Ok. I know we only dressed 7 scholarship players and Du had four fouls but we should have had this in the bag. I hope Markus and Katin are back soon cuz we need them both. With that said,
1. Rowsey. Only PG out there, shot well and played well overall. Geez, you can't leave him open. Thankfully we have a few guys like that this year.
2. Haanie. Good all around game.
3. JjJ. Obvious numbers but 5 turnovers did him in for me. But for them, he's SOTG. am.
4. Sam. Love his rebounding. And shooting obviously.
Need to get healthy with the BE season almost upon us. Go Warriors.
1. Rowsey
1a. HC
2. Sam.
Everybody else should be ashamed of themselves.
Rowsey. Great all-around game from him.
Quote from: tower912 on December 19, 2016, 07:52:45 PM
1. Rowsey
1a. HC
2. Sam.
Everybody else should be ashamed of themselves.
Seems like a fair assessment.
AR
gotta go Rowsey or cheats
Quote from: tower912 on December 19, 2016, 07:52:45 PM
1. Rowsey
1a. HC
2. Sam.
Everybody else should be ashamed of themselves.
This.
Traci and Sandy...snowflakes OTG
Rowsey. Only Warrior tonight.
1. Rowdy Rowsey Piper
2. If you ain't Cheatham, you ain't trying.
3. Doogie
1. Rowsey
2. HC
3. JjJ (Look at his line, he played a solid game minus the TO's)
Rowsey
Rousey, HC, Sam, JJJ, DW, Luke, Heldt.
Quote from: #UnleashRowsey on December 19, 2016, 08:11:42 PM
3. JjJ (Look at his line, he played a solid game minus the TO's)
If you actually watched him play, he was crap.
It seems weird to kvetch about a guy with a double double, but 5 turnovers, a couple other near turnovers, and crap defense all night outweigh the 11/11.
Andrew "Rowdy" Rousey.
When I think of tonight's SOTG, I find myself strangely A. Rowsey-d.
I'll say Cheats, also took on leadership role.
I don't think I'm going to look back on the JJJ era with much fondness.
Rowsey.
JJJ was awful.
Quote from: tower912 on December 19, 2016, 08:32:04 PM
When I think of tonight's SOTG, I find myself strangely A. Rowsey-d.
Rowsey was wow-sy.
Rhonda's kid brother
Quote from: Dr. Vinnie Boombatz on December 19, 2016, 08:39:08 PM
I don't think I'm going to look back on the JJJ era with much fondness.
Said the same thing to a buddy during the game. He consistently makes mind boggling decisions.
Rowsey.
Kid knows how to score. His pump fake side step 3 will make him money some day. Plus he just knows he can score. I honestly thought that with the ball in his hands at the end of the WI game we had chance to win - but he didn't get it enough at the end.
Haani. He stepped up in the second half when needed.
Chairman Row
Haanif with Rowsey a distant second. It SOTG, not SOT1H.
I agree with HC, just needs to figure out how to make that shot against big east comp
Rowsey
Or as the tv schmerm kept calling him, Howsey
Quote from: tower912 on December 19, 2016, 07:52:45 PM
1. Rowsey
1a. HC
2. Sam.
Everybody else should be ashamed of themselves.
My thoughts, exactly.
Quote from: MerrittsMustache on December 19, 2016, 09:38:43 PM
Haanif with Rowsey a distant second. It SOTG, not SOT1H.
It's not SOT2H either....
Haanif 1st half: 8 points, 3 rebounds, 2 assists, 2 turnovers, 2 fouls, 2/5 FG, 1/2 3P
Rowsey 2nd half: 8 points, 2 rebounds, 2 assists, 1 steal, 1 turnover, 2/6 FG, 2/2 FT, 2/6 3P
Rowsey's 2nd half was pretty much equal to HC's 1st half. I know you dislike Rowsey but come on man. Rowsey had a solid game.
Rowsey. KPom agrees.
Only one real option.
Rowsey.
Rowsey only he ,Sam and Hc showed up tonight, JJJ had good stats but overshadowed by his mistakes
Haanif was huge when we needed him. He scored eight straight points when the offense was struggling.
