Chartouny played much better against DePaul

[94Warrior]

I haven't seen it mentioned, but Joe picked up his play considerably last night.  He took care of the ball, drove and kicked to open shooters, made an important open 3 at the top of the key, cut down on turnovers and was solid on D.  If that is the guy we get the rest of the year, the team will be better for it.

Watching Howard last night, he continued to grab his side/back.  It almost looked like he was adjusting a back brace which was out of position.  Also, there were a few times on offense where he stood and watched, clearly wasn't himself.  I would guess the back is still bothersome, and having Joe become more dependable will take some pressure/wear and tear off of Markus.

I know JC is not the missing piece that we all hoped for him to be, but last night was a step in the right direction. 

A question for those who follow other teams, out of curiosity are other grad transfer PG's having a bigger/lesser impact for their new teams?

[NorthernDancerColt]

I haven't seen it mentioned, but Joe picked up his play considerably last night.  He took care of the ball, drove and kicked to open shooters, made an important open 3 at the top of the key, cut down on turnovers and was solid on D.  If that is the guy we get the rest of the year, the team will be better for it.

Watching Howard last night, he continued to grab his side/back.  It almost looked like he was adjusting a back brace which was out of position.  Also, there were a few times on offense where he stood and watched, clearly wasn't himself.  I would guess the back is still bothersome, and having Joe become more dependable will take some pressure/wear and tear off of Markus.

I know JC is not the missing piece that we all hoped for him to be, but last night was a step in the right direction. 

A question for those who follow other teams, out of curiosity are other grad transfer PG's having a bigger/lesser impact for their new teams?

MH “standing and watching”. You mean the times where Markus beautifully fed Theo and watched the ensuing monster dunks?

[NorthernDancerColt]

Good points made by 94Warrior.

The season is not even at its midpoint. There’s time for Joe to meet his own expectations, which I’d guess at least equals our own. It’s most encouraging that he picked this DePaul game featuring big, lengthy perimeter defenders to show his poise.

Joe needs to channel his inner Bernie Mac and send this message to the entire BigEast:

“I ain’t scared o you MFs”

[1SE]

Looking up the "other" JC we were targeting at as a grad transfer PG:

Cremo: 5.5pts, 1.8 reb, 1.5 asst, 0.5 steals, 1.1 TO in 19.9 min

Chartouny: 4.3 pts, 3.2 reb, 2.8 assts, 1.0 stl, 1.9 TO in 19.9 min

Now I have no idea if Cremo's been more consistent, has had more of his minutes in conference play, etc. but it doesn't look like we got the worse of the two options.

The truth of the matter is these guys were playing at mid-majors for a reason - to expect them to be difference makers at top-level P6 schools was always ridiculous.

If we can get 10 solid minutes where Joe is a net contributor for the rest of the season I'd say we're doing well.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

A question for those who follow other teams, out of curiosity are other grad transfer PG's having a bigger/lesser impact for their new teams?

These are the basic stats for every PG/CG grad transfer that ended up at a high major or top mid-major organized by minutes played:

Makai Mason (Baylor from Yale) 32.2 mpg, 15.7 ppg, 2.7 rpg, 2.9 apg, 0.5 spg, 0.0 bpg, 2.5 tpg, 52.6 eFG%
Zach Johnson (Miami-FL from FGCU): 30.7 mpg, 13.3 ppg, 3.2 rpg, 2.2 apg, 1.6 spg, 0.4 bpg, 1.9 tpg, 47.6 eFG%
Tramaine Isabell (St. Louis from Drexel) 30.0 mpg, 11.4 ppg, 4.1 rpg, 3.2 apg, 1.1 spg, 0.1 bpg, 2.8 tpg, 42.6 eFG%
Matt Mooney (Texas Tech from South Dakota): 29.2 mpg, 10.2 ppg, 3.6 rpg, 2.8 apg, 1.7 spg, 0.1 bpg, 2.6 tpg, 48.5 eFG%
Justin Coleman (Arizona from Samford): 29.0 mpg, 9.1 ppg, 2.2 rpg, 3.2 apg, 1.0 spg, 0.0 bpg, 2.0 tpg, 52.6 eFG%
Christen Cunningham (Louisville from Samford): 28.7 mpg, 10.8 ppg, 2.1 rpg, 4.1 apg, 0.5 spg, 0.1 bpg, 1.7 tpg, 59.4 eFG%
Nat Dixon (SMU from Chattanooga): 26.6 mpg, 6.3 ppg, 1.9 rpg, 1.7 apg, 0.8 spg, 0.0 bpg, 1.1 tpg, 54.5 eFG%
Keyshawn Woods (Ohio State from Wake Forest): 26.2 mpg, 7.0 ppg, 2.8 rpg, 2.9 apg, 0.4 spg, 0.1 bpg, 1.2 tpg, 47.8 eFG%
Tre Campbell (South Carolina from Georgetown): 23.6 mpg, 5.4 ppg, 1.6 rpg, 1.6 apg, 1.1 spg, 0.1 bpg, 1.2 tpg, 39.4 eFG%
Miles Reynolds (Oklahoma from Pacific): 23.3 mpg, 8.4 ppg, 2.8 rpg, 1.5 apg, 0.8 spg, 0.1 bpg, 1.5 tpg, 41.6 eFG%
Aaron Calixte (Oklahoma from Maine): 23.1 mpg, 7.9 ppg, 2.3 rpg, 2.9 apg, 0.4 spg, 0.0 bpg, 2.3 tpg, 51.6 eFG%
Tarin Smith (UConn from Duquesne): 23.0 mpg, 8.5 ppg, 3.0 rpg, 2.2 apg, 1.0 spg, 0.3 bpg, 1.2 tpg, 48.1 eFG%
Torry Johnson (Wake Forest from Northern Arizona): 20.2 mpg, 5.6 ppg, 1.7 rpg, 1.4 apg, 0.6 spg, 0.0 bpg, 1.4 tpg, 40.1 eFG%
Joseph Chartouny (Marquette from Fordham): 19.9 mpg, 4.3 ppg, 3.2 rpg, 2.8 apg, 1.0 spg, 0.0 bpg, 1.9 tpg, 55.6 eFG%
Joe Cremo (Villanova from Albany): 19.9 mpg, 5.5 ppg, 1.8 rpg, 1.5 apg, 0.5 spg, 0.1 bpg, 1.1 tpg, 57.7 eFG%
Ehab Amin (Oregon from A&M-CC): 19.8 mpg, 5.9 ppg, 3.0 rpg, 1.7 apg, 1.8 spg, 0.2 bpg, 1.1 tpg, 41.0 eFG%
Khwan Fore (Louisville from Richmond): 19.3 mpg, 3.6 ppg, 1.4 rpg, 1.4 apg, 0.6 spg, 0.1 bpg, 0.8 tpg, 45.8 eFG%
David Nichols (Florida State from Albany): 18.9 mpg, 7.5 ppg, 1.4 rpg, 1.5 apg, 0.7 spg, 0.1 bpg, 1.7 tpg, 51.7 eFG%
Geno Crandall (Gonzaga from North Dakota): 18.8 mpg, 5.3 ppg, 2.0 rpg, 2.3 apg, 1.1 spg, 0.2 bpg, 1.7 tpg, 44.2 eFG% (missed 9 games to injury)
Mike Cunningham (Oklahoma State from USC Upstate): 18.3 mpg, 8.0 ppg, 1.6 rpg, 1.1 apg, 0.7 spg, 0.0 bpg, 1.3 tpg, 57.1 eFG% (only played in 7 games before being dismissed for violation of team rules)
Eric Lockett (NC State from FIU): 17.2 mpg, 5.6 ppg, 3.5 rpg, 1.6 apg, 0.5 spg, 0.2 bpg, 0.8 tpg, 60.0 eFG%
Lyrik Shreiner (DePaul from CSU Northridge): 11.5 mpg, 1.7 ppg, 1.6 rpg, 1.0 apg, 0.2 spg, 0.1 bpg, 0.9 tpg, 37.5 eFG%
Brock Stull (Minnesota from Milwaukee): 9.9 mpg, 1.9 ppg, 1.0 rpg, 0.6 apg, 0.3 spg, 0.1 bpg, 0.5 tpg, 62.5 eFG%
Connor Cashaw (Creighton from Rice): 9.9 mpg, 1.9 ppg, 1.6 rpg, 1.0 apg, 0.8 spg, 0.1 bpg, 0.8 tpg, 60.7 eFG%
Landon Goesling (Houston from D2 St. Edwards): 7.2 mpg, 3.4 ppg, 0.5 rpg, 0.4 apg, 0.3 spg, 0.0 bpg, 0.2 tpg, 40.9 eFG% (really only gets garbage minutes)

