OOops, yes I guess they just did that as well.
Awesome day ::)
Really? Do we really need another kick-in-the-pants thread? I could have been pleasantly oblivious to this until tomorrow and been much happier.
Seriously, Chicos, you're being as bad as nmb today. I generally like you, I really do, but between this and the lame IU thread...just too much today. Please stop.
Your boy Gasser had another big day - 2 points, 0 rebounds, 0 assists, 1 turnover, 3 fouls in 23 minutes. Almost impossible to log that much time and put up those numbers.
unnatural carnal knowledge the badgers. UIC beat Illinois, so... Not a big shock.
Quote from: brewcity77 on January 15, 2011, 04:33:17 PM
Really? Do we really need another kick-in-the-pants thread? I could have been pleasantly oblivious to this until tomorrow and been much happier.
Seriously, Chicos, you're being as bad as nmb today. I generally like you, I really do, but between this and the lame IU thread...just too much today. Please stop.
Fish gotta swim. Birds gotta fly.
UW has the best team in the state this season, no question. Give credit where credit is due.
Speaking of traditional...the #1 pick in the 2011 NBA draft sure has been lighting it up lately.
http://scores.espn.go.com/ncb/player/profile?playerId=51315
At least he scored today! Vander had a lot of zeros in his line! LOL
Quote from: thebadge10 on January 15, 2011, 06:22:46 PM
At least he scored today! Vander had a lot of zeros in his line! LOL
Hey, Vander had a turnover and three fouls! :)
Quote from: OnWisconsin on January 15, 2011, 06:53:54 PM
Hey, Vander had a turnover and three fouls! :)
Whatever. You guys would trade both testicles and Gasser for Vander. He's soooooo much better of a player.
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on January 15, 2011, 04:21:38 PM
OOops, yes I guess they just did that as well.
Awesome day ::)
Why would you post this? I respect that you and I often view things differently...I have no respect for this type of thing.
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on January 15, 2011, 04:21:38 PM
OOops, yes I guess they just did that as well.
Awesome day ::)
You've become the Ernest T. Bass of MUScoop.
Quote from: avid1010 on January 15, 2011, 07:51:07 PM
Why would you post this? I respect that you and I often view things differently...I have no respect for this type of thing.
This is who he is. If you do not respect this type of thing, you do not respect the OP.
An absolutely devastating loss for MU, a nice win for UW and a big lead for Indiana. Striped Tomato, er, Chicos, is having his finest day in quite some time.
Quote from: Lennys Tap on January 15, 2011, 04:33:43 PM
Your boy Gasser had another big day - 2 points, 0 rebounds, 0 assists, 1 turnover, 3 fouls in 23 minutes. Almost impossible to log that much time and put up those numbers.
My "boy" Gasser. Lol. He's enjoying a win over a ranked team tonight.
I'll say this about UW, they are boring, not very athletic but they play smart and traditional...we don't which is why we have a higher ceiling and a lower basement.
Our stupidity sometimes really hurts any athletic advantages we have.
Quote from: 4everwarriors on January 15, 2011, 05:02:19 PM
UW has the best team in the state this season, no question. Give credit where credit is due.
Yup. Best program the last decade, too, but instead people here want to attack their traditional play and posters here that ask why we can't land a few players that play with a high basketball IQ consistently.
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on January 15, 2011, 08:55:42 PM
My "boy" Gasser. Lol. He's enjoying a win over a ranked team tonight.
I'll say this about UW, they are boring, not very athletic but they play smart and traditional...we don't which is why we have a higher ceiling and a lower basement.
Our stupidity sometimes really hurts any athletic advantages we have.
This string of statements is such garbage. WI just choked away a 9 point lead in 2.5 minutes 5 days ago. The only reason they didn't lose in regulation is because MSU wasn't good enough to close it out in regulation. Instead, they closed it out in overtime. Really don't believe we have an athletic advantage over Louisville. Thought we did a really good job of diagnosing the man-zone defense that changed even within possessions. Thought for 35 minutes we played smarter than Louisville. Lost because of the reason teams lose when they get up big - sat on the ball and lost our aggression. Not going to call you a racist because the ignorant and inflammatory statements could be attributed any number of factors, including my guess which is you just get off on making ignorant and inflammatory statements.
Quote from: karavotsos on January 15, 2011, 10:07:36 PM
This string of statements is such garbage. WI just choked away a 9 point lead in 2.5 minutes 5 days ago. The only reason they didn't lose in regulation is because MSU wasn't good enough to close it out in regulation. Instead, they closed it out in overtime. Really don't believe we have an athletic advantage over Louisville. Thought we did a really good job of diagnosing the man-zone defense that changed even within possessions. Thought for 35 minutes we played smarter than Louisville. Lost because of the reason teams lose when they get up big - sat on the ball and lost our aggression. Not going to call you a racist because the ignorant and inflammatory statements could be attributed any number of factors, including my guess which is you just get off on making ignorant and inflammatory statements.
Perfectly said
Quote from: GOMU1104 on January 15, 2011, 05:08:04 PM
Speaking of traditional...the #1 pick in the 2011 NBA draft sure has been lighting it up lately.
http://scores.espn.go.com/ncb/player/profile?playerId=51315
When I was younger we used to say things like "that is so gay", which meant lame or incredibly stupid. I'm not sure if you can say that anymore, but just in case, that was so gay (using the definition above). I thought you hated this board, why are you here?
Definitely gay, especially since you didn't use teal.
Quote from: karavotsos on January 15, 2011, 10:07:36 PM
This string of statements is such garbage. WI just choked away a 9 point lead in 2.5 minutes 5 days ago. The only reason they didn't lose in regulation is because MSU wasn't good enough to close it out in regulation. Instead, they closed it out in overtime. Really don't believe we have an athletic advantage over Louisville. Thought we did a really good job of diagnosing the man-zone defense that changed even within possessions. Thought for 35 minutes we played smarter than Louisville. Lost because of the reason teams lose when they get up big - sat on the ball and lost our aggression. Not going to call you a racist because the ignorant and inflammatory statements could be attributed any number of factors, including my guess which is you just get off on making ignorant and inflammatory statements.
You're not going to say racist but you're going to say it anyway. LOL. Classic.
Why did you bring up race at all, it has nothing to do with race but I'm not surprised at all you went there. I would do anything to have 12 Wesley Matthews on this team, can you tell me what race he is?
There is not one iota of racism in my statements....stupid basketball knows no race. Are you saying we play smart basketball? Is the new bugaboo from you and Lenny's Tap going to be that anyone that says we play stupid basketball or a player(s) make dumb decisions that it's racist?
Incredible. Please just come out and say that out now so every poster here can understand what the new ground rules are and what labels will be applied to someone who dares to say we play dumb basketball at times and thus must be racist for thinking that way. Incredible.
Quote from: Lennys Tap on January 15, 2011, 10:58:53 PM
Perfectly said
(http://cdn.screenrant.com/wp-content/uploads/house-season-7-premiere-review.jpg)
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on January 15, 2011, 11:14:25 PM
When I was younger we used to say things like "that is so gay", which meant lame or incredibly stupid. I'm not sure if you can say that anymore, but just in case, that was so gay (using the definition above). I thought you hated this board, why are you here?