Quote from: TVDirector on December 19, 2016, 09:58:18 PM
Rowsey
Or as the tv schmerm kept calling him, Howsey
This.
The first time, I said, "Did he really just call him, 'Howsey'? The second time, I laughed my arse off!
Solid game, and great shooting.
Non-SOTGs: JJJ was really erratic and out of control tonight, and I actually usually like his game more than many here; Luke couldn't get it in the bucket and he resorted to several shots that looked like throws in the 2H.
Rowley played the best tonight.
What is wrong with JJJ?
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on December 19, 2016, 08:52:30 PM
Said the same thing to a buddy during the game. He consistently makes mind boggling decisions.
He belongs in the Jamil Wilson camp of almosts and never-weres
Quote from: GB Warrior on December 20, 2016, 05:52:09 AM
He belongs in the Jamil Wilson camp of almosts and never-weres
That last group of seniors quit on Buzz from an effort standpoint. Luke, Du and JJJ had the same feel last night. I hope they snap out of it because going through the motions in conference season would be painful.
JjJ, Duane and Luke were ALL TERRIBLE. Problem was they couldn't be benched for the game because there was nobody else. I didn't quite call out for Marotta to be inserted but the thought crossed my mind.
We had 7 guys. Hauser and Heldt were 'fine'. Not great but at least in the game. Cheatham was beginning to get his swagger back but tough to measure against the opponent. Only Rowsey was really mentally prepared to play basketball last night.
I like HC here. When they made that 2nd half push he took over the game.
Quote from: Stretchdeltsig on December 20, 2016, 04:15:08 AM
What is wrong with JJJ?
Nothing. This is "regressed to the mean JJJ." He'll get his share of points. He'll get his share of rebounds. His defense is limited to steals. He'll make some dumb turnovers.
This is who he is.
The comparison to Jamil may have been true up until last year. But I don't think it's valid now. For all his ups and downs, JaJuan is a far better player as a senior than Jamil was.
JJJ is a better shooter and more efficient scorer — especially inside the arc (58.8% on 2-pointers this year versus 47.3% for Jamil). He's one of our best players at breaking down the defense on the drive. While JaJuan and Jamie are about equal in terms of rebounding percentage, JJJ also gets the edge in DRtg so far this year.
Don't write off JaJuan just yet. Remember the dramatic improvement he showed just a year ago once the Big East conference season began. I think he still has the potential to elevate his game.
Quote from: Marcus92 on December 20, 2016, 07:45:13 AM
That may have been true up until last year. But I don't think the comparison is valid. For all his ups and downs, JaJuan is a far better player as a senior than Jamil was.
Jamil's problem in a nutshell - On senior night he passed the ball with D Wilson with 2 seconds left to take the final shot (believe we were down 1-2 points) - we lost the game - perfect reflection of Jamil's tenacity & desire to be a leader on that team.
JJJ has similar challenges now that he fixed the technical parts of his game. How he reacts will dictate if he is remembered like Jamil or more fondly
Quote from: Marcus92 on December 20, 2016, 07:45:13 AM
The comparison to Jamil may have been true up until last year. But I don't think it's valid now. For all his ups and downs, JaJuan is a far better player as a senior than Jamil was.
JJJ is a better shooter and more efficient scorer — especially inside the arc (58.8% on 2-pointers this year versus 47.3% for Jamil). He's one of our best players at breaking down the defense on the drive. While JaJuan and Jamie are about equal in terms of rebounding percentage, JJJ also gets the edge in DRtg so far this year.
Don't write off JaJuan just yet. Remember the dramatic improvement he showed just a year ago once the Big East conference season began. I think he still has the potential to elevate his game.
Are you sure about that? The offensive numbers are nearly identical. I don't know what all goes into DRtg, but if steals are included in that that is a terribly flawed number for JJ, as that is the entirety of his defense. Jump the passing lane, if he doesn't get it maybe he turns around to look to see what happens. Fatten up the steal numbers against no names and then get abused on the defensive end against teams like Wisconsin. And if he sprints into 5 guys and turns the ball over in the middle of the lane or clanks a corner 3 while holding his follow through up like a statue until the other team gets the rebound he might consider jogging to half court before the other team gets an open 3.
Give me Jamil over JJJ 100% of the time.
