as well. I could argue that this team peaked during the second half v. Buffalo. But that doesn't mean much.
buzzkill
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on January 30, 2019, 08:04:04 AM
You have 2009 ranked too high. Sure if DJ would have been healthy it would have been better, but he wasn't and the team tanked down the stretch and lost in the second round.
Also you have 2013 ranked too low. That team won the BE and got to the E8.
Disagree on both counts. If anything, I think 2009 might be too low. If James stays healthy (which is the premise of the thread) I think we win the Big East and potentially make a Final Four run as a more legitimate title contender than 2003. And while the E8 run was fun, that team was incredibly lucky to survive the first weekend not just against Davidson but also against Butler. 2008 and 2007 may have ended sooner, but they were probably better teams.
Not a big quibble, but since it hasn't been mentioned, I think the 2017 team was better than the 2018 team.
Quote from: Marqus Howard on January 30, 2019, 10:59:49 AM
Not a big quibble, but since it hasn't been mentioned, I think the 2017 team was better than the 2018 team.
I think the difference is negligible, I put last year's team higher because how lucky we were with the injuries to X and Creighton when we played them
Quote from: brewcity77 on January 30, 2019, 10:51:05 AM
Disagree on both counts. If anything, I think 2009 might be too low. If James stays healthy (which is the premise of the thread) I think we win the Big East and potentially make a Final Four run as a more legitimate title contender than 2003. And while the E8 run was fun, that team was incredibly lucky to survive the first weekend not just against Davidson but also against Butler. 2008 and 2007 may have ended sooner, but they were probably better teams.
2007 n 2008 we had Crean as a coach, the guy sucked, still does. Career has been a downward spiral since his pot of gold was drafted 5th overall by the Miami Heat.
Quote from: Galway Eagle on January 30, 2019, 11:23:52 AM
I think the difference is negligible, I put last year's team higher because how lucky we were with the injuries to X and Creighton when we played them
Not related to this at all, but your signature would officially be depressing if it were to happen :o
Quote from: LoudMouth on January 30, 2019, 11:45:28 AM
Not related to this at all, but your signature would officially be depressing if it were to happen :o
Was my preseason prediction. Gotta own it.
Quote from: Galway Eagle on January 30, 2019, 11:46:50 AM
Was my preseason prediction. Gotta own it.
(https://media.giphy.com/media/yCAoGdVUCW5LW/giphy.gif)
Quote from: blikemike2 on January 30, 2019, 07:57:44 AM
I didn't realize we missed 3 years in a row 14-16 and 4 out of last 5 NCAA's. Needless to say I'm hungry
How did you not realize this?
Good thread idea. I think 2009 was our best team, followed by 2003 and 2012. 2013 was kind of a flash in the pan run. Was amazingly fun but I think the 2012 team smokes the 2013 team
Are you rating the team at the end of the year or full strength. James broken foot was a killer. The Diener NIT team was obviously better than their end result, but he was sidelined. The McNeal broken wrist team the same.
Quote from: Cheeks on January 30, 2019, 02:26:42 PM
Are you rating the team at the end of the year or full strength. James broken foot was a killer. The Diener NIT team was obviously better than their end result, but he was sidelined. The McNeal broken wrist team the same.
Full strength, sorry if that was not clear. Forgot that McNeal broke his wrist, that was the sophomore year team right against MSU?
Quote from: Lennys Tap on January 30, 2019, 09:40:42 AM
Ranking teams based on their actual accomplishments (regular and post season) is an interesting exercise. Ranking teams "at their peak" doesn't make any more sense to me than ranking them "at low ebb".
This year's team might end up being #1 in the 2000s. Or much lower. Enjoy the ride and hope they're "at their peak" in March when the games matter most.
I agree with you Lenny but I see the opening post's point. That 2009 team was a personal favorite as they were tough as nails. I still wonder what they would have done if not for the injury to James.
Quote from: Galway Eagle on January 30, 2019, 02:59:49 PM
Full strength, sorry if that was not clear. Forgot that McNeal broke his wrist, that was the sophomore year team right against MSU?
Correct
Lenny is spot on. There is no way to evaluate teams at their peaks vs. other peaks. This team should be judged by the end result, just like all other years. This team might be #1 or out of top half.
Quote from: Goose on January 30, 2019, 03:33:05 PM
Lenny is spot on. There is no way to evaluate teams at their peaks vs. other peaks. This team should be judged by the end result, just like all other years. This team might be #1 or out of top half.
