Let's not forget one thing in all this... the NCAA means nothing to Football, they can break away and decide their own champ (like they have been doing for years) and nothing will change other than the names of the conferences and the where the schools align.
However, the NCAA is EVERYTHING to college basketball. NCAA hoops is essentially a 1-month league with all their $ being made in March/April. Remember, CBS has a 14-year, $11 billion deal in place... conference realignment will have little affect on that from an MU perspective.
I still think that nowadays, having a coach that gets players to the NBS is the best recruiting tool you can offer. It looks like we have that. Not saying it won't be rocky and we won't lose revenue in TV deals, but the opportunity to recruit the best players and to play for championships will not be lost due to this shake up.
There will be no "BCS" of basketball and we will not be shut out like Boise/TCU/BYU are about to be....
Today, you are correct. Play this through, and the BCS could completely separate from the NCAA - for basketball, football ... heck even LAX.
I'm hoping down the line, the next major transformation is a BCS break from the NCAA and a maybe some sort of affiliation with the NFL. Probably pie in the sky, but it would put MU in a great position if things were to be run by basketball schools.
Quote from: LAZER on September 19, 2011, 10:43:40 AM
I'm hoping down the line, the next major transformation is a BCS break from the NCAA and a maybe some sort of affiliation with the NFL. Probably pie in the sky, but it would put MU in a great position if things were to be run by basketball schools.
This means MU essentially becomes part of the new Division II you know....
Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on September 19, 2011, 10:52:40 AM
This means MU essentially becomes part of the new Division II you know....
Yep. I don't view it as a positive.
I guess what I meant is that football breaks off entirely into this "BCS" division, where all other sports stay aligned with their current conferences.
Quote from: LAZER on September 19, 2011, 10:43:40 AM
I'm hoping down the line, the next major transformation is a BCS break from the NCAA and a maybe some sort of affiliation with the NFL. Probably pie in the sky, but it would put MU in a great position if things were to be run by basketball schools.
A great position for what? No one would care about the remnants of the NCAA if the BCS schools broke away completely. The NCAA tournament would be dead. Oh, it would still be played, but the lack of major teams would mean that virtually no one would watch and it would lose prominence very quickly. And the BCS would hold a new BCS Basketball Tournament for all the teams that the majority of people actually want to watch.
And meanwhile they won't have to share revenue with anyone...including the hundreds of lower level NCAA programs whose championships are essentially underwritted by the current D1 basketball tournament.
The only bright side I can see is that the NCAA currently has no control over college football postseason. The BCS currently has no contorl over college basketball at all. If it stays that way, we will land on our feet. If the BCS tries to take over other sports, it could get very ugly. I mean that in many ways - not just applicable to MU.
This could end up with 64 greedy schools completely destroying college athletics for everyone but themselves.
Or it could end up with 64 greedy schools overhauling college football completely and leaving the NCAA to deal with the fallout of what they did and what it means for the rest of college athletics.
Quote from: MUMac on September 19, 2011, 10:36:34 AM
Today, you are correct. Play this through, and the BCS could completely separate from the NCAA - for basketball, football ... heck even LAX.
I think i am correct for the next 14 years... or at least I hope...
Also, the BCS wants NOTHING to do with anything but Football. Every other sport is a drain on football revenue. The only thing that makes $ outside of that is March Madness...
I also don't see the BCS breaking into any kind of actual governing body because it doesn't even really exist. The BCS is just a collection of schools who invented a system to monopolize the best Bowls in College Football. The reason they were able to do that is the NCAA never sponsored any kind of Championship in football. The NCAA owns the tournament, and makes a TON of $ off it, so that's not going to get privatized any time soon.
I hope you are correct. I, though, see potential greed among the 4 conferences and 64 schools. They would not need to share revenue. They could make it an awfully nice basketball tournament. They could include the other sports with little negative cost impact to them. It may help boost all the sports - through TV contracts ... that they would not share.
It may not be the BCS that remains, but another body that takes it's place for all the sports.
Quote from: TJ on September 19, 2011, 11:04:45 AM
This could end up with 64 greedy schools completely destroying college athletics for everyone but themselves.
Or it could end up with 64 greedy schools overhauling college football completely and leaving the NCAA to deal with the fallout of what they did and what it means for the rest of college athletics.
Exactly. This is all about Football, and the $ it generates. Nothing else. That's the advantage the BCS schools have, they are not tied to anything related to the NCAA so they can do this sort of thing with no real reprecussions.
Not saying this will not affect MU negatively, but it will not destroy our program or MU's ability to compete for Championships...
Quote from: MUMac on September 19, 2011, 11:10:43 AM
It may not be the BCS that remains, but another body that takes it's place for all the sports.
