I wonder if Dimes\Hayward\Robbie predicted this.
http://www.clickorlando.com/knights/23927913/detail.html
For the record, Dimes, this isn't a prediction....it's called passing on information. Article attached
Makes an incredible amount of sense. Improves us both in terms of football and basketball. Though I suppose now the question is whether this is a move that starts to push Marquette and other basketball-only schools out of the conference as the Big East gets closer to the number needed for a conference championship game.
Need one more team to get to 19, so we have an 18 game basketball schedule where you play everyone once. No divisons in basketball. Add one more football school and have Villanova upgrade theirs, which results in 12 football schools.
Time for the basketball/football split. They are watering down the conference basketball even further for the sake of football. (And actually they are really watering down BE football too. This actually makes the conference weaker IMO.)
See, this is what "proactivity" gets you. Stupid decisions. In Memphis they get a team that drew about 20,000 fans per game outside of when Ole Miss visited, and in Central Florida a team that drew about 30,000 per game. Seriously, I hope this report is inaccurate. Is it really worth being in a "BCS Conference" when the conference is basically just an upgraded version of CUSA??
I know the talk has been about being proactive, but does this really help? Will any football school invited by the Big Ten not go because they're now in a conference with the great Memphis Tigers and Final Four contender UCF? As for football, the football teams get a terrible Memphis program and Florida's 5th best program. This would be better suited as a reactive move to try to hold the conference together if a couple schools were preparing to pack their bags, not something that will keep things from falling apart by adding these "gems" now.
Quote from: bilsu on June 17, 2010, 07:02:26 AM
Need one more team to get to 19, so we have an 18 game basketball schedule where you play everyone once. No divisons in basketball. Add one more football school and have Villanova upgrade theirs, which results in 12 football schools.
Villanova isn't upgrading anything, and it won't keep the conference together if they did. Plus it's completely stupid to throw away revenue potential and try to negotiate a television deal that doesn't put UConn and Syracuse on the schedule twice or Pitt/WVU, Georgetown/Syracuse, etc. And it's not any more "unfair" to have some matchups twice and others not at all, at least any moreso than the home/road splits that decide a team's fate. I would rather the basketball schools split up and add Xavier to our schedule twice instead of the watered down Grand Tour of a schedule that seems to be happening in attempt to try to milk a couple million out of a football situation that will barely be improved.
So the Big East will have 18 schools for basketball, good lord!! ::) ::)
Blowhards talking? That sounds difficult.
Quote from: Benny B on June 17, 2010, 08:39:22 AM
Blowhards talking? That sounds difficult.
I'd prefer talkhards blowing.
Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on June 17, 2010, 07:13:19 AM
Time for the basketball/football split. They are watering down the conference basketball even further for the sake of football.
I guess it depends on whether you feel it is important to be a member of a BCS confernece for MU basketball. My opinion is that MU basketball takes a big hit if we go backwards to a non-BCS conference, which is what a basketball only conference would be. Most of the teams in a basketball only conference will not be a big draw at the gate either. I wish the Big East would not change at all, but I rather have it add some football schools to survive than to have it split up. We would no longer be playing against Pitt, WV, Uconn, Syracuse, Louisville and Cincy. Rutgers and South Florida I would not miss. Problably end up playing DePaul, Providence, Seton Hall, St. John's twice (yawn). I would not mind playing Notre Dame, Villanova and Georgetown twice. Throw in Xavier and Dayton would alright. Besides that, if the Big East splits I could see the football schools keeping Georgetown and Villanova and than we would totally suck.
Time to split up the conference....which sucks because I like the football side a little bit better.
You wouldn't miss playing L'ville, Syracuse and Pitt? I would!!
Quote from: bilsu on June 17, 2010, 08:44:42 AM
I guess it depends on whether you feel it is important to be a member of a BCS confernece for MU basketball. My opinion is that MU basketball takes a big hit if we go backwards to a non-BCS conference, which is what a basketball only conference would be. Most of the teams in a basketball only conference will not be a big draw at the gate either. I wish the Big East would not change at all, but I rather have it add some football schools to survive than to have it split up. We would no longer be playing against Pitt, WV, Uconn, Syracuse, Louisville and Cincy. Rutgers and South Florida I would not miss. Problably end up playing DePaul, Providence, Seton Hall, St. John's twice (yawn). I would not mind playing Notre Dame, Villanova and Georgetown twice. Throw in Xavier and Dayton would alright. Besides that, if the Big East splits I could see the football schools keeping Georgetown and Villanova and than we would totally suck.
