Post what you think he'll say.
"We got our butts whipped."
That and we "had no heart" out there today. You can't win "if you don't want it".
But we had a hard, great practice.
St Johns not only has some great basketball players, they are even better human beings.
Hopefully he says, "Perhaps I shouldn't have let them have a night on the town Friday"
"We had our best practice of the year yesterday."
"These are good kids."
"We kept it under 20"
"Jamil didn't play in the second half because he was playing like Softy Softerson."
He won't show up is my prediction. Horrible result, another game at the Garden after....He'll be a no show.
Quote from: Afroman on February 01, 2014, 01:51:43 PM
"Jamil didn't play in the second half because he was playing like Softy Softerson."
Derrick is our elite defender, but I need some more which is why I did not have him guard Harrison today, wanted to see who else is. But I love Derrick's story, and he is a game changer.
Silence. Suspect theres a chance he may not appear because of this double header.
Quote from: NavinRJohnson on February 01, 2014, 01:53:48 PM
Silence. Suspect theres a chance he may not appear because of this double header.
Just announced he is up next on postgame
Prediction:
"Give credit to ST Johns, but as all year no consistency and this time no heart from our players. I'm exhausted..."
Quote from: willie warrior on February 01, 2014, 01:53:27 PM
Derrick is our elite defender, but I need some more which is why I did not have him guard Harrison today, wanted to see who else is. But I love Derrick's story, and he is a game changer.
You need to actually closely watch the games. Derrick (or when he was in Jake) were assigned Harrison. I just went back and watched a good chunk of the 2nd half. Derrick was the primary defender. When he was the defender, Harrison did not score (similarly the end of the 2nd half with Jake...Harrison did not score). During that time Harrison scored 12 points on 4 possessions. All 4 were guarded by Freshman...why.
First scoring possession, box-outs/rebounding left Burton on Harrison, he let him drive straight to the hoop where a foul was committed on a lay-up. 2-2 on FTs.
Second scoring possession. Transition possession. Wilson is the first one back so picks up a guy near the baseline. Harrison is late down the court so (Jujuan ends up on him). Harrison makes a 3.
Third scoring possession. Transition possession again, MU picks up in a 2-3. Harrison is on Burton/Jujuan's side of the floor. Burton follows a player away from his side (guessing he forgot it was a 2-3 zone), Harrison left open makes a wide open 3.
Fourth scoring possession. Derrick picks him up at the half court line. Harrison passes to the wing (Burton's guy), and runs behind the player. Derrick tries to go with Harrison to stay on him, per the game plan. Burton waves him off and calls for the switch. Derrick has to go with it at this point. Burton gets into poor position and does not get back to the shooter. 3-pt basket and foul...makes the FT. 12 points, none of which are on Derrick.
That is why scorer's score sometime with an elite defender. Because of transition possessions and switches they will have opportunities to score on someone else.
But continue with your mantra of bad defense and who plays well by only looking at the box score.
Now they say they might not be able to get Buzz do to next game
Respectfully coach, I watched every minute of the game. I believe you could have had the courtesy to face Homer's questions after the game. Thanks for listening.
Quote from: BenCat12 on February 01, 2014, 01:52:58 PM
He won't show up is my prediction. Horrible result, another game at the Garden after....He'll be a no show.
LOL what do I win?
No show.
Well, damn. Now how are we going to judge the guesses in this thread?
Quote from: NavinRJohnson on February 01, 2014, 01:53:48 PM
Silence. Suspect theres a chance he may not appear because of this double header.
Actually, I win.
Quote from: mu_hilltopper on February 01, 2014, 02:15:41 PM
No show.
Well, damn. Now how are we going to judge the guesses in this thread?
Just lock the thread and, if our winning ways is any indication, pull it out after the SHU game. ;)
Quote from: NavinRJohnson on February 01, 2014, 02:16:26 PM
Actually, I win.
Congrats, good call and got the reason right too.
You can claim your prize ... I have a pound of blue Meth for you.
Don't worry, I'm sure Mike Hunt will give us a very comprehensive report.
Quote from: NavinRJohnson on February 01, 2014, 02:22:19 PM
Don't worry, I'm sure Mike Hunt will give us a very comprehensive report.
+1
Mike Hunt is itching for a good story.....
Quote from: NavinRJohnson on February 01, 2014, 02:22:19 PM
Don't worry, I'm sure Mike Hunt will give us a very comprehensive report.
For once, if Mike wrote his usual, condensed article with two words "MU stinks," I may actually not have a problem with him.
For $2.8 million per, Buzz should have the balls to show up and tell us what went wrong.
Quote from: ecompt on February 01, 2014, 03:21:32 PM
For $2.8 million per, Buzz should have the balls to show up and tell us what went wrong.
If he just didn't show up I agree, but according to Homer it was because they had to vacate the area earlier than usual due to the second game of the doubleheader.
Quote from: forgetful on February 01, 2014, 02:10:53 PM
You need to actually closely watch the games. Derrick (or when he was in Jake) were assigned Harrison. I just went back and watched a good chunk of the 2nd half. Derrick was the primary defender. When he was the defender, Harrison did not score (similarly the end of the 2nd half with Jake...Harrison did not score). During that time Harrison scored 12 points on 4 possessions. All 4 were guarded by Freshman...why.
First scoring possession, box-outs/rebounding left Burton on Harrison, he let him drive straight to the hoop where a foul was committed on a lay-up. 2-2 on FTs.
Second scoring possession. Transition possession. Wilson is the first one back so picks up a guy near the baseline. Harrison is late down the court so (Jujuan ends up on him). Harrison makes a 3.
Third scoring possession. Transition possession again, MU picks up in a 2-3. Harrison is on Burton/Jujuan's side of the floor. Burton follows a player away from his side (guessing he forgot it was a 2-3 zone), Harrison left open makes a wide open 3.
Fourth scoring possession. Derrick picks him up at the half court line. Harrison passes to the wing (Burton's guy), and runs behind the player. Derrick tries to go with Harrison to stay on him, per the game plan. Burton waves him off and calls for the switch. Derrick has to go with it at this point. Burton gets into poor position and does not get back to the shooter. 3-pt basket and foul...makes the FT. 12 points, none of which are on Derrick.
