Good lord, I have no idea.
If I was Buzz, about the only thing I would do would be to bench my seniors and begin playing my core for next year. Get Steve Taylor Jr., some time if he is healthy, Play Jujuan, Deonte and maybe Todd a LOT. Give Juan enough time to see if he has it. Time for Jake and Jamal to have a seat.
To use a baseball analogy, we're at September 8 and we're 10 games out of first place with four teams in front of us. The season is a loss. Let's begin planning for next year and hope for something better.
Quote from: dgies9156 on January 18, 2014, 06:05:33 PM
Good lord, I have no idea.
If I was Buzz, about the only thing I would do would be to bench my seniors and begin playing my core for next year. Get Steve Taylor Jr., some time if he is healthy, Play Jujuan, Deonte and maybe Todd a LOT. Give Juan enough time to see if he has it. Time for Jake and Jamal to have a seat.
To use a baseball analogy, we're at September 8 and we're 10 games out of first place with four teams in front of us. The season is a loss. Let's begin planning for next year and hope for something better.
Ditto
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uepFO4psgKE
Quote from: dgies9156 on January 18, 2014, 06:05:33 PM
Good lord, I have no idea.
If I was Buzz, about the only thing I would do would be to bench my seniors and begin playing my core for next year. Get Steve Taylor Jr., some time if he is healthy, Play Jujuan, Deonte and maybe Todd a LOT. Give Juan enough time to see if he has it. Time for Jake and Jamal to have a seat.
To use a baseball analogy, we're at September 8 and we're 10 games out of first place with four teams in front of us. The season is a loss. Let's begin planning for next year and hope for something better.
We can afford three more losses before we are out of the tournament picture. Until then, we play to win now.
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on January 18, 2014, 06:34:39 PM
We can afford three more losses before we are out of the tournament picture. Until then, we play to win now.
Most certainly agree with being able to afford three more losses; however, the Warriors are "trending" the wrong way (choke), and if nothing is changed, they will continue to fade away the last 10 minutes of close games.
I agree with the original post. It's time to play for next season.
Quote from: dgies9156 on January 18, 2014, 06:05:33 PM
Good lord, I have no idea.
If I was Buzz, about the only thing I would do would be to bench my seniors and begin playing my core for next year. Get Steve Taylor Jr., some time if he is healthy, Play Jujuan, Deonte and maybe Todd a LOT. Give Juan enough time to see if he has it. Time for Jake and Jamal to have a seat.
To use a baseball analogy, we're at September 8 and we're 10 games out of first place with four teams in front of us. The season is a loss. Let's begin planning for next year and hope for something better.
at least pull the whole gang out and do a hockey lineup change if they don't get a basket during a 4 minute period between time outs.
You go out and try to win the next game. That's what you do.
All of this play for next year talk is just silly. How exactly do you do that. Johnson is hurt. Taylor is obviously not healthy. Fact is, you still need to have 5 guys out there for 40 minutes.
Like it or not, playing for next year would really be about guys like Derrik Wilson and Juan Anderson. They aren't going anywhere and are going to (should) be expected to contribute next season.
This is not MLB where you can trade away veterans and bring up prospects. Wholesale line up changes simly aren't realistic.
Quote from: NavinRJohnson on January 19, 2014, 09:59:07 AM
You go out and try to win the next game. That's what you do.
All of this play for next year talk is just silly. How exactly do you do that. Johnson is hurt. Taylor is obviously not healthy. Fact is, you still need to have 5 guys out there for 40 minutes.
Like it or not, playing for next year would really be about guys like Derrik Wilson and Juan Anderson. They aren't going anywhere and are going to (should) be expected to contribute next season.
This is not MLB where you can trade away veterans and bring up prospects. Wholesale line up changes simly aren't realistic.
Correct. Plan A is trying to win the next game. As others have said, this season is not over, and expecting Buzz to throw in the towel is disappointing and unrealistic.
And playing for next season - like it or not - starts with the Juniors who will be Seniors. Derrick, Juan and Todd will be the core of next year's team, so even if we start playing for next season, it likely means that Derrick continues to get huge minutes, and Todd and Juan play more. Yes, the younger players would also get more minutes if we start to play for next year, but they would NOT get those minutes at the expense of players who will still be here. The guys who would sit would be Jake, Jamil, Chris and yes, even Davante.
Accept the fact the NCAA is gone this year & hope we can make the NIT.
My God, the NCAA is not lost. If we continue to lose like this, then yes, it is gone. But all we need is to go 10-3 the rest of the way. Until we lose that 4th game, fans shouldn't give up. And even if we do, there is still the BET.
