SCOTUS

[Scoop Snoop]

There’s definitely room for a centrist party in this country that cuts out the Trump republicans and far left dems. 

Press coverage has been an issue in the past for third-parties but a party taking on both radical wings of the dominant parties would be interesting.  Of course, the entrenched money funding both parties make that unlikely anyway

Agree. You hit on two major points. The long history of third parties in the US has been that they often are formed with a presidential candidate to lead the way and-no surprise-fade into obscurity. The centrists in both parties are becoming dinosaurs. While Republican centrists should perhaps be declared an endangered species, the Democrats are under heavy attack from their own party's far left wing. So, point #1-room for an independent third party-strikes me as true. Point #2-money-is a much bigger issue. It's almost impossible to win without a big pile of money. A third issue is the infrastructure to run a campaign.

Presidential and senate races are mind-boggling expensive. If a third party-preferably with experienced candidates who have left their former parties-put all its effort and limited money into a few winnable House seats scattered around the country, a viable alternative party just might be born. As of today, it would take only a small number to be in the driver's seat (or maybe I should say the referees) in the House.   

[muwarrior69]

Oh, you believe that this actually happened, and isn't a morality story based on other morality stories.

I do. Paul's letters are not a morality story but a testament of Christ's life, death and resurrection.

[Uncle Rico]

I do. Paul's letters are not a morality story but a testament of Christ's life, death and resurrection.

Now do Islam, Hinduism and other faiths

[brewcity77]

Does it make you feel like a bigger man to mock other people's religious beliefs?

When unfounded mythological beliefs are being used to infringe upon or strip outright the rights of American citizens? Yes, you are damn right I will push back on that.

[jesmu84]

What's the definition of "centrist"? Is it a political candidate who espouses policies that the majority of Americans want?

[21Jumpstreet]

Serious question. How do you propose getting more parties involved? I am for it.

We continue to vote for neither of the main parties.

[Hards Alumni]

I do. Paul's letters are not a morality story but a testament of Christ's life, death and resurrection.

You ever hear the saying, "Don't believe everything you hear"?  Don't you think it is awfully strange that the supernatural miracles performed in the bible and the centuries thereafter haven't happened since?  It's a story to teach people to be virtuous, and give them solace and hope in the worst of times.

Consider that the Christ story is highly similar to large parts of Greek and Roman mythology. 

Of course, you're welcome to believe what you want, and I would never advocate for legislation that would infringe on that belief system.

[lawdog77]

When unfounded mythological beliefs are being used to infringe upon or strip outright the rights of American citizens? Yes, you are damn right I will push back on that.

OK, duly noted. You decide to mock a whole religion, or probably all religions, instead of mocking the individual person. Character revealed.

[MU Fan in Connecticut]

The constitution is purely secular.  History leading into the writing of it was rife with state-based religion plunging nations into wars because that’s what religion does best, kill.  If you want to ignore what the founding fathers said about how this nation was formed, so be it.  You’re wrong.  This specifically wanted a government removed from religion because history shows what happens when the two are mixed.

I’m not surprised when christofascists ignore this.  They don’t want history taught because it isn’t pretty for them

Yep.

Franklin the agnostic probably an atheist.
Jefferson the Animist.
Adams who really hated a powerful church and blamed pastors for not stopping things like the Salem Witch trials and other hysteria.
Washington who only referred to Providence and never kneeled in church services because he didn't bow to anyone.
Hamilton didn't really belong to any church until much later in life after he stepped down from Secretary of Treasury and had to something back in NYC.

I was on a founders kick for a decade and devoured multiple biographies.

[MU Fan in Connecticut]

There’s definitely room for a centrist party in this country that cuts out the Trump republicans and far left dems. 

Press coverage has been an issue in the past for third-parties but a party taking on both radical wings of the dominant parties would be interesting.  Of course, the entrenched money funding both parties make that unlikely anyway

Without third parties, Ranked Choice voting would probably soften out and cull out some of the extremists.  Not quite a cure all.
I believe Alaska and Maine already utilize.

[21Jumpstreet]

You ever hear the saying, "Don't believe everything you hear"?  Don't you think it is awfully strange that the supernatural miracles performed in the bible and the centuries thereafter haven't happened since?  It's a story to teach people to be virtuous, and give them solace and hope in the worst of times.

Consider that the Christ story is highly similar to large parts of Greek and Roman mythology. 

Of course, you're welcome to believe what you want, and I would never advocate for legislation that would infringe on that belief system.

It also came about as a sort of argument or debate to reason back in the day. Reason assesses and faith trusts. I think they can coexist, but we allow ourselves to get into debates over faith versus reason. I am a confirmed Catholic, however I am not Catholic, nor Christian. But, I do find the existence of a higher power fascinating and quite possibly true. I have faith…in people. I think we can allow for someone to be truly faithful and a follower of their religion, they have to be equally open to faith in humanity and law. Most people are open, we just like to listen to those who aren’t.