That is why scorer's score sometime with an elite defender. Because of transition possessions and switches they will have opportunities to score on someone else.
But continue with your mantra of bad defense and who plays well by only looking at the box score.
I did watch the game. Derrick was on Harrison about the first 4 minutes or so. Then mayo was on him for quite a while and was torched. Dawson guarded him, Burton and even Jake. Derrick was taken off Harrison early in the first half.
Quote from: willie warrior on February 01, 2014, 03:38:57 PM
I did watch the game. Derrick was on Harrison about the first 4 minutes or so. Then mayo was on him for quite a while and was torched. Dawson guarded him, Burton and even Jake. Derrick was taken off Harrison early in the first half.
Harrison did not score in those first 4 minutes. I do not remember when Dawson came in, but obviously if he is in the game Derrick is on the bench, so it only makes sense that someone else, Burton, Dawson, Mayo will have to guard Harrison.
Dawson saw a lot of action in the first half. Most of the 11 1st half pts that Harrison scored came when Dawson was in the game (and Derrick was on the bench). I can't give specific numbers because I did not record the first half, watched it live, and the play-by-play does not have substitutions up yet.
You can't fault Derrick for defense when he is not in the game. Also, defense is tiring, so they will from time to time switch primary defenders to get some rest, hence Jake taking (and shutting him down) Harrison for awhile in the 2nd half.
When Jake or Derrick were on Harrison they effectively shut him down completely.
Quote from: Lennys Tap on February 01, 2014, 03:30:49 PM
If he just didn't show up I agree, but according to Homer it was because they had to vacate the area earlier than usual due to the second game of the doubleheader.
Hopefully that was the case, but I remember Buzz peeing on the media in New Jersey a few years back after an equally poor performance.
Quote from: Lennys Tap on February 01, 2014, 03:30:49 PM
If he just didn't show up I agree, but according to Homer it was because they had to vacate the area earlier than usual due to the second game of the doubleheader.
Homer did say that .. but that's bogus. Homer stayed on the air a good 30 minutes after the game, before they pulled the plug due to the next game. Plenty of time for Buzz to get there. He chose to prioritize his time otherwise.
Quote from: forgetful on February 01, 2014, 04:18:10 PM
Harrison did not score in those first 4 minutes. I do not remember when Dawson came in, but obviously if he is in the game Derrick is on the bench, so it only makes sense that someone else, Burton, Dawson, Mayo will have to guard Harrison.
Dawson saw a lot of action in the first half. Most of the 11 1st half pts that Harrison scored came when Dawson was in the game (and Derrick was on the bench). I can't give specific numbers because I did not record the first half, watched it live, and the play-by-play does not have substitutions up yet.
You can't fault Derrick for defense when he is not in the game. Also, defense is tiring, so they will from time to time switch primary defenders to get some rest, hence Jake taking (and shutting him down) Harrison for awhile in the 2nd half.
When Jake or Derrick were on Harrison they effectively shut him down completely.
Reading is fundamental. I never faulted Derrick. I question why he was not on Harrison more as he is an "elite defender". Mayo, Burton, Dawson and jake spent most of the game on him.
He pulled a Crean?
Shoulda had our elite defender on Harrison all game long, hey?
Quote from: ecompt on February 01, 2014, 03:21:32 PM
For $2.8 million per, Buzz should have the balls to show up and tell us what went wrong.
For free didn't you watch the game yourself! What did you see!? He doesn't have to come tell us what went wrong. You have eyes.
Maybe he stayed in the locker room and saw fit to TELL AND COACH HIS TEAM ON WHAT WENT WRONG not us! For $2.8 mil I would have...and expect no less from him.
That is more important. If you want to know what went wrong watch his hour long coaches show...with a game right after his he was not obligated to come out and tell us anything.
After all the fans are the real experts and couch coaches, you know what went wrong. ;)
Quote from: jsglow on February 01, 2014, 02:14:03 PM
Respectfully coach, I watched every minute of the game. I believe you could have had the courtesy to face Homer's questions after the game. Thanks for listening.
LOL...what!? Courtesy? His courtesy is to his team! If he choose to spend it with his team, that is his job and that is more important. You will "talk" later.
Many are 'salt wound fans.' They Looooovvveee to rub salt in wounds when things go south. There was nothing that Buzz could have said that you didn't see.
In fact, instead of having Buzz come out every game they should have some of the players come out every once and awhile. Buzz has a show.
No offense on Buzz. I love listening to Buzz, and think he is one of the brightest minds in college bball. I could hear his views on hoops all night. But as an out for himself, he can send some players out there to do the after game interview.
They are the ones who played. Why does Buzz always have to face the music? But this game he is entitled to coach his team and stay in the locker room. It is crazy to expect him to come out after that with another game up next.
Use your head. Why didn't he send # 0 or #54 out to talk to Homer and Jim?
Quote from: NavinRJohnson on February 01, 2014, 02:22:19 PM
Don't worry, I'm sure Mike Hunt will give us a very comprehensive report.
See, I told you. I just took 38 seconds to read his game report today. It is full of quotes and insights. You can see he really took the time to ask the right questions.
Seriously, did he even notice that Jamil and a mayo didn't play a minute in the second half, or that Gardner really only got in when forced into action?
Quote from: MUHoopsFan2 on February 02, 2014, 08:30:15 AM
LOL...what!? Courtesy? His courtesy is to his team! If he choose to spend it with his team, that is his job and that is more important. You will "talk" later.
Many are 'salt wound fans.' They Looooovvveee to rub salt in wounds when things go south. There was nothing that Buzz could have said that you didn't see.
In fact, instead of having Buzz come out every game they should have some of the players come out every once and awhile. Buzz has a show.
No offense on Buzz. I love listening to Buzz, and think he is one of the brightest minds in college bball. I could hear his views on hoops all night. But as an out for himself, he can send some players out there to do the after game interview.
They are the ones who played. Why does Buzz always have to face the music? But this game he is entitled to coach his team and stay in the locker room. It is crazy to expect him to come out after that with another game up next.