Definitely gay, especially since you didn't use teal.
You're smarter than this.
Quote from: avid1010 on January 15, 2011, 07:51:07 PM
Why would you post this? I respect that you and I often view things differently...I have no respect for this type of thing.
Example number 10,000....you could say this about many threads here, I don't recall you, Lenny or a few others ever saying that about any of those threads. I wonder why? Wait, no I don't. We know exactly why you don't get upset when others do it. Carry on with selective outrage.
I am saying that to say one team plays smart basketball or another plays dumb basketball all the time is an overgeneralization. I would say yes, Marquette for the most part plays smart basketball. Buzz is a good basketball coach, and he teaches guys to recognize how to beat teams based on mismatches and individual teams' weaknesses. Bo does the same things. Their mismatch is that they have big guys who can draw big guys out on the floor and shoot and generally handle the ball. He teaches them to play D within the 3 point line. They don't extend. It works to a degree.
I am saying we did not lose today because we had a lower basketball IQ. I am saying that you cannot say that we lost because we have a low basketball IQ and that WI has a high basketball IQ and would not have lost this game if we were WI with this lead because WI lost a similar lead 6 days ago. I am saying there is some other reason that you say the things you say aside from what actually happened. I don't care what anyone calls it.
If you prefer WI and the way they play just say it. I don't. I like the way MU plays. I think its very smart. Guys don't execute all the time. I think we attempt a higher degree of difficulty and more things. The higher ceiling lower floor thing is stupid. You just say that so you can say you're right either way. And instead of responding to statements you whine about this or that. Defend your statement that WI has a higher IQ. Explain what that means.
Well Krav, you didn't really say that, you brought in the racist charge and tried to be cute with it and said you weren't really saying it but just kind of throwing it out there to see if you can score some kind of points. That was B.S.
I think Buzz is a good coach and I think we have some very good players, the problem is that at this level everyone's a good coach and has very good players. It's often the team that plays smarter and executes that wins the games. I do not care for how Wisconsin plays basketball, but at the end of the day they get results.
I think Bo Ryan is a better coach and has less skilled players than we do but they still end up having tremendous results. Yes, that's frustrating on many levels.
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on January 16, 2011, 12:47:08 AM
I think Buzz is a good coach and I think we have some very good players, the problem is that at this level everyone's a good coach and has very good players. It's often the team that plays smarter and executes that wins the games. I do not care for how Wisconsin plays basketball, but at the end of the day they get results.
I think Bo Ryan is a better coach and has less skilled players than we do but they still end up having tremendous results. Yes, that's frustrating on many levels.
Disagree. Cronin is not a good coach, to name 1. There are years when players are not good; people told me last year that Kemba Walker and Jerome Dyson were not good guards. Disagree that WI gets results.
You did not answer the question regarding the loss at MSU. Disagree that WI gets "tremendous" results. Regarding the best team the past 10 years, MU is the only team with a Final 4 appearance in the last 10 years. Disagree that you do not care for how WI plays, or you would not compliment them so much. Really disagree that Bo is better than Buzz. I think Buzz sees the season as a process of going to work every day. Bo wants players who have the system learned to win on day 1. I vote for Buzz on that. Keep learning and getting better. Don't peak in December.
Also, I think you are doing a disservice to Leuer and Taylor especially by calling them less skilled. Nankovil also. Very good players.
Quote from: karavotsos on January 16, 2011, 01:04:28 AM
Disagree. Cronin is not a good coach, to name 1. There are years when players are not good; people told me last year that Kemba Walker and Jerome Dyson were not good guards. Disagree that WI gets results.
You did not answer the question regarding the loss at MSU. Disagree that WI gets "tremendous" results. Regarding the best team the past 10 years, MU is the only team with a Final 4 appearance in the last 10 years. Disagree that you do not care for how WI plays, or you would not compliment them so much. Really disagree that Bo is better than Buzz. I think Buzz sees the season as a process of going to work every day. Bo wants players who have the system learned to win on day 1. I vote for Buzz on that. Keep learning and getting better. Don't peak in December.
Also, I think you are doing a disservice to Leuer and Taylor especially by calling them less skilled. Nankovil also. Very good players.
Go back through the years and see how often I compliment Wisconsin....not very much. I think Bo Ryan is a complete jagoff for a number of reasons. I don't care for their style at all.
You don't agree they get results? WTF? Then you must really be pissed off at how we do.
What have they done this last decade beside go to the NCAAs every year, win several Big Ten titles, several Big Ten Tournament titles, win more NCAA games then us, win more games than us, win more head to head games than us, win more conference titles than us, win more conference tourney games than us, win more conference tournament titles than us. I'd hate to see how you describe our results. Whoa.
I think Leuer is a very good player as is Taylor and Nankivil can be at times. But when you compare who we have brought into our program vs theirs in the last decade in terms of quality and quantity, it's not close. Half the problem is that a lot of our guys have left while only a few have left that program.
I really don't get your December comments either. In order to win a Big Ten tournament title, don't you have to be playing well in March? In the last five years they have gone to the Big Ten tourney title game twice and won it all once. They've won over 30 games twice in the last five years. The last time they were one and done in the NCAAs....2006. They have consistently played very good basketball at the end of the season with the exception of 2006, on average winning 8 of their final 10 regular season games. Let's not let facts get in the way.
Please explain what results mean to you because I'm puzzled to find what they could possibly be.
Finally on MSU, yup...Wisconsin choked that game. I wonder how many chokes they've had in the last 3 years?
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on January 16, 2011, 12:47:08 AM
Well Krav, you didn't really say that, you brought in the racist charge and tried to be cute with it and said you weren't really saying it but just kind of throwing it out there to see if you can score some kind of points. That was B.S.
I think Buzz is a good coach and I think we have some very good players, the problem is that at this level everyone's a good coach and has very good players. It's often the team that plays smarter and executes that wins the games. I do not care for how Wisconsin plays basketball, but at the end of the day they get results.
I think Bo Ryan is a better coach and has less skilled players than we do but they still end up having tremendous results. Yes, that's frustrating on many levels.
Yet again, what was the point of you starting this thread? Clearly you get enough attention....at least here...no?
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on January 15, 2011, 11:25:37 PMExample number 10,000....you could say this about many threads here, I don't recall you, Lenny or a few others ever saying that about any of those threads. I wonder why? Wait, no I don't. We know exactly why you don't get upset when others do it. Carry on with selective outrage.
What a load of crap. This thread has sweet-f-all to do with Marquette basketball. What, going to argue that a UW win helps our RPI? Please. All this is is an example of kicking MU fans when they're down. And as it comes from a fellow MU fan, it's more than a bit out-of-line and simply unnecessary.
I too remember a day when people said "that's so gay" but it was always clearly a derogatory remark based on homosexuality. In those days, this entire thread would have gotten that label. Today, we'd probably just call it lame. In 20 years, that'll probably be too insensitive to the legless.