I agree. I think it helps recruiting to play UConn and Syracuse for sure. I think we would still get a pre-conference game with Louisville. But Buzz can recruit saying that you will get a chance to play against those two NBA feeders and show what you have. Memphis obviously adds to that. A Bball only conference would not have that as much, even with Georgetown and Villanova in my opinion.
The conference is already so big that two more teams won't really hurt, in my opinion, in hoops. If ten teams makes football strong enough to keep the conference together, then so be it. I don't know if these additions are strong enough, but let's hope the BE knows what it is doing.
Necessary evil. If the Big East wants to maintain their BCS status, they need to keep football together. That's what this move is about. Whether it waters down basketball, I'm not so sure. Memphis is better than half of the Big East teams in hoops as is. I hate how they do things (they've been on probation off and on since the early 1970's) but they have quality hoops. UCF is purely a football play, but also gives USF a rival.
If we all agree that staying in a BCS conference is key, then this move makes sense.
Of course, we need to wait until Dimes weighs in on his prediction before anything else can be said.
I relayed the article to BE alums in my office and the reaction was amusing. The Cuse and UConn alums were excited about it because they want a football-only conference and think this will put the wheels in motion for the split to happen. The lone Nova alum shuddered at the thought of adding two football schools because he (along with most other Nova and GTown alums I know) absolutely do not want to join an all-catholic-type of conference. They all want to keep their traditional BE rivals. And, of course, the SJU alum is excited for a split to happen so he was obviously encouraged.
Couldn't football separate from all non football sports very simply?
At top division NCAA is still sanctioning/rule making body, but except as to football, where bcs schools band together and agree bcs controls--ie schools agree to "use" ncaa rules as the BCS rules, but play, recruiting, sanctions etc, are segregated and controlled ultimately, by the BCS sanctioning body, whose rules and rulings on football are given "supremacy" on football issues (like fed law, over any state law).
NCAA controls all non football sports fully--but to better allow the open greed of BCS schools in football--they carve out FB and make BCS--the ultimate sanctioning ruling body--easing tv, conferences, games etc
I think BCS already has some agreed rules on not accepting non qualifiers in the fb programs--let BCS write up a separate rule book, for fb--controlling over any conflicting rule or action of ncaa, in fb--only..
Then MU is just like all schools-- an NCAA member--but not a BCS member--because it lacks football. Other schools would be in both-but the 2 worlds are separated-- so ncaa has no ultimate influence on football, and vice versa, as to football/bcs--on the other sports
UCF & Memphis with their recruiting bases, lax standards and a BCS bid could easily become pretty formidable in football.
Football rules the day. The stronger we are as a BCS conf, the better.
I also have zero faith that if a split occured that we would end up with Nova & GT. Something tells me they'd move mountains to stay with UConn & Cuse.
Quote from: The Lens on June 17, 2010, 09:58:50 AM
I also have zero faith that if a split occured that we would end up with Nova & GT. Something tells me they'd move mountains to stay with UConn & Cuse.
Or, why wouldnt the football schools go after them? I could see the Dixon, Calhoun and Boeheim going to bat for Nova and GTown.
A trip to Orlando to see a game sure would be nice. If this would keep the conference together, I'm all for it. Football at 10 teams should be enough. Would a BE conference championship game really bring that much $. And maybe we'll see 10 be enough for a conference championship game - wth the BE and Big 12 leading the charge and maybe one of the western conferences - with the help of Congressional pressure to look into and break up the BCS as anti-competitive/monopoly.
Create a large penalty for leaving the BE in the next 10 years, say 20 million or more. 18 basketball teams is okay and can work. Again, if these two schools keep the conference together, this is best for MU and I'm all for it. Orlando is a great market.
If there is a breakup of the Big East, I would expect Georgetown and Nova to stay with the football schools. Just my guess, but the football schools would probably want them. If so, best we could hope for is that the Big 12 adds a couple of basketball schools such as DePaul and Marquette (maybe ND - except for football - if the BE football schools don't want them), or, the football schools go to 16 teams with 12 for football and add MU or DePaul along with Nova, Georgetown and ND. Otherwise, we will be in a tough place as I think Georgetown and Nova will stay with the big east football teams.