Use your head. Why didn't he send # 0 or #54 out to talk to Homer and Jim?
Buzz faces no music. It is his way or the highway. Does not owe anything to the fans according to many on this board.
We all love listening to Buzz's downhome lonesome cowboy spiel. But you aren't going to hear it when mayhem is happening.
Quote from: willie warrior on February 02, 2014, 01:37:50 PM
Buzz faces no music. It is his way or the highway. Does not owe anything to the fans according to many on this board.
We all love listening to Buzz's downhome lonesome cowboy spiel. But you aren't going to hear it when mayhem is happening.
I've heard this from you many times. That Buzz "owes" the fans something. I've asked you before what exactly is owed to us but I haven't received an answer. The only thing I can think of is his best effort in coaching the team to victory and being an upstanding role model of the university. I feel like you think there is more that is "owed"
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on February 02, 2014, 11:54:46 PM
I've heard this from you many times. That Buzz "owes" the fans something. I've asked you before what exactly is owed to us but I haven't received an answer. The only thing I can think of is his best effort in coaching the team to victory and being an upstanding role model of the university. I feel like you think there is more that is "owed"
Explanations. Not excuses like 1.6 transfers; or "We" decided the RS for Duane was in everybody's best interest (now there is a safe statement--sorta like, we need to pass it to find out what is in it). When Buzz feels like not saying anything he does not. IMO, he owes the fans more as HC. By the way, how is that best effort in coaching the team working out this year? Other examples: Why did McKay transfer? What happened with Newbill? And the list goes on. Buzz needs to let us know what is going on. But then, if there are things that are not flattering to the image, it is best to not say anything.
So IMO he does owe the fans something. Others must think so also, judging by the comments about his no show at the post game presser. If you have a different opinion, fine. There I gave you an explanation---EVEN THOUGH YOU ARE NOT OWED ONE!!!!!!
Quote from: willie warrior on February 03, 2014, 12:12:01 PM
Buzz needs to let us know what is going on.
Why? That's the question you haven't answered. That's a great list of things you'd like to know, but the question is,
why does he owe you those answers?
Why does he need to et us know what's going on.
Quote from: willie warrior on February 03, 2014, 12:12:01 PM
Explanations. Not excuses like 1.6 transfers; or "We" decided the RS for Duane was in everybody's best interest (now there is a safe statement--sorta like, we need to pass it to find out what is in it). When Buzz feels like not saying anything he does not. IMO, he owes the fans more as HC. By the way, how is that best effort in coaching the team working out this year? Other examples: Why did McKay transfer? What happened with Newbill? And the list goes on. Buzz needs to let us know what is going on. But then, if there are things that are not flattering to the image, it is best to not say anything.
So IMO he does owe the fans something. Others must think so also, judging by the comments about his no show at the post game presser. If you have a different opinion, fine. There I gave you an explanation---EVEN THOUGH YOU ARE NOT OWED ONE!!!!!!
Do you have any idea how this compares to other coaches in Div 1? Your standard is insanely high and quite frankly Buzz provides more clarity and insight than any other coach I've seen. Just because you want to know the intimate details of how a RS was arrived at doesn't mean he should or even can provide that to you.
Side note, didn't Buzz no show a post game interview after an MU loss at Seton Hall or Providence? I think they went on to be a 6th seed in the tourney, but Buzz decided he wanted to have a heart to heart with the team. I suspect the same thing went on here.
Quote from: mu03eng on February 03, 2014, 12:28:48 PM
Do you have any idea how this compares to other coaches in Div 1? Your standard is insanely high and quite frankly Buzz provides more clarity and insight than any other coach I've seen. Just because you want to know the intimate details of how a RS was arrived at doesn't mean he should or even can provide that to you.
Side note, didn't Buzz no show a post game interview after an MU loss at Seton Hall or Providence? I think they went on to be a 6th seed in the tourney, but Buzz decided he wanted to have a heart to heart with the team. I suspect the same thing went on here.
Buzz's show with Homer should be interesting. Esp. if we have another bad effort tomorrow.
Quote from: ATWizJr on February 03, 2014, 01:02:26 PM
Buzz's show with Homer should be interesting. Esp. if we have another bad effort tomorrow.
Tomorrow will definitely be the tell. I'm curious to see the line-up and who gets the most minutes. Clearly Buzz benched JWil, Mayo, and partially Gardner. It will be interesting to see if that message carries over or if the players get it. Butler is a team they should beat at home pretty handily so could be a very interesting coaches show on Wednesday.
Quote from: mu03eng on February 03, 2014, 12:28:48 PM
Do you have any idea how this compares to other coaches in Div 1? Your standard is insanely high and quite frankly Buzz provides more clarity and insight than any other coach I've seen. Just because you want to know the intimate details of how a RS was arrived at doesn't mean he should or even can provide that to you.
Side note, didn't Buzz no show a post game interview after an MU loss at Seton Hall or Providence? I think they went on to be a 6th seed in the tourney, but Buzz decided he wanted to have a heart to heart with the team. I suspect the same thing went on here.
Do you? And sorry, but I disagree with your perception about clarity. He has not addressed the Du. Wilson issue satisfactorily. I used that as on example in response to your prior question. Do you really believe that comments such as De. Wilson is an elite defender, a game changer, and the best defender he has ever coached, when the contrary has shown through this year. Might as well agree to disagree on the great communication skills of Buzz.
Quote from: willie warrior on February 03, 2014, 02:58:12 PM
Do you? And sorry, but I disagree with your perception about clarity. He has not addressed the Du. Wilson issue satisfactorily.
Again, according to what standard exactly, and why are you entitled to determine that standard? You've been clear about what you feel you are owed, what you can't seem to explain is
why you feel you are owed it.
Quote from: NavinRJohnson on February 03, 2014, 12:19:50 PM
Why? That's the question you haven't answered. That's a great list of things you'd like to know, but the question is, why does he owe you those answers? Why does he need to et us know what's going on.