We will see how JJJ performs during the BE season when he can't just "out athlete" people. I hope it's not a repeat of the UW game and more a repeat of the end of last year.
Quote from: Frenns Liquor Depot on December 20, 2016, 08:01:29 AM
Jamil's problem in a nutshell - On senior night he passed the ball with D Wilson with 2 seconds left to take the final shot (believe we were down 1-2 points) - we lost the game - perfect reflection of Jamil's tenacity & desire to be a leader on that team.
JJJ has similar challenges now that he fixed the technical parts of his game. How he reacts will dictate if he is remembered like Jamil or more fondly
Jamil also hit 2 absolutely massive 3 pointers towards the end of the Davidson game to give us a prayer in that game.
Last time Rowsey was a potential SOTG he couldn't get it according to some because he didn't get it done in the first half. Now he had a good first half and he can't get it because he didn't have a good second half (which he really didn't have a bad 2nd half either).
What Jamil Wilson and JjJ have in common is that they are both better as the wingman and not the leader. Both lack the dynamic, refuse-to-lose mentality MU had become accustomed to from its seniors. Talented players. Not leaders. Both had the fate to play on a team that needed them to be leaders their senior years.
Quote from: tower912 on December 20, 2016, 08:29:18 AM
What Jamil Wilson and JjJ have in common is that they are both better as the wingman and not the leader. Both lack the dynamic, refuse-to-lose mentality MU had become accustomed to from its seniors. Talented players. Not leaders. Both had the fate to play on a team that needed them to be leaders their senior years.
BTW, this is why Junior Vander >>>>>>>>>>>> Senior JJJ
Quote from: Dr. Vinnie Boombatz on December 20, 2016, 08:30:44 AM
BTW, this is why Junior Vander >>>>>>>>>>>> Senior JJJ
Yes. And you're missing a few hundred >'s.
Quote from: tower912 on December 20, 2016, 08:29:18 AM
What Jamil Wilson and JjJ have in common is that they are both better as the wingman and not the leader. Both lack the dynamic, refuse-to-lose mentality MU had become accustomed to from its seniors. Talented players. Not leaders. Both had the fate to play on a team that needed them to be leaders their senior years.
Frankly, we've lacked that since Vander left. Guys like the Amigos, Lazar, JFB, Crowder, Junior (for my criticisms of his game, his will to win was always there), and Blue gave us that edge in toughness. Maybe Carlino had a bit of it, but the rest of the team just wasn't at that level. Last year, nothing. This year, much of the same.
I thought I saw that in Traci, but that ship sailed. I do think Markus has it. I look forward to seeing what he does as this team starts to become his.
Quote from: wadesworld on December 20, 2016, 08:12:04 AM
Jamil also hit 2 absolutely massive 3 pointers towards the end of the Davidson game to give us a prayer in that game.
Yes wades ... as I read the previous several posts in this thread, I kept thinking this, too.
I also kept thinking how out of character this was for Jamil, who was so willing to defer and so rarely willing to lead. I've been watching MU hoops closely since 1977, and Jamil is in my top-five for both "most frustrating player" and "most unrealized potential."
As to who is better between Jamil and JJJ ... who knows? We're all just throwing out opinions here. I was in Brooklyn and saw JJJ being willing to win a game with an aggressive drive and FTs. I also enjoyed watching him take over a few games during the second half of last season. Hopefully, we'll see more of that JJJ during Big East play. Jamil? He almost always left me saying, "Is that it?"
Quote from: brewcity77 on December 20, 2016, 08:42:28 AM
Frankly, we've lacked that since Vander left. Guys like the Amigos, Lazar, JFB, Crowder, Junior (for my criticisms of his game, his will to win was always there), and Blue gave us that edge in toughness. Maybe Carlino had a bit of it, but the rest of the team just wasn't at that level. Last year, nothing. This year, much of the same.
I thought I saw that in Traci, but that ship sailed. I do think Markus has it. I look forward to seeing what he does as this team starts to become his.
Agreed. See a willingness in Sam to take the big shot and guard a bigger opponent. I see flashes from Haanif, but most of the time he plays well but unemotionally. We need some dirtbags.
