Barnes, Henson and Marshall are saying so long to Chapel Hill.
In the end, these superstars helped UNC get one game further than Marquette each of the last two years.
Add them to Austin Rivers, who spurned his daddy's alma mater to go to Duke and is a one-and-done with fewer NCAA tourney wins than Juan Anderson.
Not saying I wouldn't have wanted all of them. Of course I'd want them and any other star recruit I could get. Just reiterating what we all already know: There are no guarantees.
Getting all worked up about recruiting is too tiring. Just get the players, start the season and then let's see how good everybody is!
Like our odds in Maui.
http://rivals.yahoo.com/basketballrecruiting/basketball/recruiting/commitments/2012/northcarolina-6
They just re-load. J.P. might actually see some playing time now. With Zeller a senior, thats four starters gone.
Only one of that bunch I would not is Henson. What a punk that guy is.
I enjoy watching our guys grow as players over their years at MU. Never want to be a 'one and done' school.
Quote from: MU82 on March 29, 2012, 05:40:13 PM
Not saying I wouldn't have wanted all of them. Of course I'd want them and any other star recruit I could get.
If I were a college coach, I would have very little, if any, interest in a recruit who was planning to be a one-and-done. To devote all that time and energy ( recruiting, conditioning, etc.) a kid you are only have for a year seems like a waste of resources. And that is on top of the fact that a one-and-doner doesn't care about being a member of a team. He is very likely to only be interested in doing what makes him look good to the folks who make NBA draft picks.
Sure, they might win you a few extra games - in one season. But all the hassle that comes with the turnover might not be worth it.
Quote from: MarquetteDano on March 29, 2012, 08:06:27 PM
Only one of that bunch I would not is Henson. What a punk that guy is.
Not a punk at all, actually a really good kid.
I would like to have a one and done once...how about Jabari?
Quote from: texaswarrior74 on March 29, 2012, 08:38:01 PM
Not a punk at all, actually a really good kid.
Jae Crowder disagrees
If I have ever seen a kid who's just a good college point guard, it's Kendall Marshall. Huge mistake for him to leave
Quote from: jsglow on March 29, 2012, 08:28:13 PM
I enjoy watching our guys grow as players over their years at MU. Never want to be a 'one and done' school.
Marshall and Barnes were at UNC as long as our 2 best players in the last 15 years, Wade and Crowder. Give me a guy like Anthony Davis or Jabari Parker every class. That's why you can never stop recruiting.
Quote from: Jamailman on March 29, 2012, 08:54:17 PM
Marshall and Barnes were at UNC as long as our 2 best players in the last 15 years, Wade and Crowder. Give me a guy like Anthony Davis or Jabari Parker every class. That's why you can never stop recruiting.
Ill also take a hot blonde who's ass tastes like French Vanilla ice cream.
None of these were 1-and-dones. As was pointed out, all three were playing for UNC at least as long as Wade and Crowder played at Marquette.
Still, the lesson is that Wade was barely recruited and went to a Final Four and Crowder wasn't recruited at all and went to two Sweet 16s. You don't have to have 5-stars to win ... although when you don't, you have a pretty small margin of error.
Some folks here say they don't want a 1-and-done. So if Carmelo or Derrick Rose says, "I want to come to Marquette, even if I'm only around for a year," we're gonna say, no, we'd rather have a 3-star who will stay 4 years? Right.
I don't think I'd want a whole program of them, but I sure wouldn't turn my back on any 5-star, 1-and-done kid. I doubt Jim Boeheim regrets having Carmelo Anthony, you know?
Quote from: PTM on March 29, 2012, 09:00:02 PM
Ill also take a hot blonde who's ass tastes like French Vanilla ice cream.
Overused line.........but this may be the greatest set of words written in the history of this forum.
Well. Played. Sir.
Roy Williams should be publicly mocked every year he doesn't make a Final Four.
Quote from: PTM on March 29, 2012, 09:00:02 PM
Ill also take a hot blonde who's ass tastes like French Vanilla ice cream.
(http://a8.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash2/59671_160823380604323_111668908853104_446977_4213814_n.jpg)
Quote from: MU82 on March 29, 2012, 09:53:11 PMNone of these were 1-and-dones. As was pointed out, all three were playing for UNC at least as long as Wade and Crowder played at Marquette.