+1000
Quote from: NavinRJohnson on February 03, 2014, 04:25:14 PM
Again, according to what standard exactly, and why are you entitled to determine that standard? You've been clear about what you feel you are owed, what you can't seem to explain is why you feel you are owed it.
Did that already in several posts--but sorry you are not satisfied. And just like Buzz, you do not need further explanation. You are simply disgruntled that I do not agree with your view.
Quote from: NavinRJohnson on February 03, 2014, 04:25:14 PM
Again, according to what standard exactly, and why are you entitled to determine that standard? You've been clear about what you feel you are owed, what you can't seem to explain is why you feel you are owed it.
I would actually like examples of other coaches/programs where the "owed" or "fully explained" information was presented. That way, we all might, understand a little better.
Quote from: willie warrior on February 03, 2014, 12:12:01 PM
Explanations. Not excuses like 1.6 transfers; or "We" decided the RS for Duane was in everybody's best interest (now there is a safe statement--sorta like, we need to pass it to find out what is in it). When Buzz feels like not saying anything he does not. IMO, he owes the fans more as HC. By the way, how is that best effort in coaching the team working out this year? Other examples: Why did McKay transfer? What happened with Newbill? And the list goes on. Buzz needs to let us know what is going on. But then, if there are things that are not flattering to the image, it is best to not say anything.
So IMO he does owe the fans something. Others must think so also, judging by the comments about his no show at the post game presser. If you have a different opinion, fine. There I gave you an explanation---EVEN THOUGH YOU ARE NOT OWED ONE!!!!!!
Just so you know, Buzz is not allowed to comment on specifics when it comes to non-players such as McKay and Newbill. Duane he could have commented on but it is possible that Duane asked him not to. Or its possible that everything he said "redshirt is in Duane's and program's best interest" is all there is to it.
Quote from: willie warrior on February 03, 2014, 05:36:21 PM
Did that already in several posts--but sorry you are not satisfied.
No, actually you didn't...at all. If you'd like to point me to it, I'm all eyes. You've bitched and moaned about
what you'd like him to say more about, but have provided no rationale as to
why Buzz owes you an explanation.
Quote from: NavinRJohnson on February 03, 2014, 08:02:55 PM
No, actually you didn't...at all. If you'd like to point me to it, I'm all eyes. You've bitched and moaned about what you'd like him to say more about, but have provided no rationale as to why Buzz owes you an explanation.
I think it's because Buzz makes a lot of money. Maybe it's coming out of Willie's pocket.
Quote from: NavinRJohnson on February 03, 2014, 08:02:55 PM
No, actually you didn't...at all. If you'd like to point me to it, I'm all eyes. You've bitched and moaned about what you'd like him to say more about, but have provided no rationale as to why Buzz owes you an explanation.
Reading is fundamental. I have explained that he owes explanations to the fans, not just me, and why on several occasions. Do your own research.
I am with Willie that I do think fans deserve more or better information. Buzz has done a great job of protecting the kids and the program and that is both good and bad. If fans are left to fill in the blank too often they often lean to the worst outcome over the best. If not for the unknown reasons behind suspensions and relatively high number of transfers I would normally think of positives regarding MU.
I love Buzz, but wish he would open up a bit more when things go badly. Buzz has little trouble saying negative things about players as a rule, yet protects the program very hard when he feels fit. I do accept the fact Buzz is not changing and that is fine, but if too many unknowns it leaves too much room for rumors IMO.
Quote from: willie warrior on February 03, 2014, 02:58:12 PM
Do you? And sorry, but I disagree with your perception about clarity. He has not addressed the Du. Wilson issue satisfactorily. I used that as on example in response to your prior question. Do you really believe that comments such as De. Wilson is an elite defender, a game changer, and the best defender he has ever coached, when the contrary has shown through this year. Might as well agree to disagree on the great communication skills of Buzz.
I bet I have a better sense for it than you do, at least based on all your demands for information which are wildly unrealistic. I could site plenty of examples where other coaches at other schools have said far less about scenarios than Buzz has.
Hasn't explained the Du. Wilson situation? Do you want a Zapruder like break down of how the conversation went down? You really want Buzz to go into a detail walk through of the life and decision of an 18 year old kid? Really, that's caring for the whole person that Marquette's about? I can't even imagine what you would need to be "satisfied" with that "situation".
Are you a millennial? Are you just entitled to every bit of information ever? Would you like to know more, I bet so would I but that doesn't mean we can, should, or will know more. I'd love to be Buzz's best friend and know everything about the organization, but I don't see that happening any time soon.
I will say this, you should given some sort of award, I haven't seen trolling this hard in many a year.
Quote from: Goose on February 04, 2014, 07:30:58 AM
I love Buzz, but wish he would open up a bit more when things go badly. Buzz has little trouble saying negative things about players as a rule, yet protects the program very hard when he feels fit. I do accept the fact Buzz is not changing and that is fine, but if too many unknowns it leaves too much room for rumors IMO.
Has trouble saying negative things? He says negative things about the players all the time. He typically couches it a little bit, but he calls his players out in the press all the time. Remember all the times he called Gardner fat and out of shape? Or that Derrick Wilson can't shoot?
Just like this season in general, the amount of info Buzz puts out there is about expectation. You and Willie expect a completely open book and are disappointed when you don't get it, regardless of the fact that nobody else in Div 1 is an open book. If fact being an open book could hamper the team.
He missed one post game conference, let's see what happens after tonight's game, I'm betting he addresses the last post game in tonight's post game, but I could be wrong. We'll see but just because we spend time on an internet message board doesn't mean we deserve the inside track on MU basketball from the head coach.
Quote from: willie warrior on February 04, 2014, 07:03:59 AM
Reading is fundamental. I have explained that he owes explanations to the fans, not just me, and why on several occasions. Do your own research.
Typical internet dodge, act like you've said something that you actually haven't hoping the other person is just as lazy as you to take you at your word
Troll on
Quote from: willie warrior on February 04, 2014, 07:03:59 AM
I have explained that he owes explanations to the fans, not just me, and why on several occasions.
