MUScoop
MUScoop => Hangin' at the Al => Topic started by: jesmu84 on November 23, 2018, 11:07:33 PM
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Don't win games when they're down late in the second half to a seasoned/good opposing coach
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Don't win games when they're down late in the second half to a seasoned/good opposing coach
Sure wish we could refer to our coach as "seasoned/good"
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Don't win games when they're down late in the second half to a seasoned/good opposing coach
Last year, (edit...this year, 2018) on Feb 24th, DePaul was soft and poorly coached and they beat us. Marquette was up by 5 at the half.
But then again I don't think Wojo is seasoned or good!!!
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Last year, (edit...this year, 2018) on Feb 24th, DePaul was soft and poorly coached and they beat us. Marquette was up by 5 at the half.
But then again I don't think Wojo is seasoned or good!!!
DePaul is a lot of things. They definitely are not soft. That team played hard and physical all year last year.
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Don't win games when they're down late in the second half to a seasoned/good opposing coach
Louisville lost because of some horribly DUMB fouls 30 feet from the basket, and off the ball sending Markus, Joey and Sam to the line. Gave us 6-8 pts on FT's down the stretch. We were very fortunate to get to OT.
The first 38 mins were uninspired and ugly. If everyone is willing to concede Chris Mack (seasoned/good coach) is head and shoulders above Wojo - then that's a problem.
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Louisville lost because of some horribly DUMB fouls 30 feet from the basket, and off the ball sending Markus, Joey and Sam to the line. Gave us 6-8 pts on FT's down the stretch. We were very fortunate to get to OT.
The first 38 mins were uninspired and ugly. If everyone is willing to concede Chris Mack (seasoned/good coach) is head and shoulders above Wojo - then that's a problem.
So now we’ll discount wins because the other team didn’t put us away huh?
Eff it. None of Wojo’s wins count. M
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Louisville lost because of some horribly DUMB fouls 30 feet from the basket, and off the ball sending Markus, Joey and Sam to the line. Gave us 6-8 pts on FT's down the stretch. We were very fortunate to get to OT.
The first 38 mins were uninspired and ugly. If everyone is willing to concede Chris Mack (seasoned/good coach) is head and shoulders above Wojo - then that's a problem.
Mack's teams play hard and give it all they got. We won tonight because that's the way we played too.
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So now we’ll discount wins because the other team didn’t put us away huh?
Eff it. None of Wojo’s wins count. M
This is a win we needed but not one we're saving on the DVR. If we play like this all year, it's going to be a long year.
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This is a win we needed but not one we're saving on the DVR. If we play like this all year, it's going to be a long year.
On offense, yes. If this is our defense for the rest of the season I will be pretty happy provided they clean up the offensive boards.
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So now we’ll discount wins because the other team didn’t put us away huh?
Eff it. None of Wojo’s wins count. M
All of Wojo's wins count. And, this one was critical to our post-season hopes. I am extremely happy that we won.
However, that doesn't mean I liked what I saw in the first 38 mins vs UL, 40 mins vs IU, or last 20 mins vs KU. Many of us had lofty expectations from the day Chartouny committed. Things aren't playing out quite like we had hoped - frustrating! If we go 1-2 vs KSU, UW and Buffalo, things are going to get ugly around here.
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All of Wojo's wins count. And, this one was critical to our post-season hopes. I am extremely happy that we won.
However, that doesn't mean I liked what I saw in the first 38 mins vs UL, 40 mins vs IU, or 20 mins vs KU. Many of us had lofty expectations from the day Chartouny committed. Things aren't playing out quite like we had hoped - frustrating! If we go 1-2 vs KSU, UW and Buffalo, things are going to get ugly around here.
Take the win.
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This is a win we needed but not one we're saving on the DVR. If we play like this all year, it's going to be a long year.
Maybe. Maybe not. We just beat a team that was in a 2 point game at the under 8:00 timeout with Tennessee 2 nights ago. Louisville is far from a pushover.
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All of Wojo's wins count. And, this one was critical to our post-season hopes. I am extremely happy that we won.
However, that doesn't mean I liked what I saw in the first 38 mins vs UL, 40 mins vs IU, or last 20 mins vs KU. Many of us had lofty expectations from the day Chartouny committed. Things aren't playing out quite like we had hoped - frustrating! If we go 1-2 vs KSU, UW and Buffalo, things are going to get ugly around here.
Did you enjoy the defense? I did personally. The offense was frustrating but I at least appreciated that we weren't beating ourselves. Only 9 TOs despite the offensive struggles. And 2 of those were offensive fouls one of which was especially fishy to me.