True, but if not for the NBA uncertainty and strike this past year, Barnes would have been a one-and-done, and both Henson and Zeller probably would have declared.
Sure I'd take take the occasional 5 star that gives us his Frosh and Soph year. But I never want to be the training ground for kids that park themselves for a single year before heading to the NBA. No, I never want to follow the Kentucky blueprint even if the do win the NCAA Championship this year. We're a university focused on educating young people, not a pro franchise focused on winning athletic events for profit. Basketball players earning degrees is an important lesson for the student body as a whole, 2 of which I have particular interest in.
(Funny, be interesting to have a broad sense of the various MU constituencies on this.)
Last year's strike uncertainty helped Butler get drafted in the first year and this year will hurt Crowder and DJO in the draft.
EDIT: Last year's strike CERTAINLY helped Butler get drafted in the first ROUND and this year it will hurt Crowder and DJO in the draft.
--Never post in the morning before you drink coffee.
Quote from: Badgerhater on March 30, 2012, 08:43:06 AM
Last year's strike uncertainty helped Butler get drafted in the first year and this year will hurt Crowder and DJO in the draft.
Great point.
Quote from: brewcity77 on March 29, 2012, 07:20:06 PM
Like our odds in Maui.
Yeah, for how good that field looked to be a year ago it's not going to be all that tough next year. If we take an international trip to get the ten additional practices and some extra games before then I'd say we've got a good shot of winning.
Quote from: jsglow on March 30, 2012, 08:43:01 AM
Sure I'd take take the occasional 5 star that gives us his Frosh and Soph year. But I never want to be the training ground for kids that park themselves for a single year before heading to the NBA. No, I never want to follow the Kentucky blueprint even if the do win the NCAA Championship this year. We're a university focused on educating young people, not a pro franchise focused on winning athletic events for profit. Basketball players earning degrees is an important lesson for the student body as a whole, 2 of which I have particular interest in.
(Funny, be interesting to have a broad sense of the various MU constituencies on this.)
So those 2 do not get a degree, which I heard they are not, some of the Buzz issues (graduating players) but really if they do not they still will be in the 1% of salaries next year for first
year students out of school. Isn't that why you go to school? To get a job, now if they want to get a degree, they would be fools if they do not finish, as basketball at most is a 10 year
job.
Quote from: warriorchick on March 29, 2012, 08:37:21 PM
If I were a college coach, I would have very little, if any, interest in a recruit who was planning to be a one-and-done. To devote all that time and energy ( recruiting, conditioning, etc.) a kid you are only have for a year seems like a waste of resources. And that is on top of the fact that a one-and-doner doesn't care about being a member of a team. He is very likely to only be interested in doing what makes him look good to the folks who make NBA draft picks.
Sure, they might win you a few extra games - in one season. But all the hassle that comes with the turnover might not be worth it.
This sounds mildly like some people's aversion to Juco players. Like Buzz has said in regards to Juco players, it can't just be
any talented player, it has to be the
right type of player. Not all one-and-doners are selfish players who only care about numbers and use college as a 30+ game NBA tryout. This year's Kentucky team is a perfect example of that. Three of their top six players are freshman with potential to be one-and-done and two others are sophs who could have been one-and-done, yet those six players have each taken between 290 and 348 shots. That's an incredibly even distribution for any team, let alone a young team. Say what you want about Coach Cal, but he has definitely brought in 5-star players who buy in to his system.
For those people who mentioned Melo, keep in mind that he wanted to come back to Syracuse but knew that his NBA stock would never be higher than it would be after winning a NC. He actually cried at his press conference announcing his NBA intentions because he didn't want to go but knew it was the right time.
Quote from: MerrittsMustache on March 30, 2012, 09:18:15 AM
This sounds mildly like some people's aversion to Juco players. Like Buzz has said in regards to Juco players, it can't just be any talented player, it has to be the right type of player. Not all one-and-doners are selfish players who only care about numbers and use college as a 30+ game NBA tryout. This year's Kentucky team is a perfect example of that. Three of their top six players are freshman with potential to be one-and-done and two others are sophs who could have been one-and-done, yet those six players have each taken between 290 and 348 shots. That's an incredibly even distribution for any team, let alone a young team. Say what you want about Coach Cal, but he has definitely brought in 5-star players who buy in to his system.
