Hindsight is 20/20 of course...but man this team sure could have used DJ Newbill - guy is playing on marginal Penn State team and just is ballin...his numbers this year compared to Vander last year..probably are reflective of the next step up Vander would have taken, had he stayed...but man, we sure could have used Newbill...glad to see him doing well and suspect he'll be playing in the league either after this year or next...is a big, physical guard...
http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/compare?add=devonte-newbill&p1=vander-blue
I sometimes wonder (in the very few moments I think about DJ Newbill because people on this board keep bringing him up) if getting spurned by Marquette gave him the chip on his shoulder he needed to be a good/great player. If he would have stayed here, it's possible he wouldn't have been as motivated/ etc.
I still think he plays at the next level.
Quote from: CrazyEcho on March 02, 2014, 10:15:25 PM
I sometimes wonder (in the very few moments I think about DJ Newbill because people on this board keep bringing him up) if getting spurned by Marquette gave him the chip on his shoulder he needed to be a good/great player. If he would have stayed here, it's possible he wouldn't have been as motivated/ etc.
Certainly probably didn't hurt his motivation, that's for sure....yet prior to his coming to MU there were videos uploaded here showing him doing some insane workouts....which a lot of high major prospects now do...but...think he's probably always had a good work ethic...just might have taken a tick up after MU drama..
When he committed to MU, there were many posters here that thought he would not be any good. Of course they were saying the same thing about Dawson. People should forget about rankings and let the players prove or disprove themselves on the floor. Nobody thought Dawson would be playing more than JJJ at this point.
I don't think Newbill would have stayed at MU anyway. MU had a lot of guards at the time that would have been ahead of him on the depth chart. I think he was ending up at Penn State either way. Also, I think if Newbill was here one of MU's top players would not be.
Quote from: MARQ_13 on March 02, 2014, 10:42:20 PM
I don't think Newbill would have stayed at MU anyway. MU had a lot of guards at the time that would have been ahead of him on the depth chart. I think he was ending up at Penn State either way. Also, I think if Newbill was here one of MU's top players would not be.
Didn't we cut his scholarship so that we could get Jamil? Looking at whats happening this year I'd be ok with that. At the time I would've been upset but now...
Quote from: PunchingPiper on March 02, 2014, 10:51:04 PM
Didn't we cut his scholarship so that we could get Jamil? Looking at whats happening this year I'd be ok with that. At the time I would've been upset but now...
Basically, yes...a backcourt with Newbill and Vander would have been insanely good (even last year..as Newbill had a strong year at PSU last year too.)
Glad it worked out for him...and Jamil has had some really great moments at MU too...made some huge shots in the NCAA tourney last year, and that Elite 8 run will live on for a long time.
Just too bad for Jamil he's been plagued by inconsistency this season..it is a challenging team to operate effectively as our backcourt is generally pretty overmatched game in, game out which puts added stress on Jamil/DG..
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on March 02, 2014, 10:21:00 PM
I still think he plays at the next level.
If by the "next level" you mean Niv Berkowitz, Biggie Clausen, Chris Grimm level I agree. Pretty much any D1 starter (and lots of non starters) fit that bill. If by next level you mean NBA I'd say probably not.
Newbill is definitely an NBADL talent who will see some hardwood time in the L.
Jake Thomas has made 60 3 - Pt shots this season. Newbill has made 39.
Jake shoots 39% behind the arc, Newbill 34%
Jake has 41 assists to 29 TO's. Newbill has 53 assists to 61 TO's.
And to those who would have rather had Newbill over Jamil last season, I think you need to go back and look at what Jamil did for us and rethink your position.
Newbill is a volume scorer on a bad team. He's much better than I thought he would be, and can do a lot of things, but I can't see him playing at the next level. What does he do particularly well?
Quote from: IrwinFletcher on March 03, 2014, 06:52:49 AM
Jake Thomas has made 60 3 - Pt shots this season. Newbill has made 39.
