Since he missed his first FT is 67 attempts at the beginning of the Xavier Game (Jan 24)
Free-Throws 16 for 21 (76%) - and missed at least one in every game since
3 Pointers 10 for 32 (31%)
Average Points = 14.3
Assists = 8
Turnovers = 13
Team record 0 - 4
These numbers are not good for him.
Is he sick (flu?), hurt? pressing too much (yes)
Do you think that miss really bothered him? After that miss he has been a very average FT shooter, which is terrible for him.
When did he get that shiner under his eye? Does that line up with his game's fall off?
Could it be that he is a 5'11 18 year old who is the target of all opposing defenses in a league full of smart coaches? It doesn't help that he is not getting any bail out calls on his drives to the rack.
Quote from: tower912 on February 04, 2018, 11:31:31 AM
Could it be that he is a 5'11 18 year old who is the target of all opposing defenses in a league full of smart coaches? It doesn't help that he is not getting any bail out calls on his drives to the rack.
And these coaches are so good that they have even devised a "FT defense" that has dropped from 100% for the season to 76% the last four games?
Free throws are mental. He is missing FTs is symbolic of him pressing too hard, in all aspects of the game.
Quote from: Tugg Speedman on February 04, 2018, 11:42:58 AM
And these coaches are so good that they have even devised a "FT defense" that has dropped from 100% for the season to 76% the last four games?
Free throws are mental. He is missing FTs is symbolic of him pressing too hard, in all aspects of the game.
No it's not.
Quote from: Tugg Speedman on February 04, 2018, 11:42:58 AM
And these coaches are so good that they have even devised a "FT defense" that has dropped from 100% for the season to 76% the last four games?
Free throws are mental. He is missing FTs is symbolic of him pressing too hard, in all aspects of the game.
Could be. It could also be good old fashioned regression to the mean
Quote from: Tugg Speedman on February 04, 2018, 11:42:58 AM
And these coaches are so good that they have even devised a "FT defense" that has dropped from 100% for the season to 76% the last four games?
Free throws are mental. He is missing FTs is symbolic of him pressing too hard, in all aspects of the game.
Regression to mean. Still well over 90% for the year. And, btw, consider whether the beating that he takes (as a 5'11 18 year old who is the focus of the other team's defensive plan) might be taking a toll. Wearing out?
He's a human. He's just a kid. He'll be fine.
Quote from: tower912 on February 04, 2018, 11:59:58 AM
Regression to mean. Still well over 90% for the year. And, btw, consider whether the beating that he takes (as a 5'11 18-year-old who is the focus of the other team's defensive plan) might be taking a toll. Wearing out?
You seem to be arguing that the first 20 games of the year were not the mean? He was playing over his head and the last 4 games of 14 points, 76% FT, and 31% 3FG is what we should have expected, and should continue to expect.
This is the definition of regression to the mean
Quote from: JamilJaeJamailJrJuan on February 04, 2018, 12:14:42 PM
He's a human. He's just a kid. He'll be fine.
You seem to be disagreeing with Tower and the first 20 games were the mean and when Markus "regresses to the mean" that really means he will go off for 35 and lead MU to an easy victory.
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on February 04, 2018, 11:54:36 AM
Could be. It could also be good old fashioned regression to the mean
Agreed. Also, it seems like lately he goes all the way to the basket rather than using the floater. Our bigs need to get open.on those drives. They just seem to stand around
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on February 04, 2018, 11:54:36 AM
Could be. It could also be good old fashioned regression to the mean
(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-wg8iuLA5JT0/UVMxsbMFijI/AAAAAAAAAHg/srZyuRefYY4/s1600/Inigo+Montoya+from+The+Princess+Bride+_5eb38f6e2f66bcfb3c178e52e0882339.jpg)
Quote from: Tugg Speedman on February 04, 2018, 12:24:45 PM
(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-wg8iuLA5JT0/UVMxsbMFijI/AAAAAAAAAHg/srZyuRefYY4/s1600/Inigo+Montoya+from+The+Princess+Bride+_5eb38f6e2f66bcfb3c178e52e0882339.jpg)
Oh the irony.
Just my opinion, but Markus becoming a player that looks to drive to the hoop has hurt the overall offense.
He rarely passes the ball off and the rest of the team have become spectators. The team was better offensively when it moved the ball around looking for a three. I am sure part of this is due to the other team's defense, but as good as Markus has become at making two point shots there is a reason the other team's coaches want him to drive.
Quote from: bilsu on February 04, 2018, 12:52:47 PM
Just my opinion, but Markus becoming a player that looks to drive to the hoop has hurt the overall offense.