For those people who mentioned Melo, keep in mind that he wanted to come back to Syracuse but knew that his NBA stock would never be higher than it would be after winning a NC. He actually cried at his press conference announcing his NBA intentions because he didn't want to go but knew it was the right time.
Definitely disagree there. His stock was probably the lowest it possibly could have been solely because Lebron James was in the draft. He was the number 1 recruit in the country out of high school, and then led his team to the national title in his freshman season. If he went back to Syrcacuse for his sophomore season, regardless of how his team did, he would have been the #1 overall pick in the 2004 draft.
Quote from: BCHoopster on March 30, 2012, 09:17:22 AM
So those 2 do not get a degree, which I heard they are not, some of the Buzz issues (graduating players) but really if they do not they still will be in the 1% of salaries next year for first
year students out of school. Isn't that why you go to school? To get a job, now if they want to get a degree, they would be fools if they do not finish, as basketball at most is a 10 year
job.
The problem isn't the players. It's the system. The Portsmouth Invitational is in mid-April. That's the marquee NBA "tryout" for college seniors and it's during the school year. If Butler had skipped that event last season to focus on his school work, he wouldn't have been a 1st Round pick, which meant a guaranteed 2-year contract worth over $2 million. If he goes in the 2nd Round, that could mean maybe a 1-year, $450k contract. While that's no small change, finishing up a degree could have potentially cost him over $1.5M. A player can always go back to get his degree. He can't ever go back and compete at Portsmouth again.
From an outside perspective it's easy to say that these kids should stick it out and finish their degrees, but if you look at it closer, an overwhelming majority of us would go for the money and dream job.
Quote from: MerrittsMustache on March 30, 2012, 09:38:23 AM
The problem isn't the players. It's the system. The Portsmouth Invitational is in mid-April. That's the marquee NBA "tryout" for college seniors and it's during the school year. If Butler had skipped that event last season to focus on his school work, he wouldn't have been a 1st Round pick, which meant a guaranteed 2-year contract worth over $2 million. If he goes in the 2nd Round, that could mean maybe a 1-year, $450k contract. While that's no small change, finishing up a degree could have potentially cost him over $1.5M. A player can always go back to get his degree. He can't ever go back and compete at Portsmouth again.
From an outside perspective it's easy to say that these kids should stick it out and finish their degrees, but if you look at it closer, an overwhelming majority of us would go for the money and dream job.
Cosign
Quote from: wadesworld on March 30, 2012, 09:30:00 AM
Definitely disagree there. His stock was probably the lowest it possibly could have been solely because Lebron James was in the draft. He was the number 1 recruit in the country out of high school, and then led his team to the national title in his freshman season. If he went back to Syrcacuse for his sophomore season, regardless of how his team did, he would have been the #1 overall pick in the 2004 draft.
He was projected as the #2 player in the draft in 2003. Another year in school would not have guaranteed him the #1 spot in 2004, especially with Howard and Okafor available - NBA teams love big men. Another year would have also allowed scouts to pick apart his game.
I challenge you to find a player who would have been a lottery pick but stayed in school and saw his draft stock rise.
Quote from: chapman on March 30, 2012, 09:04:51 AM
Yeah, for how good that field looked to be a year ago it's not going to be all that tough next year. If we take an international trip to get the ten additional practices and some extra games before then I'd say we've got a good shot of winning.
this is what i was thinking. although don't sleep on Texas, they return everyone and have a stud freshman coming in. They were a talented team who was young this year.
my guess is the bracket will set up to have a UNC-UT final.
Quote from: BCHoopster on March 30, 2012, 09:17:22 AM
So those 2 do not get a degree, which I heard they are not, some of the Buzz issues (graduating players) but really if they do not they still will be in the 1% of salaries next year for first
year students out of school. Isn't that why you go to school? To get a job, now if they want to get a degree, they would be fools if they do not finish, as basketball at most is a 10 year
job.
Getting an education is more than just about getting a job.
Quote from: PTM on March 29, 2012, 09:00:02 PM
Ill also take a hot blonde who's ass tastes like French Vanilla ice cream.