NM, what chicos said
Quote from: Goose on January 30, 2019, 03:33:05 PM
Lenny is spot on. There is no way to evaluate teams at their peaks vs. other peaks. This team should be judged by the end result, just like all other years. This team might be #1 or out of top half.
Disagree. I don't find it that hard to judge what a team is when fully operational vs one that is missing key parts at the end. It literally is a different team.
MU with Jim Chones was a great great team. Same year, not great ending because he left. Was that a great team for 85% of the year? A national title contender? Yes. But the composition of the team changed.
I'd characterize those teams as better than their record, often much better then their postseason end due to injury or departure.
What mattas is the end the result.
But that doesn't mean it isn't fun for fans to compare and contrast rosters. 12-13 was our second most successful roster since 77. Personally, I don't think they were our 2nd best roster of that time period.
Good call on the '07 team, too, Chicos. That was a team at least a couple of seed lines higher before the McNeal injury.
Peaks no matta — this team is getting better as we play more games. That's what gets me excited.
I'm concerned people on this board don't understand the game of basketball. Judging a team based only on the "end result" makes absolutely zero sense. Basketball is a possession-to-possession game; entire games can be win or lost on only 1 single possession.
A perfect example of that comes to mind during the 2009 NCAA tournament where one Lazar Hayward stepped out of bounds against a Demarre Carrol Missouri team to hand them the victory. Without that misstep, we very well could have won that game. And imagine if we had a healthy DJ at that time... I ultimately think we beat UConn at home during the regular season and go much deeper in the tournament than the lowly 2nd-round result.
You have to judge a team on more than just the end result, because one small misstep can cost so much.
2003 was the best team Marquette has had during the 2000's
The team we have currently is the 2nd best.
A healthy 2009 is the third best, potentially tied for 2nd.
Quote from: MountainCreekHouse on January 30, 2019, 08:50:19 PM
I'm concerned people on this board don't understand the game of basketball. Judging a team based only on the "end result" makes absolutely zero sense. Basketball is a possession-to-possession game; entire games can be win or lost on only 1 single possession.
A perfect example of that comes to mind during the 2009 NCAA tournament where one Lazar Hayward stepped out of bounds against a Demarre Carrol Missouri team to hand them the victory. Without that misstep, we very well could have won that game. And imagine if we had a healthy DJ at that time... I ultimately think we beat UConn at home during the regular season and go much deeper in the tournament than the lowly 2nd-round result.
You have to judge a team on more than just the end result, because one small misstep can cost so much.
2003 was the best team Marquette has had during the 2000's
The team we have currently is the 2nd best.
A healthy 2009 is the third best, potentially tied for 2nd.
Plus Tax
I'd still take the 2011-12 over this team at the moment, they were unbelievably good.
Quote from: ChitownSpaceForRent on February 02, 2019, 02:56:15 PM
I'd still take the 2011-12 over this team at the moment, they were unbelievably good.
I'd say it's a toss up for third between this team and the 11-12 team. That team had no consistent third option the way this team does and especially the way the 08-09 team did
Quote from: Galway Eagle on February 02, 2019, 04:19:27 PM
I'd say it's a toss up for third between this team and the 11-12 team. That team had no consistent third option the way this team does and especially the way the 08-09 team did
The 11-12 team had Davante as actually a great first option until he got hurt. Also it had Vander and Jamil as very above average fourth and fifth options.
Obviously 2003 was the best team by result, but the 08-09 was the most enjoyable team for me since the Al era.
Quote from: Herman Cain on February 02, 2019, 10:45:57 PM
The 11-12 team had Davante as actually a great first option until he got hurt. Also it had Vander and Jamil as very above average fourth and fifth options.
Davante as a first option? He was never going to be first on that team. He was crazily effective for what he did, but didn't have the conditioning to be a reliable game after game third option. Vander & Jamil were just average that year. Neither was close to the players they would develop into, Vander as a junior and Jamil as a pro.
It's too early to rank this year's team, let's see how they finish. I will say though, I do fear we may be overvaluing this year's team so far due to the gaudy record and top 10 ranking. If we're being honest, they are certainly benefiting from a very down conference.
I'm not saying they don't deserve the top 10 ranking, because they do- that's how it works, but it's kind of hard to pinpoint how good they really are. Not trying to take anything away from our guys because they deserve credit for winning the games in front of them. However, we haven't faced a top 50 KenPom team in over a month and the one we did face (St Johns) beat us by 20.
