for those of you who wanted a Catholic league - here is where the 40 rank

[auburnmarquette]

http://www.crackedsidewalks.com/2018/03/marquettes-ranking-among-catholic-d1.html

I mean, the Catholic-school advocates won with a 90% Catholic league, but with two Catholic schools in the Final Four here is where all 40 rank.

[Skitch]

I think you missed Loyola-Chicago.

[PuertoRicanNightmare]

Canisius?

[mileskishnish72]

Man, when I was there Holy Cross was a Jesuit school.

[MU Fan in Connecticut]

I think Sacred Heart University is Diocesan.

[jsglow]

Redo! 

[WarriorDad]

http://www.crackedsidewalks.com/2018/03/marquettes-ranking-among-catholic-d1.html

I mean, the Catholic-school advocates won with a 90% Catholic league, but with two Catholic schools in the Final Four here is where all 40 rank.

Were you using this list from years ago?   http://www.crackedsidewalks.com/2012/12/top-40-catholic-basketball-teams-and.html

[GooooMarquette]

USF at 19?

But they are on the verge of hanging a banner....

[MU82]

Yeshiva?

[Galway Eagle]

This is an awkward list.

Also would a Jesuit league be the most top heavy conference in the country?

[Knight Commission]

How did I not know the West Coast Conference is made up of only Private schools?  It is really the Big East of the West.  Would like to see a Big East/West Coast Conference tourney

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

How did I not know the West Coast Conference is made up of only Private schools?  It is really the Big East of the West.  Would like to see a Big East/West Coast Conference tourney

Its the Big East of the west only if you don't take into account the quality of basketball being played.

The WCC would be like a conference of Xavier (Gonzaga)  Creighton (St.  Mary's)   St. John's (BYU),   DePaul (USF),  and 6 teams worse than DePaul.

[auburnmarquette]

Thanks all - so added the two and have 42 of 351 now on the link.

[Galway Eagle]

Let's say college athletics changed and somehow this became a separate league. Would you all follow MU as closely? I mean there's still a lot of solid teams on here with classic tradition. Not sure you could still claim national champion though.

[GooooMarquette]

Let's say college athletics changed and somehow this became a separate league. Would you all follow MU as closely? I mean there's still a lot of solid teams on here with classic tradition. Not sure you could still claim national champion though.

Follow? Yes. As closely? No.

Without a chance to get to the (real) dance and win it all, it might as well be D-2.

[Galway Eagle]

Follow? Yes. As closely? No.

Without a chance to get to the (real) dance and win it all, it might as well be D-2.

If a change in landscape were to force a change like the one I'm suggesting why would it not be the real dance? Us, ND, Zags, Nova, Georgetown and Creighton have all gotten top 3 seeds in the past few years.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

If a change in landscape were to force a change like the one I'm suggesting why would it not be the real dance? Us, ND, Zags, Nova, Georgetown and Creighton have all gotten top 3 seeds in the past few years.

Because this year there were only 7 catholic schools in the top 50 teams per KenPom and only 10 in the top 75.

The average Catholic school might be better than the average non-catholic school, but a majority of the top programs (and fanbases) are at non-catholic schools. If Catholics broke off from non-catholic schools no one would miss them honestly.

[vogue65]

John, you got it wrong, some of us want less catholic.   Big Al was totally against a catholic league, even a close imitation.  Yes, we were independent in those days, but there were many strong independents.   Today l think there is only one independent, NJIT of Newark.

ND and BC are the model, go play with the big boys.  There was a day for the Bonnies, La Sale, H.C., and St. Joe's, but that day has come and gone.

[Galway Eagle]

Because this year there were only 7 catholic schools in the top 50 teams per KenPom and only 10 in the top 75.

The average Catholic school might be better than the average non-catholic school, but a majority of the top programs (and fanbases) are at non-catholic schools. If Catholics broke off from non-catholic schools no one would miss them honestly.

Was this an average year for catholic schools? I guess I think of us Georgetown and Dayton being pretty farther down than usual but maybe there were a few more that were up as opposed to how they usually are.

