...don't cha think? After all the crap and haters and BADger trolls and rumors and even more crap, she has to love the development of her son and the team and his growth under Buzz.
I even saw him smile JUST a little bit after his "and one" layup in the GT game....
40 minutes of three quarter court trapping hell starts in about 24 hours....Peaking at the right time, boys and girls.
Let's go 9 for 9 Warriors!!
Not quite 40 minutes of hell but getting close. We need Vander to take it up another notch between now on April 2nd.
Vander elevating his game one more notch might mean a Final Four run. You're almost an upperclassman. Time to shine.
Quote from: jsglow on March 07, 2012, 03:04:16 PM
Vander elevating his game one more notch might mean a Final Four run. You're almost an upperclassman. Time to shine.
Yes, would like to see Mayo start to get on a roll as well.
Vander has certainly stepped up his game this year. Vander is trending well and showing that he is a winner and will be a great leader.
Good point on Mayo. I wonder if he is being too passive in letting the game come to him or if the coaches have shut him down a bit offensively and told him to guard like a demon (and he does) and feed the ball to the scorers. You will notice that Blue and Mayo's minutes flipped-flopped about a third of the way into conference play
Agree: Need both VB and Mayo to elevate to the next level and we will be an even more dangerous team....(or as they say in Houghton: dangerouser)
Relentless....gotta bring it the whole game
Since Gardner went down Vander has averaged 11 points and 5+ boards per game while providing a ton of energy and killing it (78.5%) from the FT line. Not sure there's a player on the team I'd rather have on the stripe in a clutch situation at this point. If he boosts his shooting %'s across the board next year the way he did this year he'll be an excellent all-around player. By his senior year I'll be shocked if he's not at least second team all conference.
If vander had any sort of touch around the rim, we'd talk about him like he was Jae or DJO. He's still a good player, but that kid needs to finish some more of the quality looks he creates for himself.
Quote from: hairyworthen on March 07, 2012, 03:10:03 PM
Yes, would like to see Mayo start to get on a roll as well.
I see what you did there.
In the last nine games, Vander really has only had one poor game (@UConn).
In the other eight games, he has hit double figures seven times...had 6+ rebounds six times...and has cut down on the turnovers while increasing both assists and steals. All the while being the best perimeter defender on the team.
Something clicked with him...it's like he finally figured it all out.
Quote from: boyonthedock on March 07, 2012, 04:18:29 PM
If vander had any sort of touch around the rim, we'd talk about him like he was Jae or DJO. He's still a good player, but that kid needs to finish some more of the quality looks he creates for himself.
He's gotten better. He still isn't as bad as some portray him to be.
NO question he's gotten better. he still throws up a prayer at the rim when a simple layup will do in a way that just looks way worse than any other players misses. Just makes it frustrating because he can beat guys off the bounce.
Quote from: hairyworthen on March 07, 2012, 03:10:03 PM
Yes, would like to see Mayo start to get back on a roll as well.
FIXED!
Vander will get paid to play in a couple of years, just a matter of how much. If he improves his shooting he will be a first round draft pick.
Quote from: boyonthedock on March 07, 2012, 04:24:05 PM
NO question he's gotten better. he still throws up a prayer at the rim when a simple layup will do in a way that just looks way worse than any other players misses. Just makes it frustrating because he can beat guys off the bounce.
Why do you hate Vander Blue?
Vander is my favorite player, It's exciting to see him develop right before our eyes.
A lot of times we jump to judge numbers and how that is the only thing that brings value to the team. I believe Vander has the biggest heart and hustles the most out of anybody. He is going to be a great leader for Marquette and is a tremendous asset for our team to have.
#Number2VanderBlue!
Quote from: ErickJD08 on March 07, 2012, 04:45:11 PM
Why do you hate Vander Blue?
Not even remotely close to some of your gems.
Quote from: LancesOtherNut on March 07, 2012, 04:48:28 PM
Not even remotely close to some of your gems.
like what gems? Would love to hear...