But for now, Chicos, I'm calling it lame. As I said before, please stop. None of this is relevant to the loss at hand.
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on January 15, 2011, 11:25:37 PM
Example number 10,000....you could say this about many threads here, I don't recall you, Lenny or a few others ever saying that about any of those threads. I wonder why? Wait, no I don't. We know exactly why you don't get upset when others do it. Carry on with selective outrage.
Nobody is picking on you. Stop whining. Be a man, look in the mirror and face the fact that you bring this on yourself. You beg for attention then b*tch when a good deal of it is negative. The reason you are called out more than others is simple - you ask for it more often, and in a uniquely annoying style. You have said "I don't come here (to MU Scoop) to make friends". That's too bad, but that kind of an attitude has consequences.
Make sure to get some racist comments in there, too, Lenny....it wouldn't be complete without you agreeing with the poster making those original accusations. I hope to be a man like you, where you lie on this board about people, accuse people of being racists, etc.
Very man like, we should all aspire to be such men like you. ::)
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on January 15, 2011, 11:20:33 PM
(http://cdn.screenrant.com/wp-content/uploads/house-season-7-premiere-review.jpg)
what's with all the House photos?
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on January 16, 2011, 11:34:10 AM
Make sure to get some racist comments in there, too, Lenny....it wouldn't be complete without you agreeing with the poster making those original accusations. I hope to be a man like you, where you lie on this board about people, accuse people of being racists, etc.
Very man like, we should all aspire to be such men like you. ::)
Easy there, big fella. Nobody has accused you of being a racist. As a matter of fact, Karavotsos (the poster with whom I agreed) specifically said he DID NOT think of you as racist, but as someone who gets off on making ignorant and inflammatory statements. I agreed, though I will stipulate that the ignorance componant is unintentional (not the inflammatory part though). But keep playing the race card - anything to cement your status as victim. That bunker must be getting lonely.
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on January 15, 2011, 11:19:21 PM
Why did you bring up race at all, it has nothing to do with race but I'm not surprised at all you went there. I would do anything to have 12 Wesley Matthews on this team, can you tell me what race he is?
This sure sounds like the old, "but dudes, I have a black friend, so I'm not racist!!" Chicos, you read a lot of things that aren't there...
...although the reality is, as you admit and continue to bring up, you'd be feel less squeamish if Marquette had a traditional player in the lineup in place of one of our basketball-second JUCOs.
Quote from: ZiggysF*ckinFryBoy on January 16, 2011, 12:29:51 PM
what's with all the House photos?
My last name is House. The photos are either a lame attempt at humor or evidence that Chicos stalking is getting out of hand. Depends on your point of view. He frequently uses the creepy "I know who you are" tactic to annoy and/or piss people off. Just another example of Chicos being Chicos.
Quote from: karavotsos on January 15, 2011, 10:07:36 PM
Not going to call you a racist because the ignorant and inflammatory statements could be attributed any number of factors, including my guess which is you just get off on making ignorant and inflammatory statements.
Absolutely out of line. I'm not going to call the poster a moron because his use of the race card could be attributed to any number of factors. But if I were to speculate..... he's probably a moron.
Quote from: Jay Bee on January 16, 2011, 01:24:46 PM
This sure sounds like the old, "but dudes, I have a black friend, so I'm not racist!!" Chicos, you read a lot of things that aren't there...
...although the reality is, as you admit and continue to bring up, you'd be feel less squeamish if Marquette had a traditional player in the lineup in place of one of our basketball-second JUCOs.
I read a lot of things that aren't there....please...his comments were totally out of line. We play some dumb basketball at times and that cannot be denied. I don't care how people look, smell, how long their hair is, what color their skin or eyes are. Never have and never will...I don't with my hiring practices, my promotion practices and I certainly don't with the teams I follow.
I don't know how to read his comments any other way, they were way out of line.
Of course, this same clown was the one that said UW-madison doesn't get results and plays their best basketball in December not in March, so based on those total fallacies I should take him with a grain of salt.
Quote from: Lennys Tap on January 16, 2011, 01:32:10 PM
My last name is House. The photos are either a lame attempt at humor or evidence that Chicos stalking is getting out of hand. Depends on your point of view. He frequently uses the creepy "I know who you are" tactic to annoy and/or piss people off. Just another example of Chicos being Chicos.
so post some hot lesbian photos back at him. ;D
Quote from: ZiggysF*ckinFryBoy on January 16, 2011, 12:29:51 PM
what's with all the House photos?
House's motto is Everyone Lies. Considering how much Lenny's tendency is to do just that with what people say or his blatantly false accusations, it's a perfect fit.
Quote from: ZiggysF*ckinFryBoy on January 16, 2011, 03:27:12 PM
so post some hot lesbian photos back at him. ;D
Hahah... wuzz goooodd!!!
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/5/57/UtahStateUniversitySeal.png)
Quote from: ZiggysF*ckinFryBoy on January 16, 2011, 03:27:12 PM
so post some hot lesbian photos back at him. ;D
Exactly
(http://grp.funformobile.com/grpdata/210/lesbians.jpg)
(http://evilbeetgossip.film.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/10/lipstick_lesbians_kiss_jpg2.jpg)
Although something tells me Lenny might like this pair instead
(http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:Msp1PD9fW3Ui3M:http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg270/manbeasst/Hot_Lesbians.jpg&t=1)
Quote from: Jay Bee on January 16, 2011, 01:24:46 PM
This sure sounds like the old, "but dudes, I have a black friend, so I'm not racist!!" Chicos, you read a lot of things that aren't there...
Chicos relishes being the victim.
Seriously, I have tried to defend him before because I agree with a number of points, but his self-victimization is just so annoying. He's like a little kid that throws sticks at his older brother, and when the older brother finally punches him, goes running to mommy...
Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on January 16, 2011, 04:26:43 PM
Chicos relishes being the victim.
Seriously, I have tried to defend him before because I agree with a number of points, but his self-victimization is just so annoying. He's like a little kid that throws sticks at his older brother, and when the older brother finally punches him, goes running to mommy...
I've spent (wasted?) thousands of words on the guy and you summed him up better in one sentence than I ever could.
Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on January 16, 2011, 04:26:43 PM
Chicos relishes being the victim.
Seriously, I have tried to defend him before because I agree with a number of points, but his self-victimization is just so annoying. He's like a little kid that throws sticks at his older brother, and when the older brother finally punches him, goes running to mommy...
There is a spot waiting for this post in the Message Board Hall of Fame. Well done.
Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on January 16, 2011, 04:26:43 PM
Chicos relishes being the victim.
Seriously, I have tried to defend him before because I agree with a number of points, but his self-victimization is just so annoying. He's like a little kid that throws sticks at his older brother, and when the older brother finally punches him, goes running to mommy...
Nah....I just don't appreciate being called a racist when I'm not and you better damn well bet I'm going to bellow an objection to that. Nor am I going to put up with House's constant lies without calling him on it either...by the way House, it's three sentences, not one....maybe you should go back to that 5th grade math commentary you had the other day and learn to count.