I find it hard to believe that the country wasn’t founded with some belief that god is important, it’s all over our documents, coins, recitations. In my opinion, any church not paying taxes or functioning or being treated like a citizen or business is clearly in bed with the government. Separation of the two is a myth.

A specific religion certainly should not play a role in our laws, but it does, like many many other countries in the world, maybe all. It’s up to the religious to take a look at what they are saying and understand that maybe their personal strong belief in a Christian religion is the best argument for that Christian religion not to be part of our system of laws.

[Hards Alumni]

It also came about as a sort of argument or debate to reason back in the day. Reason assesses and faith trusts. I think they can coexist, but we allow ourselves to get into debates over faith versus reason. I am a confirmed Catholic, however I am not Catholic, nor Christian. But, I do find the existence of a higher power fascinating and quite possibly true. I have faith…in people. I think we can allow for someone to be truly faithful and a follower of their religion, they have to be equally open to faith in humanity and law. Most people are open, we just like to listen to those who aren’t.

I find it hard to believe that the country wasn’t founded with some belief that god is important, it’s all over our documents, coins, recitations. In my opinion, any church not paying taxes or functioning or being treated like a citizen or business is clearly in bed with the government. Separation of the two is a myth.

A specific religion certainly should not play a role in our laws, but it does, like many many other countries in the world, maybe all. It’s up to the religious to take a look at what they are saying and understand that maybe their personal strong belief in a Christian religion is the best argument for that Christian religion not to be part of our system of laws.

Great post.  Personally, I have a strong distaste for organized religion.  I understand the societal desire for community and the inherent value in it, but I naturally have a strong distrust of authority.  Especially when that authority is a means to controlling people, their finances, and their politics.

[brewcity77]

OK, duly noted. You decide to mock a whole religion, or probably all religions, instead of mocking the individual person. Character revealed.

I'm sure you and everyone else here would happily sign up for Sharia Law if that was the religious push on our legal system. 

Separation of church and state. Period. No mythology should administer or have any say in legislation in a society where not everyone claims that mythology for their own.

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

I'm sure you and everyone else here would happily sign up for Sharia Law if that was the religious push on our legal system. 

Separation of church and state. Period. No mythology should administer or have any say in legislation in a society where not everyone claims that mythology for their own.

This is an impossible standard.

[lawdog77]

This is an impossible standard.

I agree. There is a difference between a moral code based upon one's religion and actually pushing that religion. There is still a separation of church and state. The recent Supreme Court rulings , some argue, strengthen individuals rights to exercise their religion free from governmental restraints. All religion. And many argue Roe v Wade has nothing to do with religion.

[TSmith34, Inc.]

I do. Paul's letters are not a morality story but a testament of Christ's life, death and resurrection.

Great. So should we make ol' Joe Smith's writings the basis of our laws? If not, why not? How about Mohammed's? If not, why not?

Are you OK with making the Bhagavad-Gita the law of the land?
Surely we can all agree that the teachings of Buddha should be the law, no?
Maybe Battlefield Earth Dianetics?
The Invisible Pink Unicorn? If not, why not?

[21Jumpstreet]

Great post.  Personally, I have a strong distaste for organized religion.  I understand the societal desire for community and the inherent value in it, but I naturally have a strong distrust of authority.  Especially when that authority is a means to controlling people, their finances, and their politics.

Appreciate you. I used to feel like you, after my parents Catholic marriage was annulled after 30 years, after my mom was basically shunned by her church while my dad had a second Catholic wedding, and my Catholic priest godfather was kicked out of the church for being gay and falling in love with an adult male parishioner, I was disgusted with organized religion. I then had both my sons baptized, because that’s what I thought should happen and my wife was more open than I was. After finding Montessori education and really questioning myself, I moved on from my religious faith. Then…I sent both my boys to a Jesuit high school! I can’t get away from it!

My point, I am no longer disgusted nor do I have a strong distaste for organized religion. So many good people are faithful, religious people, some of the kindest people I have ever met. It’s just not for me, and I don’t need or want a god to tell me how to act, it’s 100% on me.

 Now, I also believe we as humans like to be grouped, labeled, and led. My personal goal for the last oh five years or so is to try to remove groupings and labels from difficult discussions. It is quite possibly impossible, but I try. So, what I mean is that I am all for organized religion, it is really important to billions of people. I’m all for law. I am all for humanity. I strongly believe people are good at the core even when left to their own devices. I know deep down that no single belief, group, organization could possibly represent the person I am. That’s not meant to be arrogant, it’s actually meant as the complete opposite. It also helps me to be open. For abortion, for example, I could never fathom my wife getting one, AND I could never fathom letting my wife die if an abortion will save her life. I think what some of the self described religious people get mixed up is that they don’t have to get an abortion. They can still choose to live their kind of virtuous life. Yes, they can choose. Remove pro-life and pro-choice from the discussion, because we are all both!