A couple of observations:

You don't see a lot of for sure tourney teams giving a PG grad transfer 20+ minutes. You have Mooney for Texas Tech and Cunningham for Louisville and maybe Calixte/Reynolds for Oklahoma (I'm still not convinced they're good). The rest are bubble teams or not likely to make the tourney.

The player we may have missed out on was Christen Cunningham. We beat out Louisville for Chartouny and then Mack turned around and grabbed Cunningham who has been very solid for them.

In terms of the polls, us and Gonzaga are the two top teams on here, and our grad transfers are backups.

Joe has some of the best assist numbers and worst turnover numbers. His eFG% is also on the higher end. I still think a lot of his issues are confidence based.

All in all, Joe isn't quite what I hoped he be. I was hoping he would be the 5th starter on this team. Instead his numbers are more like the first guy off the bench. Not too far off from expectations and there is still time for him to get there.

[Stretchdeltsig]

I haven't seen it mentioned, but Joe picked up his play considerably last night.  He took care of the ball, drove and kicked to open shooters, made an important open 3 at the top of the key, cut down on turnovers and was solid on D.  If that is the guy we get the rest of the year, the team will be better for it.

Watching Howard last night, he continued to grab his side/back.  It almost looked like he was adjusting a back brace which was out of position.  Also, there were a few times on offense where he stood and watched, clearly wasn't himself.  I would guess the back is still bothersome, and having Joe become more dependable will take some pressure/wear and tear off of Markus.

I know JC is not the missing piece that we all hoped for him to be, but last night was a step in the right direction. 

A question for those who follow other teams, out of curiosity are other grad transfer PG's having a bigger/lesser impact for their new teams?

Agree with your points. It was noticeable that Markus played much slower.  He was not as quick on the court, especially when running around without the ball.  The lack of quickness made him much easier to defend.  His back must be bothering him.

[JakeBarnes]

Agree with your points. It was noticeable that Markus played much slower.  He was not as quick on the court, especially when running around without the ball.  The lack of quickness made him much easier to defend.  His back must be bothering him.

I agree with the above points as well. Joe was a lot more intense on the defensive end, but played really controlled. It feels like he has been forcing it all season. However, every so often you see him let things flow naturally and it goes well. The 3pt he hit was completely a rhythm shot: strong, instinctual. Contrast that with the 2 he airballed on Sunday--you could literally watch the wheels turn in his head as he thought it through.

I really do hope he starts to feel more comfortable on the court. Wojo has been preaching it to the team for the past weeks: be confident with it. The Hausers and Sacar have taken it to heart. Heck, even Bailey had some good possessions in the GTown game where he shot his shot. Need Joe C to get that feeling on the offensive end where he creates out of instinct rather than second-guessing.

[Daniel]

JC will be fine if he stops thinking about everything he is doing or about to do.   When he reacts instead of responds he will ok.    It is hard to get that concept from the brain to the body, but if he does he will be very valuable the rest of Season and tourneys.