No self-victimization either, it is what is it and has proven time and again. It depends WHO says it, not WHAT is said and that's been the case here for a long time. If I felt like a victim, I wouldn't come back. What's the point? None.
GOMU...maybe you can attend the Hall of Fame Message Board induction here for the very message board you despise. That would be cool. LOL.
Quote from: GOMU1104 on January 15, 2011, 11:21:42 PM
You're smarter than this.
So are you, or at least I thought. No one ever said Gasser was the end all answer. It all started with a very simple question on why we didn't even offer the kid. From there, well it became a life of it's own.
Margaret says, "behave!"
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/20/Margaret_Thatcher.png/225px-Margaret_Thatcher.png)
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on January 16, 2011, 05:40:11 PM
So are you, or at least I thought. No one ever said Gasser was the end all answer. It all started with a very simple question on why we didn't even offer the kid. From there, well it became a life of it's own.
You caused that to happen, my friend.
BTW...You are twisting words around. Dont you usually chastise posters for doing the same thing to you?
Tradition is...18% from beyond the arc.
Can you guys make a resolution to keep your bitch fights into one thread? It's getting to the point where this bickering is making Scoop itself shitty.
For the sake of MUScoop, quit acting like a bunch of 7th grade girls and grow up.
Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on January 16, 2011, 04:26:43 PM
Chicos relishes being the victim.
Seriously, I have tried to defend him before because I agree with a number of points, but his self-victimization is just so annoying. He's like a little kid that throws sticks at his older brother, and when the older brother finally punches him, goes running to mommy...
+1
I've said before and in this thread that I generally like Chicos. But stuff like this is ridiculous. What place does this thread have in this forum? What point does it's creation serve other than to rile up Marquette fans? And what is more galling than knowing that the person rubbing salt into your wounds supports the same team you do. I've brought this general point up twice in here and been conveniently ignored by the thread-starter. I don't know if it's because he doesn't have an answer or because I have made decent rational points without making personal attacks so he doesn't know how to respond.
Come on, Chicos, is there really any rational need for this thread or argument? Especially in the emotional wake of one of the biggest choke jobs in NCAA history?
You guys are only picking on Chicos because it's him. If anyone else would have started this thread you would have had no issue with it.
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on January 16, 2011, 05:38:25 PM.by the way House, it's three sentences, not one....maybe you should go back to that 5th grade math commentary you had the other day and learn to count.
It was just the final sentence about throwing stuff and then running to Mommy that I was referring to.
Quote from: brewcity77 on January 16, 2011, 06:52:51 PM
+1
I've said before and in this thread that I generally like Chicos. But stuff like this is ridiculous. What place does this thread have in this forum? What point does it's creation serve other than to rile up Marquette fans? And what is more galling than knowing that the person rubbing salt into your wounds supports the same team you do. I've brought this general point up twice in here and been conveniently ignored by the thread-starter. I don't know if it's because he doesn't have an answer or because I have made decent rational points without making personal attacks so he doesn't know how to respond.
Come on, Chicos, is there really any rational need for this thread or argument? Especially in the emotional wake of one of the biggest choke jobs in NCAA history?
I think you're looking in the wrong direction.
Go back and read some threads from 2006, 2007, 2008. Specifically look at Chico's contributions. Compare the nature of those who responded to him back then with discussions today.
After you look through those older posts, do you still want to blame him?
Now look at some MU Scoop registration dates:
Chicos: October 24, 2006, 06:34:22 PM
Lenny: January 19, 2009, 09:34:18 PM
Ners: November 14, 2009, 10:40:58 AM
Canadian Dimes: March 18, 2010, 02:14:54 PM
There is no argument that the civility on this board has taken a decided turn for the worse lately. It seems like every other thread results in either Lenny or Ners or Dimes making some ad-hominem attack, personal smear or namecalling, regardless of the subject. There have been more threads locked in the last few months than I recall in the history of the board--and the common thread seems to be that one of these guys is involved.
Here's a good example: Chicos asks a legit question about Gasser--a local kid with high-major offers (Maryland, Wisconsin, Northwestern) that goes off for 21 in his first game.
http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=22194.0 (http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=22194.0)
Do we get a discussion of his recruitment? Hardly.
--Lenny accuses him of being racist.
--Ners says he's on a "witch hunt"
--Canadian Dimes said he's "highly ignorant" and "smothered in agenda"
There was a time we could ask these questions and have civil discussions. For example, here's a question about the recruitment of Nick Fazekas from 2006:
http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=954.0 (http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=954.0)
Note that raising the question didn't lead to accusations of a witch hunt. Nobody jumped in and accused the guy of holding an anti-MU agenda. Nobody accused him of being racist for wanting Fazekas (who is white). Nobody callled him ignorant.
You can blame Chico's if you want--but you'll be blaming the wrong guy.
Quote from: Marquette84 on January 16, 2011, 08:22:10 PM
Here's a good example: Chicos asks a legit question about Gasser--a local kid with high-major offers (Maryland, Wisconsin, Northwestern) that goes off for 21 in his first game.
http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=22194.0 (http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=22194.0)
Do we get a discussion of his recruitment? Hardly.
--Lenny accuses him of being racist.
.
Just read the thread you referenced and nowhere do I call Chicos a racist. I will, however, unequivically call you a liar for saying it.
aw hell.
Ignore button was finally used for 2011.
Quote from: Jay Bee on January 16, 2011, 07:10:21 PM
You guys are only picking on Chicos because it's him. If anyone else would have started this thread you would have had no issue with it.
Bingo! As a newcomer here I could not understand why people were constantly trashing Chico's rather reasonable posts. Then I finally figured out it had nothing to do with the merits of his arguments.
84, I understand that I don't share that history on this site, but how many new members would go back 4-5 years to figure that stuff out. I'll agree that people do pile on Chicos, but this thread is a perfect example of him bringing it on himself. All I can really say is to reiterate my question: what is the point of this thread other than to either rile up MU fans or to kick them when they're down. Unless I missed something, no one provoked Chicos into creating this thread, and no one has provided any logical explanation as to the relevance of it on this site.
Quote from: GOMU1104 on January 16, 2011, 06:11:00 PM
You caused that to happen, my friend.
BTW...You are twisting words around. Dont you usually chastise posters for doing the same thing to you?
Tradition is...18% from beyond the arc.
Tradition is 50% beyond the arc...Scott Christopherson and he was actually ON OUR TEAM
Quote from: brewcity77 on January 15, 2011, 06:56:01 PM
Whatever. You guys would trade both testicles and Gasser for Vander. He's soooooo much better of a player.
Dream on, you're like an upset child saying stuff they don't mean. (Happens when you blow 18 point leads)
We (badger fans) don't view Gasser as a stud. We do think he will be a very good 4 year player, which he will be. What on earth makes you think we need Vander Blue's 3.6 Big East PPG? Or his pitiful 45 assists to 33 turnovers (Gasser 36 to 13). They are both shooting a pathetic clip from three, although Gasser will prove to be the better shooter as time goes on. Point is, they are so similar statistically that you have no grounds to say that we want Vander Blue. I'll take Gasser personally. Only thing Wisconsin misses about not getting Vander, is his speed and athleticism. But we're doing okay with our slow, boring, farm boys.