He rarely passes the ball off and the rest of the team have become spectators. The team was better offensively when it moved the ball around looking for a three. I am sure part of this is due to the other team's defense, but as good as Markus has become at making two point shots there is a reason the other team's coaches want him to drive.
Definitely on display yesterday. He's a shooting guard in a point guard's body. If he has dreams of making the NBA, he's got to adjust.
Someone on some thread a while back asked "can anyone name an NBA shooting guard that is/was really really short?" I immediately thought of Joe Dumars. For some reason I thought that he was 6-foot even. Then, I googled his height and it turns out that he was 6'4.
Quote from: Eldon on February 04, 2018, 01:18:06 PM
Definitely on display yesterday. He's a shooting guard in a point guard's body. If he has dreams of making the NBA, he's got to adjust.
Someone on some thread a while back asked "can anyone name an NBA shooting guard that is/was really really short?" I immediately thought of Joe Dumars. For some reason I thought that he was 6-foot even. Then, I googled his height and it turns out that he was 6'4.
He was LISTED at 6'3. It was a program 6'3.
Even with the recent misses, he still leads the nation in free throw percentage.
https://www.ncaa.com/stats/basketball-men/d1/current/individual/142
Can we at least see if he falls all the way to second or third before we get too concerned?
Quote from: Tugg Speedman on February 04, 2018, 12:22:27 PM
You seem to be disagreeing with Tower and the first 20 games were the mean and when Markus "regresses to the mean" that really means he will go off for 35 and lead MU to an easy victory.
The f you talking about?
I'm getting the sense that this board is too busy blaming Wojo for everything, including how he handles presser with a whopping 850 views on youtube, to discuss the poor play of the team's best player.
Want to know we are 0 - 4 since January 24. Markus poor play (by Markus standards) is a big reason. And until he plays better/makes adjustments (which he will, the question is when) this team will continue to struggle ... even if the ghost of Al McGuire was coaching them.
Quote from: Tugg Speedman on February 04, 2018, 01:44:00 PM
I'm getting the sense that this board is too busy blaming Wojo for everything, including how he handles presser with a whopping 850 views on youtube, to discuss the poor play of the team's best player.
Want to know we are 0 - 4 since January 24. Markus poor play (by Markus standards) is a big reason. And until he plays better/makes adjustments (which he will, the question is when) this team will continue to struggle ... even if the ghost of Al McGuire was coaching them.
There are old wives tales about freshmen walls. About sophomore walls. About teams wearing down in conference play. Markus has struggled lately. Rowsey has struggled lately. Sam is struggling since the hip injury. There is the big 3. All are struggling. The freshmen are hit and miss. Yesterday, Theo and Greg were hits. Jamal, not so much. Matt, Harry, Sacar? The last 4 games, the opposing defenses have found way to cut off the head.
Quote from: Tugg Speedman on February 04, 2018, 01:44:00 PM
I'm getting the sense that this board is too busy blaming Wojo for everything, including how he handles presser with a whopping 850 views on youtube, to discuss the poor play of the team's best player.
Want to know we are 0 - 4 since January 24. Markus poor play (by Markus standards) is a big reason. And until he plays better/makes adjustments (which he will, the question is when) this team will continue to struggle ... even if the ghost of Al McGuire was coaching them.
I don't disagree that Markus is in a slump, and IMHO it's fine to talk about it.
I just don't think his 93.6% FT percentage is a reasonable example of "poor play" just because the misses were recent. He still has the best percentage in the country...and in fact a better percentage than the NBA's all-time FT percentage leader (Steve Nash at 90.4%).
Markus was 7-8 yesterday.......
Quote from: bilsu on February 04, 2018, 12:52:47 PM
He rarely passes the ball off and the rest of the team have become spectators.
Definitely an area he needs to improve. If he drives, there is a >95% chance he is going to shoot it.
Very occasionally he'll drop it off, and I can't recall a single drive and kick. All opposing defense need to do is collapse on him without fear of leaving their man.
Quote from: TSmith34 on February 04, 2018, 03:25:15 PM
Definitely an area he needs to improve. If he drives, there is a >95% chance he is going to shoot it.
And if he misses, there is a >95% chance he is going to tumble to the ground. I mean, I get trying to pick up a cheap foul but...
Quote from: #bansultan on February 04, 2018, 03:38:35 PM
And if he misses, there is a >95% chance he is going to tumble to the ground. I mean, I get trying to pick up a cheap foul but...
I noticed this. I wonder how much of it is trying to influence a call and how much of it is simple physics. Jumping and getting bumped by someone 50 lbs heavier.
Quote from: tower912 on February 04, 2018, 03:48:53 PM
I noticed this. I wonder how much of it is trying to influence a call and how much of it is simple physics. Jumping and getting bumped by someone 50 lbs heavier.