I thought it was understood that the term "BCS" is a placeholder for whatever actual governing body they create to manage themselves if they choose to break away completely from the NCAA.
Quote from: TJ on September 19, 2011, 11:17:12 AM
I thought it was understood that the term "BCS" is a placeholder for whatever actual governing body they create to manage themselves if they choose to break away completely from the NCAA.
That is the way I intended it, but it seemed to cause some confusion, so I clarified.
Quote from: Jblattner7 on September 19, 2011, 11:14:06 AM
Exactly. This is all about Football, and the $ it generates. Nothing else. That's the advantage the BCS schools have, they are not tied to anything related to the NCAA so they can do this sort of thing with no real reprecussions.
Not saying this will not affect MU negatively, but it will not destroy our program or MU's ability to compete for Championships...
Well, option 1 in my post did imply that this would destroy MU's ability to compete for Championships. I guess you could say that we'd have a great shot at winning an NCAA Tournament, but would it really feel the same if UNC, Duke, UK, UCLA, etc. all competed in a completely different tournament?
But if the football schools breakoff into a "BCS" division, they wouldn't be affiliated with the NCAA. This makes it plausible that basketball and all other sports realign back into conferences where we currently are and have no need to align themselves with the way the football schools do in a "BCS" divsion.
Quote from: LAZER on September 19, 2011, 11:33:49 AM
But if the football schools breakoff into a "BCS" division, they wouldn't be affiliated with the NCAA. This makes it plausible that basketball and all other sports realign back into conferences where we currently are and have no need to align themselves with the way the football schools do in a "BCS" divsion.
That's not going to happen.
Quote from: LAZER on September 19, 2011, 11:33:49 AM
But if the football schools breakoff into a "BCS" division, they wouldn't be affiliated with the NCAA. This makes it plausible that basketball and all other sports realign back into conferences where we currently are and have no need to align themselves with the way the football schools do in a "BCS" divsion.
It is not football that is going to the Super Conferences - it is the universities. Thus, that would include their basketball, soccer, track, la crosse ... programs as well. I guess I am unclear as to your comment.
There are no restrictions. The BCS schools *could* very well do as you are suggesting for football. However, they *won't.* They are not going to form a BCS division for football, and then simply go back to the other conferences for other sports. They are going to make a clean break and leave the others behind.
Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on September 19, 2011, 11:50:44 AM
There are no restrictions. The BCS schools *could* very well do as you are suggesting for football. However, they *won't.* They are not going to form a BCS division for football, and then simply go back to the other conferences for other sports. They are going to make a clean break and leave the others behind.
"could"...So there's a chance????
I "could" strip off my clothes in the office and run around naked down the the hallway - but I'm not going to.
Quote from: MUMac on September 19, 2011, 12:06:21 PM
Yes, Lloyd.
I guess that everything is just so f*cked up now with what looks like to be 4 superconferences that nothing will surprise me and i'm trying to disregard and preconceived notions of what college sports should be. That's where my head's at at least.
Quote from: LAZER on September 19, 2011, 12:10:09 PM
I guess that everything is just so f*cked up now with what looks like to be 4 superconferences that nothing will surprise me and i'm trying to disregard and preconceived notions of what college sports should be. That's where my head's at at least.
I was kidding. Your comment just reminded me of the line from Dumb and Dumber.
Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on September 19, 2011, 12:04:03 PM
I "could" strip off my clothes in the office and run around naked down the the hallway - but I'm not going to.
Thank you. Bad visual
You guys are getting way off track. Here's how it will shake down:
-Schools will align into new, 16 team conferences, this will apply to all sports
-The BCS will "contract" to include only these 4 "super conferences" in FOOTBALL
-The rest of the varsity sports are entirely unaffected (competitively) by the BCS in any way.
So, for example, Syracuse women's golf will now play against Duke and Virginia, but there will not be a "BCS of Women's Golf". Similarly, there will not be a "BCS of College Hoops"... the NCAA already owns and runs the best non-Football TV product in the Tournament and makes a killing off of it. If you'll notice, current BCS alignment has NOTHING to do with who makes the field (theoretically).
Therefore, conference expansion/realignment/goat-f*cking will eventually force MU out of the "BCS Conference", but not out of any kind of ability to qualify for the tournament. The idea that the BCS will somehow spread to any other sport than Football is absurd.
Quote from: Jblattner7 on September 19, 2011, 01:52:35 PM
Therefore, conference expansion/realignment/goat-f*cking will eventually force MU out of the "BCS Conference", but not out of any kind of ability to qualify for the tournament. The idea that the BCS will somehow spread to any other sport than Football is absurd.