Quote from: boyonthedock on March 07, 2012, 04:18:29 PM
If vander had any sort of touch around the rim, we'd talk about him like he was Jae or DJO. He's still a good player, but that kid needs to finish some more of the quality looks he creates for himself.
he looks lost with layups. that's my only real criticism. a lot of players struggle with their shot from time to time. it looks like he just throws the ball towards the backboard and prays he draws the foul.
Quote from: ErickJD08 on March 07, 2012, 05:01:29 PM
like what gems? Would love to hear...
how can anyone take you seriously when you can't even spell your own name right
He needs to be less flashy on the layups. Too often he makes it into highlight film. I like the flash but get pissed with the misses.
Now if he'd only learn to high five his teammates........
Quote from: ErickJD08 on March 07, 2012, 05:01:29 PM
like what gems? Would love to hear...
I'm not going to waste my time going through your posts, but I guarantee if someone on Scoop asked the question, "Who is the resident Blue-basher?", your name shoots to the top of the list.
i'm not sure vander is capable of picking it up another notch for the tourney...he isn't going to learn to shoot overnight, and i think he'll begin to finish better around the rim through repetition, it won't just happen in the tourney. i do think that the other areas of his game are some of the very best on the team, and he has been so reliable in those areas that his importance probably is under-appreciated by some.
mayo is the one that could get hot and make a difference for MU, and even his consistency in other areas would be very beneficial to mu. he has the athleticism and size to defend and rebound for his position in a fashion very similar to vander....some games he looks as good as vander, others not.
Quote from: LancesOtherNut on March 07, 2012, 05:22:02 PM
I'm not going to waste my time going through your posts, but I guarantee if someone on Scoop asked the question, "Who is the resident Blue-basher?", your name shoots to the top of the list.
My bashing is pretty much exclusive to his inability to finish around the rim. That is the same comments I am reading from other posters on this thread. That is why I threw the joke out there "Why do you hate Blue?" because I don't hate the kid. And being critical of a player for his play is not bashing. I just wish he could finish around the rim because our team (although is very good) could be much better if he could finish. That's what it was. That's what it is. Fun times ahead...
Fans, it's tournament time. Don't criticize our players, the very ones who carried us to a second place Beast finish and 14 conference wins. In other words, Don't Mess With Our Chi!!!
I love Vander!!
Quote from: ErickJD08 on March 07, 2012, 05:40:25 PM
My bashing is pretty much exclusive to his inability to finish around the rim. That is the same comments I am reading from other posters on this thread. That is why I threw the joke out there "Why do you hate Blue?" because I don't hate the kid. And being critical of a player for his play is not bashing. I just wish he could finish around the rim because our team (although is very good) could be much better if he could finish. That's what it was. That's what it is. Fun times ahead...
How about the several times you posted "Vander Blue sucks at basketball"? Then when people called you out saying that he's good at pretty much everything but shooting you would defend that position to the death. Now you want to say you were pretty much ONLY critical of his ability to finish around the rim? Sorry dude, that's revisionist history. No one claimed he was a good shooter. No one claimed he was without flaws. But there are other things you can do to help a basketball team that don't get all the glory, and he selflessly does those things. It's not like he's Truck Bryant chucking up 15 shots a game shooting 30%. That would actually hurt the team. Nevertheless, he's clearly working on his shooting. It has improved, and it will continue to do so, and you will continue to look like a moron.
Quote from: ErickJD08 on March 07, 2012, 05:40:25 PM
My bashing is pretty much exclusive to his inability to finish around the rim. That is the same comments I am reading from other posters on this thread. That is why I threw the joke out there "Why do you hate Blue?" because I don't hate the kid. And being critical of a player for his play is not bashing. I just wish he could finish around the rim because our team (although is very good) could be much better if he could finish. That's what it was. That's what it is. Fun times ahead...