Oh, now that I've responded with my opinion of what could happen, am I a blowhard now too? If so, I hope I am welcomed warmly to the blowhard club. It's nice to be a member :)
Quote from: goodgreatgrand on June 17, 2010, 10:06:26 AM
Or, why wouldnt the football schools go after them? I could see the Dixon, Calhoun and Boeheim going to bat for Nova and GTown.
If the 4 megaconference situation happened, each conference taking 2 hoops only schools would be good for us. MU is one of the 8 best hoops only programs out there so while we don't have the the established rivalries that Nova and Gtown have, we would be an obvious choice for a conference if they went to 16 football and 18 bball schools each. There is not much to back up this happening, but schools like Marquette and Georgetown and Villanova provide good cash flows that it is not completely out of the question I guess.
Quote from: GOO on June 17, 2010, 10:16:59 AM
Oh, now that I've responded with my opinion of what could happen, am I a blowhard now too? If so, I hope I am welcomed warmly to the blowhard club. It's nice to be a member :)
You ;D
(http://softwaremaestro.files.wordpress.com/2007/07/blowhard.jpg)
I do not know if you are a blow hard, but you caused another fight on this board.
The football schools would have to be very careful not only shutting Notre Dame out of its outlet to compete in other sports, but also taking Nova and Georgetown, as it could very well blow up in their faces. Makes Notre Dame's decision to go to the Big Ten much easier, and results in taking 1-3 football schools with them. If they try to replace with even lower ranks of football schools like ECU, the ACC could easily turn the thing into a mid-major by taking two of the best schools. If they take Georgetown, Nova, and try to play it safe by taking ND, they might also be sympathetic to St. John's since it gives them access to NYC and the Garden. If they would go that far, hard to believe MU wouldn't be added and would be cast aside with Providence, DePaul, and Seton Hall - wish someone would just get the balls to dismiss two of those three now.
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on June 17, 2010, 09:10:46 AM
If we all agree that staying in a BCS conference is key, then this move makes sense.
I don't agree that staying in a BCS conference is key *IF* Georgetown, Nova, SJU, etc. exit with us to form a basketball conference with the top A10 schools.
The conference has no idea what it wants to be. It has a eye to the future (I guess) but still wants to live in the past.
Quote from: GOO on June 17, 2010, 10:16:59 AM
Oh, now that I've responded with my opinion of what could happen, am I a blowhard now too? If so, I hope I am welcomed warmly to the blowhard club. It's nice to be a member :)
Welcome
Dimes will be sending you this t-shirt very soon...he's already got down under territory covered
(http://rlv.zcache.com/blowhard_australia_tshirt-p235368962005058466qw9y_400.jpg)
EDIT....Reinko....great minds think alike....same cartoon I found
(http://softwaremaestro.files.wordpress.com/2007/07/blowhard.jpg)
I'm guessing if this does happen, we would see the BigEast Championship presented by FedEx. That seems like a reasonable amount for that sponsorship deal ($10m per year over ten years). Not sure what the existing contracts are though. And $10m split between an 18 team conference ain't much.
Write it stone, if it happens. If it doesn't I will delete this post before anyone can link to it.
Edit: added "per year" so it didn't read like less than it is.
Quote from: T-Bone on June 17, 2010, 11:02:07 AM
I'm guessing if this does happen, we would see the BigEast Championship presented by FedEx. That seems like a reasonable amount for that sponsorship deal ($10m per year over ten years). Not sure what the existing contracts are though. And $10m split between an 18 team conference ain't much.
Write it stone, if it happens. If it doesn't I will delete this post before anyone can link to it.
Edit: added "per year" so it didn't read like less than it is.
There is no way part-time BE members will receive so much as a penny from a conference championship. None. Zero.
Thoughts from around the conference on this expansion possibility:
http://www.nunesmagician.com/2010/6/17/1522307/memphis-central-florida-to-big#comments
http://www.casualhoya.com/2010/6/17/1522746/memphis-and-ucf-invitation-to-big#comments
http://www.pittblather.com/2010/06/17/ucf-rumors-abound/#comments
Quote from: goodgreatgrand on June 17, 2010, 11:19:26 AM
Thoughts from around the conference on this expansion possibility:
http://www.nunesmagician.com/2010/6/17/1522307/memphis-central-florida-to-big#comments
http://www.casualhoya.com/2010/6/17/1522746/memphis-and-ucf-invitation-to-big#comments
http://www.pittblather.com/2010/06/17/ucf-rumors-abound/#comments
What a surprise, the football schools want to get rid of MU and DePaul...