Losing a 9 point lead on the road in 2.5 minutes = losing a 18 pt leat on the road in 5.5 minutes, when adjusted for pace.(Hint: one of the two teams plays at the slowest pace in D1) Neither leaves a lot of room for smack talk. Blue vs Gasser? Both have had one good game. Both are freshmen with upside. Both fit their respective schools' scheme. Both would not look so good playing for the other.
Quote from: brewcity77 on January 16, 2011, 10:09:05 PM
84, I understand that I don't share that history on this site, but how many new members would go back 4-5 years to figure that stuff out. I'll agree that people do pile on Chicos, but this thread is a perfect example of him bringing it on himself. All I can really say is to reiterate my question: what is the point of this thread other than to either rile up MU fans or to kick them when they're down. Unless I missed something, no one provoked Chicos into creating this thread, and no one has provided any logical explanation as to the relevance of it on this site.
There are definitely times where people respond to Chicos' posts the way that they do simply because Chicos is the poster...but this had to come from somewhere. There wasn't a secret meeting where a handful of MUScoopers got together, drew Chicos name out of a hat and decided to pick on him. IMO, he often makes posts for no other reason than to be an instigator and to rile up the masses and then he condescendingly basks in the glow of being the center of attention.
I'm sure that Chicos and his boyfriend, Marquette84, will continue to blame everyone else, but starting posts like this one seem to serve no purpose other than to get people talking about Chicos' favorite subject: Chicos.
chico's started this thread. His original comment could just as easily have come from a badger troll. He got the attention he craved as the thread went in all of the predictable directions. Kind of pathetic.
Quote from: Marquette84 on January 16, 2011, 08:22:10 PM
I think you're looking in the wrong direction.
Go back and read some threads from 2006, 2007, 2008. Specifically look at Chico's contributions. Compare the nature of those who responded to him back then with discussions today.
After you look through those older posts, do you still want to blame him?
Now look at some MU Scoop registration dates:
Chicos: October 24, 2006, 06:34:22 PM
Lenny: January 19, 2009, 09:34:18 PM
Ners: November 14, 2009, 10:40:58 AM
Canadian Dimes: March 18, 2010, 02:14:54 PM
There is no argument that the civility on this board has taken a decided turn for the worse lately. It seems like every other thread results in either Lenny or Ners or Dimes making some ad-hominem attack, personal smear or namecalling, regardless of the subject. There have been more threads locked in the last few months than I recall in the history of the board--and the common thread seems to be that one of these guys is involved.
Here's a good example: Chicos asks a legit question about Gasser--a local kid with high-major offers (Maryland, Wisconsin, Northwestern) that goes off for 21 in his first game.
http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=22194.0 (http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=22194.0)
Do we get a discussion of his recruitment? Hardly.
--Lenny accuses him of being racist.
--Ners says he's on a "witch hunt"
--Canadian Dimes said he's "highly ignorant" and "smothered in agenda"
There was a time we could ask these questions and have civil discussions. For example, here's a question about the recruitment of Nick Fazekas from 2006:
http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=954.0 (http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=954.0)
Note that raising the question didn't lead to accusations of a witch hunt. Nobody jumped in and accused the guy of holding an anti-MU agenda. Nobody accused him of being racist for wanting Fazekas (who is white). Nobody callled him ignorant.
You can blame Chico's if you want--but you'll be blaming the wrong guy.
Nice effort but it's an apples to orangatuns comparison. There was interest between MU and Fazekas and he was a very talented and productive player. On the other hand, there wasn't much interest between Gasser and MU, not to mention that he was an invited walk-on who had a good game against a very bad team which was all it took to lead to Chicos' slurping of him. Also, no one implied that Chicos was racist simply because he wanted Gasser. The racial overtones came into play when Chicos stated that he wanted more "traditional" players, etc, etc.
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on January 15, 2011, 08:55:42 PM
My "boy" Gasser. Lol. He's enjoying a win over a ranked team tonight.
I'll say this about UW, they are boring, not very athletic but they play smart and traditional...we don't which is why we have a higher ceiling and a lower basement.
Our stupidity sometimes really hurts any athletic advantages we have.
CBB got a little close to the bandwagon in the first half of Saturday's game. He has to re -establish himself with a little Badger love.
Quote from: Lennys Tap on January 16, 2011, 08:36:52 PM
Just read the thread you referenced and nowhere do I call Chicos a racist. I will, however, unequivically call you a liar for saying it.
This post:
http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=22194.msg242724#msg242724
1. "Code word" is a common way to put forth a charge of racism (e.g. the term "states rights" is often described as a "code word." As are "separate but equal", "inner city", "neighborhood schools", etc. ). Now apply the context that Gasser is white and all scholarship players on MU's roster are black. Your use of the term "code word" is entirely consistent with someone who was charging that Chicos was racist for using the term "traditional."
I'll grant that its possible that you were ignorant of the historical context of the phrase "code word". Maybe you had some other code in mind that you didn't bother to explain.
2. If you DID have another meaning in mind, the onus is upon you to explain what you actually meant.
You claim you didn't mean it in a racial context. Fine--what DID you mean? Code word for what?
3. Given that I have provided the link to the post, I request that you retract your charge of "Liar" and offer an apology. I may have misinterpreted your comment due to your lack of explanation--but that doesn't constitute lying on my part.
4. Finally, if you offer a reasonable and rational explanation of what alternate meaning for "code word" you had, I will be more than happy to provide a retraction and apology.
Quote from: MerrittsMustache on January 17, 2011, 11:43:11 AM
Nice effort but it's an apples to orangatuns comparison. There was interest between MU and Fazekas and he was a very talented and productive player. On the other hand, there wasn't much interest between Gasser and MU, not to mention that he was an invited walk-on who had a good game against a very bad team which was all it took to lead to Chicos' slurping of him.
Actually, I was comparing the tone of the responses on the board--not the players themselves.
And Gasser must have had some talent, because he had other high-major offers. And while you can claim the opponent wasn't very good, Gasser's 21 point performance was better than any Marquette player had against the same team.
It wasn't an unreasonable question in the context of when it occurred. It didn't warrant the attacks in incivility.
Quote from: MerrittsMustache on January 17, 2011, 11:43:11 AM
Nice effort but it's an apples to orangatuns comparison. There was interest between MU and Fazekas and he was a very talented and productive player. On the other hand, there wasn't much interest between Gasser and MU, not to mention that he was an invited walk-on who had a good game against a very bad team which was all it took to lead to Chicos' slurping of him. Also, no one implied that Chicos was racist simply because he wanted Gasser. The racial overtones came into play when Chicos stated that he wanted more "traditional" players, etc, etc.
Which remains beyond ridiculous because a "traditiional" player as I have defined clearly doesn't have to be white, black, Asian, whatever. It's someone that can shoot the ball, has a high basketball IQ, shoots free throws well, and does the little things that has to be done to be successful. You guys are the ones that took traditional to mean white and then started all the racial B.S. That's on your heads, not mine. There is no place on this board for it, but Lenny has stated it twice now and affirmed another post with a +1 that came flat out and implied it. Krav's has said it and others have implied it, including yourself. It's B.S. And you wonder why I sometimes have a chip on my shoulder toward certain a-holes? When someone goes there, you're damn right I'm going to fire back.