[auburnmarquette]

John, you got it wrong, some of us want less catholic.   Big Al was totally against a catholic league, even a close imitation.  Yes, we were independent in those days, but there were many strong independents.   Today l think there is only one independent, NJIT of Newark.

ND and BC are the model, go play with the big boys.  There was a day for the Bonnies, La Sale, H.C., and St. Joe's, but that day has come and gone.

Yes, I agree with you and was arguing less Catholic when all the merger talk was going on. I'd love UConn back in the Big East as an 11th team - though I realize when you build a $90 million football stadium to go up to FBS you are stuck. Heck, if Boston University had a plan to really upgrade, I'd love them just to break back into Boston.

I was just throwing this out for those on the other side of the argument, but I am truly on your side though I'm fine with the way things worked out due to FS1 backing as the best option we had.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

John, you got it wrong, some of us want less catholic.   Big Al was totally against a catholic league, even a close imitation.  Yes, we were independent in those days, but there were many strong independents.   Today l think there is only one independent, NJIT of Newark.


ND and BC are the model, go play with the big boys.  There was a day for the Bonnies, La Sale, H.C., and St. Joe's, but that day has come and gone.

No independents left. NJIT joined the Atlantic Sun a few years back....which I don't know that I would ever describe Newark as a place that fits with Atlantic Sun... Sounds so tropical

[Sir Lawrence]

Because this year there were only 7 catholic schools in the top 50 teams per KenPom and only 10 in the top 75.

The average Catholic school might be better than the average non-catholic school, but a majority of the top programs (and fanbases) are at non-catholic schools. If Catholics broke off from non-catholic schools no one would miss them honestly.

I agree with your over all point, but I count 8 in KenPom top fifty:

1.  Villanova
10.  Gonzaga
15.  Xavier
25.  Seton Hall
30.  Loyola/Chicago
31.  Creighton
32.  St. Mary's
35.  Notre Dame

[GooooMarquette]

If a change in landscape were to force a change like the one I'm suggesting why would it not be the real dance? Us, ND, Zags, Nova, Georgetown and Creighton have all gotten top 3 seeds in the past few years.

With the exception of Gonzaga, ND and the BE schools have gotten 3 seeds because we have always been able to tell recruits they'd be playing the big boys game in and game out, getting major TV exposure, etc. If we were suddenly a quasi minor league, those things would go away and the talent level would eventually go to a mid-major level.

[WarriorFan]

The top 16-20 on the list would make for a really fun early-season tournament... or maybe the top 2 from each conference.  it would have to be set up so no BEAST or WCC teams play their own conference in the first two rounds.  Would be much better than playing South Western Kentucky Technical and Agricultural College. 

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

I agree with your over all point, but I count 8 in KenPom top fifty:

1.  Villanova
10.  Gonzaga
15.  Xavier
25.  Seton Hall
30.  Loyola/Chicago
31.  Creighton
32.  St. Mary's
35.  Notre Dame

Haha,  the one I missed was Notre Dame

[auburnmarquette]

Haha,  the one I missed was Notre Dame

My favorite thing to ask Notre Dame grads, "Did you apply to any Catholic Universities?"

[GooooMarquette]

The top 16-20 on the list would make for a really fun early-season tournament... or maybe the top 2 from each conference.  it would have to be set up so no BEAST or WCC teams play their own conference in the first two rounds.  Would be much better than playing South Western Kentucky Technical and Agricultural College.

Aren't they in the same conference as Milwaukee Teachers' College?

[Billy Hoyle]

The top 16-20 on the list would make for a really fun early-season tournament... or maybe the top 2 from each conference.  it would have to be set up so no BEAST or WCC teams play their own conference in the first two rounds.  Would be much better than playing South Western Kentucky Technical and Agricultural College.

Too bad that isn't permissible and even possible. Any such "tournament" would have to be set up like PK80 which was two separate brackets that crowned two separate champions since the rule is that an exempt tournament cannot have multiple teams from the same conference.

[CTWarrior]

I know it could never, ever, ever happen, but it would be fun if it became a EPL style relegation league with four 10 team leagues.  With the bottom three in each league being relegated and the top 3 moving up the following year.  Would never work for a million reasons (Would the Sisters of the Poor League (level 4) get an auto invite to the NCAA tournament?  The constant roster turnover would probably result in a bottom feeder being great one year and then moving up when the players that made them great graduated)  The top league in most years would be in the top 2 of conferences in the country, I was guess.

