MUScoop
MUScoop => Hangin' at the Al => Topic started by: CrackedSidewalksSays on January 26, 2011, 12:30:04 AM
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Formally Offensive Title
Written by: noreply@blogger.com (muwarrior92)
(http://findavet.us/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/choking-dog-cartoon.jpg)
(http://findavet.us/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/choking-dog-cartoon.jpg)
Been there, done that and that and that and that again.
Marquette with lead in the second half finds way to piss it away and lose again. We have this one done pat it seems. It's not the first time this year, hell it's not the first time in the last 4 days. Once again Marquette finds away to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory.
Up 60 to 55 in the second half, MU allows a 13-0 run to #5 UCONN killing any hopes Marquette had of a victory tonight against the Huskies. If this sounds familiar, it is. MU led by 11 at Notre Dame on Saturday and pissed that game away. Only 7 days earlier MU led by 18 points against Louisville with barely five minutes to play and wet the bed to lose by 1. Three blown games in 10 days...that's impressive. Of course earlier in the year MU also blew a late lead against Vanderbilt and nearly choked it all away against a dreadful UW-Milwaukee team.
Why is this happening? For starters, our defense is brutal. The easy baskets we allow teams to "earn" is amazing. We seem to value this concept of shooting more free throws than our opponents take, but that has made us into a defensive team that fears fouling. Fears physicality on the defensive side of the ball. That's strange, because offensively our guys are tough as nails, they take it to the hoop, they get hit, they bang, they're warriors. Flip to the defensive side of the ball, and you would think they were playing flag football instead of tackle.
Ok, enough of the defensive lapses, what about offense. Marquette scored at the 11:25 mark on a Jimmy Butler layup and foul. Butler made the free throw for the old fashioned 3 point play. MU had the Big Mo, we were leading by 5 points and the crowd was rocking. So what happens? Marquette notches it's next field goal over 9 minutes later at the 1:50 mark on a DJO layup. Incidentally, that was DJO's first bucket in 15 minutes. In our 9 minute drought, MU managed to miss 7 shots, several free throws and turned the ball over 4 times (three of them by our point guards).
Some will argue it is because we aren't deep. Wait a minute, don't we have more top 100 players on our team than anytime in decades? We have plenty of depth, we just don't want to play these kids or have no confidence in them. Either that, or the kids were overrated and we made bad recruiting mistakes. It has to be something because there are plenty of warm bodies on the bench that have lots of pretty stars next to their names according to the recruiting services.
But should any of this really surprise anyone? Harken back to what the University of New Orleans fans said about Buzz several years ago. Two points stick out like a sore thumb.
- He has a short rotation
- His defenses stink
Sound familiar? Quotes like this from Jimmy Butler raise an eyebrow as well. "We were so concerned on offense that we were ready to get the ball back and try to score on that end," Butler said. "We weren't even worried about guarding them on the defensive end of the floor." We missed the context in which that answer was given and will provide an update if we can find it.
MU still has a chance to turn things around. Their RPI is in the zip code of an at large berth, they have plenty of top teams still to play to get back in it and the with 68 NCAA bids and seemingly ho-hum teams scattering the landscape nationwide, the opportunity is there. Will MU be tough enough to take it? Another opportunity presents itself against Syracuse later this week. A team MU has never beaten since joining the Big East. A team that is on a 3 game losing streak and looked beyond pathetic tonight against Seton Hall. Dare we say a MUST WIN for MU? Yes, it's a MUST WIN for MU at this point.
Three years into the Buzz Williams regime many didn't expect a potential NIT year this season, especially coming off 5 straight NCAA appearances and several stellar recruiting classes. In year three of the Tom Crean era MU went to the NCAA tournament after two misses. We may be seeing the reverse of that in year 3 with Buzz. We're not ready to throw in the towel yet, but the time to get things in gear is right now without a moment to waste. There is no more room for errors. There are no more games that can be pissed away at this point. Marquette needs to start winning and winning now.
On a positive note, Jimmy Butler's 21 points put him over 1,000 for his career. He is the 42nd player to accomplish that feat at Marquette.
This entry is dedicated to Rocky
http://www.crackedsidewalks.com/2011/01/marquette-choking-dogs-pee-themselves.html
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In Buzz we trust: Meltdown after meltdown.
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for me at least. Not in any way, shape, or form is this an acceptable way to treat this group of young men.
This board has become one giant turd sandwich......Adios
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I feel ya, indee. Who knew that MU produced so many whiners?