Quote from: Marquette84 on January 17, 2011, 12:32:49 PM
Actually, I was comparing the tone of the responses on the board--not the players themselves.
And Gasser must have had some talent, because he had other high-major offers. And while you can claim the opponent wasn't very good, Gasser's 21 point performance was better than any Marquette player had against the same team.
It wasn't an unreasonable question in the context of when it occurred. It didn't warrant the attacks in incivility.
And you don't think the responses had anything to do with the players being discussed?
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on January 17, 2011, 12:41:00 PM
Which remains beyond ridiculous because a "traditiional" player as I have defined clearly doesn't have to be white, black, Asian, whatever. It's someone that can shoot the ball, has a high basketball IQ, shoots free throws well, and does the little things that has to be done to be successful. You guys are the ones that took traditional to mean white and then started all the racial B.S. That's on your heads, not mine. There is no place on this board for it, but Lenny has stated it twice now and affirmed another post with a +1 that came flat out and implied it. Krav's has said it and others have implied it, including yourself. It's B.S. And you wonder why I sometimes have a chip on my shoulder toward certain a-holes? When someone goes there, you're damn right I'm going to fire back.
When YOU make a post and a large number of posters misinterpret what YOU wrote, then it's on YOU to clarify what YOU meant because clearly YOU did a poor job of expressing how YOU feel. Other people "went there" only after believing that YOU had "gone there."
Despite what you claim, I did NOT imply that you were being racist. I stated that I initially thought your comments were racist until reading further posts and realizing that wasn't the case.
Quote from: brewcity77 on January 16, 2011, 10:09:05 PM
84, I understand that I don't share that history on this site, but how many new members would go back 4-5 years to figure that stuff out. I'll agree that people do pile on Chicos, but this thread is a perfect example of him bringing it on himself. All I can really say is to reiterate my question: what is the point of this thread other than to either rile up MU fans or to kick them when they're down. Unless I missed something, no one provoked Chicos into creating this thread, and no one has provided any logical explanation as to the relevance of it on this site.
On the other hand, Chicos was attacked mercilessly for being complementary of the success that Wisconsin has had with their style of play. The Illinois game supports his point, and given the nature of the attacks he suffered, he has every right to put forth evidence that his point had merit--just as those who opposed him posted about the Wisconsin/Michigan State game.
And its not as if MU fans are indifferent to Wisconsin. Its a relevant topic.
As I said the bigger issues is that the discussions are getting more personal, the personal attacks and namecalling are getting out of hand. And its fair to look back to see when the tone started going south and who instigated it.
Quote from: tower912 on January 17, 2011, 11:31:05 AM
Losing a 9 point lead on the road in 2.5 minutes = losing a 18 pt leat on the road in 5.5 minutes, when adjusted for pace.(Hint: one of the two teams plays at the slowest pace in D1) Neither leaves a lot of room for smack talk. Blue vs Gasser? Both have had one good game. Both are freshmen with upside. Both fit their respective schools' scheme. Both would not look so good playing for the other.
Pace doesn't play a factor in this argument.. if your doing anything besides running clock, up 18 with four and change left, you aren't a smart team. That UW loss was ugly though, we had a player make two crucial mistakes that cost us. dropping an in bounds pass (35 seconds) and attacking the hoop with no reason at all with 30 on the shot clock, kind of like what buckys (sp?) did from what I've heard.
Quote from: Marquette84 on January 17, 2011, 12:13:29 PM
This post:
http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=22194.msg242724#msg242724
1. "Code word" is a common way to put forth a charge of racism (e.g. the term "states rights" is often described as a "code word." As are "separate but equal", "inner city", "neighborhood schools", etc. ). Now apply the context that Gasser is white and all scholarship players on MU's roster are black. Your use of the term "code word" is entirely consistent with someone who was charging that Chicos was racist for using the term "traditional."
I'll grant that its possible that you were ignorant of the historical context of the phrase "code word". Maybe you had some other code in mind that you didn't bother to explain.
2. If you DID have another meaning in mind, the onus is upon you to explain what you actually meant.
You claim you didn't mean it in a racial context. Fine--what DID you mean? Code word for what?
3. Given that I have provided the link to the post, I request that you retract your charge of "Liar" and offer an apology. I may have misinterpreted your comment due to your lack of explanation--but that doesn't constitute lying on my part.
4. Finally, if you offer a reasonable and rational explanation of what alternate meaning for "code word" you had, I will be more than happy to provide a retraction and apology.
Chicos, without ever seeing Josh Gasser play and after one college game, starts a thread about the kid. Calls him "very intelligent", "a good outside shooter", "a spot up shooter" and a "traditional" player who is lacking in athleticism. He knows none of these things, but assumes them as facts based on what? Turns out Chicos was wrong on everything verifiable - he's not a good outside or spot up shooter, but he is a very good athlete. Nobody knows whether or not he's "very intelligent", but why would someone attribute that quality to him without any evidence is puzzling.
Why did Chicos engage in this type of (incorrect) sterotyping as regards Josh Gasser and his game? I don't know, but I (and others) correctly pointed out what it SOUNDED LIKE.
But I NEVER said he was a racist and for you to claim it is a lie. My belief is he was doing his usual thing - finding anything he can to rip the program. In the process he unintentionally made some foolish and insensitive comments. But for him to play the victim in the fight he clearly started is silly.
So no retraction or apology here. Your assertion that I called Chicos a racist is still a lie. I'll anxiously await your apology.
What I've learned from this thread...
1) I can ask time and time again what the point is of a thread in a logical manner and never expect a response from the person I'm directing the question at.
2) UW fans have somehow convinced themselves that they are better off with Gasser than Blue. Right, because having athletic, skilled players like Devin Harris and Alando Tucker never got them anywhere.
3) Chicos is discriminated against by some on this site, but also perpetuates that discrimination with threads like this. Seems like everyone likely is getting what they want, even if they'd never admit it.
Quote from: brewcity77 on January 17, 2011, 01:56:10 PM
What I've learned from this thread...
1) I can ask time and time again what the point is of a thread in a logical manner and never expect a response from the person I'm directing the question at.
2) UW fans have somehow convinced themselves that they are better off with Gasser than Blue. Right, because having athletic, skilled players like Devin Harris and Alando Tucker never got them anywhere.
3) Chicos is discriminated against by some on this site, but also perpetuates that discrimination with threads like this. Seems like everyone likely is getting what they want, even if they'd never admit it.