Are we really one of the 10 best teams in all of college basketball? It's hard to say. Rating metrics like KenPom, Sagarin, T-rank, BPI say we are not and would be underdogs against 20+ teams on a neutral floor. Personally, I think we can play with most, if not all teams on any given night.
Postseason play can be a crapshoot, but fair or unfair, that is going to tell the story with this year's squad. An early exit in the dance and the critics will say we were overrated the whole time because the BEAST wasn't any good.
Quote from: GrimmReaper33 on February 03, 2019, 08:16:13 AM
It's too early to rank this year's team, let's see how they finish. I will say though, I do fear we may be overvaluing this year's team so far due to the gaudy record and top 10 ranking. If we're being honest, they are certainly benefiting from a very down conference.
I'm not saying they don't deserve the top 10 ranking, because they do- that's how it works, but it's kind of hard to pinpoint how good they really are. Not trying to take anything away from our guys because they deserve credit for winning the games in front of them. However, we haven't faced a top 50 KenPom team in over a month and the one we did face (St Johns) beat us by 20.
Are we really one of the 10 best teams in all of college basketball? It's hard to say. Rating metrics like KenPom, Sagarin, T-rank, BPI say we are not and would be underdogs against 20+ teams on a neutral floor. Personally, I think we can play with most, if not all teams on any given night.
Postseason play can be a crapshoot, but fair or unfair, that is going to tell the story with this year's squad. An early exit in the dance and the critics will say we were overrated the whole time because the BEAST wasn't any good.
Excellent eFG% defense gives our elite 3 point shooting enough chances to beat anyone.
The past couple years if we went cold from 3 for a few possessions in a row we couldn't get a stop so teams would rip off multiple runs to nearly insurmountable leads. This year if we go cold for a few or more we at least hang tight with stops, then when it starts raining again, it pours
Quote from: brewcity77 on February 03, 2019, 02:26:22 AM
Davante as a first option? He was never going to be first on that team. He was crazily effective for what he did, but didn't have the conditioning to be a reliable game after game third option. Vander & Jamil were just average that year. Neither was close to the players they would develop into, Vander as a junior and Jamil as a pro.
Buzz definitely ran plays for Davante and in that sense he was among the top 3 options . So even though he was fat and winded he put up big production in his minutes before the injury . The home game we won against Louisville was a great example. No plays were being run for Vander or Jamil but that did not take away from the talent they displayed at times as the fourth and fifth players.
I think we're all in agreement that 2003, 2009, 2012, and 2019 are the four best teams of the 2000s. How would those teams fare against each other?
2003: Wade, Diener, Jackson, Merritt, Townsend, Novak
2009: McNeal, Matthews, Hayward, James, Burke, Butler
2012: DJO, Crowder, Blue, Gardner, Wilson, Cadougan
2019: Howard, Hauser, Hauser, Anim, John, Morrow
I don't see the 2019 guards (Howard-Anim) keeping up on defense with the guard duos or trios from any of those other years. We don't have a player to guard the third guard (Sam on Matthews or DJO?...wouldn't go well). 2019 front court might be one of the best of the bunch, though I can't see John playing more than about 10 possessions against Gardner without fouling out. Gardner vs Jackson would be a helluva battle of similar styles, ditto to Crowder vs Hayward. There's more playmakers on the 2009 and 2012 teams, whereas in 2003 and 2019 the offense tends to run through just a few guys. If we add a healthy Otule back to the 2012 team, there are very few weaknesses, as Cadougan was a good distributor and good on D even if he didn't score much.
Call me a blasphemer, but I think 2009 (with DJ) and 2012 might have been the best teams but 2003 and 2019 have the most transcendent players.
Quote from: SaveOD238 on February 03, 2019, 09:39:20 AM
I think we're all in agreement that 2003, 2009, 2012, and 2019 are the four best teams of the 2000s. How would those teams fare against each other?
2003: Wade, Diener, Jackson, Merritt, Townsend, Novak
2009: McNeal, Matthews, Hayward, James, Burke, Butler
2012: DJO, Crowder, Blue, Gardner, Wilson, Cadougan
2019: Howard, Hauser, Hauser, Anim, John, Morrow
I wanted to add to my earlier post some KenPom ratings for those squads:
2003: Overall 15, AdjO 120.5 (2), AdjD 99.2 (109)
2009: Overall 19, AdjO 117.1 (9), AdjD 96.1 (52)
2012: Overall 18, AdjO 111.5 (40), AdjD 91.3 (14)
2019: Overal 26, AdjO 113.0 (26), ADJD 94.6 (32)
2003 had an outstanding offense, but a mediocre defense. 2009's offense was almost equal to 2003's but they were significantly better on D, though still not amazing. 2012 flipped the script with an outstanding defense and a good, but not great offense. 2019 doesn't have an elite offense or defense, but is probably the most balanced.