Quote from: goodgreatgrand on June 17, 2010, 11:19:26 AM
Thoughts from around the conference on this expansion possibility:
http://www.nunesmagician.com/2010/6/17/1522307/memphis-central-florida-to-big#comments
http://www.casualhoya.com/2010/6/17/1522746/memphis-and-ucf-invitation-to-big#comments
http://www.pittblather.com/2010/06/17/ucf-rumors-abound/#comments
Jeez...some of these comments lead me to believe that some people would praise the BE for being "proactive" if they invited St. Norberts and UW-Stout.
I just cannot believe that Memphis is an atractive football target.
Quote from: bma725 on June 17, 2010, 11:26:47 AM
What a surprise, the football schools want to get rid of MU and DePaul...
Syracuse still plays football?
If someone is the antithesis of a blowhard are they a sucklight?
Quote from: RawdogDX on June 17, 2010, 11:56:21 AM
If someone is the antithesis of a blowhard are they a sucklight?
sucksoft.
The weird thing on Casual Hoya is the claim: "Either way, Georgetown is sitting at the table without a voice." Uh, what's Tagliabue doing then?
Good question. What IS he going? Last we heard, he was being proactive....
Quote from: goodgreatgrand on June 17, 2010, 11:07:33 AM
There is no way part-time BE members will receive so much as a penny from a conference championship. None. Zero.
Who would be part-time? Did you think I was referring to a Big East Football Championship? If so, then that would make sense, but they'd also need to get to 12 football teams (from what I believe is required by NCAA regulations).
I should have maybe clarified the basketball Big East Tournament at MSG sponsored by FedEx.
Quote from: T-Bone on June 17, 2010, 11:02:07 AM
I'm guessing if this does happen, we would see the BigEast Championship presented by FedEx. That seems like a reasonable amount for that sponsorship deal ($10m per year over ten years). Not sure what the existing contracts are though. And $10m split between an 18 team conference ain't much.
Write it stone, if it happens. If it doesn't I will delete this post before anyone can link to it.
Edit: added "per year" so it didn't read like less than it is.
Only the football schools would share in those dollars. Incidentally, Fred Smith's little comments the other day have raised the eyebrows of a few legal folks in the industry. Some have wondered whether a publicly traded company is in essence, offering a bribe to public institutions to get Memphis into a conference. I'm not a lawyer but a few of those musings were going around last night from some folks in the biz.
I really am beginning to worry that the fact that DePaul has been terrible the last few years is going to bite us in the......'
Quote from: bilsu on June 17, 2010, 12:58:58 PM
I really am beginning to worry that the fact that DePaul has been terrible the last few years is going to bite us in the......'
I don't think they would want to throw the baby out with the bathwater
Besides, in order to push a member out, there are bylaws that would have to be adhered to. I don't know what the threshold is, but I'm guessing something like 75% to 80% agreement. Someone would have to confirm that
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on June 17, 2010, 01:04:20 PM
I don't think they would want to throw the baby out with the bathwater
Besides, in order to push a member out, there are bylaws that would have to be adhered to. I don't know what the threshold is, but I'm guessing something like 75% to 80% agreement. Someone would have to confirm that
It takes 12 votes to send someone packing.
NCAA tournament every year (and contributing the revenue to share), top 10 in attendance every year, even if you only take the spending reports with a grain of salt it's clear we still invest more into the program than most of the others, no NCAA violations. Yeah, sounds like a terrible school to have. A geographic outlier? Makes sense when you don't have South Florida and wouldn't be adding two more.
Makes me wonder though, with the balance between football/non-football schools, if something like this happens would the non-football schools be better off fighting back? Make the football schools split right away or add nobody, or force them to add two non-football schools (i.e. Xavier and Dayton) and go to 20 for a couple years while also setting the table for a split.
http://ncaafootball.fanhouse.com/2010/06/17/big-east-dismisses-ucf-memphis-expansion-report/
Big East is not confirming this.
Quote from: goodgreatgrand on June 17, 2010, 01:10:42 PM
It takes 12 votes to send someone packing.