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for me at least. Not in any way, shape, or form is this an acceptable way to treat this group of young men.
This board has become one giant turd sandwich......Adios
Agree. Title is more than satirical. Offensive.
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for me at least. Not in any way, shape, or form is this an acceptable way to treat this group of young men.
+1000 - Unacceptable. It would be one thing if the problem was a lack of effort. These kids are playing hard but are struggling right now
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+1000 - Unacceptable. It would be one thing if the problem was a lack of effort. These kids are playing hard but are struggling right now
The absolutely disgusting part is that the same jackasses that write this stuff will be back on the bandwagon when (ok...if) we start pulling some of these close games out. And probably trying to figure out a way to take credit/share in the glory. After all, they went to Marquette so they must in some way be responsible for any success, right?
The sense of entitlement of many of our fans is astounding. I'm well on my way to thinking the UW-Madison's fan base is far more rational than ours.
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for me at least. Not in any way, shape, or form is this an acceptable way to treat this group of young men.
This board has become one giant turd sandwich......Adios
Just to clarify - this is a Cracked Sidewalks blog post which we pull in automatically (including the title).
While many of the points are valid, it appears the author worked in a number of personal grievances, and is pissy because he was banned from MUScoop last night (hence the "This entry is dedicated to Rocky").
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Just to clarify - this is a Cracked Sidewalks blog post which we pull in automatically (including the title).
While many of the points are valid, it appears the author worked in a number of personal grievances, and is pissy because he was banned from MUScoop last night (hence the "This entry is dedicated to Rocky").
THANK SWEET BABY JESUS
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344 D1 teams. Two end the year with a win. On any given night, at least 172 fanbases are unhappy. Probably closer to 200, as several whine about the quality of a win. I would like to expect a little maturity, a little evidence of a Jesuit education, from my MU brethren. A loss does not reflect on you personally. You are not somehow diminished today, unless you choose to tie your sense of self esteem to a bunch of young men who represent a university you once attended. If you are ashamed of them, do you think that if they read this and realized that an MU education means nothing to some, that they would be ashamed of you and the way you react to the outcome of an athletic contest? I feel ya, ATL MU. We are lowering ourselves to an embarrassing level.
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344 D1 teams. Two end the year with a win. On any given night, at least 172 fanbases are unhappy. Probably closer to 200, as several whine about the quality of a win. I would like to expect a little maturity, a little evidence of a Jesuit education, from my MU brethren. A loss does not reflect on you personally. You are not somehow diminished today, unless you choose to tie your sense of self esteem to a bunch of young men who represent a university you once attended. If you are ashamed of them, do you think that if they read this and realized that an MU education means nothing to some, that they would be ashamed of you and the way you react to the outcome of an athletic contest? I feel ya, ATL MU. We are lowering ourselves to an embarrassing level.
You said this far better than I ever could have. Thanks
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This post on Cracked Sidewalks is a complete embarrassment to all Marquette fans.
First of all, it was a tough loss last night but anybody who was at the game could tell you that we lost to a better team. We didn't "choke" the game away. We were down 7 (or 9, I can't remember) at halftime, fought back to take the lead and couldn't hold on. Obviously, the Louisville game was another story but I thought we were simply outmanned last night. The "author" cites the Vanderbilt game as another choke job. Seriously? I was at that game. We played a helluva game. Had a chance to win and an unfortunate slip kept us from getting a shot off. What in the world is this guy talking about?
I mean...calling our players "dogs?" Totally and completely uncalled for and lacking in any sense. I seriously wonder if there is something personally wrong with the author this season as his tone has lacked any objectivity at all. Criticize the coach if you want. He's fair game, he gets paid to take the heat. Calling teenagers and kids in their early 20s "choking dogs" is about as pathetic as it gets.
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This BS blog post has no place on this board....embarrassing.
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I agree with the overall sentiment on this thread. Classless title and classless write-up.
If someone believes that a "choke job" entails losing a game against the #5 team in the country despite having a whopping 5 point lead with 7:30 remaining should not be writing about basketball.
My assumption is that the article was written immediately following the game with about 6-8 Miller Lites in the author's system.
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Just to clarify - this is a Cracked Sidewalks blog post which we pull in automatically (including the title).
While many of the points are valid, it appears the author worked in a number of personal grievances, and is pissy because he was banned from MUScoop last night (hence the "This entry is dedicated to Rocky").
it's about damn time.
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I can't F'ing believe this.