It would be interesting to have a "What I learned from this thread" post at the end of each thread. We'd probably find that we've all gotten a lot dumber ;)
As with most super polarizing, overblown debates I think that most of this community has fallen into that ol'logical fallacy of the false dichotomy. People seem to be clawing at each other over the following division:
1. Chicos is unfairly treated by some (the overwhelming minority - they just happen to be active and vocal) posters and is frequently attacked unfairly
2. Chicos brings it upon himself and is simply a mean spirited instigator.
Surprise! Neither is right. At least not all the way. There are probably shades of both positions in how the real situation has played out, but the vast majority of "the problem" lies somewhere in the middle. Chicos has unpopular (though not unjustifiable views) on some issues discussed here and is criticized for them. That's what having unpopular views will do to you. Unfortunately, this criticism sometimes comes in the form of ad hominem and "poisoning the well" so that everything he says is dismissed out of hand only because it comes from him.
On the other hand, threads like this one (just looking at the title, not how it has developed) do have an undeniably antagonizing tone to them. Especially when TIMING in considered. To post that UW beat Illinois is not out of bounds here - I think we all care about the failure (or unfortunate success) of UW basketball. But given the wording and timing (right after the event that shall not be named) it sure comes off as mean spirited. Maybe history has something to do with this (the "traditional" joke is pretty played out at this point) but that doesn't change the fact that it was sort of lame.
So. For the sake of the board and it's quality, it would seem a detente is in order. We get it. You guys disagree. You might not even like each other (I have no idea). But if we could all just not get tied up in these he said, she said arguments, the whole board would be better - and don't we all want that? At this point, who cares who started it - let's just all agree that it should end. Your self image should not be caught up in what posters on an online message board think of you and "who wins the argument."
That was probably too many words - but this place is starting to suck, which is a shame, because I used to really like reading and posting here.
Badger fan here
Gasser v.s. Blue debates are silly but inevitable. Both players are a jump shot away from being highly productive for their teams. They seem to have most other parts figured out. I haven't seen enough of Blue to know if he is going to become a good shooter. Having seen plenty of Gasser, he looks great shooting the ball but his shots aren't falling. Both players play similar roles for their teams.
Gasser wasn't out there at crunch time v.s. MSU and it cost the Badgers dearly. Bo went with Rob Wilson for the first time this season and he made some stupid plays. Gasser was out there down the stretch v.s. Illinois and Bo thought enough of him to guard McCamey. I know most people here hate Bo but we as Badger fans trust him and for him to have so much confidence in a freshman makes us believe that Gasser is going to be a good one.
Both guys fit nicely into what their teams do. I question the posters though that say the two wouldn't look good if they switched teams. The two players aren't mirror images of each other but they are pretty similar. Both are good defenders, can get to the bucket and draw fouls, both pass the ball nicely, rebound, etc. Either team would be lucky to have both guys on their roster. Could have made for a dynamite back court in a few years. If Marquette didn't recruit Gasser very hard they should be kicking themselves. Similar to the way I feel about UW and Diante Garrett.
Who is Jay Culter?
Quote from: JayCultersChins on January 17, 2011, 02:38:01 PM
Badger fan here
Gasser v.s. Blue debates are silly but inevitable. Both players are a jump shot away from being highly productive for their teams. They seem to have most other parts figured out. I haven't seen enough of Blue to know if he is going to become a good shooter. Having seen plenty of Gasser, he looks great shooting the ball but his shots aren't falling. Both players play similar roles for their teams.
Gasser wasn't out there at crunch time v.s. MSU and it cost the Badgers dearly. Bo went with Rob Wilson for the first time this season and he made some stupid plays. Gasser was out there down the stretch v.s. Illinois and Bo thought enough of him to guard McCamey. I know most people here hate Bo but we as Badger fans trust him and for him to have so much confidence in a freshman makes us believe that Gasser is going to be a good one.
Both guys fit nicely into what their teams do. I question the posters though that say the two wouldn't look good if they switched teams. The two players aren't mirror images of each other but they are pretty similar. Both are good defenders, can get to the bucket and draw fouls, both pass the ball nicely, rebound, etc. Either team would be lucky to have both guys on their roster. Could have made for a dynamite back court in a few years. If Marquette didn't recruit Gasser very hard they should be kicking themselves. Similar to the way I feel about UW and Diante Garrett.
The biggest difference is that Gasser's ceiling is a Michael Flowers-type of college career and Blue's ceiling is a Dwyane Wade-type of college career.
Quote from: MerrittsMustache on January 17, 2011, 03:17:33 PM
The biggest difference is that Gasser's ceiling is a Michael Flowers-type of college career and Blue's ceiling is a Dwyane Wade-type of college career.
If Blue ends up being like Wade he better get crackin soon. Blue's going to be a very good player, but his ceiling is not Dwyane Wade in his college career. Put another way, there is no way Blue is a top 5 pick out of Marquette.
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on January 17, 2011, 03:19:59 PM
If Blue ends up being like Wade he better get crackin soon. Blue's going to be a very good player, but his ceiling is not Dwyane Wade in his college career. Put another way, there is no way Blue is a top 5 pick out of Marquette.
Agree. Guys like Wade are once in a lifetime, and even then only if you're lucky.
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on January 17, 2011, 03:19:59 PM
If Blue ends up being like Wade he better get crackin soon. Blue's going to be a very good player, but his ceiling is not Dwyane Wade in his college career. Put another way, there is no way Blue is a top 5 pick out of Marquette.
Blue doesn't have to be a top 5 NBA Draft pick to have a Wade-like career at MU (which, by the way, I said was his
ceiling). Wade's NBA career and draft status are inconsequential to his college career.
Quote from: Lennys Tap on January 17, 2011, 01:40:39 PM
Chicos, without ever seeing Josh Gasser play and after one college game, starts a thread about the kid. Calls him "very intelligent", "a good outside shooter", "a spot up shooter" and a "traditional" player who is lacking in athleticism. He knows none of these things, but assumes them as facts based on what? Turns out Chicos was wrong on everything verifiable - he's not a good outside or spot up shooter, but he is a very good athlete. Nobody knows whether or not he's "very intelligent", but why would someone attribute that quality to him without any evidence is puzzling.
Why did Chicos engage in this type of (incorrect) sterotyping as regards Josh Gasser and his game? I don't know, but I (and others) correctly pointed out what it SOUNDED LIKE.
But I NEVER said he was a racist and for you to claim it is a lie. My belief is he was doing his usual thing - finding anything he can to rip the program. In the process he unintentionally made some foolish and insensitive comments. But for him to play the victim in the fight he clearly started is silly.
So no retraction or apology here. Your assertion that I called Chicos a racist is still a lie. I'll anxiously await your apology.
Well, you've basically confirmed my suspicion that you were really trying to make some sort of accusation of racisim. Your defense is that you never said the word racist--you used "code words" yourself--and that you were justified based on what Chicos posted.
I accept your defense that you used "code words" for racism rather the word itself and apologize for saying that you called him racist directly.
But I think you also owe an apology for calling me a liar, since my comments were based on a correct interpretation of the underlying sentiment of your post.
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on January 17, 2011, 03:19:59 PMIf Blue ends up being like Wade he better get crackin soon. Blue's going to be a very good player, but his ceiling is not Dwyane Wade in his college career. Put another way, there is no way Blue is a top 5 pick out of Marquette.