We may need another poll to determine whether (weather) you should use
"who's" or "whose".
May not be relevant in the context of hot blondes!
Quote from: MerrittsMustache on March 30, 2012, 09:49:33 AM
He was projected as the #2 player in the draft in 2003. Another year in school would not have guaranteed him the #1 spot in 2004, especially with Howard and Okafor available - NBA teams love big men. Another year would have also allowed scouts to pick apart his game.
I challenge you to find a player who would have been a lottery pick but stayed in school and saw his draft stock rise.
Depending on the season Carmelo would have had at Syracuse, Dwight Howard might have gone above him. There is no chance Emeka Okafor would have gone above him. There was plenty of time for scouts to pick Carmelo's game apart. He would have absolutely dominated college basketball again if he had returned. He was an NBA player coming out of high school. There was a very good chance he would have gone #1 overall, but at worst would have gone #2.
Al Horford and Corey Brewer could have left earlier than they did but returned and their stock rose. Hard to say because off the top of my head I don't know who had seasons good enough to go pro and then returned. I would guess Blake Griffin would have been a top 15 pick if he left after his freshman year (15 points, 9 rebounds as a freakishly athletic freshman) and he came back and went 1 overall.
Carmelo was not a guy like Gordon Hayward, who was somebody who was unknown to NBA GM's coming out of high school (2 star on Scout, 3 star on Rivals) and blew up for a season, making a deep tournament run, and then took his money. Carmelo was the #1 recruit coming out of high school. He was NBA-ready in high school and at Syracuse. Another year at Syracuse was not going to hurt his stock at all. It might have been the right time for him to leave, but if he wanted to go back to Syracuse he would have and he would've been just fine.
Too bad there can't be a legitimate degree called Basketball Studies....which would also teach you about coaching theory, training theory, hoops economics, etc.
Marquette would probably make it quite rigorous, whereas Kentucky would award graduate credit for a class in the proper inflation of a basketball.
Quote from: Badgerhater on March 30, 2012, 10:45:33 AM
Too bad there can't be a legitimate degree called Basketball Studies....which would also teach you about coaching theory, training theory, hoops economics, etc.
Marquette would probably make it quite rigorous, whereas Kentucky would award graduate credit for a class in the proper inflation of a basketball.
Add investments and personal budgetting to the agenda. How many NBA players each year go bankrupt after making millions in the League?
just be sure it's taught in the first year so everyone has the chance to take it
Quote from: MarquetteDano on March 30, 2012, 11:02:46 AM
Add investments and personal budgetting to the agenda. How many NBA players each year go bankrupt after making millions in the League?
And fundamentals of birth control.
Quote from: box of beer on March 30, 2012, 11:27:16 AM
just be sure it's taught in the first year so everyone has the chance to take it
Make that first semester.
Anyone ever take "Music Appreciation" from Horton Roe in the 60's and 70's at Marquette??
Quote from: MarquetteDano on March 30, 2012, 11:02:46 AM
Add investments and personal budgetting to the agenda. How many NBA players each year go bankrupt after making millions in the League?
You RANG?
(http://dealbreaker.com/_old/2009/10/28/Antoine%20Walker.jpg)
Quote from: MerrittsMustache on March 30, 2012, 09:49:33 AM
He was projected as the #2 player in the draft in 2003. Another year in school would not have guaranteed him the #1 spot in 2004, especially with Howard and Okafor available - NBA teams love big men. Another year would have also allowed scouts to pick apart his game.
I challenge you to find a player who would have been a lottery pick but stayed in school and saw his draft stock rise.
+1
Quote from: texaswarrior74 on March 29, 2012, 08:38:01 PM
Not a punk at all, actually a really good kid.
Based on what information? Don't know the guy so don't have an opinion one way or the other - don't think you know him either.
Quote from: jsglow on March 30, 2012, 09:57:36 AM
Getting an education is more than just about getting a job.
What like learning about time management, working with and learning from people who have different experiences than you, hard work, perseverance. I think these kids get a good deal of that with their intense schedule and all the people they interact with.
Could you elaborate on what getting an education should be about? Most students simply use it to hone their flip cup skills and ability to cram in search of a piece of paper and hopefully a job (yours truly not excluded).