Yeah, because a 5 point lead with a lot of time left is completely unacceptable to lose....vs. the #5 team in the country.
F*cking ridiculous.
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In Buzz we trust: Meltdown after meltdown.
Yeah, we all heard you. Seriously, that crap is getting lame. "In willie we trust: stupid, repetitive, pseudo-cleverness--but only after losses."
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Just to clarify - this is a Cracked Sidewalks blog post which we pull in automatically (including the title).
While many of the points are valid, it appears the author worked in a number of personal grievances, and is pissy because he was banned from MUScoop last night (hence the "This entry is dedicated to Rocky").
Who is it?
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The irony here is that if the author is the person most of us think he is, it's the same guy who frequently bashed anyone who had the temerity to criticize a college kid who was giving his all for his school.
Now the same person is describing the current crop of college kids giving their all for his school as choking dogs who pee themselves.
I wonder what's changed between now and then.
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I'm glad that there is finally a thread on this board where reason is starting to take over. I felt like the past 16 hours was like if Y2K had kicked in for a night and everyone had to hide in their homes in some sort of scary dark period. There were a lot of usernames that have just sprouted up spouting a lot of vitriol and embodying the type of (read: lack of) fandom we love to hate from other schools.
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Who is it?
your buddy.
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So I am confused, we cannot hand Marquette players criticism now? I get that the tone was a bit harsh but the overall point is valid, MU is playing with no consistency right now, and I don't care if it is the #5 team in the country, or #18 or #16 the fact is the last three losses we had decent leads fairly deep in the second half and are pissing it away. Its time to stop continually coddling these players and calling them "kids." I'm pretty sure thousands of men and women their age overseas put up with a lot more strife than a few negative/unhappy posts. MU isn't playing well and the players and coaches are letting themselves get beat by teams that are very beatable. Theres this concept that its ok to post only when positive things are brought to the table. That "we can't fault these young men because they give it their all." That's bogus they signed with a team in a power conference and therefore they can put up with a little needed criticism. I for one am tired of seeing MU piss away late second half leads. I know I am going to get heat for this but whatever, its national college basketball these kids have full rides (except RoFro) and they're most important job is to do the one thing that they love, shooting hoops, sorry my sympathy is all but run out. Criticism of poor play isn't lack of fandom, its facing the reality that we need to right this ship and fast.
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Its time to stop continually coddling these players and calling them "kids." I'm pretty sure thousands of men and women their age overseas put up with a lot more strife than a few negative/unhappy posts
At least we're keeping perspective.
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At least we're keeping perspective.
+1,000.
Anybody who analogizes college basketball to war needs to have their computer taken away.
That said, I'm glad to hear that calling players dogs who wet themselves is the kind of "needed criticism" that'll "right this ship and fast."
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So I am confused, we cannot hand Marquette players criticism now? I get that the tone was a bit harsh but the overall point is valid, MU is playing with no consistency right now, and I don't care if it is the #5 team in the country, or #18 or #16 the fact is the last three losses we had decent leads fairly deep in the second half and are pissing it away. Its time to stop continually coddling these players and calling them "kids." I'm pretty sure thousands of men and women their age overseas put up with a lot more strife than a few negative/unhappy posts. MU isn't playing well and the players and coaches are letting themselves get beat by teams that are very beatable. Theres this concept that its ok to post only when positive things are brought to the table. That "we can't fault these young men because they give it their all." That's bogus they signed with a team in a power conference and therefore they can put up with a little needed criticism. I for one am tired of seeing MU piss away late second half leads. I know I am going to get heat for this but whatever, its national college basketball these kids have full rides (except RoFro) and they're most important job is to do the one thing that they love, shooting hoops, sorry my sympathy is all but run out. Criticism of poor play isn't lack of fandom, its facing the reality that we need to right this ship and fast.
First, please use the return tab every so often so that we can read what you're saying. Second, I don't think most here would disagree with what you're saying. Criticize away, just do it with some class.
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your buddy.
OK...it's Jay Bee.
I'm amazed that the CS bloggers would allow him to be part of their group. I don't think he wrote one intelligent basketball point on this board as long as I've been here.
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+1,000.
Anybody who analogizes college basketball to war needs to have their computer taken away.
That I'm glad to hear that calling players dogs who wet themselves is the kind of "needed criticism" that'll "right this ship and fast."
As I said the tone was harsh, but seriously it should be ok to say a team isn't doing well even if they are giving it their all, but frankly I'm not buying that, a couple might be putting their all in it but its not everyone on that team.