Anyway, my diarrhea of the mouth is rarely a good thing, so I’ll continue to read our posts here and faith that we all have some mutual respect for each other, deep down somewhere, it’s there. We just have to find it.

[Hards Alumni]

100%

[Spotcheck Billy]

We continue to vote for neither of the main parties.

I've been doing that in elections since 1980. I have since learned that I'm going to need more help with this lol.

[21Jumpstreet]

I've been doing that in elections since 1980. I have since learned that I'm going to need more help with this lol.

Same, not quite as long, but Papa Bush is/was my first and only main party vote, my parents told me to. Then after complaining to my future father-in-law about the system and saying I would never vote again, he looked me dead in the eye and said that’s lazy, that’s the problem, find the person who best represents you, or go be that person. Well, okay then. I have had so many people tell me I’m throwing away my vote, I’m the reason that Trump won or Obama won. Well, for me, this is one of those stubborn mindsets I have, and I’ve since thought if I voted for a main party candidate I would personally be throwing away my vote.

He was also a strong believer in Jesus as the leader of men and did not go to church. Interesting man he was, lost way too early to ALS. I told my boys he might be in Heaven, he might be in the earth, he might be our dog or the cardinal in our yard, and that he is within them. Politics and religion are tricky, for everyone.

[Dickthedribbler]

When unfounded mythological beliefs are being used to infringe upon or strip outright the rights of American citizens? Yes, you are damn right I will push back on that.

Man, if you guys are going to toss your cookies everytime the U.S. Supreme Court issues a ruling you don't agree with, you're going to be in for a long, long 10-15 years or so, given the relative youth of the majority Justices.

[JWags85]

Appreciate you. I used to feel like you, after my parents Catholic marriage was annulled after 30 years, after my mom was basically shunned by her church while my dad had a second Catholic wedding, and my Catholic priest godfather was kicked out of the church for being gay and falling in love with an adult male parishioner, I was disgusted with organized religion. I then had both my sons baptized, because that’s what I thought should happen and my wife was more open than I was. After finding Montessori education and really questioning myself, I moved on from my religious faith. Then…I sent both my boys to a Jesuit high school! I can’t get away from it!

My point, I am no longer disgusted nor do I have a strong distaste for organized religion. So many good people are faithful, religious people, some of the kindest people I have ever met. It’s just not for me, and I don’t need or want a god to tell me how to act, it’s 100% on me.

 Now, I also believe we as humans like to be grouped, labeled, and led. My personal goal for the last oh five years or so is to try to remove groupings and labels from difficult discussions. It is quite possibly impossible, but I try. So, what I mean is that I am all for organized religion, it is really important to billions of people. I’m all for law. I am all for humanity. I strongly believe people are good at the core even when left to their own devices. I know deep down that no single belief, group, organization could possibly represent the person I am. That’s not meant to be arrogant, it’s actually meant as the complete opposite. It also helps me to be open. For abortion, for example, I could never fathom my wife getting one, AND I could never fathom letting my wife die if an abortion will save her life. I think what some of the self described religious people get mixed up is that they don’t have to get an abortion. They can still choose to live their kind of virtuous life. Yes, they can choose. Remove pro-life and pro-choice from the discussion, because we are all both!

Anyway, my diarrhea of the mouth is rarely a good thing, so I’ll continue to read our posts here and faith that we all have some mutual respect for each other, deep down somewhere, it’s there. We just have to find it.

Too many people use a dislike or grievance with a particular church, or organized religion, as an excuse to bash faith, belief, or religious people in general, and thats what I have always had an issue with.

Do I want extremely conservative dogmatic people making decisions for a whole population?  No.  Can I keep that separate from trashing Christianity?  Absolutely.  Plenty of others cant.

[Jockey]

Jefferson hung around the French too much, which reminds me of a joke.

A man walks into a library and asks the librarian:
"Can I see the a copy of the French Constitution?"
to which the librarian responds, "Sorry, we don't carry periodicals."

You must have been a big ‘Freedom Fries’ advocate.

[Jockey]

Does it make you feel like a bigger man to mock other people's religious beliefs?

Evangelicals believe trump is a Christian.

Yes, that should be made fun of.

[Hards Alumni]

Man, if you guys are going to toss your cookies everytime the U.S. Supreme Court issues a ruling you don't agree with, you're going to be in for a long, long 10-15 years or so, given the relative youth of the majority Justices.

Yeah no kidding, why else would there be anger?  We're just trying to advocate for balance on the court, and not the willy nilly flip flopping on settled law.  Republicans have absolutely no qualms about playing dirty, some folks around here think it's about time for a tit for tat from the Dems.

As I've said, the GOP will dump the filibuster rule in the senate the very first time they need to.  The Democrats want to continue to play by the rules as if they even exist anymore.  1994 was the turning point in the political discourse in the US, and the Dems are still trying to play by the rules of 1993.