You can give up if you want to, that's your prerogative, but don't ask the team to give up on the year and "play for next year"
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on January 19, 2014, 11:26:55 AM
My God, the NCAA is not lost. If we continue to lose like this, then yes, it is gone. But all we need is to go 10-3 the rest of the way. Until we lose that 4th game, fans shouldn't give up. And even if we do, there is still the BET.
You can give up if you want to, that's your prerogative, but don't ask the team to give up on the year and "play for next year"
No sh*t. So many Debbie downers and sallies in this board. Does a NCAA at large look likely right now? No. But a 12-6 record gets them an at large of they don't go 1 and done in NYC. And even if the boys continue to dissappint and finish up 10-8 or 9-9 in conference, there is still the BIg East tournament. So no, you don't throw in the towel. There are no fu*king draft picks in college basketball, and the majority of conference play is still on the table. Man up.
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on January 19, 2014, 11:26:55 AM
My God, the NCAA is not lost. If we continue to lose like this, then yes, it is gone. But all we need is to go 10-3 the rest of the way. Until we lose that 4th game, fans shouldn't give up. And even if we do, there is still the BET.
You can give up if you want to, that's your prerogative, but don't ask the team to give up on the year and "play for next year"
this team 10-3 that would mean beating villanova twice, creighton and xavier... not happening that........... 8-5 is more a reality and thats even a stretch...
Quote from: Nevada233 on January 19, 2014, 11:37:10 AM
this team 10-3 that would mean beating villanova twice, creighton and xavier... not happening that........... 8-5 is more a reality and thats even a stretch...
How do you figure? If this team beats Nova twice, CU and X, I like their chances of going better than 10-3. I don't thinks that's gonna happen, but your logic sucks.
I find it laughable that anyone who has watched this team play 17 games can think that we have a chance to go to the NCAA. If there was progression and we were getting better I would feel differently but we were at a point where beating a 0-5 team on the road would have been a "signature win" and we lost. We have had 8 chances to beat good-decent teams and lost every game. Our best wins were at home against DePaul and Seton Hall. Buzz is looking at a rebuilding project.
Quote from: JamilJaeJamailJrJuan on January 19, 2014, 11:42:07 AM
How do you figure? If this team beats Nova twice, CU and X, I like their chances of going better than 10-3. I don't thinks that's gonna happen, but your logic sucks.
If you think this team is going to beat Villanova 2x, CU and X who are a combined 49-7 this year....... you must have your Blue and Gold lenses on... that Wont happen... logic or not... unless D. Wade is coming back and bringing Wes Matthews, Jae Crowder, Jimmy Butler and DJO with him.....
Quote from: Nevada233 on January 19, 2014, 12:29:39 PM
If you think this team is going to beat Villanova 2x, CU and X who are a combined 49-7 this year....... you must have your Blue and Gold lenses on... that Wont happen... logic or not... unless D. Wade is coming back and bringing Wes Matthews, Jae Crowder, Jimmy Butler and DJO with him.....
Off our most recent performance, I don't see a guaranteed win the rest of the way.
Quote from: ATWizJr on January 19, 2014, 12:33:09 PM
Off our most recent performance, I don't see a guaranteed win the rest of the way.
If you were here, Tom, I would pour you a stiff one. This figures to be a long year. I guess we were due.
Quote from: Nevada233 on January 19, 2014, 12:29:39 PM
If you think this team is going to beat Villanova 2x, CU and X who are a combined 49-7 this year....... you must have your Blue and Gold lenses on... that Wont happen... logic or not... unless D. Wade is coming back and bringing Wes Matthews, Jae Crowder, Jimmy Butler and DJO with him.....
I clearly stated I don't think that is going to happen. What I did say is that they don't need to beat Nova 2x, CU and X to go 10-3 in the last 13.
Quote from: Superfan on January 19, 2014, 12:11:36 PM
I find it laughable that anyone who has watched this team play 17 games can think that we have a chance to go to the NCAA. If there was progression and we were getting better I would feel differently but we were at a point where beating a 0-5 team on the road would have been a "signature win" and we lost. We have had 8 chances to beat good-decent teams and lost every game. Our best wins were at home against DePaul and Seton Hall. Buzz is looking at a rebuilding project.
Thank you for speaking the truth.
Let's begin now so that the mistakes that are far too common now are rare next year. That comes with experience. Experience that John Dawson, Jujuan, et al don't have. If Steve is injured, OK, then we should have red shirted him (and perhaps we might still be able to petition the NCAA).