JJJ almost had a triple double
Quote from: GoldenEagles32 on December 20, 2016, 09:05:40 AM
JJJ almost had a triple double
Points, rebounds and turnovers?
Quote from: GoldenEagles32 on December 20, 2016, 09:07:33 AM
Points, boards and assists
Yeah I was joking. Did you watch the game? He wasn't very good.
Quote from: #UnleashRowsey on December 19, 2016, 08:11:42 PM
3. JjJ (Look at his line, he played a solid game minus the TO's)
It was a good car trip except for the head on collision
5 turnovers. Could/should have been at least 7. He threw that crapty pass that got deflected and he chased it down at mid court. He traveled on that Euro-step lay up late. Disinterested in d-ing up.
Quote from: MU82 on December 20, 2016, 08:43:12 AM
Yes wades ... as I read the previous several posts in this thread, I kept thinking this, too.
I also kept thinking how out of character this was for Jamil, who was so willing to defer and so rarely willing to lead. I've been watching MU hoops closely since 1977, and Jamil is in my top-five for both "most frustrating player" and "most unrealized potential."
As to who is better between Jamil and JJJ ... who knows? We're all just throwing out opinions here. I was in Brooklyn and saw JJJ being willing to win a game with an aggressive drive and FTs. I also enjoyed watching him take over a few games during the second half of last season. Hopefully, we'll see more of that JJJ during Big East play. Jamil? He almost always left me saying, "Is that it?"
This is ridiculous. Jamil has always been viewed unfairly by MU fans. He's 6'7" and fairly athletic and he "looked the part" and because of that, fans wanted him to be the next Hayward/Butler/Crowder. The fact of the matter is that he simply was not nearly as talented as those guys. It wasn't a lack of heart or having no killer instinct, it was that he simply wasn't as good as many fans thought he
should be. That's on the fans, not on Jamil. He was long and could jump, but he wasn't very quick, wasn't a great shooter and couldn't really create his own shot. His ceiling was that of a third option on a Big East team. He never had the ability to be "the man" on a high major team. He did a lot of things well but nothing great. I'd take Jamil on the current team in a heartbeat.
Much like with Jamil, MU's struggles haven't come as a result of a lack of leadership, it has come from a lack of talent. Fischer shot 4-13 last night and had several bunnies that he almost always makes rim out. Everyone has those nights. If he gets a few of those shots to fall and ends up with 16-18 points, would that have made him a better leader?
I think Rowsey and Howard are "junkyard dog" types. Gritty, in your face players. Unfortunately, they are both 5'8" on a good day. I think Heldt isn't afraid to mix it up, but unfortunately he has limited athleticism and skills. I don't think Hauser is the toughest guy in the world, but I think he's willing to mix it up defensively and has a will to win in him. I think Katin has the attitude of a junkyard dog but not the skillset to take over like he thinks he can.
I like next year's class. I think John is a tough dude down low, I think Eke will be a mean guy but I'm in a big time "wait and see" mode on whether he can develop the skill to be on the floor much, and I think Cain is going to be a tough minded wing for us.
Quote from: brewcity77 on December 20, 2016, 08:42:28 AM
Frankly, we've lacked that since Vander left. Guys like the Amigos, Lazar, JFB, Crowder, Junior (for my criticisms of his game, his will to win was always there), and Blue gave us that edge in toughness. Maybe Carlino had a bit of it, but the rest of the team just wasn't at that level. Last year, nothing. This year, much of the same.
I thought I saw that in Traci, but that ship sailed. I do think Markus has it. I look forward to seeing what he does as this team starts to become his.
I think Cheatham sort of showed that "I'll take it from here, boys" mentality last night when things go a bit tighter in the second half. It will be good if that spurt is his break out of the rut moment. Plus, I'd still like to see him diversify his offense a bit more. What he can do against competition like St. Francis will not be feasible in BEast play.
Quote from: Frenns Liquor Depot on December 20, 2016, 05:55:51 AM
That last group of seniors quit on Buzz from an effort standpoint. Luke, Du and JJJ had the same feel last night. I hope they snap out of it because going through the motions in conference season would be painful.
I don't know what game you were watching last night, but I didn't see any sign at all -- not even a trace -- that Luke, Duane and JJJ quit on Wojo or the team.