Jake shoots 39% behind the arc, Newbill 34%
Jake has 41 assists to 29 TO's. Newbill has 53 assists to 61 TO's.
And to those who would have rather had Newbill over Jamil last season, I think you need to go back and look at what Jamil did for us and rethink your position.
Are you kidding me?! Trying to make a case that Jake Thomas is a better player than Newbill??! Wow...Newbill's numbers this year are a good bit better than Vander's from last year...so essentially what you are saying is that Jake Thomas this year is better than Vander last year? Okay.
Quote from: The Sultan of Slurpery on March 03, 2014, 08:47:24 AM
Newbill is a volume scorer on a bad team. He's much better than I thought he would be, and can do a lot of things, but I can't see him playing at the next level. What does he do particularly well?
A volume shooter? He's done virtually everything better than Vander did last year percentage wise and output wise - shoot, rebound, get to the line....and many think it is easier to be a better player when surrounded with other high level talent. The fact Newbill is getting it done at a better rate than Vander last year, on a team with mediocre talent in the Big 10 - which is a tough league....I'd say he's shown he does a lot well.
Quote from: IrwinFletcher on March 03, 2014, 06:52:49 AM
Jake Thomas has made 60 3 - Pt shots this season. Newbill has made 39.
Jake shoots 39% behind the arc, Newbill 34%
Jake has 41 assists to 29 TO's. Newbill has 53 assists to 61 TO's.
Yes, Jake Thomas has more 3 pointers than Newbill this year. Big deal. Newbill has 513 points (in arguably the best conference) compared to Thomas' 231, for a difference of 282 points. Average that out over the 29 games we've played and that's a 9.82 points-per-game difference that Newbill (theoretically) could have provided. Add 9.82 points to each of our losses this year and we wind up with 6 more wins, a 23 and 6 record and sole possession of 3rd place in the Big East. We'd be talking about our seed in the opening round right now and not bitching about the lack of scoring from our starters. I understand that all of this is just speculation, but the fact is, Newbill is the kind of hard driving, high scoring guard who could have consistently put points on the board for us all year long. The lack of that kind of production from our guards is, IMO, the single biggest reason why we are on the outside looking in right now.
Somewhere 'Philly Coach' is gloating...
If Newbill had matriculated, would he be here this year?
Quote from: The Love House on March 03, 2014, 09:46:03 AM
Somewhere 'Philly Coach' is gloating...
I think the situation was handled poorly, and I fault Buzz for it. That being said, Marquette has been to two Sweet Sixteens and an Elite Eight while Newbill has never even been in the dance.
If there is any gloating it is Southern Miss fans who went to the tourney after Newbill transferred. And they have chance of going again this year while Penn State might not even make the NIT.
Quote from: jesmu84 on March 03, 2014, 09:57:43 AM
If Newbill had matriculated, would he be here this year?
Yes...would have been a senior...along with Vander...what could have been...think about that team along with Davante...wow!
Vander scored 47 points yesterday, 35 points a few days ago. I don't know how much D is played in the "D" League, but here you go
http://www.youtube.com/v/0dO5jsyNTPY
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on March 03, 2014, 12:26:39 PM
Vander scored 47 points yesterday, 35 points a few days ago. I don't know how much D is played in the "D" League, but here you go
His shot is looking a lot smoother in that video than it has in the past.
It's something we'll never know. But I think the comparison should be Newbill and Jamil Wilson.
Quote from: muwarrior69 on March 03, 2014, 12:38:44 PM
It's something we'll never know. But I think the comparison should be Newbill and Jamil Wilson.
I was going to say the same thing, especially since they are interlinked by the scholarship that was given.
Quote from: The Sultan of Slurpery on March 03, 2014, 08:47:24 AM
Newbill is a volume scorer on a bad team. He's much better than I thought he would be, and can do a lot of things, but I can't see him playing at the next level. What does he do particularly well?
+1 - He may play in the D-League or Europe. He certainly won't get drafted. He's just the best player on a bad team.