I've watched Marquette basketball since the 1960s and have followed it closely since then. I've also been a big college basketball fan since that time as well. I see nothing in this team that suggests we're post-season candidates and even if we are, I'm not sure "one-and-done" is worth sacrificing the future for.
For you Biz-Ad majors, it's a present value equation. We sit Jamil, Chris et al now and make our mistakes today in hopes that 2014-2015 and 2015-2016 will be glory years. Play who we think will be the core of our future and let them make their mistakes when it DOES NOT MATTER! Perhaps they have more skill and maturity than we think!
Quote from: downtown85 on January 19, 2014, 09:38:47 AM
at least pull the whole gang out and do a hockey lineup change if they don't get a basket during a 4 minute period between time outs.
Scrambled Eggs!!
Quote from: Superfan on January 19, 2014, 12:11:36 PM
I find it laughable that anyone who has watched this team play 17 games can think that we have a chance to go to the NCAA. If there was progression and we were getting better I would feel differently but we were at a point where beating a 0-5 team on the road would have been a "signature win" and we lost. We have had 8 chances to beat good-decent teams and lost every game. Our best wins were at home against DePaul and Seton Hall. Buzz is looking at a rebuilding project.
This. No question Marquette is shaping up as a big disappointment this season.
Play for the future, play the frosh and STJ and build up for next year since I don't even think the CBI wants this squad
Quote from: muwarrior97 on January 19, 2014, 03:20:34 PM
Play for the future, play the frosh and STJ and build up for next year since I don't even think the CBI wants this squad
Good plan. JJJ and Taylor are both hurt. When Burton and Dawson foul out with 15 minutes to play, then what? Time to quit searching for easy answers the current roster simply won't support.
Quote from: dgies9156 on January 19, 2014, 01:27:25 PM
Thank you for speaking the truth.
Let's begin now so that the mistakes that are far too common now are rare next year. That comes with experience. Experience that John Dawson, Jujuan, et al don't have. If Steve is injured, OK, then we should have red shirted him (and perhaps we might still be able to petition the NCAA).
I've watched Marquette basketball since the 1960s and have followed it closely since then. I've also been a big college basketball fan since that time as well. I see nothing in this team that suggests we're post-season candidates and even if we are, I'm not sure "one-and-done" is worth sacrificing the future for.
For you Biz-Ad majors, it's a present value equation. We sit Jamil, Chris et al now and make our mistakes today in hopes that 2014-2015 and 2015-2016 will be glory years. Play who we think will be the core of our future and let them make their mistakes when it DOES NOT MATTER! Perhaps they have more skill and maturity than we think!
If that is the take-away you are getting from your education, it makes me wonder what they are teaching students. I would contend that if you could construct a present value equation that took into consideration all the effects and variables at play that you would see that sticking with the veteran players that give you the best chance to win now is the best long term value.
The problem with any equation/model is if you do not include the appropriate number of variables you can get an incorrect result.
My god again. We are 5 games into an 18 game conference schedule. We are a 2-3 in conference with two of those losses being two of our most brutal road games. And playing at Hinkle isn't easy either. I'm greatly disappointed in those who are willing to give up so early in the season. Have doubts? Sure. Be pessimistic? I can accept that. But to actually say give up on this season is pretty pathetic
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on January 19, 2014, 04:45:32 PM
My god again. We are 5 games into an 18 game conference schedule. We are a 2-3 in conference with two of those losses being two of our most brutal road games. And playing at Hinkle isn't easy either. I'm greatly disappointed in those who are willing to give up so early in the season. Have doubts? Sure. Be pessimistic? I can accept that. But to actually say give up on this season is pretty pathetic
What have you seen to suggest otherwise? I'm all eyes on this one!
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on January 19, 2014, 04:45:32 PM
My god again. We are 5 games into an 18 game conference schedule. We are a 2-3 in conference with two of those losses being two of our most brutal road games. And playing at Hinkle isn't easy either. I'm greatly disappointed in those who are willing to give up so early in the season. Have doubts? Sure. Be pessimistic? I can accept that. But to actually say give up on this season is pretty pathetic
Yet DePaul was somehow able to beat Butler at Hinkle in OT. DePaul just got drilled by 30 against Nova. Our best wins for the year are George Washington (respectable), Seton Hall, and DePaul. Do you see improvement in this team?? They don't appear to be trending the right way. We just had a whole week of practice with no games....coming off XMas break with no class....and were desperate to win a game. If there ever was a game we should have won - it was this one at 0-5 Butler.