Lol! nice try. Youve made 14 posts since you were questioned on this yesterday, and yet you can't produce even a single sentence as to
why you feel you are entitled to what you feel you are entitled to.
mu03
I sais Buzz has little trouble saying negative things about players...we agree on that. I do not care if Buzz missed the post game talk one bit, thing happen. I am not in Willie's camp 100% on this by any stretch. However, I do think Buzz can be more open when things are not going right. All in all there is little I would want to see Buzz change about his style.
Quote from: Goose on February 04, 2014, 07:54:37 AM
mu03
I sais Buzz has little trouble saying negative things about players...we agree on that. I do not care if Buzz missed the post game talk one bit, thing happen. I am not in Willie's camp 100% on this by any stretch. However, I do think Buzz can be more open when things are not going right. All in all there is little I would want to see Buzz change about his style.
I guess I get what you are saying...and this will sound harsh, not meant to but can't think of another example....you want a little more "we suck, not a good team right now, we're trying to figure it out" from Buzz. I get that.
I think one of the things that is interesting in this whole thing is that it's a very interesting character study. One of Buzz's greatest strengths' is that he's got an us against the world mentality that drives him to out think, out hustle, and out recruit everyone....constantly proving that he and the team belong. However, when there is time for legitimate criticism I think that mentality serves to "bunker" Buzz. He circles the wagons as if it were a perceived slight not a reflection of reality. That then creates an incongruous media message.
I'm not saying this as an excuse, I'm saying it as something that fans and Buzz should both be aware of because at the end of the day we're all on the same side.
I'm not sure on the exact nature of the rules but there are several privacy laws that come into effect with student athletes. Some come into play from the NCAA, others from the state and federal government. In many of these situations, Buzz legally cannot say anymore than he is already saying. For example, when the sexual assault cases were going on, federal law prevented Buzz from making on comments on the ongoing cases.
Anyone with more expertise in this area care to share on what is/isn't allowed to be said by the coaches?
I guess knowing why Mayo did not play against UW or why Jamil sat the 2nd half would be nice to know. Several times on suspensions the announcers did not even know guys were suspended. Stated here many times we have had more suspensions in three years than the previous 40 years combined. If they are suspended for ticky tack stuff I am cool with that, but not knowing if it because of missing class or getting caught with weed makes folks talk.
Quote from: Goose on February 04, 2014, 08:47:19 AM
I guess knowing why Mayo did not play against UW or why Jamil sat the 2nd half would be nice to know. Several times on suspensions the announcers did not even know guys were suspended. Stated here many times we have had more suspensions in three years than the previous 40 years combined. If they are suspended for ticky tack stuff I am cool with that, but not knowing if it because of missing class or getting caught with weed makes folks talk.
Having a beat writer who was willing to get off his couch occasionally would probably help in this regard.
Quote from: Goose on February 04, 2014, 08:47:19 AM
I guess knowing why Mayo did not play against UW or why Jamil sat the 2nd half would be nice to know. Several times on suspensions the announcers did not even know guys were suspended. Stated here many times we have had more suspensions in three years than the previous 40 years combined. If they are suspended for ticky tack stuff I am cool with that, but not knowing if it because of missing class or getting caught with weed makes folks talk.
I thought the reason why Jamil & Todd didn't play in the 2nd half was pretty obvious to anyone who watched the 1st half.
Quote from: mu03eng on February 04, 2014, 08:02:43 AM
I guess I get what you are saying...and this will sound harsh, not meant to but can't think of another example....you want a little more "we suck, not a good team right now, we're trying to figure it out" from Buzz. I get that.
I think one of the things that is interesting in this whole thing is that it's a very interesting character study. One of Buzz's greatest strengths' is that he's got an us against the world mentality that drives him to out think, out hustle, and out recruit everyone....constantly proving that he and the team belong. However, when there is time for legitimate criticism I think that mentality serves to "bunker" Buzz. He circles the wagons as if it were a perceived slight not a reflection of reality. That then creates an incongruous media message.
I'm not saying this as an excuse, I'm saying it as something that fans and Buzz should both be aware of because at the end of the day we're all on the same side.
This is the most interesting thing written on this board in weeks.
For the record, I love Buzz, but the us vs them thing can only work for so long, right? Case in point, this year's team was the favorite, not the underdog, and the results have been disappointing.
It will be interesting to watch Buzz's evolution as a coach as he continues to have success.
Brandx
Are you serious? Jake and Derrick have horrible stints on the court and have not sat for entire halves of games. I have watched ball for quite some time and cannot say why they sat. If because of horrible play I think the coach is inconsistent in this case.
Quote from: Goose on February 04, 2014, 08:47:19 AM
I guess knowing why Mayo did not play against UW or why Jamil sat the 2nd half would be nice to know. Several times on suspensions the announcers did not even know guys were suspended. Stated here many times we have had more suspensions in three years than the previous 40 years combined. If they are suspended for ticky tack stuff I am cool with that, but not knowing if it because of missing class or getting caught with weed makes folks talk.
This is where I totally disagree with you. I don't think we should know these things. It's up to the adults in the administration and athletic department to make sure everything is legit. I don't want a 18-23 year kids business splashed all over the internet because he made a mistake. We as fans aren't owed that. You can make a case as a stakeholder in the university(as alumnus) that we have a vested interest in what's going on inside the team, but that's again why we have agents in the form of university administration and the athletic department.
Choices I made as a college student I wouldn't want splashed around, why should I expect any less of the student athletes?
And Navin is right, some of this vacuum is created(or perceived) because we have Jabba the Hutt running the media arm of what should be the most intrusive and independent segment of the information delivery machine.
Quote from: NavinRJohnson on February 04, 2014, 07:42:14 AM
Lol! nice try. Youve made 14 posts since you were questioned on this yesterday, and yet you can't produce even a single sentence as to why you feel you are entitled to what you feel you are entitled to.
The posts were not just yesterday, but over the last month or so. You are just lazy, so this is all you get.
Quote from: Goose on February 04, 2014, 09:50:03 AM
Brandx
Are you serious? Jake and Derrick have horrible stints on the court and have not sat for entire halves of games. I have watched ball for quite some time and cannot say why they sat. If because of horrible play I think the coach is inconsistent in this case.