At no point am I comparing war to college basketball and if thats how you read that's on you. Point is that I'm pretty sure even with the petty name calling from CS, I think these young ball players can handle criticism and whether they read it or not they prolly don't care and if everyone hates the article so much why is it getting so much feedback. Negative feedback is still feedback.
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The topic of this thread and the CW blog is the ultimate in lack of taste and sensibility. SHAME...SHAME
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The topic of this thread and the CW blog is the ultimate in lack of taste and sensibility. SHAME...SHAME
/signed
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Am I a bad person for thinking it's a little funny?
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OK...it's Jay Bee.
I'm amazed that the CS bloggers would allow him to be part of their group. I don't think he wrote one intelligent basketball point on this board as long as I've been here.
Uh, no, JayBee is not a CS contributor.
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As I said the tone was harsh, but seriously it should be ok to say a team isn't doing well even if they are giving it their all, but frankly I'm not buying that, a couple might be putting their all in it but its not everyone on that team.
First, nobody is suggesting that any and all criticism should be (or is ... why not read the site?) off limits. Rather, the complaints are geared toward the nature and tone of the criticism. Saying a kid played poorly, didn't something incorrectly, needs to do something else better, etc., is and should be fair game. Likening kids to animals with bladder control issues shouldn't be.
Get it?
Secondly, please enlighten us on who isn't trying (and how you can tell).
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First, nobody is suggesting that any and all criticism should be (or is ... why not read the site?) off limits. Rather, the complaints are geared toward the nature and tone of the criticism. Saying a kid played poorly, didn't something incorrectly, needs to do something else better, etc., is and should be fair game. Likening kids to animals with bladder control issues shouldn't be.
Get it?
Secondly, please enlighten us on who isn't trying (and how you can tell).
Thank you.
I don't understand why this is so hard for some people to grasp.
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Secondly, please enlighten us on who isn't trying (and how you can tell).
Never said they weren't trying. I just feel that the term "giving it their all" is thrown around too much, if everyone was giving it their all we wouldn't have these late losses and the decline in production.
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your buddy.
Who is MUWarrior92 and what was he banned for?
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This headline is embarassing and immature. It reflects poorly on MU which we all have a stake in. I can't imagine it makes a recruit excited about MU. It has fostered no good discussions about MU. There is no point to having this post.
I appreciate the free speech on this site, but there is really nothing good about posts that look like it came from a immature high school sophmore.
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This headline is embarassing and immature. It reflects poorly on MU which we all have a stake in. I can't imagine it makes a recruit excited about MU. It has fostered no good discussions about MU. There is no point to having this post.
I appreciate the free speech on this site, but there is really nothing good about posts that look like it came from a immature high school sophmore.
Again, this site subscribes to the blogs of Rosiak, Cracked Sidewalks and Go Marquette that are automatically added to MUScoop as a post. This particular post is from Cracked Sidewalks, a blog we like very much. We're not going to start censoring their content as well. We'd much rather the discussion take place.
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Who is MUWarrior92 and what was he banned for?
that's chicos. (the only CS blogger that doesn't put his real name out there.)
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Again, this site subscribes to the blogs of Rosiak, Cracked Sidewalks and Go Marquette that are automatically added to MUScoop as a post. This particular post is from Cracked Sidewalks, a blog we like very much. We're not going to start censoring their content as well. We'd much rather the discussion take place.
I love that Scoop brings us the blogs from all of these sources. Usually they are interesting and informative. This particularly distastful leap off the deep end reflects poorly only on its author. It's too bad - he's a smart guy. If he can get past his anger and sense of victimhood he has something to offer.
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I'm going to give the author of this post the same treatment he gives our current coach: I know him; I like him; I know that he's as big of a Marquette fan as any other poster on this board; I agree with a lot of what he says on this board and I even defend him quite a bit; but this article makes me squirm.
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Looks like he changed the title of the article. I was fine with most of the content, I just thought the title lacked some class by basically calling our players names, and I posted as much in the comments section.
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that's chicos. (the only CS blogger that doesn't put his real name out there.)
Oh...OK.
So JB and CBB got banned? I can live with that.
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Chicos changed the title on CS, could the mods do the same here?
New Title: Rinse, repeat, rinse, repeat.
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Oh...OK.
So JB and CBB got banned? I can live with that.
And Ners too (http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=23969.0) (see Reply #14). A two week vacation.
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Chicos changed the title on CS, could the mods do the same here?