I can appreciate your optimism TAMU - I generally am one with MU hoops as well - and used to catch hell here for being so optimistic. Yet this year, I just don't see anything to be optimistic about until Buzz bites the bullet and rolls with Dawson, Burton and Mayo for 25+ per game. Derrick and Jake getting nearly 30 minutes a game is a formula for disaster, which is what this season has been.
Quote from: dgies9156 on January 19, 2014, 05:32:47 PM
What have you seen to suggest otherwise? I'm all eyes on this one!
I'm not sure what you mean by this. But I assume it's along the lines of how you can have any hope? Simple, 20-11 is what I see as the minimum record for us to get an at large bid. I have faith in my team because I am a fan, and that is what fans do. For me, the Brewers are going to win the Series every season until they are mathematically eliminated. Some may call that naive but I call it being a good fan. I could sit here and b!tch and moan about how our team isn't living up to our expectations but I'd rather be optimistic and think that my team is going to pull it together.
As far as I am concerned, Marquette is going 13-0 the rest of the season. I'll probably be wrong but I'd rather be the fan who was faithful to the end instead of wanting to ditch 5 games into the conference season
The only way this team has a prayer of making the NCAA tourney is if the ghost of Dean Meminger shows up in a Derrick Wilson suit.
Have him bring along Lucas, McNeil, Whitehead, and Rosie.
Quote from: Boone on January 18, 2014, 06:12:37 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uepFO4psgKE
Well played, John.
Another great line from Bluto: "Did we give up after the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor?"
The sky is presently filled with Messerschmitts and Stukas...
(http://www.aviation-history.com/messerschmitt/109e3.jpg)
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on January 19, 2014, 06:52:08 PM
I'm not sure what you mean by this. But I assume it's along the lines of how you can have any hope? Simple, 20-11 is what I see as the minimum record for us to get an at large bid. I have faith in my team because I am a fan, and that is what fans do. For me, the Brewers are going to win the Series every season until they are mathematically eliminated. Some may call that naive but I call it being a good fan. I could sit here and b!tch and moan about how our team isn't living up to our expectations but I'd rather be optimistic and think that my team is going to pull it together.
As far as I am concerned, Marquette is going 13-0 the rest of the season. I'll probably be wrong but I'd rather be the fan who was faithful to the end instead of wanting to ditch 5 games into the conference season
Wow! Prefer fantasyland instead of realville. Ok...? At least I know why you have your point of view on Derrick now.
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on January 19, 2014, 06:52:08 PM
I'm not sure what you mean by this. But I assume it's along the lines of how you can have any hope? Simple, 20-11 is what I see as the minimum record for us to get an at large bid. I have faith in my team because I am a fan, and that is what fans do. For me, the Brewers are going to win the Series every season until they are mathematically eliminated.
Eagle, I appreciate your loyalty and I used to feel that way. Maybe this year I'm a bit jaundiced because I expected Todd Mayo to step up and make us ask, "Vander Who?" I didn't expect anyone to replace Junior but I hoped we would come close.
I have no hope because I think Jamil would rather shoot from Wauwatosa than drive the basket. Because neither Mayo, Jake or anyone else seems willing to penetrate and score. I see little senior leadership and a lot of excuses. Everytime we have a "must win," we have a "gee failed again moment."
If you see us going 13-0 the rest, wonderful. But remember, smoking that weed is still illegal in Wisconsin!
The only thing left to do is Pray!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=2NXHrc080-E#t=0
Quote from: NotAnAlum on January 19, 2014, 09:55:14 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=2NXHrc080-E#t=0
St. Jude, Pray for Us.
What you would do or I would do is immaterial.
This just in: Buzz Williams is a coach, and coaches simply do not think along these lines.
I, for one, wouldn't want a coach to give up on a season with his team 2-3 and 13 conference games to play.
Of course, we are fans. And these sites are made just for this type of conversation. So go at it if it makes you feel better.
Just be aware that Buzz isn't gonna wake up tomorrow and say: "The season is lost. I'm playing for next year. Dawson, Burton and JJJ are starting against Georgetown; Derrick, Jake and Otule will be lucky to get 5 minutes each."
Not.
Gonna.
Happen.
Quote from: dgies9156 on January 18, 2014, 06:05:33 PM
Good lord, I have no idea.
If I was Buzz, about the only thing I would do would be to bench my seniors and begin playing my core for next year. Get Steve Taylor Jr., some time if he is healthy, Play Jujuan, Deonte and maybe Todd a LOT. Give Juan enough time to see if he has it. Time for Jake and Jamal to have a seat.
To use a baseball analogy, we're at September 8 and we're 10 games out of first place with four teams in front of us. The season is a loss. Let's begin planning for next year and hope for something better.