Bingo....my guess - it's because Buzz damn well knows Derrick and Jake are limited in talent but are getting the most out of their talent, whereas Jamil and Todd are more talented but not maximizing. Jamil - can't say a whole lot as to what ails him this year - beyond being started with a lineup of Derrick, Jake, Juan and Otule for most of the season. Todd - Well, Buzz simply refuses to give him a consistent 30 to play through his mistakes....for the most part....only Jake and Derrick have been given the LONG leash this season...to be able to continue to play through crap performance.
Quote from: willie warrior on February 04, 2014, 10:48:31 AM
The posts were not just yesterday, but over the last month or so. You are just lazy, so this is all you get.
Translation: I have no answer.
Quote from: MUHoopsFan2 on February 02, 2014, 08:22:49 AM
For free didn't you watch the game yourself! What did you see!? He doesn't have to come tell us what went wrong. You have eyes.
Maybe he stayed in the locker room and saw fit to TELL AND COACH HIS TEAM ON WHAT WENT WRONG not us! For $2.8 mil I would have...and expect no less from him.
That is more important. If you want to know what went wrong watch his hour long coaches show...with a game right after his he was not obligated to come out and tell us anything.
After all the fans are the real experts and couch coaches, you know what went wrong. ;)
Wow, a lot here wrong.
You do not know why he did not show but guess he saw fit to tell and coach his team. Others guess he did not have the balls. Who knows-maybe the shadow.
Does he have an hour long TV show to watch? Was not aware. He does have an hour long radio program to listen to. I have listened to three this year, and he has been at least 20 minutes late to each, leaving Homer to fill the air time. Punctuality is not one of his virtues, and that shortens the hour considerably.
If he is not obligated to come out and tell people anything on a post game show, why the hell have one? I guess it is just Buzz being Buzz, or is it Manny being Manny? I can never remember.
We all should not expect Buzz to communicate with fans, because obviously that is not part of the University's job description or expectations of a 2.8 million dollar man.
Quote from: mu03eng on February 04, 2014, 07:38:04 AM
Has trouble saying negative things? He says negative things about the players all the time. He typically couches it a little bit, but he calls his players out in the press all the time. Remember all the times he called Gardner fat and out of shape? Or that Derrick Wilson can't shoot?
Just like this season in general, the amount of info Buzz puts out there is about expectation. You and Willie expect a completely open book and are disappointed when you don't get it, regardless of the fact that nobody else in Div 1 is an open book. If fact being an open book could hamper the team.
He missed one post game conference, let's see what happens after tonight's game, I'm betting he addresses the last post game in tonight's post game, but I could be wrong. We'll see but just because we spend time on an internet message board doesn't mean we deserve the inside track on MU basketball from the head coach.
You are correct, he does rip players for being fat or being unable to shoot, in the media. This is something I, for one, could do without. It makes him look like petty and I highly doubt it motivates anyone. I think the problem Willie and others have is Buzz doesn't ever disclose the "big stuff." The list is long of things people would like, but aren't going to get, a clarification on: Vander's fight and decision to leave, the sexual assault incident, every transfer situation, the infamous one game suspensions, etc.....I am not saying I agree with Willie, but it can be frustrating. It looks bad when he doesn't give whole truths. His lack of disclosure on things makes it look like he and the university are hiding things. I realize all programs do it, but it does rub people the wrong way. I also realize it is the nature of the business, but I have heard many alumni and season ticket holders complain about this, not to mention all the program "haters," like Badger fans and local sports media.
Buzz has to protect his, the kids and the programs best interests at all costs. Just the nature of the business
Quote from: Guns n Ammo on February 04, 2014, 09:48:45 AM
This is the most interesting thing written on this board in weeks.
For the record, I love Buzz, but the us vs them thing can only work for so long, right? Case in point, this year's team was the favorite, not the underdog, and the results have been disappointing.
It will be interesting to watch Buzz's evolution as a coach as he continues to have success.
I am curious most about this as well. I don't know if I'm projecting or just nervous because I think losing Buzz would be a bigger blow than losing Crean, but I get a sense he is very frustrated with the atmosphere of the fans. What will be interesting is how he responds to it, especially the fan consternation (some deserved, some not). It is a real character revealed moment for him, which I think he'll pass, but I get why he'd be frustrated. Everyone is "entitled" these days and I think that is reflected in the MU fan base that is calling for heads after a very mediocre season that isn't even over yet.
Quote from: mu03eng on February 04, 2014, 12:48:00 PM
I am curious most about this as well. I don't know if I'm projecting or just nervous because I think losing Buzz would be a bigger blow than losing Crean, but I get a sense he is very frustrated with the atmosphere of the fans. What will be interesting is how he responds to it, especially the fan consternation (some deserved, some not). It is a real character revealed moment for him, which I think he'll pass, but I get why he'd be frustrated. Everyone is "entitled" these days and I think that is reflected in the MU fan base that is calling for heads after a very mediocre season that isn't even over yet.
I haven't seen many heads called for, outside of one or two people on here. If Buzz goes on to a "bigger" job, the heat will be much worse than anything he's felt this season.
I'm a Buzz guy, but what I've seen this season has altered my view of him a bit. He hasn't helped things by deflecting blame on the unfair (round robin) schedule, and complaining about the fans. For a guy that has had a mantra of toughness while he's been here, I haven't seen that from him in the face of criticism.
This season hasn't been a good look on anyone; fans, players, or the coach.
Quote from: mu03eng on February 04, 2014, 12:48:00 PM
I am curious most about this as well. I don't know if I'm projecting or just nervous because I think losing Buzz would be a bigger blow than losing Crean, but I get a sense he is very frustrated with the atmosphere of the fans. What will be interesting is how he responds to it, especially the fan consternation (some deserved, some not). It is a real character revealed moment for him, which I think he'll pass, but I get why he'd be frustrated. Everyone is "entitled" these days and I think that is reflected in the MU fan base that is calling for heads after a very mediocre season that isn't even over yet.
Well, the problem, (at least for Buzz) is that every program has expectations, and when you don't meet them, this is what you get.