[willie warrior]

I agree with your over all point, but I count 8 in KenPom top fifty:

1.  Villanova
10.  Gonzaga
15.  Xavier
25.  Seton Hall
30.  Loyola/Chicago
31.  Creighton
32.  St. Mary's
35.  Notre Dame

What is really pathetic about this list is that MU is 9th.

[auburnmarquette]

What is really pathetic about this list is that MU is 9th.

Hate to say Notre Dame would have been much further ahead of us if Bonzie didn't go down - so there is a huge gap between these 8 and us

[Fullodds]

And MU would have been better wo injuries to Howard and Hauser.

[GooooMarquette]

And MU would have been better wo injuries to Howard and Hauser.

Yep. People can play "what if" all day when it comes to injuries, but the reality is that every team deals with them eventually. Sam's injury in particular could have swung several games in the other direction.

And our '09 tourney run if Dominic didn't get hurt...and missing out in '05 without Diener....

[Galway Eagle]

Yep. People can play "what if" all day when it comes to injuries, but the reality is that every team deals with them eventually. Sam's injury in particular could have swung several games in the other direction.

And our '09 tourney run if Dominic didn't get hurt...and missing out in '05 without Diener....

09-present if otule wasn't hurt

[GooooMarquette]

09-present if otule wasn't hurt

I laughed.

[Billy Hoyle]

Yep. People can play "what if" all day when it comes to injuries, but the reality is that every team deals with them eventually. Sam's injury in particular could have swung several games in the other direction.

And our '09 tourney run if Dominic didn't get hurt...and missing out in '05 without Diener....

Don't forget Jerel's injury in 2007.  His being out dropped us to a 9 seed against Michigan State.

Dom's injury sucked but Buzz really mismanaged that Missouri game. There is no way Dom should have played.  That lost the game, not Lazar stepping over the line while trying to inbound the ball under our hoop.

You are correct on your first point too. Just look at the conference. Creighton could play the "what if" game this year, as could St. John's.  The biggest "what if" in recent history is Cincy and Kenyon Martin.  They probably win the 2000 national title if he doesn't break his leg in the CUSA quarters against SLU.  I know for some this is stunning, but other teams have injuries that change their seasons too.

[WarriorDad]

USA Today Article on Catholics love of basketball.  MU mention

https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/ncaab/2018/03/28/villanova-loyola-reaching-final-four-brings-light-catholic-love-basketball/467753002/

[tower912]

Uh oh, rocket, somebody did a story on Catholicism and basketball.

[WarriorDad]

New York Times article today.  Why Catholic colleges excel at basketball.  Marquette mention.

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/03/30/sports/catholic-basketball-final-four.html?smid=tw-share

[willie warrior]

Don't forget Jerel's injury in 2007.  His being out dropped us to a 9 seed against Michigan State.

Dom's injury sucked but Buzz really mismanaged that Missouri game. There is no way Dom should have played.  That lost the game, not Lazar stepping over the line while trying to inbound the ball under our hoop.

You are correct on your first point too. Just look at the conference. Creighton could play the "what if" game this year, as could St. John's.  The biggest "what if" in recent history is Cincy and Kenyon Martin.  They probably win the 2000 national title if he doesn't break his leg in the CUSA quarters against SLU.  I know for some this is stunning, but other teams have injuries that change their seasons too.

Ah yes. That MSU game, we scored 11-13 points in the first half. A real offensive onslaught, that game.

[WarriorDad]

Ah yes. That MSU game, we scored 11-13 points in the first half. A real offensive onslaught, that game.

That was one ugly game, though we did score 18 points not 11-13.   One of our worst NCAA halves in MU history.

In 2013, we also scored 18 points against Syracuse in the first half and 21 points in the second half of same game (39 total points).

In '94, 23 points against Duke in the second half.  Also 23 points in '71 in first half in our win against Miami (OH) and 23 points in '13 first half in our win against Davidson.