Or a third option: wanting so much to avoid contact that he flinches enough to lose his balance when there is little to no contact. Kinda like a batter flinching on a pitch to the inside corner.
I personally think that is often what happens. Some guys are comfortable with contact, while others aren't.
Quote from: #bansultan on February 04, 2018, 03:38:35 PM
And if he misses, there is a >95% chance he is going to tumble to the ground. I mean, I get trying to pick up a cheap foul but...
Yes. And when he makes it he still tumbles to the ground >60% of the time
Quote from: GooooMarquette on February 04, 2018, 04:11:40 PM
Or a third option: wanting so much to avoid contact that he flinches enough to lose his balance when there is little to no contact. Kinda like a batter flinching on a pitch to the inside corner.
I personally think that is often what happens. Some guys are comfortable with contact, while others aren't.
Maybe that's true, but bad physics if that's his thinking... contact with the ground is generally going to be more forceful than contact with a guy 50lbs heavier (at least, for non contact sports).
Quote from: rocky_warrior on February 04, 2018, 05:01:21 PM
Maybe that's true, but bad physics if that's his thinking... contact with the ground is generally going to be more forceful than contact with a guy 50lbs heavier (at least, for non contact sports).
Yep. Know you're gonna get hit by someone much bigger than you, know you could go down hard if that happens, know you really don't want to go down hard, so you flinch....
But still the ultimate difference is the fear of getting hit...as evidenced by significant differences in FT attempts and floor burns between one small guy like Markus and another small guy like Rowsey.
Quote from: GooooMarquette on February 04, 2018, 05:57:28 PM
Yep. Know you're gonna get hit by someone much bigger than you, know you could go down hard if that happens, know you really don't want to go down hard, so you flinch....
But still the ultimate difference is the fear of getting hit...as evidenced by significant differences in FT attempts and floor burns between one small guy like Markus and another small guy like Rowsey.
Rowsey draws more fouls when driving than Markus, but the majority of the difference between the two is that Rowsey has 20 some fouls on three point attempts. Markus maybe has a couple.
In case anyone is watching OU WVU.. We need to run the play OU just ran at 14:28. Trae rejects the ball screen, drives, kicks out to the corner man who drives, which leaves two shooters open...drains the three
Quote from: lawdog77 on February 05, 2018, 08:25:31 PM
In case anyone is watching OU WVU.. We need to run the play OU just ran at 14:28. Trae rejects the ball screen, drives, kicks out to the corner man who drives, which leaves two shooters open...drains the three
You mean how Elliott and Hauser get most of their open looks?
Quote from: Tugg Speedman on February 05, 2018, 11:05:00 PM
You mean how Elliott and Hauser get most of their open looks?
well, according to many on here, Howard does not pass when he drives, so I am not sure.
Update through the St. Johns game.
Since he missed his first FT in 67 attempts at the beginning of the Xavier Game (Jan 24)
In the five games MU has lost since the Providence miss
Free-Throws 20 for 26 (77%) - and missed at least one in every loss since the streak was broken
3 Pointers = 12 for 40 (30%)
Average Points = 15.0
Assists = 10
Turnovers = 15
Team record 0 - 4
In the one game we won (Seton Hall)
Free-Throws 10 for 10 (100%)
3 Pointers = 4 for 6 (66%)
Average Points = 32
Assists = 3
Turnovers = 2
Since the FT streak ended Markus has had 5 subpar games (by Markus standards). Record 0 - 5
Markus had one good game, record 1-0
Will we win the next game? Depends on which Markus shows up. How do we know which one shows up? If he misses an FT. 0 - 5 when he does.
Whats wrong? He is short, relatively unathletic and has small hands. Doesnt see the court and struggles to finish and dribble. He is a horrible horrible defender.
He shoots very well when he takes good shots.
Thats who he is. Present day steve novak shoots very well. Does nothing else well.
Quote from: Mr. Sand-Knit on February 10, 2018, 10:53:11 PM
Whats wrong? He is short, relatively unathletic and has small hands. Doesnt see the court and struggles to finish and dribble. He is a horrible horrible defender.
He shoots very well when he takes good shots.
Thats who he is. Present day steve novak shoots very well. Does nothing else well.
And this suddenly happened the morning of January 24, 2018? Because for the first 1 1/2 seasons none of these issues were evident in his game.
Quote from: Tugg Speedman on February 10, 2018, 10:56:13 PM
And this suddenly happened the morning of January 24, 2018? Becuase for the first 1 1/2 seasons none of this was a problem evident in his game.
Last year he took open jump shots in a far more limited role n excelled in what he excells in. This year he is being called to everything else. None of which he does well.