Buzz has developed a very fierce me vs them, us vs the world, underdog mentality. It has worked FANTASTICALLY for him to this point in his career.
However, I wonder how long he can burn that hot before he burns himself down.
I hope the guy takes a decent vacation this summer and gets some quality time with his family, which is something he hasn't allowed himself to do in the past. He's earned it. He should be able to step away and reset in every off season.
It will be interesting to see how the team performs if/when they are the favorite again (hopefully in a couple of years). Buzz might need to explore the different physiological approach with a team like that.
Quote from: NavinRJohnson on February 04, 2014, 11:00:12 AM
Translation: I have no answer.
translation: You are lazy and cannot read. Translation: Do your own research. Translation: You are dumbfounded.
Quote from: MUfan12 on February 04, 2014, 01:32:15 PM
I'm a Buzz guy, but what I've seen this season has altered my view of him a bit. He hasn't helped things by deflecting blame on the unfair (round robin) schedule, and complaining about the fans. For a guy that has had a mantra of toughness while he's been here, I haven't seen that from him in the face of criticism.
Buzz has always had thin-skin when it comes to fans booing and such. He complained about it back in February of 2011, after losses at home to Cincy & St. Johns. There's nothing new here.
Quote from: Guns n Ammo on February 04, 2014, 01:40:07 PM
Well, the problem, (at least for Buzz) is that every program has expectations, and when you don't meet them, this is what you get.
Buzz has developed a very fierce me vs them, us vs the world, underdog mentality. It has worked FANTASTICALLY for him to this point in his career.
However, I wonder how long he can burn that hot before he burns himself down.
I hope the guy takes a decent vacation this summer and gets some quality time with his family, which is something he hasn't allowed himself to do in the past. He's earned it. He should be able to step away and reset in every off season.
It will be interesting to see how the team performs if/when they are the favorite again (hopefully in a couple of years). Buzz might need to explore the different physiological approach with a team like that.
You and I are in complete agreement. I also would strongly recommend that for the fan base in general and for Scoopers in specific. Seriously, as a fan base we need to reflect on our attitude and expectation level. Yes, this is a disappointing season, but if we were ever to have a below average season (this season is average for Div 1) let alone a bad season I just can't imagine what things would be like.
I get debate on the message board and disagreements as to plans and strategy, but I get the sense that there are some on here who legitimately think Buzz is on the hot seat after this season.
Quote from: mu03eng on February 04, 2014, 01:53:39 PM
I get debate on the message board and disagreements as to plans and strategy, but I get the sense that there are some on here who legitimately think Buzz is on the hot seat after this season.
I hope nobody is thinking that.
Also, I hope Buzz's bosses at MU are instilling confidence in him and the work he's doing.
Quote from: Goose on February 04, 2014, 09:50:03 AM
Brandx
Are you serious? Jake and Derrick have horrible stints on the court and have not sat for entire halves of games. I have watched ball for quite some time and cannot say why they sat. If because of horrible play I think the coach is inconsistent in this case.
Todd played for 12 minutes and was awful. No points, no assists, no rebounds. His one contribution (a steal) became a negative (offensive foul). Add one flagrant foul and four TOs to the mix and I can't imagine 12 worse minutes. Dylan Flood would have been better. He got what he deserved in the 2nd half - a seat on the bench. Jamil was really bad also - not epic bad like Todd, but really bad. And it's not the first time our leader went missing in a big game. Buzz sent him a message - probably won't work, but nothing else has either.
Quote from: Lennys Tap on February 04, 2014, 02:08:08 PM
Todd played for 12 minutes and was awful. No points, no assists, no rebounds. His one contribution (a steal) became a negative (offensive foul). Add one flagrant foul and four TOs to the mix and I can't imagine 12 worse minutes. Dylan Flood would have been better. He got what he deserved in the 2nd half - a seat on the bench. Jamil was really bad also - not epic bad like Todd, but really bad. And it's not the first time our leader went missing in a big game. Buzz sent him a message - probably won't work, but nothing else has either.
If I had to guess (and I don't), Buzz didn't bench those guys simply because of poor play (though that would have been warranted). I suspect that they were benched for some combination of the following things...
- lack of focus
- lack of effort
- lack of taking direction
- defensive lapses
- repeated mistakes that had been harped on in practice
Quote from: MerrittsMustache on February 04, 2014, 02:24:13 PM
If I had to guess (and I don't), Buzz didn't bench those guys simply because of poor play (though that would have been warranted). I suspect that they were benched for some combination of the following things...
- lack of focus
- lack of effort
- lack of taking direction
- defensive lapses
- repeated mistakes that had been harped on in practice
+1 They were benched for those exact reasons. They all deserved to be benched....Buzz was sending a message.
The question then needs to be asked if Buzz has lost this team for the remainder of the season. The things you listed above should never happen to Juniors and Seniors.
Senioritis is a common malady.
Quote from: BenCat12 on February 04, 2014, 11:29:16 AM
I think the problem Willie and others have is Buzz doesn't ever disclose the "big stuff." The list is long of things people would like, but aren't going to get, a clarification on: Vander's fight and decision to leave, the sexual assault incident, every transfer situation, the infamous one game suspensions, etc.....I am not saying I agree with Willie, but it can be frustrating. It looks bad when he doesn't give whole truths. His lack of disclosure on things makes it look like he and the university are hiding things. I realize all programs do it, but it does rub people the wrong way. I also realize it is the nature of the business, but I have heard many alumni and season ticket holders complain about this, not to mention all the program "haters," like Badger fans and local sports media.
Buzz has to protect his, the kids and the programs best interests at all costs. Just the nature of the business
I can't comment on everything but I can offer what I know as an administrator at a major university:
Vander's fight: Buzz cannot legally say anything about the matter. Vander is protected by Family Education Rights and Privacy Act (FERPA).
Vander's departure: I believe he can comment on this and did repeatedly. Said it was the best decision for Vander and his family. Still texts Vander weekly.
The Sexual Assault Incidents: The victim is protected by several privacy laws and the players are protected by FERPA. Buzz would have been sued multiple times for all he was worth and could have faced termination or even jail time if he muttered so much as a peep about the situations.