75%....thanks. By the way, where did you find that?
Quote from: chapman on June 17, 2010, 01:16:28 PM
Makes me wonder though, with the balance between football/non-football schools, if something like this happens would the non-football schools be better off fighting back? Make the football schools split right away or add nobody, or force them to add two non-football schools (i.e. Xavier and Dayton) and go to 20 for a couple years while also setting the table for a split.
Keep in mind that it was the bball schools that didnt support adding Penn State. The bball schools have always had the upper hand. This is why the BE is such a pathetic football conference....and why BC, VT and Miami all bolted.
Forget going to 20. I hate that idea (how big is too big? Especially when there are so many dead-weight bball teams already). Just make the split. Adding any more schools as full-time members will do nothing to prevent WVU from joining the SEC, Rutgers from joining the B10, Syracuse from joining the B10/ACC, UConn from joining the ACC, or Pitt from joining the B10/ACC (obviously they need in invite first). BE expansion is nothing but a stay of execution. We would still be on death row...
Quote from: goodgreatgrand on June 17, 2010, 01:30:29 PM
Keep in mind that it was the bball schools that didnt support adding Penn State. The bball schools have always had the upper hand. This is why the BE is such a pathetic football conference....and why BC, VT and Miami all bolted.
Syracuse didnt want Penn State either.
Quote from: goodgreatgrand on June 17, 2010, 01:30:29 PM
Forget going to 20. I hate that idea (how big is too big? Especially when there are so many dead-weight bball teams already). Just make the split. Adding any more schools as full-time members will do nothing to prevent WVU from joining the SEC, Rutgers from joining the B10, Syracuse from joining the B10/ACC, UConn from joining the ACC, or Pitt from joining the B10/ACC (obviously they need in invite first). BE expansion is nothing but a stay of execution. We would still be on death row...
Exactly. This doesn't make the television contracts any more lucrative. It's just expansion for the sake of expansion...to give people the sense they are "being proactive!"
Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on June 17, 2010, 01:43:40 PM
Syracuse didnt want Penn State either.
I found this tidbit...
That last event has always carried controversy because Penn State head football coach Joe Paterno has maintained Syracuse director of athletics Jake Crouthamel was a part of the blockade to keep the Nittany Lions out of an all-sports conference. Tranghese said that's just not the case.
"Despite all the negativity that comes out about Jake, he fought like crazy for Penn State to be in the league," Tranghese told Thamel. "Syracuse and Boston College really fought to have Penn State because Jake understood the importance of Penn State. What happened in the previous fall, Penn State had tried to form a football league. Coach Paterno has laid a lot of this at Jake's feet, which I think is wrong. What never got written was that the basketball league was being pretty successful and they couldn't agree on revenue sharing in football. There wasn't going to be any revenue sharing. Jake just wasn't going to do that. The next year Dave brought it up for discussion and Jake was absolutely supportive. We voted five different times and all five times Jake voted for Penn State. And Bill Flynn at Boston College, God rest his soul, voted for Penn State all five times. The reason that they didn't get in was that the league was new, a lot of the directors felt it was a basketball league. Some of the directors felt that the concept of the Big East was big markets. It was a 5-3 vote that changed the face of history."
Quote: "It was a 5-3 vote that changed the face of history."
Ya, right up there with with the FDR and Stalin meetings... really history changing events.
UCF and Memphis doesn't add nothing to Big East football.
Quote from: mupanther on June 17, 2010, 02:27:11 PM
UCF and Memphis doesn't add nothing to Big East football.
OK...does your use of the double negative mean that you think they will add something?
Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on June 17, 2010, 05:13:36 PM
OK...does your use of the double negative mean that you think they will add something?
+1
no thanks. some of the comments at the end of the story are pretty funny. this is only for business, no big east school in their right mind would actually want ucf or memphis, gross.
p.s. is that 3 times in this thread alone that an unprovoked chicos perpetuated a petty online girl fight? that has to be a record.
anyways?
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on June 17, 2010, 01:24:54 PM
75%....thanks. By the way, where did you find that?
12/18 is 66.6%
Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on June 17, 2010, 10:42:29 AM
I don't agree that staying in a BCS conference is key *IF* Georgetown, Nova, SJU, etc. exit with us to form a basketball conference with the top A10 schools.