I'm not saying it will happen, but why is it so absurd? Money and greed is driving all of this, right? When the 4 super conferences are done with football who is to say that don't look around at what else they can take? You said yourself that the NCAA owns, runs, and profits from the Tournament - what if the 4 conferences with the biggest 64 schools decide that they don't want to share that money anymore either and breaks away from the NCAA entirely, forms their own association, and makes their own 64 team basketball tournament with most of the teams that people really wanted to see anyway. Is there anything forcing these institutions to remain affiliated with the NCAA, and if not why does an NCAA contract with CBS mean anything?
Quote from: Jblattner7 on September 19, 2011, 01:52:35 PM
You guys are getting way off track. Here's how it will shake down:
-Schools will align into new, 16 team conferences, this will apply to all sports
-The BCS will "contract" to include only these 4 "super conferences" in FOOTBALL
-The rest of the varsity sports are entirely unaffected (competitively) by the BCS in any way.
So, for example, Syracuse women's golf will now play against Duke and Virginia, but there will not be a "BCS of Women's Golf". Similarly, there will not be a "BCS of College Hoops"... the NCAA already owns and runs the best non-Football TV product in the Tournament and makes a killing off of it. If you'll notice, current BCS alignment has NOTHING to do with who makes the field (theoretically).
Therefore, conference expansion/realignment/goat-f*cking will eventually force MU out of the "BCS Conference", but not out of any kind of ability to qualify for the tournament. The idea that the BCS will somehow spread to any other sport than Football is absurd.
It's not at all out of the realm of plausibility that the four superconferences secede from the NCAA entirely and form their own 64-team confederation. Besides keeping ALL the revenue for themselves, they can do away with pesky things like NCAA violations and academic rules and whatnot. I'm not saying this will happen, but you're wrong to dismiss the concept out of hand.
Quote from: Jblattner7 on September 19, 2011, 01:52:35 PM
Therefore, conference expansion/realignment/goat-f*cking will eventually force MU out of the "BCS Conference", but not out of any kind of ability to qualify for the tournament. The idea that the BCS will somehow spread to any other sport than Football is absurd.
It may be absurd, but 5 years ago, these moves were all considered absurd as well. I expect there will be discussions, possibly overtures to leave the NCAA and go on their own. Money will be big for them with less sharing. Will they call it the BCS? No. Many, including I, are using this term as a placeholder name, not the ultimate name.
It may not happen, as you suspect. To call it absurd, though, is to become like the ostrich.
Points taken, but i still disagree. Mainly for the two reasons:
1) College football never had an NCAA-sponsored championship, so molding the current Bowl system into the BCS was fairly simple... there was nothing standing in their way since all of the bowls were/are run by the Conferences and their sponsors
2) $$$$$$. Every other sport loses money (including a lot of hoops programs).Having to take on the responsibility to manage/run/fund/etc every other (or ANY other, including basketball) varsity sport is so far past the reach of the BCS conferences it's not even an option. They won't take on hoops because in the long run they will lose $ trying to figure out how to manage it.
Additionally, you'd have to convince all the same university presidents (not AD's) to create, fund, and run a new tournament to crown a champ, when one already exists where they make plenty of dough. The infrastructure and relationships already existed for the BCS to stamp it's name on it, not so with the tournament.
The great Myth is that the BCS is some governing body that rules and makes decisions similar to the NCAA. There are no headquarters, there is no president (just a rotating "coordinator" i.e one of the member schools presidents), there are no employees, there is just a computer, and a brand name, that's it.
None of this has anything to do with basketball. It will affect it, but it's just not in anyone's interest to try and overhaul the system that exists in hoops. I will agree that it's "possible", but it's so unlikely and so far in the future i don't think it's worth bothering with.
one more thing... the schools that are really getting screwed in all this are the ones that have football programs but arent going to be invited into any of the new superconferences... South Florida, Baylor, TCU, etc are really going to be screwed in all this as they will be left holding the bag in dying conferences but not be aligned with any shot at a title in football...
Quote from: Jblattner7 on September 19, 2011, 04:15:39 PM
one more thing... the schools that are really getting screwed in all this are the ones that have football programs but arent going to be invited into any of the new superconferences... South Florida, Baylor, TCU, etc are really going to be screwed in all this as they will be left holding the bag in dying conferences but not be aligned with any shot at a title in football...
That is where I see Washington stepping in. If your cut out, no money to offer athletic scholarships, not only for football, but all the other sports, depriving kids an education who don't get into those 64 schools. Will MU be able to offer women basketball schollies if thy can't find a league with a good TV contract?