Transfer situations: I'm not sure on this but I believe the NCAA has some rules on what coaches can and cannot say about former players who have left the program. Even if there aren't rules, statements probably could negatively impact recruiting. Transparency is not worth this cost.
One game suspensions: "Violations of team rules" are considered conduct incidents and thus are protected by FERPA. Buzz is legally not allowed to reveal reasons for a suspension without WRITTEN consent of all players involved. Buzz is also not allowed to ask players to give consent as it is considered in an improper use of authority.
I get the frustration, but y'all are asking for things that Buzz cannot legally supply. Your beef isn't with him, it's with the NCAA and the federal government. And let me tell you, every single one of you should be grateful for these laws. Would you really want any old person (say an employer or a business rival) be able to have open access to all the stupid crap you did when you were a college student?
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on February 04, 2014, 04:15:58 PM
I can't comment on everything but I can offer what I know as an administrator at a major university:
Vander's fight: Buzz cannot legally say anything about the matter. Vander is protected by Family Education Rights and Privacy Act (FERPA).
Vander's departure: I believe he can comment on this and did repeatedly. Said it was the best decision for Vander and his family. Still texts Vander weekly.
The Sexual Assault Incidents: The victim is protected by several privacy laws and the players are protected by FERPA. Buzz would have been sued multiple times for all he was worth and could have faced termination or even jail time if he muttered so much as a peep about the situations.
Transfer situations: I'm not sure on this but I believe the NCAA has some rules on what coaches can and cannot say about former players who have left the program. Even if there aren't rules, statements probably could negatively impact recruiting. Transparency is not worth this cost.
One game suspensions: "Violations of team rules" are considered conduct incidents and thus are protected by FERPA. Buzz is legally not allowed to reveal reasons for a suspension without WRITTEN consent of all players involved. Buzz is also not allowed to ask players to give consent as it is considered in an improper use of authority.
I get the frustration, but y'all are asking for things that Buzz cannot legally supply. Your beef isn't with him, it's with the NCAA and the federal government. And let me tell you, every single one of you should be grateful for these laws. Would you really want any old person (say an employer or a business rival) be able to have open access to all the stupid crap you did when you were a college student?
Thanks for the input, I do appreciate it. I didn't realize there are so many laws protecting players.
I understand why Buzz can't disclose more information, he is protecting his program and apparently abiding by the law.
So yes my beef and others beef is definitely with the NCAA and the government....who'd-a-thought! Doesn't make it any less frustrating. I still believe he could handle the situations better without violating laws, but I understand your point. Thanks again.
Quote from: Lennys Tap on February 04, 2014, 02:08:08 PM
Todd played for 12 minutes and was awful. No points, no assists, no rebounds. His one contribution (a steal) became a negative (offensive foul). Add one flagrant foul and four TOs to the mix and I can't imagine 12 worse minutes. Dylan Flood would have been better. He got what he deserved in the 2nd half - a seat on the bench. Jamil was really bad also - not epic bad like Todd, but really bad. And it's not the first time our leader went missing in a big game. Buzz sent him a message - probably won't work, but nothing else has either.
I expect both to play much better tonite - and by that I mean greater effort which will produce much better results. I have no doubt that Buzz made it quite clear than their effort was unsatisfactory.
Quote from: Goose on February 04, 2014, 09:50:03 AM
Brandx
Are you serious? Jake and Derrick have horrible stints on the court and have not sat for entire halves of games. I have watched ball for quite some time and cannot say why they sat. If because of horrible play I think the coach is inconsistent in this case.
Yes, I am. But, I am not talking about the results - any player can have a game where things don't go right. I'm talking about their effort. Jake and Derrick have obviously had some bad games, but I would challenge you to find a play where they didn't give 100% on either end of the floor.
Quote from: MerrittsMustache on February 04, 2014, 02:24:13 PM
If I had to guess (and I don't), Buzz didn't bench those guys simply because of poor play (though that would have been warranted). I suspect that they were benched for some combination of the following things...
- lack of focus
- lack of effort
- lack of taking direction
- defensive lapses
- repeated mistakes that had been harped on in practice
It has been mentioned that Jamil had the flu. If it is true, it would explain his apparent lack of effort.
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on February 04, 2014, 04:15:58 PM
I can't comment on everything but I can offer what I know as an administrator at a major university:
Vander's fight: Buzz cannot legally say anything about the matter. Vander is protected by Family Education Rights and Privacy Act (FERPA).
Vander's departure: I believe he can comment on this and did repeatedly. Said it was the best decision for Vander and his family. Still texts Vander weekly.
The Sexual Assault Incidents: The victim is protected by several privacy laws and the players are protected by FERPA. Buzz would have been sued multiple times for all he was worth and could have faced termination or even jail time if he muttered so much as a peep about the situations.
Transfer situations: I'm not sure on this but I believe the NCAA has some rules on what coaches can and cannot say about former players who have left the program. Even if there aren't rules, statements probably could negatively impact recruiting. Transparency is not worth this cost.
One game suspensions: "Violations of team rules" are considered conduct incidents and thus are protected by FERPA. Buzz is legally not allowed to reveal reasons for a suspension without WRITTEN consent of all players involved. Buzz is also not allowed to ask players to give consent as it is considered in an improper use of authority.
I get the frustration, but y'all are asking for things that Buzz cannot legally supply. Your beef isn't with him, it's with the NCAA and the federal government. And let me tell you, every single one of you should be grateful for these laws. Would you really want any old person (say an employer or a business rival) be able to have open access to all the stupid crap you did when you were a college student?
Should be pinned at the top of this board for everyone who complains about what Buzz does and doesn't say.
So......
What do you think Buzz is going to say? ;)
Juan and Steve did not have good practice this week.
Quote from: brandx on February 04, 2014, 04:27:22 PM
I expect both to play much better tonite - and by that I mean greater effort which will produce much better results. I have no doubt that Buzz made it quite clear than their effort was unsatisfactory.
Not to blow my own horn about Mayo & Wilson, but....
Buzz put them on the bench and left them there against St. John's for a reason. Play hard and play smart or sit.