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Did you enjoy the defense? I did personally. The offense was frustrating but I at least appreciated that we weren't beating ourselves. Only 9 TOs despite the offensive struggles. And 2 of those were offensive fouls one of which was especially fishy to me.
You're right on this. We forced Louisville to beat us, and when they couldn't, we took advantage and came away with the W.
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Did you enjoy the defense? I did personally. The offense was frustrating but I at least appreciated that we weren't beating ourselves. Only 9 TOs despite the offensive struggles. And 2 of those were offensive fouls one of which was especially fishy to me.
My only frustration with the defense last night was not securing rebounds. Joey needs to get stronger grabbing the ball. Other than that though, it feels like a much better defensive team relative to the rest of the Wojo era.
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Louisville lost because of some horribly DUMB fouls 30 feet from the basket, and off the ball sending Markus, Joey and Sam to the line. Gave us 6-8 pts on FT's down the stretch. We were very fortunate to get to OT.
The first 38 mins were uninspired and ugly. If everyone is willing to concede Chris Mack (seasoned/good coach) is head and shoulders above Wojo - then that's a problem.
So, if Louisville lost to a soft, uninspired team due to it's own incompetence and dumb play ... what's that say about Chris Mack?
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My only frustration with the defense last night was not securing rebounds. Joey needs to get stronger grabbing the ball. Other than that though, it feels like a much better defensive team relative to the rest of the Wojo era.
Joey had butterfingers for part of the night. Soft teams with bad coaching lose 19 point first half leads. What a crock of crap. There are a lot of teams out there with talent. There was a lot of fascinating games yesterday. For those who watch basketball other than Marquette, surely you recognize that MU is not the only team out there that struggles at times. For teams good enough to have a fanbase that cares, all but a couple have to have the exact same gripes. Probably not Kansas or Gonzaga. But I am sure there is an angry subset of Duke fans that think losing to Gonzaga is proof that K is an idiot.
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We had angry fans in 1977 regular season when many thought it was good Al was retiring because Hank was the real coach anyway and Al was getting in the way. Seriously, people thought that.
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My only frustration with the defense last night was not securing rebounds. Joey needs to get stronger grabbing the ball. Other than that though, it feels like a much better defensive team relative to the rest of the Wojo era.
Yes. Though I will see that we at least made up for it a little bit by grabbing double digit offensive boards ourselves. I know some were impressed by Ed last night but I wasn't as much. This is why Wojo went and got him, to make sure we don't get destroyed on the offensive glass. He only had 2 rebounds I believe in a game where we needed him to have more.
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Can someone toss us (me) the Kenton D rankings for us at this point?
(Having played top 50 UL, #2 Kansas and almost top 25 IU) I’ve got to assume we now have a pretty solid idea for our teams D.
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Yes. Though I will see that we at least made up for it a little bit by grabbing double digit offensive boards ourselves. I know some were impressed by Ed last night but I wasn't as much. This is why Wojo went and got him, to make sure we don't get destroyed on the offensive glass. He only had 2 rebounds I believe in a game where we needed him to have more.
I’m happy Morrow showed signs of life, hoping he gets settled in because it was ugly before last night.
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I’m happy Morrow showed signs of life, hoping he gets settled in because it was ugly before last night.
Still think it is reasonable that Ed and JC will both turn out just fine ala all our recent transfers.
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Still think it is reasonable that Ed and JC will both turn out just fine ala all our recent transfers.
Yeah, I can see it.
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Still think it is reasonable that Ed and JC will both turn out just fine ala all our recent transfers.
Absolutely.
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Can someone toss us (me) the Kenton D rankings for us at this point?
(Having played top 50 UL, #2 Kansas and almost top 25 IU) I’ve got to assume we now have a pretty solid idea for our teams D.
57th in overall defense. 28th in eFG% defense.
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57th in overall defense. 28th in eFG% defense.
Soft.
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Soft.
Charmin soft.
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I don't really get the "we played bad for 38 minutes" narrative. We played bad for 10 minutes against Kansas and the game was essentially over. If we had truly played bad for 38 minutes, it would have been a blow out. We didn't play our best, but we gave Louisville a 5 minute drought in the first half, and even when we weren't scoring a lot, IIRC the deficit was never double digits. We didn't play at our ceiling, but we also didn't play at our floor.
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This is a win we needed but not one we're saving on the DVR. If we play like this all year, it's going to be a long year.