[We R Final Four]

I think DePaul played Joe poorly. They attacked Joe defensively on his drives allowing him to kick out to open teammates behind the arc. Joe did what he was supposed to—which is fine. However, I don’t think he’s turned any corner, I don’t think he “gets it” now. I think he is what he is.
That may mean 0-1, 1-3 FT, 3 TOs and 2 other poor decisions.....OR he may go 1-2 from deep, 3 assts., 2-3 FTs, 1-2 TOS.
But Joe will see a little action.....if he plays ok Wojo will ride him for another minute.
I think Wojo will continue to go with “who doesn’t screw up.” BB will get chances but a bad shot, a bad pass and not grabbing a loose ball means you’re done. Same with Joe.

[TheTulsaWarrior]

Living in Eugene I've seen a lot of the Egyptian point guard who transferred to the Ducks.  He would have been a good addition to Marquette.  Amin has good quickness and a decent offensive game.  On D he has stayed in front of anyone on the Oregon schedule.

Ehab Amin (Oregon from A&M-CC): 19.8 mpg, 5.9 ppg, 3.0 rpg, 1.7 apg, 1.8 spg, 0.2 bpg, 1.1 tpg, 41.0 eFG%

[warriorchick]

Living in Eugene I've seen a lot of the Egyptian point guard who transferred to the Ducks.  He would have been a good addition to Marquette.  Amin has good quickness and a decent offensive game.  On D he has stayed in front of anyone on the Oregon schedule.

Ehab Amin (Oregon from A&M-CC): 19.8 mpg, 5.9 ppg, 3.0 rpg, 1.7 apg, 1.8 spg, 0.2 bpg, 1.1 tpg, 41.0 eFG%

Egyptian Point Guard is the name of my glam-goth band.

[Loose Cannon]

Egyptian Point Guard is the name of my glam-goth band.

Reminds me of Rodney Dangerfield's dog he said he was an Egyptian Pointer when the dog left the room he left a Pyramid.

[MU82]

I think DePaul played Joe poorly. They attacked Joe defensively on his drives allowing him to kick out to open teammates behind the arc. Joe did what he was supposed to—which is fine. However, I don’t think he’s turned any corner, I don’t think he “gets it” now. I think he is what he is.

I understand what you're saying here, but ...

In many games, JCS committed turnovers on what should have been the very routine passes you mention here. Just handed the ball to our opponents.

So I think JCS looked good vs. DePaul -- did the job we brought him here for, including stepping confidently into a 3, which he swished. He also played decently against Creighton and St. John's. So there is hope. Need him to bring it every game.

[brewcity77]

Nice summary, but you forgot one key stat...

Connor Cashaw (Creighton from Rice): 9.9 mpg, 1.9 ppg, 1.6 rpg, 1.0 apg, 0.8 spg, 0.1 bpg, 0.8 tpg, 60.7 eFG%, 1 ridiculously dumb longball pass with 0.8 seconds left

[GooooMarquette]

Looking up the "other" JC we were targeting at as a grad transfer PG:

Cremo: 5.5pts, 1.8 reb, 1.5 asst, 0.5 steals, 1.1 TO in 19.9 min

Chartouny: 4.3 pts, 3.2 reb, 2.8 assts, 1.0 stl, 1.9 TO in 19.9 min

Now I have no idea if Cremo's been more consistent, has had more of his minutes in conference play, etc. but it doesn't look like we got the worse of the two options.

The truth of the matter is these guys were playing at mid-majors for a reason - to expect them to be difference makers at top-level P6 schools was always ridiculous.

If we can get 10 solid minutes where Joe is a net contributor for the rest of the season I'd say we're doing well.

I didn't know either, but you made me curious....