You attempt to downplay Vander's contributions to the team any and every chance you get to. There are numerous examples after just about any game Vander plays well in. It does not start and end with his inability to finish around the rim.
For example, after the Villinova game where he clinched the win for us at the free throw line and played a very strong all around game, the first post on this page shows you trying to downplay what he did in that game:
http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=30087.25
Here is the box score for that game:
http://espn.go.com/ncb/boxscore?gameId=320280222
9 points, 7 rebounds, 2 assists, 1 steal, 1 turnover. Played strong defense in the game. A strong all around game. In case you haven't noticed, you can be effective and have a good game without scoring 20 points. No need to try to pretend he did not have a good game at Villinova.
http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=29474.0
Claiming "the 5 star status" is what was "buying him minutes," as if Buzz actually gives a sh!t how many stars you come in with next to your name (DJO? Crowder? Butler? Gardner? Weird). On the same page, saying "If you are a complete non-factor on offense and mistake prone you are not having a good game." Was Bruce Bowen an ineffective NBA player? He was a non-factor on offense...and made millions in the NBA. By the way, here is that game's box score:
http://espn.go.com/ncb/boxscore?gameId=320010269
He had 7 points, 4 assists, and 7 rebounds. Again, where do you get the idea that 7 points and 4 assists equates to being a "complete non-factor on offense?" Once again, you try to downplay his contributions and are just straight up wrong. Did he score 30 points? No. That isn't the only way somebody is a "factor" on offense. Foolish.
In that same thread you claim that Vander should not have allowed a layup while we were winning and the clock was running late in the game. Do you know anything about basketball? You don't foul in that situation, no matter what. Give up the layup. It does no harm.
The entire 10 pages goes on like that. You do everything and anything you can to try to downplay Blue's (very important) contributions to Marquette. It's a joke. I'm not going to go through and point out every post you do that. You can take a look at page 3 for my response to that. You do not like Vander. We get it. You don't have to try to argue the facts every time somebody gives Vander credit, and then pretend that you don't do that.
Quote from: Jamailman on March 07, 2012, 06:10:10 PM
How about the several times you posted "Vander Blue sucks at basketball"? Then when people called you out saying that he's good at pretty much everything but shooting you would defend that position to the death. Now you want to say you were pretty much ONLY critical of his ability to finish around the rim? Sorry dude, that's revisionist history. No one claimed he was a good shooter. No one claimed he was without flaws. But there are other things you can do to help a basketball team that don't get all the glory, and he selflessly does those things. It's not like he's Truck Bryant chucking up 15 shots a game shooting 30%. That would actually hurt the team. Nevertheless, he's clearly working on his shooting. It has improved, and it will continue to do so, and you will continue to look like a moron.
This is accepting the fact that he won't ever get better at scoring/shooting. This kid can be great. making a layup won't make him suddenly worse at getting steals and rebounds. People don't look like a moron by pointing out what is obvious to people with eyes. We all love the team, and obviously like Blue as a player. Things said in the heat of the moment shouldn't cause you to turn against your fellow fan!
Quote from: wadesworld on March 07, 2012, 06:13:23 PM
You attempt to downplay Vander's contributions to the team any and every chance you get to. There are numerous examples after just about any game Vander plays well in. It does not start and end with his inability to finish around the rim.
For example, after the Villinova game where he clinched the win for us at the free throw line and played a very strong all around game, the first post on this page shows you trying to downplay what he did in that game:
http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=30087.25
Here is the box score for that game:
http://espn.go.com/ncb/boxscore?gameId=320280222
9 points, 7 rebounds, 2 assists, 1 steal, 1 turnover. Played strong defense in the game. A strong all around game. In case you haven't noticed, you can be effective and have a good game without scoring 20 points. No need to try to pretend he did not have a good game at Villinova.