The defensive effort, though still needing improvement in dribble drives, was the best effort under Wojo. We won the game. If we play like this all year - an inside-outside game with solid D, it will be a long year meaning we are in the tourney and may win one or two. Looking forward to that!
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57th in overall defense. 28th in eFG% defense.
Thanks!
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Can someone toss us (me) the Kenton D rankings for us at this point?
(Having played top 50 UL, #2 Kansas and almost top 25 IU) I’ve got to assume we now have a pretty solid idea for our teams D.
Overall offensive/defensive rankings are essentially useless this early into the season. Here are the four factors for offense and defense:
Off eFG%: 51.3 (158th)
Off TO%: 19.8 (203rd)
Off O Reb%: 29.0 (171st)
Off FTA/FGA: 31.1 (235th)
Def eFG%: 43.4 (28th)
Def TO%: 15.6 (309th)
Def O Reb%: 26.6 (114th)
Def FTA/FGA: 29.7 (94th)
There are no really good direct comparisons, but I figure the best teams to look at are those from upper echelon leagues with somewhat comparable stats. Since eFG% is most important, I tried to peg teams within 25 of our eFG% rating (133-183 on offense).
Offense
Georgetown -- 135/309/90/52 84th Adjusted Offensive Efficiency
Tulane -- 148/207/215/142 136th Adjusted Offensive Efficiency
Texas A&M -- 149/233/30/217 66th Adjusted Offensive Efficiency
Wisconsin -- 171/67/189/198 83rd Adjusted Offensive Efficiency
Based on what we've done so far, I'd guess our offense would be more accurately somewhere in the 80-100 range. Tulane might be the closest comparison, but their opposition was far lower than ours will be. For defense, since our current eFG% is so high, I'm restricting it to teams within 15 of us, so 13-43 in eFG%.
Defense
Missouri -- 16/306/137/102 43rd Adjusted Defensive Efficiency
Texas A&M -- 18/328/109/43 14th Adjusted Defensive Efficiency
Maryland -- 33/296/155/7 67th Adjusted Defensive Efficiency
I think somewhere between TAMU and Missouri are probably the most likely comparisons based on what we've done so far. Somewhere in the 20-40 range. Pretty darn good so far, and definitely better than the offense has been.
Based on last year, the best case comparison is probably a team like K-State, who was 78th in AdjOE and 21st in AdjDE with a total ranking of 43rd. Worst case is probably Providence, who was 100th in AdjOE and 36th in AdjDE with a total ranking of 63rd. FWIW the one team to appear in both comparisons, Texas A&M, was a bit better at 66th AdjOE/14th AdjDE for an overall of 29th.
All that said, it's really hard to gauge the actual meaning of kenpom rankings at this point of the season. The salient numbers are just the four factors until mid-January. They start to become accurate later in December, but it's really mid-January when the current season data is fully realized.
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Good stuff brew. Defense has definitely been ahead of the offense so far
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We had angry fans in 1977 regular season when many thought it was good Al was retiring because Hank was the real coach anyway and Al was getting in the way. Seriously, people thought that.
I second that. I was in the student union after the Wichita State game and there were a lot of people upset with McGuire, that thought we would be playing a much better brand of basketball under Hank. Didn't turn out that way. Was also at the Wichita State game where the fans booed the team in front of the players parents.
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So, fans have been fickle for a long time.
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Gato
There was not a person with ball knowledge that felt that way in ‘77. Students or fringe followers may have been in that camp, but no one that knew the hoop is ten feet off the court felt that way.
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Goose: Knowledgable fans were mad at Al for starting Neary and not replacing him with BT for the stretch run. I knew guys on the team who expressed this sentiment. They thought Al had cashed it in and were very down--especially after the Wichita State game.
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Gato
Agree to disagree. As for Neary, Al never changed the starting five during the season. We were ranked number one preseason with Neary as a starter.
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I second that. I was in the student union after the Wichita State game and there were a lot of people upset with McGuire, that thought we would be playing a much better brand of basketball under Hank. Didn't turn out that way. Was also at the Wichita State game where the fans booed the team in front of the players parents.
I was at that game and see it completely differently . The fans were upset Al got tossed and were booing the refs. The police were court side as it was mayhem. Our seats were right behind the basket on the floor by the MU bench and we saw it all unfold. I did not know a single person booing the players.
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Goose: Knowledgable fans were mad at Al for starting Neary and not replacing him with BT for the stretch run. I knew guys on the team who expressed this sentiment. They thought Al had cashed it in and were very down--especially after the Wichita State game.
Fire Al!!!
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... Don't beat 2 top 15 teams back to back