New Title: Rinse, repeat, rinse, repeat.
Sure
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Sure
Thanks, SoCal. Much appreciated.
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This post (and accompanying CS blog entry) really strikes me the wrong way.
Pulling out quotes from UNO fans when Buzz bounced for MU? Really? C'mon.
I thoroughly enjoy the majority (all, until I read this) of contributors to CS, but my advice to the blog owner is to not let this author discredit all of the hard work the rest of the intelligent CS contributors share with MU grads and fans. Keep it intelligent, or keep it off the CS site.
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I'm with the vast majority who dislike referring to our players as dogs. IMO, they do a fine job representing the university. However, I was at the game last night. It DID seem like the effort was lacking from both the fans and the players. Can't put my finger on it but the whole BC seemed a little off.
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I'm with the vast majority who dislike referring to our players as dogs.
Unless it's Junkyard Dogs.
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344 D1 teams. Two end the year with a win. On any given night, at least 172 fanbases are unhappy. Probably closer to 200, as several whine about the quality of a win. I would like to expect a little maturity, a little evidence of a Jesuit education, from my MU brethren. A loss does not reflect on you personally. You are not somehow diminished today, unless you choose to tie your sense of self esteem to a bunch of young men who represent a university you once attended. If you are ashamed of them, do you think that if they read this and realized that an MU education means nothing to some, that they would be ashamed of you and the way you react to the outcome of an athletic contest? I feel ya, ATL MU. We are lowering ourselves to an embarrassing level.
Perfectly stated.
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As a CS contributor, I was also disappointed with this post. While there may have been several good points, they were lost in the tone, language, and especially the headline.
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344 D1 teams. Two end the year with a win. On any given night, at least 172 fanbases are unhappy. Probably closer to 200, as several whine about the quality of a win. I would like to expect a little maturity, a little evidence of a Jesuit education, from my MU brethren. A loss does not reflect on you personally. You are not somehow diminished today, unless you choose to tie your sense of self esteem to a bunch of young men who represent a university you once attended. If you are ashamed of them, do you think that if they read this and realized that an MU education means nothing to some, that they would be ashamed of you and the way you react to the outcome of an athletic contest? I feel ya, ATL MU. We are lowering ourselves to an embarrassing level.
Just to be a jerk... probably a few Ivy League teams end the year with a win as well, so the number's more like 6-7 ;D.
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Duly noted......
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I'm with the vast majority who dislike referring to our players as dogs.
Be careful. Chicos may commission his aide-de-camp to conduct a survey on whether the "vast majority" actually agrees with you.
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This post (and accompanying CS blog entry) really strikes me the wrong way.
Pulling out quotes from UNO fans when Buzz bounced for MU? Really? C'mon.
I thoroughly enjoy the majority (all, until I read this) of contributors to CS, but my advice to the blog owner is to not let this author discredit all of the hard work the rest of the intelligent CS contributors share with MU grads and fans. Keep it intelligent, or keep it off the CS site.
IMO, some of the warning signs that were brought up by the UNO faithful sure have seemed right on the money.
It's not even a question anymore that Buzz cannot coach defense.
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Originally posted 12:30 AM - did adult beverages play a role?
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Along with hurt feelings.
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Not enough good basketball discussion on Scoop anymore. Too much over the top criticism of everyone, coaches, players, posters.
Time to leave this immature bunch.
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Whoa, with warriormom leaving, that brings Scoop's gender demographics from 99.5% male to 99.8%.
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Ironically, warriormom posted very little about basketball.
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IMO, some of the warning signs that were brought up by the UNO faithful sure have seemed right on the money.
Well he has a short rotation for sure but I'm not sure he is necessarily to blame for this. The defensive thing is an issue. OTOH, what I don't understand is how a two year player like EWill can't figure things out enough to get on the floor. Does Buzz not do a good enough job teaching these kids? Can they just not pick it up? Is the scheme bad?
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Well he has a short rotation for sure but I'm not sure he is necessarily to blame for this. The defensive thing is an issue. OTOH, what I don't understand is how a two year player like EWill can't figure things out enough to get on the floor. Does Buzz not do a good enough job teaching these kids? Can they just not pick it up? Is the scheme bad?
sometimes i think coaches try to make things more complicated than there are. Whatever happened to just guarding the man in front of you. All this helping out and switching and hitting your spot seems to be leading to a lot of layups. Hell, getting beat one on one by the man you are guarding can't be much worse than they are doing now with all the helping out and switching.