http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=29474.0
Claiming "the 5 star status" is what was "buying him minutes," as if Buzz actually gives a sh!t how many stars you come in with next to your name (DJO? Crowder? Butler? Gardner? Weird). On the same page, saying "If you are a complete non-factor on offense and mistake prone you are not having a good game." Was Bruce Bowen an ineffective NBA player? He was a non-factor on offense...and made millions in the NBA. By the way, here is that game's box score:
http://espn.go.com/ncb/boxscore?gameId=320010269
He had 7 points, 4 assists, and 7 rebounds. Again, where do you get the idea that 7 points and 4 assists equates to being a "complete non-factor on offense?" Once again, you try to downplay his contributions and are just straight up wrong. Did he score 30 points? No. That isn't the only way somebody is a "factor" on offense. Foolish.
In that same thread you claim that Vander should not have allowed a layup while we were winning and the clock was running late in the game. Do you know anything about basketball? You don't foul in that situation, no matter what. Give up the layup. It does no harm.
The entire 10 pages goes on like that. You do everything and anything you can to try to downplay Blue's (very important) contributions to Marquette. It's a joke. I'm not going to go through and point out every post you do that. You can take a look at page 3 for my response to that. You do not like Vander. We get it. You don't have to try to argue the facts every time somebody gives Vander credit, and then pretend that you don't do that.
Simply: Owned.
Exactly. Erick is now diminishing his criticism because Blue has pretty much proven him to be wrong. You were saying that he needs to play 10-15 minutes a game...said "he is not good," and words of the sort.
Simply put...he was wrong.
Don't feed the trolls. ;)
Quote from: wadesworld on March 07, 2012, 06:13:23 PM
You attempt to downplay Vander's contributions to the team any and every chance you get to. There are numerous examples after just about any game Vander plays well in. It does not start and end with his inability to finish around the rim.
For example, after the Villinova game where he clinched the win for us at the free throw line and played a very strong all around game, the first post on this page shows you trying to downplay what he did in that game:
http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=30087.25
Here is the box score for that game:
http://espn.go.com/ncb/boxscore?gameId=320280222
9 points, 7 rebounds, 2 assists, 1 steal, 1 turnover. Played strong defense in the game. A strong all around game. In case you haven't noticed, you can be effective and have a good game without scoring 20 points. No need to try to pretend he did not have a good game at Villinova.
http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=29474.0
Claiming "the 5 star status" is what was "buying him minutes," as if Buzz actually gives a sh!t how many stars you come in with next to your name (DJO? Crowder? Butler? Gardner? Weird). On the same page, saying "If you are a complete non-factor on offense and mistake prone you are not having a good game." Was Bruce Bowen an ineffective NBA player? He was a non-factor on offense...and made millions in the NBA. By the way, here is that game's box score:
http://espn.go.com/ncb/boxscore?gameId=320010269
He had 7 points, 4 assists, and 7 rebounds. Again, where do you get the idea that 7 points and 4 assists equates to being a "complete non-factor on offense?" Once again, you try to downplay his contributions and are just straight up wrong. Did he score 30 points? No. That isn't the only way somebody is a "factor" on offense. Foolish.
In that same thread you claim that Vander should not have allowed a layup while we were winning and the clock was running late in the game. Do you know anything about basketball? You don't foul in that situation, no matter what. Give up the layup. It does no harm.
The entire 10 pages goes on like that. You do everything and anything you can to try to downplay Blue's (very important) contributions to Marquette. It's a joke. I'm not going to go through and point out every post you do that. You can take a look at page 3 for my response to that. You do not like Vander. We get it. You don't have to try to argue the facts every time somebody gives Vander credit, and then pretend that you don't do that.
You must be a politician because you can really grab some small clips and spin. First, neither Nova game was really strong. They were average. Remember the game that he "clinched"? Remember how he played only 16 minutes and he was getting benched for Mayo? Remember how we were getting smoked in beginning and I think Buzz benched him for the last 12 minutes of the first half. My comments came after people were crowning Blue SOG when clearly DJO was the reason we won. Kudos to the kid for hitting clutch free throws but he missed two bunnies and made two bunnies. Again, he can have a much bigger impact if he could made lay ups. In the end, he had an average game.