Quote from: Tugg Speedman on February 10, 2018, 10:56:13 PM
And this suddenly happened the morning of January 24, 2018? Because for the first 1 1/2 seasons none of these issues were evident in his game.
Wrong. Markus had some very poor stretches well before that date.
In the 3 games prior to Jan. 24, Markus averaged 11 points on 43% shooting (23% on 3s).
And in the 3 games before he went for 52 vs Providence and 37 vs Nova, Markus averaged 12 points on 33% shooting (27% on 3s). He also had 13 TOs during that stretch.
He made all of his FTs in those games, but he still didn't shoot well.
Glad we have the young man on our team, obviously, but Markus has not been Mr. Consistent.
Shoot to get hot. Shoot to stay hot. Just not staying hot, forcing it and whining like an NBA Star at every perceived no call. Bad look for Baby Bruno Mars but hey coach gives he and frat boy a green lite so whatever
Quote from: muhoops1 on February 10, 2018, 11:17:35 PM
Shoot to get hot. Shoot to stay hot. Just not staying hot, forcing it and whining like an NBA Star at every perceived no call. Bad look for Baby Bruno Mars but hey coach gives he and frat boy a green lite so whatever
You're cool.
Quote from: tower912 on February 04, 2018, 03:48:53 PM
I noticed this. I wonder how much of it is trying to influence a call and how much of it is simple physics. Jumping and getting bumped by someone 50 lbs heavier.
He's coached by a guy who was taught to do that as a player. Duke teaches their guys to do that and they usually get calls because they're Duke. Watch Allen, go back and watch Paulus, Redick, Scheyer, Singler, et al. The difference is Howard isn't a Dukie so he's not getting the calls when there isn't a foul.
Quote from: muhoops1 on February 10, 2018, 11:17:35 PM
Shoot to get hot. Shoot to stay hot. Just not staying hot, forcing it and whining like an NBA Star at every perceived no call. Bad look for Baby Bruno Mars but hey coach gives he and frat boy a green lite so whatever
What kind of so-called "fan" spews garbage like that?
Quote from: MU82 on February 10, 2018, 11:13:29 PM
Glad we have the young man on our team, obviously, but Markus has not been Mr. Consistent.
Completely agree as this is what I was getting at, he has been inconsistent this year. The reason I noted his performance after the miss is it was obvious in the Providence game that miss upset him (which is fine) and his play collapsed right after that. Five games later and it only got better for Seton Hall.
When Markus is on, we win. When he is off, Rowsey and/or Hauser better be lighting it up or we have no chance.
This year defense is outscoring your opponent.
Quote from: Billy Hoyle on February 11, 2018, 12:01:04 AM
He's coached by a guy who was taught to do that as a player. Duke teaches their guys to do that and they usually get calls because they're Duke. Watch Allen, go back and watch Paulus, Redick, Scheyer, Singler, et al. The difference is Howard isn't a Dukie so he's not getting the calls when there isn't a foul.
You do realize that players for every program in the country do this, right? Or do you only watch Duke games and Marquette games?
I will be refereeing 3 rec-league games of 10-year-olds and 11-year-olds later today, and I guarantee I will see at least a half-dozen players react to "fouls" as if they've been shot.
P.S.: Duke and Marquette players aren't the only ones who scream, "And 1!" after every layup, either. Again, I will hear that numerous times this afternoon from the little kiddies.
Quote from: MU82 on February 11, 2018, 12:29:17 PM
You do realize that players for every program in the country do this, right? Or do you only watch Duke games and Marquette games?
I will be refereeing 3 rec-league games of 10-year-olds and 11-year-olds later today, and I guarantee I will see at least a half-dozen players react to "fouls" as if they've been shot.
P.S.: Duke and Marquette players aren't the only ones who scream, "And 1!" after every layup, either. Again, I will hear that numerous times this afternoon from the little kiddies.
82 is correct, every player that has ever put on a competitive basketball uniform whines and flops over fouls. Duke was the 438,171 team to adopt it.
He has played a lot of minutes, taken a lot of shots and hit the floor a lot of times. Several games, especially of late, his shot has been hitting front end of the rim. He might just be worn out.
Markus is a tremendous shooter, and the addition of the floater (which devastated Marquette in the NCAA tourney last year) has been huge. But he's below average as a ball-handler, distributor, and defender. He needs to get better in these parts of his game. Being 5'10 or 5'11" is a challenge, but the previous three short-comings are addressable.
Quote from: muhoops1 on February 10, 2018, 11:17:35 PM
Shoot to get hot. Shoot to stay hot. Just not staying hot, forcing it and whining like an NBA Star at every perceived no call. Bad look for Baby Bruno Mars but hey coach gives he and frat boy a green lite so whatever
Hey, congrats on making Scoop Takes.