Quote from: GrimmReaper33 on February 03, 2019, 08:16:13 AM
It's too early to rank this year's team, let's see how they finish. I will say though, I do fear we may be overvaluing this year's team so far due to the gaudy record and top 10 ranking. If we're being honest, they are certainly benefiting from a very down conference.
I'm not saying they don't deserve the top 10 ranking, because they do- that's how it works, but it's kind of hard to pinpoint how good they really are. Not trying to take anything away from our guys because they deserve credit for winning the games in front of them. However, we haven't faced a top 50 KenPom team in over a month and the one we did face (St Johns) beat us by 20.
Are we really one of the 10 best teams in all of college basketball? It's hard to say. Rating metrics like KenPom, Sagarin, T-rank, BPI say we are not and would be underdogs against 20+ teams on a neutral floor. Personally, I think we can play with most, if not all teams on any given night.
Postseason play can be a crapshoot, but fair or unfair, that is going to tell the story with this year's squad. An early exit in the dance and the critics will say we were overrated the whole time because the BEAST wasn't any good.
I think this is extremely well said.
Quote from: GrimmReaper33 on February 03, 2019, 08:16:13 AM
It's too early to rank this year's team, let's see how they finish. I will say though, I do fear we may be overvaluing this year's team so far due to the gaudy record and top 10 ranking. If we're being honest, they are certainly benefiting from a very down conference.
I'm not saying they don't deserve the top 10 ranking, because they do- that's how it works, but it's kind of hard to pinpoint how good they really are. Not trying to take anything away from our guys because they deserve credit for winning the games in front of them. However, we haven't faced a top 50 KenPom team in over a month and the one we did face (St Johns) beat us by 20.
Are we really one of the 10 best teams in all of college basketball? It's hard to say. Rating metrics like KenPom, Sagarin, T-rank, BPI say we are not and would be underdogs against 20+ teams on a neutral floor. Personally, I think we can play with most, if not all teams on any given night.
Postseason play can be a crapshoot, but fair or unfair, that is going to tell the story with this year's squad. An early exit in the dance and the critics will say we were overrated the whole time because the BEAST wasn't any good.
I have enjoyed this team regardless of how they do in the post season. We all hope they receive a favorable match up, but I won't judge the team only on how they do there. It has been an extremely enjoyable campaign thus far and we all want it to go deeply into March.
Quote from: WarriorDad on February 03, 2019, 11:31:44 AM
I have enjoyed this team regardless of how they do in the post season. We all hope they receive a favorable match up, but I won't judge the team only on how they do there. It has been an extremely enjoyable campaign thus far and we all want it to go deeply into March.
Yep, as much as we rejoice in the final results, there is much more enjoyment during the season's ride.
Quote from: Herman Cain on February 03, 2019, 09:36:14 AM
Buzz definitely ran plays for Davante and in that sense he was among the top 3 options . So even though he was fat and winded he put up big production in his minutes before the injury . The home game we won against Louisville was a great example. No plays were being run for Vander or Jamil but that did not take away from the talent they displayed at times as the fourth and fifth players.
Sure, he ran plays for him, but he wasn't close to being one of the top options. Jae and DJO were 1 and 1A. Gardner, Mayo, Blue, and Jamil were all well behind them in terms of not just minutes but the number of shots available to them while on the floor.
Quote from: Mr. Sand-Knit on January 30, 2019, 11:26:42 AM
2007 n 2008 we had Crean as a coach, the guy sucked, still does. Career has been a downward spiral since his pot of gold was drafted 5th overall by the Miami Heat.
I would love to make the money he has in is downward spiral.
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on January 30, 2019, 08:04:04 AM
You have 2009 ranked too high. Sure if DJ would have been healthy it would have been better, but he wasn't and the team tanked down the stretch and lost in the second round.
Also you have 2013 ranked too low. That team won the BE and got to the E8.
On that team you had MU's 1, 2, 4 , 9 & 31 all-time scorers. McNeal, Hayward, James,, Mathews and Butler were quick and good defenders.
2013 was a perfect storm of great matchups at the right time, I still don't know how good that team actually is.
