when do you guys think MU can be not only a realistic top 20 team for a seasons length but also a consistent DEEP tourny run team and possible National Title contender, with the direction we are headed Im starting to feel like we are not far away. What do you guys think?
Not next year. Maybe the following year.
Just as soon as the Easter bunny drops some stud big men our way to go along with our already fine assortment of guards.
The year after next, DJO is a senior, Van Blue is a sophomore, buzz will have a stud big man in, and otule and yous will be serviceable at least.
It is hard to say, but probably in 2 years when DJO is a senoir. I could see him averaging 20 pts a game.
I can definitly see that from DJO. When you guys say two year do you actually view us as a legit title threat, or just top 20 team with Sweet 16/Elite 8 hopes?
If the tournament is indeed expanding we dont have to really worry about making it, even next year in a unpredictable season for us.
Not until we have 3 McDonald's all-americans on our team.
As soon as we land a serviceable big man; its our missing link at this point.
Quote from: HaywardsHeroes32 on March 22, 2010, 10:16:45 PM
When you guys say two year do you actually view us as a legit title threat, or just top 20 team with Sweet 16/Elite 8 hopes?
If DJO scores 20+ per game and keeps improving on D. If Van Blue is the next great MU guard since Wade. If Yous turns into Thabeet. If Someone else steps up big time (erik williams, jamail jones). If we develop a good point (either Caddy or Smith) And if we have a deep bench, we will be a title contender. These are a lot of huge IFs.
Even if these don't happen, I could see us making a couple deep tourney runs in the next 2+ years as long as Buzz is here.
Quote from: bilsu on March 22, 2010, 10:26:10 PM
Not until we have 3 McDonald's all-americans on our team.
Please tell me you forgot to use teal.
1. Last year we were on our way to a 3 seed until DJ went down
2. What does GT have? 3 of them? How far did they go? The last 2 years?
3. UNC looked good this year with all those MAA. Pause not.
Bottom line is with hard work we can go anywhere (in yrs to come).
As soon as we sign more white guys and change our name to Northern Iowa or Cornell.
Next year MU will feature a team with very limited experience. Butler has 1 and 1/2 years true experience. DJO, Buycks and Fulce have 1 year (Joe was injured his first year and hardly played other than at Providence). The soph class of Otule, Cadougan, Mbao and Williams realistically has zero on-court experience, but do have the experience of being in the program. The newbies ( Crowder, Blue, Newbill, Smith and Jones) are obviously starting from scratch. This has to one of the least experienced teams in the country next year and a team with huge questions in the post with the departure of Hayward.
This team will be fun to watch. But, its going to be hard to accomplish what was accomplished this past season. Could be a bumpy ride.
Quote from: Nukem2 on March 23, 2010, 10:27:17 AM
This team will be fun to watch. But, its going to be hard to accomplish what was accomplished this past season. Could be a bumpy ride.
We're already playing down the expectations for next year? There is no reason we can't be just as successful next year as we have been this year. Losing Hayward and Acker will hurt, but it's not like they're being replaced with chopped liver. The incoming class looks good. We have some guys returning from injury in Junior and Otule. We have a solid core in Butler and DJO, along with a hopefully improved senior Buycks and a nice role player in Fulce. Williams might start to show some improvement.
I don't expect a Final Four, but I completely expect next year's team to accomplish at least what this year's team did: compete every game, stay in the top half of the Big East, and make the tournament.
Quote from: bilsu on March 22, 2010, 10:26:10 PM
Not until we have 3 McDonald's all-americans on our team.
http://newsok.com/three-oklahoma-mens-basketball-players-might-be-on-way-out/article/3448479?custom_click=lead_story_title
Just want to point out that having three AA is not sure fire ticket to success. Oklahoma went 4-12 this season with three AA and their program is imploding.
I agree that losing all three seniors will impact next year, but the Warriors will be MUCH deeper next year. That alone buoys my hopes. I, for one, will expect a deeper run in the NCAA tourney than this year. It's funny that this was supposed to be a rebuilding year and Marquette won 22 games, so now some think next year is the rebuilding year. I think Kentucky this year and Memphis a few years ago showed that young teams can win. (And I know that we won't have Rose or Wall on next year's team. I also know that all of our players will have taken their own SATs/ACTs.) Add a stud in the middle, either from development from current guys or a real stud signing, and Marquette can start the annual Elite 8 march in two years.
If we want to be "realistic", stop talking about annual tourney performances. Tourney is a crap shoot. Lets talk about regular season performances with NCAA appearances. I think we will be strong next season but so will alot of other teams in the Big East. Next year, we will not be "deep". We will play eight players consistently and nine in a blow out. We will be lucky if Blue can contribute next season. The JUCO's will play the same roles that DJO and Butler played their first seasons. I do like the competition for starting roles next year. That will be good for everyone.