Quote from: Ners on March 03, 2014, 10:20:24 AM
Yes...would have been a senior...along with Vander...what could have been...think about that team along with Davante...wow!
Think of what Kentucky would have been... Anthony Davis Kidd-Gilchrist, Lamb, Jones, Teague. Would never lose a game with those guys as upperclassmen
So it's pretty meaningless to wonder "what if" when that isn't reality.
Besides, we'd still need a PG ;D
Quote from: brandx on March 03, 2014, 12:49:41 PM
Think of what Kentucky would have been... Anthony Davis Kidd-Gilchrist, Lamb, Jones, Teague. Would never lose a game with those guys as upperclassmen
So it's pretty meaningless to wonder "what if" when that isn't reality.
Besides, we'd still need a PG ;D
Good point on needing a PG still...
The guys you reference above though were all thought to be one and done type talents, other than Lamb...Vander and certainly Newbill weren't thought of being 2 and dones.
I will make a wager with you, however, that Newbill will get drafted whether he enters this year or next..
Newbill is a talent for sure. Would love to have him in a Warrior uniform. To say he is better than Blue is a misnomer in my opinion. Newbill is the best player on a crappy Penn State team. The offense has to roll through him. Vander had options and had to share the scoring with other stars.
Quote from: muwarrior69 on March 03, 2014, 12:38:44 PM
It's something we'll never know. But I think the comparison should be Newbill and Jamil Wilson.
Shhhh,
This way it fits the narrative of the poster who shall not be named.
Quote from: Ners on March 03, 2014, 09:33:02 AM
A volume shooter? He's done virtually everything better than Vander did last year percentage wise and output wise - shoot, rebound, get to the line....and many think it is easier to be a better player when surrounded with other high level talent. The fact Newbill is getting it done at a better rate than Vander last year, on a team with mediocre talent in the Big 10 - which is a tough league....I'd say he's shown he does a lot well.
I want to know what Newbill does particularly well at the next level. He seems to do a lot of things at Penn State because he is the guy. He's not a point guard though. His shot isn't *that* good. He isn't overly athletic.
He seems like a good college guard.
And Vander is a better player. Period. You have been trying this argument for over a year and it is still wrong.
Did the Newbill incident ever make anybody else question Buzz and his "people-first" schtick? I mean on one hand, Buzz seems very genuine in his desire about putting people before anything else, his love for former players, his good deeds that he does (even without the publicity). This all makes me think that he is a very sincere and caring person.
But, on the other hand, it seems we did Newbill dirty. No ifs ands or buts about it, the kid wanted to come here, signed the LOI, and we pulled the rug from under him to get a better player. I know that this is "part of the business of college basketball" and I'm totally fine with that. But the disturbing part for me is that Buzz puts out the perception that he is above all of that, that people are more important than the "business of college basketball."
I don't know, just my random thoughts. Wonder if anyone felt similar.
Quote from: ElDonBDon on March 03, 2014, 05:41:43 PM
Did the Newbill incident ever make anybody else question Buzz and his "people-first" schtick? I mean on one hand, Buzz seems very genuine in his desire about putting people before anything else, his love for former players, his good deeds that he does (even without the publicity). This all makes me think that he is a very sincere and caring person.
But, on the other hand, it seems we did Newbill dirty. No ifs ands or buts about it, the kid wanted to come here, signed the LOI, and we pulled the rug from under him to get a better player. I know that this is "part of the business of college basketball" and I'm totally fine with that. But the disturbing part for me is that Buzz puts out the perception that he is above all of that, that people are more important than the "business of college basketball."
I don't know, just my random thoughts. Wonder if anyone felt similar.
No one knows what really happened here except for Buzz/MU coaches, Newbill and his family. And i'm sure even those people would all tell slightly different versions of the story. You're going to get a lot of people responding to this stating a bunch of "facts" though. So have fun making a decision.
Only thing I'll say is this:
Can, open. Worms, everywhere.