The other Nova game he had 3 TOs, missed lay ups, and was 3 for 8 from the line. Again, he had an average game. But everyone gets jazzed with a 7pt, 4ast, 3TO performance. Its average.
You are going to have to reference the thread again where I criticized fouling or whatever. I couldn't find it.
Finally, it's funny that you COMPLETELY ignore the three game stretch where Vander was finishing well and playing well that I was giving him high praise. Funny how you ignored that. Very politician-like.
Quote from: ErickJD08 on March 07, 2012, 08:12:12 PM
You must be a politician because you can really grab some small clips and spin.
Here are some posts you made about Vander.
No spin here. Just the quotes. Most of these are from November, and I think that is when you gained your "rep".
Quote from: ErickJD08 on November 21, 2011, 09:14:20 PM
I'll say it again... He just isn't that good.
Quote from: ErickJD08 on November 21, 2011, 09:50:34 PM
Very true. He was a five star kid. I was expecting that he would comfortable with a layup and he is not. Great defense though. Got to him him that
Quote from: ErickJD08 on November 22, 2011, 03:26:52 PM
Can he make a layup? Kinda important.
Quote from: ErickJD08 on November 11, 2011, 10:52:59 PM
I am sorry but I just don't see how blue got his 5 star status. With less PT, Jones looks better and just more comfortable. Blue is still disappointing.
Quote from: ErickJD08 on December 30, 2011, 12:32:25 PM
Can we compare sophomore stats between Blue, Wade, and McNeal again? That would be fun.
Quote from: 2002MUalum on March 07, 2012, 11:02:09 PM
Here are some posts you made about Vander.
No spin here. Just the quotes. Most of these are from November, and I think that is when you gained your "rep".
Understood. I don't see that I said anything TERRIBLE. He struggles with layups. It's frustrating to watch. I am over the five star status. I think we have finally started to see improvement about two weeks ago. I kinda was expecting this kind of improvement around December. Big deal and it's taking him a little longer. He started to regress a bit lately but he seems to have this free throw stroke down so I absolutely want him on the floor at the end of the game with a lead.
I get a little frustrated when the fan base really amp'ed up about 7 points and 4 assists. Or like the start of this thread about how Vander has grow SO much. I completely understand offense is not the end all be all but he has a bunch of negative plays (blocked shots, TOs, sloppy passes) every game. And its the same ones every game. And he shoot a really bad percentage for the quality of shots he gets. Jae and DJO are studs but in the next two years, we are going to need him to be better on offense. On top of that, it is clear that the kid has a really high ceiling, especially on offense. I am not giving up faith. I feel like he can step it up and make this a championship team this year. The reality is that Blue and JC are going to need to be better in their own ways to make a run (and the studs have to be studs of course).
Quote from: ErickJD08 on March 07, 2012, 04:45:11 PM
Why do you hate Vander Blue?
Nah I get what boyonthedock is saying... VB did get better with layups and no-to-two footers but then he started sucking again in the past couple of games (or maybe at least the ones that he missed sticks out in my mind more than the ones that he makes). I like that his average is still in the double-digits though.
Blue has improved by leaps and bounds this season. Besides developing a somewhat reliable 10-15 foot pull-up jump shot (which is the most effective shot in a wing's arsenal, if you ask me), the next big thing he has to learn is to take the hit on his drive and still put up a reasonable shot. When he takes contact, he just sorta wings the ball at the basket, not giving himself a chance to make the shot and relying on the ref to make a call.
Quote from: ErickJD08 on March 07, 2012, 11:26:14 PM
Understood. I don't see that I said anything TERRIBLE. He struggles with layups. It's frustrating to watch. I am over the five star status. I think we have finally started to see improvement about two weeks ago. I kinda was expecting this kind of improvement around December. Big deal and it's taking him a little longer. He started to regress a bit lately but he seems to have this free throw stroke down so I absolutely want him on the floor at the end of the game with a lead.