Blue's biggest problem is his jump shot, which was a problem for Wade also when he got here. He improved it vastly between his sophomore and junior years. If Blue can do the same, with his defense and slashing ability where it is, there's no reason he can't have a Wade-like impact on the program. Doesn't mean he'll go top 5, but if he improves his finishing, he could be an All-American type player.
Quote from: akmarq on January 17, 2011, 02:27:55 PM
As with most super polarizing, overblown debates I think that most of this community has fallen into that ol'logical fallacy of the false dichotomy. People seem to be clawing at each other over the following division:
1. Chicos is unfairly treated by some (the overwhelming minority - they just happen to be active and vocal) posters and is frequently attacked unfairly
2. Chicos brings it upon himself and is simply a mean spirited instigator.
Surprise! Neither is right. At least not all the way. There are probably shades of both positions in how the real situation has played out, but the vast majority of "the problem" lies somewhere in the middle. Chicos has unpopular (though not unjustifiable views) on some issues discussed here and is criticized for them. That's what having unpopular views will do to you. Unfortunately, this criticism sometimes comes in the form of ad hominem and "poisoning the well" so that everything he says is dismissed out of hand only because it comes from him.
On the other hand, threads like this one (just looking at the title, not how it has developed) do have an undeniably antagonizing tone to them. Especially when TIMING in considered. To post that UW beat Illinois is not out of bounds here - I think we all care about the failure (or unfortunate success) of UW basketball. But given the wording and timing (right after the event that shall not be named) it sure comes off as mean spirited. Maybe history has something to do with this (the "traditional" joke is pretty played out at this point) but that doesn't change the fact that it was sort of lame.
So. For the sake of the board and it's quality, it would seem a detente is in order. We get it. You guys disagree. You might not even like each other (I have no idea). But if we could all just not get tied up in these he said, she said arguments, the whole board would be better - and don't we all want that? At this point, who cares who started it - let's just all agree that it should end. Your self image should not be caught up in what posters on an online message board think of you and "who wins the argument."
That was probably too many words - but this place is starting to suck, which is a shame, because I used to really like reading and posting here.
I'm mainly a lurker here, but I agree - this forum has really gone downhill over the past few months.
Quote from: Marquette84 on January 17, 2011, 05:15:11 PM
Well, you've basically confirmed my suspicion that you were really trying to make some sort of accusation of racisim. Your defense is that you never said the word racist--you used "code words" yourself--and that you were justified based on what Chicos posted.
I accept your defense that you used "code words" for racism rather the word itself and apologize for saying that you called him racist directly.
But I think you also owe an apology for calling me a liar, since my comments were based on a correct interpretation of the underlying sentiment of your post.
The" underlying sentiment" of my post is simply that Chicos seizes on any chance he can to passive aggressively criticize our coaching staff. He'll go so far as to make untrue assumptions (Gasser's not too athletic, Gasser's a good 3 point and spot up shooter) and unknowable (after one game) assumptions (Gasser is very intelligent) to "prove" those criticisms valid.
Could his assumptions be characterized as suggesting a sterotype? Since he drew his conclusions based on almost no facts, they certainly can be said to SOUND like that. But my guess, like Kara's, was that he got carried away and said something inarticulately.
Of course, even if he made a racially insensitive remark that in no way, shape or form would make him a racist. I don't know of anyone (myself included) who hasn't made remarks that upon reflection are inarticulate and don't SOUND right.
So, in summation, I do NOT, nor have I ever thought Chicos to be a racist, and I have NEVER called him one. Your assertion that I did remains, as it always has been, untrue.
Quote from: Lennys Tap on January 17, 2011, 08:01:50 PM
The" underlying sentiment" of my post is simply that Chicos seizes on any chance he can to passive aggressively criticize our coaching staff. He'll go so far as to make untrue assumptions (Gasser's not too athletic, Gasser's a good 3 point and spot up shooter) and unknowable (after one game) assumptions (Gasser is very intelligent) to "prove" those criticisms valid.
I made those assumptions based on his high school criteria Lenny. I do not seize on "any chance" or "vast majority" of times to rip on Buzz or the staff. These wild lies you keep stating are just that, lies. I hope this guy posts his audit soon but he's told me you're absolutely full of crap (as if I needed an audit to tell me).
Quote from: Lennys Tap on January 17, 2011, 08:01:50 PM
Could his assumptions be characterized as suggesting a sterotype? Since he drew his conclusions based on almost no facts, they certainly can be said to SOUND like that. But my guess, like Kara's, was that he got carried away and said something inarticulately.
Of course, even if he made a racially insensitive remark that in no way, shape or form would make him a racist. I don't know of anyone (myself included) who hasn't made remarks that upon reflection are inarticulate and don't SOUND right.
So, in summation, I do NOT, nor have I ever thought Chicos to be a racist, and I have NEVER called him one. Your assertion that I did remains, as it always has been, untrue.
Your last line is mindboggling as is your spinning. You have stated it twice with your code word nonsense and then gave a +1 just two days ago to another poster's message who's entire message was "I'm not calling you a racist but...." . That's how I interpreted it and that's certainly how 84 and that's how others interpreted it.
I'm tired of your implications on that, but sorry you earned what people believe you said...sound familiar? And I'm really sick of your "vast majority" comments. They are flat out untrue, and you no it but you continue to perpetuate it. Your obsession is crazy.
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on January 17, 2011, 08:54:33 PM
I made those assumptions based on his high school criteria Lenny. I do not seize on "any chance" or "vast majority" of times to rip on Buzz or the staff. These wild lies you keep stating are just that, lies. I hope this guy posts his audit soon but he's told me you're absolutely full of crap (as if I needed an audit to tell me).
Your last line is mindboggling as is your spinning. You have stated it twice with your code word nonsense and then gave a +1 just two days ago to another poster's message who's entire message was "I'm not calling you a racist but...." . That's how I interpreted it and that's certainly how 84 and that's how others interpreted it.
I'm tired of your implications on that, but sorry you earned what people believe you said...sound familiar? And I'm really sick of your "vast majority" comments. They are flat out untrue, and you no it but you continue to perpetuate it. Your obsession is crazy.
I give up. You're absolutely out of control. I'm hitting the ignore button. Go stalk somebody else.
Quote from: akmarq on January 17, 2011, 02:27:55 PM
So. For the sake of the board and it's quality, it would seem a detente is in order. We get it. You guys disagree. You might not even like each other (I have no idea). But if we could all just not get tied up in these he said, she said arguments, the whole board would be better - and don't we all want that? At this point, who cares who started it - let's just all agree that it should end. Your self image should not be caught up in what posters on an online message board think of you and "who wins the argument."
1) I agree with the above, and I'm getting closer and closer to banning everyone involved in the arguments. I don't give a sh*t who started it, or who ended it.
2) The next person that demands an apology is going to get banned. That's a load of crap, and posturing to post publicly. If you really want to demand something of someone, give them a call. Don't post it here.
3) This thread was going bad, went ok for a couple posts about Blue and Gasser (including a post by a *gasp*, UW fan), and then derailed again. Locked, though I do appreciate those who wanted to discuss the topic.
p.s. - I'm on vacation and forced to moderate this which means my ban "safety" is off...