The conference has no idea what it wants to be. It has a eye to the future (I guess) but still wants to live in the past.
I agree. I think the move to ten schools is a just in case move, so that if two teams are grabbed in another conference expansion, the Big East is still intact as a football conference without having to rush to replace the losses.
I find the speculation that Villanova and Georgetown would want to stick with the Big East as the only two basketball only schools interesting considering that it seemed to me that when it was reported that ALL the basketball schools told the Big East that they intended to take advantage of a clause in the league agreement that allowed schools to leave without penalty if two football schools decided to leave the league.
Quote from: Lennys Tap on June 17, 2010, 09:35:26 PM
12/18 is 66.6%
Don't we have 16 teams in the Big East? 12/16 is 75%
Quote from: LittleMurs on June 17, 2010, 09:43:32 PM
I find the speculation that Villanova and Georgetown would want to stick with the Big East as the only two basketball only schools interesting considering that it seemed to me that when it was reported that ALL the basketball schools told the Big East that they intended to take advantage of a clause in the league agreement that allowed schools to leave without penalty if two football schools decided to leave the league.
I agree. If you go back to when MU and DePaul were invited into the league, IMO it wasn't because the entire conference thought it would be a good idea, it's because the basketball schools wanted more allies. If the basketball schools didn't want them, I'm sure the football schools would have been happy with that.
I'm sure the administration at G'town and Nova are having these exact same conversations. What is the BE becomming? Do they want to be the two sole, basketball schools in a football conference? I doubt it.
Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on June 18, 2010, 07:46:25 AM
I'm sure the administration at G'town and Nova are having these exact same conversations. What is the BE becomming? Do they want to be the two sole, basketball schools in a football conference? I doubt it.
Actually, why not? Their biggest rivals are there. The football schools generate plenty of basketball revenue (especially 'Ville, Cuse, UConn, WVU and Pitt). If the football side can match or give more money than the bball only schools, they should at least consider it.
Also, thopse 5 schools I mentioned above all play Nova at the Wachovia Center, not on-campus. They do this because they are a huge draw and probably generate a healthy percentage of their revenue. If you take those schools away, how many games would they actually need to play in the Wachovia Center?
Georgetown is having big issues right now with fan support. They have a website that tracks season ticket holders that sell their seats to opposing teams' fans. I go to a few GTown games a year and sometimes the crowd is split 50/50. Not playing the big names in the BE will only continue to hurt their support. Plus, Im not sure GTown athletic department fits with in with a 'catholic' conference. They are smaller than a fball school but bigger than us or Nova or any other bball school....
Quote from: goodgreatgrand on June 18, 2010, 10:00:23 AM
Actually, why not?
Because they have no influence. They are two basketball members at the whim of 10 football members.
Rivalries are important, but if the BE basketball schools all go, they still have many of their rivals.
Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on June 18, 2010, 10:16:37 AM
Rivalries are important, but if the BE basketball schools all go, they still have many of their rivals.
Right. They will retain some....but none that will fill the Wachovia Center (maybe us and....). Bball needs to subsidize the entire athletic department. Everyone will take a hit but Nova and GTown will prob take the biggest hits.
Plus, the football schools are recipients of the added revenue when their teams play these two schools (was it the syracuse-nova game that had 35k people?).
Why couldnt they give Nova and GTown one vote for all basketball related issues? Just like now... Anything football related, they have no say...just like now. If revenue is a slight uptick, rivals are intact and they have a vote for bball, then why not? If its all about revenue, I have a feeling the fball side could offer more than the bball side, dont you think?
Im officially a blowhard now
Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on June 18, 2010, 10:16:37 AM
Because they have no influence. They are two basketball members at the whim of 10 football members.
Rivalries are important, but if the BE basketball schools all go, they still have many of their rivals.
Plus there's always non-conference play. If the split would happen as naturally as it seems, it won't be filled with bad feelings to the point that they can't schedule each other. Wouldn't expect UConn and Syracuse to completely ignore Georgetown when it's a good game to get on their schedule with national television likely.
And as far as the football school's decision, relegating Notre Dame basketball to the A-10 or worse will backfire. If they don't want Notre Dame to be forced into the Big Ten and risk losing 1-3 football schools with them with all the others that didn't come from CUSA doing everything to get out they have to either add Georgetown, Nova, Notre Dame, and likely another or just don't add any non-football schools.