Turns out that Cremo was invisible against ranked teams, and since the start of the BE season. He has four double-digit scoring games all year - all before Christmas and all in double-digit wins. In Nova's six BE games, he has a grand total of 17 points (2.83 ppg) and 10 boards (1.67 rpg). In their three games against ranked opponents, he has 4 points (1.33 ppg) and 2 rebounds (0.67 rpg).

Like you said, playing most of his career vs mid-majors for a reason.

[Mr. Sand-Knit]

Looking up the "other" JC we were targeting at as a grad transfer PG:

Cremo: 5.5pts, 1.8 reb, 1.5 asst, 0.5 steals, 1.1 TO in 19.9 min

Chartouny: 4.3 pts, 3.2 reb, 2.8 assts, 1.0 stl, 1.9 TO in 19.9 min

Now I have no idea if Cremo's been more consistent, has had more of his minutes in conference play, etc. but it doesn't look like we got the worse of the two options.

The truth of the matter is these guys were playing at mid-majors for a reason - to expect them to be difference makers at top-level P6 schools was always ridiculous.

If we can get 10 solid minutes where Joe is a net contributor for the rest of the season I'd say we're doing well.

Rowsey?
Struz?   It happens

[wadesworld]

Nice summary, but you forgot one key stat...

I actually thought the pass was fine.  Could he have made a smarter play and just thrown it to any player on either team inside of MU's own 3 point arc?  Yes.  But that's more on McDermott than a kid coming in fresh off the bench.  The pass was pretty good given the decision he made.  And honestly the decision wasn't even THAT bad.  If somebody touches the ball the game is over.  Even if Joey catches the ball where he is and nobody on Creighton is even close, it would take more than 0.8 seconds to get enough behind the shot from 3/4 court to get it off.  It wasn't a line drive bullet so really SOMEONE should have touched the ball.  I thought the error was more on Kempjl (spelling?).  I have no idea what he was doing.  He like ducked away from the play when he HAD to touch the basketball, and definitely could have.  And then even after he ducked away from it, the ball was lofted with enough arc that had he realized nobody touched it right away he would've had plenty of time to run the ball down and touch it before it got out of bounds, but he hesitated and by the time the bench alerted him it was too late to chase down.  Joey spooked the heck out of him.

[Mr. Sand-Knit]

Chartouney was excellent agaibst Creighton.  Crucial in the win,  then he fell apoart before being really good agaibst Depaul.  Has had a number of really good games, infact, has 2 SOTG’s.  He needs to be more consistant and reliable n if, he will be a really big part of any success going firward.

[4everwarriors]

Living in Eugene I've seen a lot of the Egyptian point guard who transferred to the Ducks.  He would have been a good addition to Marquette.  Amin has good quickness and a decent offensive game.  On D he has stayed in front of anyone on the Oregon schedule.

Ehab Amin (Oregon from A&M-CC): 19.8 mpg, 5.9 ppg, 3.0 rpg, 1.7 apg, 1.8 spg, 0.2 bpg, 1.1 tpg, 41.0 eFG%

Egyptian point guards, is dat like pygmy point guards, hey?

[MU Fan in Connecticut]

Egyptian Point Guard is the name of my glam-goth band.

The Egyptian Magician.

[We R Final Four]

The problem I foresee with Joe is what we have seen from Joe. Inconsistency. Wojo can’t trust him, so he gives him select opportunities. Joe doesn’t need to be great in those chances, he needs to be serviceable. For the sole purpose of providing rest to MH and others. If he passes up the open 3, or if he throws yet another frickin bounce pass off of a defenders leg/foot I’m gonna scream. He hasn’t gotten the memo that there is a reason Ed is open on the block with a defender behind him, just daring Ed to shoot from 10’. Joe......that will always be open. Always. No need to look to Ed to isolate in the post every time down the court.
Must have been tough sitting on the bench watching Sam bring the ball up, cuz coach thinks Sam can do it and he trusts him.
We need Joe to provide serviceable minutes for the long term success this season.