Quote from: TJ on March 23, 2010, 10:47:34 AM
We're already playing down the expectations for next year? There is no reason we can't be just as successful next year as we have been this year. Losing Hayward and Acker will hurt, but it's not like they're being replaced with chopped liver. The incoming class looks good. We have some guys returning from injury in Junior and Otule. We have a solid core in Butler and DJO, along with a hopefully improved senior Buycks and a nice role player in Fulce. Williams might start to show some improvement.
I don't expect a Final Four, but I completely expect next year's team to accomplish at least what this year's team did: compete every game, stay in the top half of the Big East, and make the tournament.
Who is downplaying expectations? The reality is that this will be a very inexperienced team next season. Certainly I have high hopes; but, it could take a while to get going and the road could well be very bumpy. That was true this past season as well. The senior class pulled its weight. the question is whether next year's seniors (and juniors) can do the same or if the newbies will make a significant contribution to help bridge the gap. Stay tuned.
Quote from: speri on March 23, 2010, 10:57:04 AM
http://newsok.com/three-oklahoma-mens-basketball-players-might-be-on-way-out/article/3448479?custom_click=lead_story_title
Just want to point out that having three AA is not sure fire ticket to success. Oklahoma went 4-12 this season with three AA and their program is imploding.
All right! That has to make us the leader for Reggie Murphy, right?
Quote from: ErickJD08 on March 23, 2010, 02:45:53 PM
If we want to be "realistic", stop talking about annual tourney performances. Tourney is a crap shoot. Lets talk about regular season performances with NCAA appearances. I think we will be strong next season but so will alot of other teams in the Big East. Next year, we will not be "deep". We will play eight players consistently and nine in a blow out. We will be lucky if Blue can contribute next season. The JUCO's will play the same roles that DJO and Butler played their first seasons. I do like the competition for starting roles next year. That will be good for everyone.
I think that you will be pleasantly surprised by Mr. Blue. Other than that, I have to say that you appear to be one smart donkey!
Quote from: ErickJD08 on March 23, 2010, 02:45:53 PM
If we want to be "realistic", stop talking about annual tourney performances. Tourney is a crap shoot. Lets talk about regular season performances with NCAA appearances.
From this point of view, I would say that we've already achieved the level of quality and consistency that the original poster was asking about (though he was obviously referring to rankings and tournament performance).
The statistic that only MU and Pitt have won at least 10 BEast games each season since the expansion remains impressive (though not necessarily one to hang a banner about). We have not (yet!) won the regular season nor BEast tournament championships, but our consistency is quite high. Can we keep it up? Can we have those 'peak' seasons where one or both of those happen? Can we parlay our league success into NCAA tourney success with deep runs?
I, like everyone here, certainly hope so. More, I believe we can and will maintain that consistency and will have peak seasons. I look forward to them!!
Quote from: redbirdwarrior on March 23, 2010, 02:11:09 PM
I agree that losing all three seniors will impact next year, but the Warriors will be MUCH deeper next year. That alone buoys my hopes. I, for one, will expect a deeper run in the NCAA tourney than this year. It's funny that this was supposed to be a rebuilding year and Marquette won 22 games, so now some think next year is the rebuilding year. I think Kentucky this year and Memphis a few years ago showed that young teams can win. (And I know that we won't have Rose or Wall on next year's team. I also know that all of our players will have taken their own SATs/ACTs.) Add a stud in the middle, either from development from current guys or a real stud signing, and Marquette can start the annual Elite 8 march in two years.
I think the fact that Cadougan, Williams, Mbao and Otule never really played this year leads people to think next year will be the rebuilding year, as it was expected all would contribute this year and get some experience under their belts. As such, these four are delayed in their development and next year could be the rebuilding year, especially with the loss of Hayward, Cubillian and Acker.
Quote from: Squawking Chickens on March 22, 2010, 10:49:09 PM
If Van Blue is the next great MU guard since Wade.
I think the next great MU guard is already on the team. It's DJO.
If Blue can approach DJO's ability, I'll be very, very happy.
DJO needs to get that aggressiveness and fearlessness that Wade had. So far he is too inconsistent to be compared to Wade.
DJO can't carry Wade's jockstrap.
Quote from: 4everwarriors on March 24, 2010, 10:22:41 AM
DJO can't carry Wade's jockstrap.
No player in the world can carry DWade's jockstrap!! Other than LeBron, there is not a more efficient, effective player in the NBA/world. DJO is the best guard at MU since D-Wade - he won't ever be as effective of slasher as DWade was, as DWade had a great body/lower center of gravity than DJO, which allowed DWade to get low to the ground and make unbelievable drives baseline/everywhere else. But, DWade never had near the 3 point shot DJO did in his 2 years are Marquette. DJO will be a major stud his senior year at MU, and will exceed what McNeal or Matthews accomplished as seniors. I bet DJO is good for 20ppg and 6/7 assists per game as a senior. He's already a better creator/passer than Jerel or Wes were..