Quote from: goodgreatgrand on June 18, 2010, 10:30:32 AM
Right. They will retain some....but none that will fill the Wachovia Center (maybe us and....). Bball needs to subsidize the entire athletic department. Everyone will take a hit but Nova and GTown will prob take the biggest hits.
Plus, the football schools are recipients of the added revenue when their teams play these two schools (was it the syracuse-nova game that had 35k people?).
Why couldnt they give Nova and GTown one vote for all basketball related issues? Just like now... Anything football related, they have no say...just like now. If revenue is a slight uptick, rivals are intact and they have a vote for bball, then why not? If its all about revenue, I have a feeling the fball side could offer more than the bball side, dont you think?
Im officially a blowhard now
I just think that there is a reason the BE has been very careful about maintaining the football / non-football balance for a reason. It goes to the heart of what the conference is about. Basketball schools will have no say in the future of the conference. Everything will be dictated to them by football schools for football's benefit.
I think basketball schools would be wise to whether a short-term storm for maintaining some control in the long term.
Good point. I forgot about ND. ND has a bigger athletic department than GTown. With their bowl tie-ins they would obviously want to be a part of the fball side. And the fball side would want ND because ND schedules BE schools often enough.
I dont think a split is necessarily going to be friendly. GTown, Nova and ND will be in the middle of a tug-o-war. If fball doesnt expand, then there are 8 teams. Add two bball-only and you have the ideal 10 team basketball conference.
Quote from: LittleMurs on June 17, 2010, 09:43:32 PM
I agree. I think the move to ten schools is a just in case move, so that if two teams are grabbed in another conference expansion, the Big East is still intact as a football conference without having to rush to replace the losses.
I find the speculation that Villanova and Georgetown would want to stick with the Big East as the only two basketball only schools interesting considering that it seemed to me that when it was reported that ALL the basketball schools told the Big East that they intended to take advantage of a clause in the league agreement that allowed schools to leave without penalty if two football schools decided to leave the league.
The fact is that the basketball schools can choose to leave as a whole. That ends the Big East conference as it is. It does not guarantee that the 8 basketball schools stick together. Would Georgetown and Villanova want to stay with the football schools? I have no idea, but their best rivals will be in the football league. If I were them, I would stay in a BCS conference. As MU fan that is what I fear will happen and we are left with teams that do not provide much excitement.
http://www.thedaonline.com/sports/wvu-active-in-conference-talks-1.1492361
Sounds like WVU is whoring themselves out ["we've been working the phones"]to just about every conference. And they would like the BE to ADD one football program so there is an odd number in the conference.
I did list UCF and Memphis in my Top 10 wish list I published on Cracked Sidewalks back in April. (Boston College and Maryland were my top 2, but realize I was reaching there). I love the BE as it is, but I do like this play because while they both add football teams, Memphis certainly keeps the focus on being the best BASKETBALL conference in the country. If the concern about having more football teams than basketball teams is valid, then the three basketball-only I listed back then stay the same - you could add Xavier, Dayton and/or Butler. However, the move is not necessarily to try to go to 20 teams, but to be prepared too in case West Virginia or someone else is raided by football, and make sure there would still be at least 8 teams in place.
Again, would prefer to keep the current 16 teams, but wouldn't complain if this move was made.
It's impossible to know what our administration would do push come to shove. From a fan perspective i think we on the whole agree we'd do anything to stay with the football teams. The money would be so much better than in a mid major all basketball league. I don't get the idea of us worrying about not having a voice in the new conference. I just don't see there being many decisions that would impact us negatively. I can't speka to what the higher ups would do. No one really can, but I think with Taglibue around he'll be able to convince them that being in a BCS conference is
As for the post about our fan support problems, eh I don't think that's all that serious. We're still very good as far as attendance numbers and we draw great away and neutral. The problem actually is that we're such a hot ticket that scalping tickets is ridiculously profitable. As a result there are a lot of "season ticket holders" that are actually just scalpers. In addition selling tickets to a game against Duke or Syracuse can pay over $1,000 per seat easily. So it may be a problem in terms of home court advantage at times. But As far as attendance and profitability it's fine. We're also improving on cutting down on this we had a lot less duke fans this year because of special pre-sales the athletic department implemented.
but you are right that our support would greatly diminish by losing the football schools and going to the all basketball league. There are more football teams that draw than basketball teams.