Beat Syracuse at home because Davante didn't miss a shot all game, Vander did have a breakout season, but I wouldn't put him in the same category as Markus, Wade, Jae, or even DJO.
Half court buzzer beater from Cadougan to beat UCONN, and a great matchup against Miami in the S16.
Quote from: ChitownSpaceForRent on February 03, 2019, 12:30:16 PM
2013 was a perfect storm of great matchups at the right time, I still don't know how good that team actually is.
Beat Syracuse at home because Davante didn't miss a shot all game, Vander did have a breakout season, but I wouldn't put him in the same category as Markus, Wade, Jae, or even DJO.
Half court buzzer beater from Cadougan to beat UCONN, and a great matchup against Miami in the S16.
Hardly halfcourt, and that was only to force OT. Like em or hate em, that team did have some talent.
Quote from: Its DJOver on February 03, 2019, 12:33:56 PM
Hardly halfcourt, and that was only to force OT. Like em or hate em, that team did have some talent.
That three was still crazy. It was the first made three of the game. Absolutely terrible shooting team.
Quote from: brewcity77 on February 03, 2019, 12:37:29 PM
That three was still crazy. It was the first made three of the game. Absolutely terrible shooting team.
Until the last 90 seconds against Davidson, but yea agree, that team won games on the defensive end. Still think Lockett may be the most underrated played in history, definition of a glue guy.
Quote from: bilsu on February 03, 2019, 12:18:12 PM
I would love to make the money he has in is downward spiral.
Yep, dwyane wade the gift that keeps on giving.
The '08 team is the only MU team in the kenpom era with a top 25 offense and defense. They were dealt a lousy BE schedule and some tough losses (Georgetown at home). It ended up that ND who we smoked twice and lost by 3 at their place, was placed one seed higher and played Wazzu in the second round.
surprised that nobody's higher on the 02 team. I know they lost early but picked up some solid wins and still had Wade and Deiner
........................................
Quote from: Galway Eagle on February 04, 2019, 07:17:43 AM
surprised that nobody's higher on the 02 team. I know they lost early but picked up some solid wins and still had Wade and Deiner
I think all of the great teams of this era (03, 09, and 12) each had a "good," but incomplete, team the year before. From 02 to 03 we added Jackson and Novak, plus another year for Diener and Wade. Then we took the next step. From 08 to 09 we added Jimmy Butler (and subtracted Tom Crean) and would have taken the next step if not for DJs broken foot and Lazar's foot on the baseline. From 11 to 12 we lost Jimmy but brought in Jamil and Todd and gained some experience for the freshmen Blue and Gardner.
From 18 to 19 we added Joey and a much improved Theo. We'll see where that takes us.
Even if 2019 turns out to be just a "good" year, in 2020 we should bring everyone back and add Koby McEwen. 2020 could take the next step, like 03 and 12 did (and 09 should have).
The 3 amigos team was really hard to gauge. On the one hand they never made it past the second round in the NCAA tournament but on the other hand they had multiple heart breaking losses where they should have gone deeper.
-2006-07 McNeal got hurt which killed our season
-2007-08 We lose to Standford on a miracle shot by Brook Lopez
-2008-09 We lose to Missouri after blowing a lead late and we would have beat Memphis in the S16 as they were vastly overrated.
-2009-10 We blow a 15 point lead with 10 to go against Washington in which we played New Mexico in the next round.
Even though all the above happened they were better teams than what the tournament made them out to be. I enjoy the ride as much as the tournament but the tournament will always be the measuring stick.
Getting back to the point. I believe this team will be better than all those teams above.
Quote from: HowardsWorld on February 04, 2019, 09:10:18 AM
The 3 amigos team was really hard to gauge. On the one hand they never made it past the second round in the NCAA tournament but on the other hand they had multiple heart breaking losses where they should have gone deeper.
-2006-07 McNeal got hurt which killed our season
-2007-08 We lose to Standford on a miracle shot by Brook Lopez
-2008-09 We lose to Missouri after blowing a lead late and we would have beat Memphis in the S16 as they were vastly overrated.
-2009-10 We blow a 15 point lead with 10 to go against Washington in which we played New Mexico in the next round.
Even though all the above happened they were better teams than what the tournament made them out to be. I enjoy the ride as much as the tournament but the tournament will always be the measuring stick.
Getting back to the point. I believe this team will be better than all those teams above.
09-10 was lazar plus jimmy and DJO.