Quote from: Ners on March 24, 2010, 10:49:31 AM
No player in the world can carry DWade's jockstrap!! Other than LeBron, there is not a more efficient, effective player in the NBA/world. DJO is the best guard at MU since D-Wade - he won't ever be as effective of slasher as DWade was, as DWade had a great body/lower center of gravity than DJO, which allowed DWade to get low to the ground and make unbelievable drives baseline/everywhere else. But, DWade never had near the 3 point shot DJO did in his 2 years are Marquette. DJO will be a major stud his senior year at MU, and will exceed what McNeal or Matthews accomplished as seniors. I bet DJO is good for 20ppg and 6/7 assists per game as a senior. He's already a better creator/passer than Jerel or Wes were..
I'll take McNeal as the best since DWade. The guy is number one scorer at MU all time. DJO still has alot to prove. I will say that DJO's current skill set is more advanced that JM's at their respective years, but DJO still needs to improve.
Quote from: Ners on March 24, 2010, 10:49:31 AM
No player in the world can carry DWade's jockstrap!! Other than LeBron, there is not a more efficient, effective player in the NBA/world. DJO is the best guard at MU since D-Wade - he won't ever be as effective of slasher as DWade was, as DWade had a great body/lower center of gravity than DJO, which allowed DWade to get low to the ground and make unbelievable drives baseline/everywhere else. But, DWade never had near the 3 point shot DJO did in his 2 years are Marquette. DJO will be a major stud his senior year at MU, and will exceed what McNeal or Matthews accomplished as seniors. I bet DJO is good for 20ppg and 6/7 assists per game as a senior. He's already a better creator/passer than Jerel or Wes were..
I think that DJO has a ways to go defensively compared to McNeil. When comparing the two as creator/passers its important to remember that Jerel only got to play for Buzz for one year and was playing for the anal retentive coach his other three years. That being said DJO definitely can surpass McNeil, if he keeps working, especially on avoiding turnovers, especially when driving the lane.
Quote from: CanadianGyroEater on March 24, 2010, 07:13:26 PM
Who would want to?
I would, for one. Think what you could get for it on Ebay!!!!
Especially if the sweat formed a picture of the face of some saint! :o
Quote from: ErickJD08 on March 24, 2010, 10:57:43 AM
I'll take McNeal as the best since DWade. The guy is number one scorer at MU all time. DJO still has alot to prove. I will say that DJO's current skill set is more advanced that JM's at their respective years, but DJO still needs to improve.
Agree DJO still needs to improve, but my feeling is that his ceiling is much higher than Jerel's. DJO is a much more explosive athlete than Jerel - Jerel could hardly dunk (one way to measure explosiveness). Furthermore DJO already is a superior shooter to Jerel, - I checked stats and DJO shot better from the field as a sophomore, than Jerel did as a senior - 45.5% to 44.2% from 3 he wins 47.4% to 39%. I loved McNeal as a player, but just see DJO as a much better shooter and a more powerful, expolosive athlete. That said, it is hard to argue against McNeal considering he is MU's all-time scoring leader.
Take into account Jerel's defense, and I don't even think its a close call. I love DJO, and while he is certainly a better athelete, and after one season looks to be a better jump shooter, Jerel could get to anywhere on the floor that he wanted to. Until I see DJO shoot like that one more year, when there is no Lazar around, or until I see him contending for a Big East Defensive Player of the year, I'm going for Jerel. DJO's offensive potential is not enough to put him past Jerel.
As to the original question, I think that MU has a chance to improve modestly over time to become a reasonably consistent top 6 team in the Big East with an occasional push for a top 3-4. A reasonable goal for the program is an annual invitation to the NCAA (isn't it 5 straight now?) and a Sweet 16 possibility. I think we kid ourselves if we believe that MU will be competing for a national championship. Wasn't Villy the last Catholic school to win one 25 years ago? Remember, we insist on having actual student athletes that graduate. I'll take that over a dirty program any day.
I simply ask you guys to remember the 90s under Mike Deane or the late 80s under Bob Dukiet. That's what we want to avoid. I have no desire to return to the days of lousy basketball. Much credit must go to Fr. Wild for his understanding of what hoops means to MU...... and for his decision to hire Buzz despite significant internal debate. If I were on the search committee, one of my questions would be about any future President's commitment to basketball.
Quote from: TJ on March 23, 2010, 10:47:34 AM
We're already playing down the expectations for next year? There is no reason we can't be just as successful next year as we have been this year. Losing Hayward and Acker will hurt, but it's not like they're being replaced with chopped liver. The incoming class looks good. We have some guys returning from injury in Junior and Otule. We have a solid core in Butler and DJO, along with a hopefully improved senior Buycks and a nice role player in Fulce. Williams might start to show some improvement.
I don't expect a Final Four, but I completely expect next year's team to accomplish at least what this year's team did: compete every game, stay in the top half of the Big East, and make the tournament.
and just who will replace Zar??? He is the biggest loss to the program in the last few years as he has been our only inside presence. We have been fortunate to reload our guards consistently. The front line is a completely different story.