I know that coaches dont think like this, but start dawson, burton, and maybe jjj so that they can work out the kinks before the BE tourney rolls around. We may still have a chance
Quote from: MU82 on January 19, 2014, 10:04:40 PM
What you would do or I would do is immaterial.
This just in: Buzz Williams is a coach, and coaches simply do not think along these lines.
I, for one, wouldn't want a coach to give up on a season with his team 2-3 and 13 conference games to play.
There was a song by REO Speedwagon from my days in Schroeder,
Keep Pushin (http://s.mlkshk.com/r/54DT)
Quote from: Sunbelt15 on January 19, 2014, 08:13:16 PM
Wow! Prefer fantasyland instead of realville. Ok...? At least I know why you have your point of view on Derrick now.
Oh I am very aware of how terrible our team usually is. And I can list every one of Derrick's deficiencies in detail. I think he is the worst Marquette PG since we joined the Big East. Please, I'm not blind.
But I also have seen this team pull together. We demolished a very good George Washington team and have had some moments where we look unbeatable. If that team shows up,we could go 13-0.
I would rather hope that the team that played George Washington will show up and stay for the rest of the season. Probably not going to happen, but it could. And I know it is better for my health. Plus, if we do go on a 13-0 run, I get the satisfaction of knowing that I never gave up on this team. What do the people who gave up on the team 5 games in get? Satisfaction for being right? That's fine, I guess, but your team still sucked all season. Who wants that kind of satisfaction?
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on January 19, 2014, 11:56:01 PM
Oh I am very aware of how terrible our team usually is. And I can list every one of Derrick's deficiencies in detail. I think he is the worst Marquette PG since we joined the Big East. Please, I'm not blind.
But I also have seen this team pull together. We demolished a very good George Washington team and have had some moments where we look unbeatable. If that team shows up,we could go 13-0.
I would rather hope that the team that played George Washington will show up and stay for the rest of the season. Probably not going to happen, but it could. And I know it is better for my health. Plus, if we do go on a 13-0 run, I get the satisfaction of knowing that I never gave up on this team. What do the people who gave up on the team 5 games in get? Satisfaction for being right? That's fine, I guess, but your team still sucked all season. Who wants that kind of satisfaction?
Just as you overestimate this team's potential for this season I believe you seriously underestimate the loyalty of many of us here. I've been supporting this team since Larry McNeill's wife was slapping ushers in the stands.
And as long as Andy Friedrich's been bangin' Terry Meeuwsen.
Quote from: keefe on January 20, 2014, 12:28:05 AM
Just as you overestimate this team's potential for this season I believe you seriously underestimate the loyalty of many of us here. I've been supporting this team since Larry McNeill's wife was slapping ushers in the stands.
Thank you Keefe.
I've been following Marquette since I was in grade school in Tennessee in 1965. My Marquette roots span multiple generations and we were always indoctrinated in the goodness of our university and our basketball team.
I remember when Walt Frazier took us down in the NIT. Or the Cobb free throw. Or our guys getting roughed up in South Carolina by bigoted white dudes. Guess what, we got even in a very nasty but very needed fight. I was on campus when we won the national title and shocked into reality when we lost of Rubesville of Ohio a year later.
I watched us kill the University of Tennessee in the early 1970s and change that school's basketball forever. A year after we killed 'em, they recruited a street-baller named Bernard King and took us into double overtime before we won.
I stayed with 'em through the Dukiet era, through the Deane era and have introduced my children to the joys of MU basketball -- like my Dad before me. I rejoiced in the shock of last year's eventual win over Davidson and thought the Butler and Miami games were indicative of what we could be.
I want badly to be wrong on my feeling about this year's team -- like I was on Buzz a few years back. I want us in the NCAA and if we make it, I'll probably go. But I'm also realistic and of all the teams that I've seen since 1965, this one may be the most disappointing. It's sad to see so much talent go bad the way it has. It's sad to think that Jamil is another Bernard Toone, both of whom were among the biggest wasters of basketball talent ever.
I hope I am wrong about this year because I want to believe. I just don't!
Quote from: keefe on January 20, 2014, 12:28:05 AM
Just as you overestimate this team's potential for this season I believe you seriously underestimate the loyalty of many of us here. I've been supporting this team since Larry McNeill's wife was slapping ushers in the stands.
I'm not underestimating anyone's loyalty. I know everyone here bleeds blue and gold. We are simply different kind of fans. I am forever the optimist despite knowing what limitations are team has. Others are the realists despite knowing what potential is there. Don't call me disillusioned and I won't call you fairweather