I get a little frustrated when the fan base really amp'ed up about 7 points and 4 assists. Or like the start of this thread about how Vander has grow SO much. I completely understand offense is not the end all be all but he has a bunch of negative plays (blocked shots, TOs, sloppy passes) every game. And its the same ones every game. And he shoot a really bad percentage for the quality of shots he gets. Jae and DJO are studs but in the next two years, we are going to need him to be better on offense. On top of that, it is clear that the kid has a really high ceiling, especially on offense. I am not giving up faith. I feel like he can step it up and make this a championship team this year. The reality is that Blue and JC are going to need to be better in their own ways to make a run (and the studs have to be studs of course).
First, I am absolutely amazed how you can say he has regressed the past few weeks. He was all over the floor defensively in both the WVU and Georgetown games. Outside of Jae, he was probably the best player on the floor against Georgetown.
Second, you harp on his mistakes, but you do realize that he has a better A/TO ratio than everyone on the team but Junior and Jae. He outrebounds everyone but Jae and Davante (yes, more per game than Jamil in only two more minutes of action). And again, he is THE BEST on ball perimeter defender on the team.
Yeah, he misses some layups that he should make. But my goodness that is a small negative compared to the positives that he brings to the floor.
I don't know where we'd be on the boards without Vander Blue.
Rebounding is our biggest weakness, and this skinny guard has been fearlessly battling the behemoths and averaging 5 a game since Gardner got hurt against Nova. He's had several games this season with 6, 7 or 8 boards.
He has flaws, yes. Who doesn't? He has improved in every facet, including shooting -- especially at the line, where his turnaround has been nothing short of remarkable. But it's on defense and on the boards that he has really helped us get to where we are. Nine more games of it would be just delightful!
Quote from: ErickJD08 on March 07, 2012, 11:26:14 PM
Understood. I don't see that I said anything TERRIBLE. He struggles with layups. It's frustrating to watch. I am over the five star status. I think we have finally started to see improvement about two weeks ago. I kinda was expecting this kind of improvement around December. Big deal and it's taking him a little longer. He started to regress a bit lately but he seems to have this free throw stroke down so I absolutely want him on the floor at the end of the game with a lead.
I get a little frustrated when the fan base really amp'ed up about 7 points and 4 assists. Or like the start of this thread about how Vander has grow SO much. I completely understand offense is not the end all be all but he has a bunch of negative plays (blocked shots, TOs, sloppy passes) every game. And its the same ones every game. And he shoot a really bad percentage for the quality of shots he gets. Jae and DJO are studs but in the next two years, we are going to need him to be better on offense. On top of that, it is clear that the kid has a really high ceiling, especially on offense. I am not giving up faith. I feel like he can step it up and make this a championship team this year. The reality is that Blue and JC are going to need to be better in their own ways to make a run (and the studs have to be studs of course).
I don't think your evaluation is entirely unfair, but quips like "Can he make a lay-up?" sounded bitter and naive. If Vander misses a lay-up in traffic, it doesn't mean he's bad at basketball. Consequently, if he makes a lay-up in traffic, it doesn't mean he's good. We all know that.
Your reaction to a developing soph. was more harsh than need be, and you are getting roasted for that.
In an ironic twist, posters here are now treating you (looking closely at every post) like you seemed to treat Vander (Focusing on specific mistakes instead of the whole picture).
Quote from: lurch91 on March 07, 2012, 05:21:53 PM
Now if he'd only learn to high five his teammates........
I believe Vander is much improved on the slap of five!
Quote from: leever on March 08, 2012, 10:26:04 AM
I believe Vander is much improved on the slap of five!
Yes, as a matter of fact, Vander was selected to the little heralded All-High Five Team for the Big East! ;D ;D ;D
And yes, I am cracking myself up!