Luke missed shots he usually makes. Duane committed some sloppy fouls. JJJ was too loose with the basketball.
They were misses, fouls and mistakes. I don't know how you could take the next step and say those were signs they were going through the motions or they didn't care or they quit.
I mean, in our loss to Vanderbilt in 2011, Jae missed 9 of 13 shots from the floor and 6 of 14 shots from the line. In our loss to Cinci later that season, he went 5-for-13 with 4 turnovers. Did he go through the motions those games?
Jeesh.
Quote from: tower912 on December 20, 2016, 09:23:37 AM
5 turnovers. Could/should have been at least 7. He threw that crapty pass that got deflected and he chased it down at mid court. He traveled on that Euro-step lay up late. Disinterested in d-ing up.
Perhaps this is just where jjj is being clever.
He's putting all these poor-decision drives and lazy passes on tape to lull our BE opponents to sleep.
Quote from: MUEng92 on December 20, 2016, 09:20:02 AM
It was a good car trip except for the head on collision
Perfect
Quote from: MU82 on December 20, 2016, 10:26:59 AM
I don't know what game you were watching last night, but I didn't see any sign at all -- not even a trace -- that Luke, Duane and JJJ quit on Wojo or the team.
Luke missed shots he usually makes. Duane committed some sloppy fouls. JJJ was too loose with the basketball.
You can compare these guys to the worst games from the best warriors all you want but I am not the only one who thought those three were completely uninspired last night.
Look - to have a shot we need all three to play possessed & lead - I am just saying that its time to step up otherwise this is going to be a long conference season.
Quote from: Frenns Liquor Depot on December 20, 2016, 10:41:17 AM
You can compare these guys to the worst games from the best warriors all you want but I am not the only one who thought those three were completely uninspired last night.
Look - to have a shot we need all three to play possessed & lead - I am just saying that its time to step up otherwise this is going to be a long conference season.
So, you're sticking by your story that Luke didn't care and was just going through the motions. OK. I don't know what came over him when he ran about 20 feet and flew over everybody for a put-back jam. He must have forgotten he had decided not to play.
As for JJJ, if anything I think he was trying to do too much, especially on offense. He does get lost on defense sometimes because he always wants to go for the steal; that's been a problem of his for 4 years.
But you can stick by them being quitters who don't give a shyte. I know you have proof.
Quote from: Dr. Vinnie Boombatz on December 20, 2016, 09:06:36 AM
Points, rebounds and turnovers?
Boom. i could care less about JiJ's stat line last night. He was awful.
Quote from: MU82 on December 20, 2016, 01:55:26 PM
So, you're sticking by your story that Luke didn't care and was just going through the motions. OK. I don't know what came over him when he ran about 20 feet and flew over everybody for a put-back jam. He must have forgotten he had decided not to play.
As for JJJ, if anything I think he was trying to do too much, especially on offense. He does get lost on defense sometimes because he always wants to go for the steal; that's been a problem of his for 4 years.
But you can stick by them being quitters who don't give a shyte. I know you have proof.
That is your opinion & I respect that. Mine is an opinion as well. Personally, I hope yours is what ultimately plays out.
Quote from: MU82 on December 20, 2016, 01:55:26 PM
So, you're sticking by your story that Luke didn't care and was just going through the motions. OK. I don't know what came over him when he ran about 20 feet and flew over everybody for a put-back jam. He must have forgotten he had decided not to play.
As for JJJ, if anything I think he was trying to do too much, especially on offense. He does get lost on defense sometimes because he always wants to go for the steal; that's been a problem of his for 4 years.
But you can stick by them being quitters who don't give a shyte. I know you have proof.
I think you've provided a fair assessment. Everyone seems to care deeply. But last night most of the team looked like they'd never had a second of coaching or practice time. Maybe it was the pressure of only having 7 and thinking they had to do everything therefore forgetting to do any of the easy, little things. Wednesday needs to go better.
Last night was similar to a lot of our games. We came out on fire, built a big (18 point) lead and faded.
If Luke shoots his usual percentage on the bunnies he had, we build a 30-point lead and coast. And the talk here is about "Do we really need to play St. Francis?" instead of "We have a bunch of quitters who mail it in under the de-motivator."