Quote from: The Sultan of Slurpery on March 03, 2014, 05:25:19 PM
I want to know what Newbill does particularly well at the next level. He seems to do a lot of things at Penn State because he is the guy. He's not a point guard though. His shot isn't *that* good. He isn't overly athletic.
He seems like a good college guard.
And Vander is a better player. Period. You have been trying this argument for over a year and it is still wrong.
Wager? You see Blue doing well in D-League, which is great...I'll just wager that Newbill gets drafted...whether he tries to come out this year or next?
And I love how you discredited him at Southern Miss for playing against poor competition, then he goes to Big 10..arguably best league this year and lights it up, and across the board all of his stats are better than Vander last year...but its only because Penn State isn't very good and not that talented...which therefore should make it easier to shut a guy down (as has Jamil been on this weak MU team)..but in Newbill's case...it's the reason for his success and numbers being better this year than Vander last year??
As for NBA...he'll be a really good 2 guard prospect - he's a legit 6'5 - and is a much more physical player than Vander, though not as explosive. He's a better shooter than Vander from 2 and 3...and he'll be able to post other 2 guards as his career evolves...
I don't gamble. If Newbill is drafted and makes an NBA roster, I will tip my cap to you.
This is an out-there question... but if we're going to go ahead and compare the two, is it fair to either of them to compare newbill's numbers this year to blue's numbers last year? Aaren't they the same age/class? I don't think you can compare blue's pro numbers this year to newbill's college numbers. But I don't think you should compare a 4 year player's stats to a 3 year palyer.
Quote from: jesmu84 on March 03, 2014, 08:00:54 PM
This is an out-there question... but if we're going to go ahead and compare the two, is it fair to either of them to compare newbill's numbers this year to blue's numbers last year? Aaren't they the same age/class? I don't think you can compare blue's pro numbers this year to newbill's college numbers. But I don't think you should compare a 4 year player's stats to a 3 year palyer.
The post was intended to illustrate how good Newbill has played this year...as many here thought Vander was a superstar last year...and how much it would have helped to have Newbill on this team..and what could have been in both Newbill and Blue were playing together as seniors right now on this team. Felt given Vander's improvement from Year 2 to 3 at MU, taking the next step in his development at MU..his numbers likely would have looked like Newbill's do this year (as he and Vander were virtually identical last year statistically speaking.)
Quote from: Ners on March 03, 2014, 06:38:39 PM
Wager? You see Blue doing well in D-League, which is great...I'll just wager that Newbill gets drafted...whether he tries to come out this year or next?
And I love how you discredited him at Southern Miss for playing against poor competition, then he goes to Big 10..arguably best league this year and lights it up, and across the board all of his stats are better than Vander last year...but its only because Penn State isn't very good and not that talented...which therefore should make it easier to shut a guy down (as has Jamil been on this weak MU team)..but in Newbill's case...it's the reason for his success and numbers being better this year than Vander last year??
As for NBA...he'll be a really good 2 guard prospect - he's a legit 6'5 - and is a much more physical player than Vander, though not as explosive. He's a better shooter than Vander from 2 and 3...and he'll be able to post other 2 guards as his career evolves...
Ners,
I'd bet 1000 that DJ doesn't get drafted and another 1000 that Blue plays in more NBA games in his first 5 years out of college than Newbill does.
Quote from: Lennys Tap on March 04, 2014, 10:44:18 AM
Ners,
I'd bet 1000 that DJ doesn't get drafted and another 1000 that Blue plays in more NBA games in his first 5 years out of college than Newbill does.
You've got yourself a wager. :)
Quote from: Ners on March 04, 2014, 11:31:44 AM
You've got yourself a wager. :)
whoa. have we had any bigger wager than $2k on this site?
Newbill eats Jake's lunch 9 out of 10 times.
NVM
DJ Newbill made All Big Ten 2nd team today.
I have to eat crow on Crawford from Northwestern....didn't make it. Finished strong with 27 points yesterday against the Boils, but too little too late.