Very nice review of Caduogan by ESPN at the Reebok Camp

[detroitwarrior]

At the top and bottom of the link.
http://sports.espn.go.com/ncaa/recruiting/basketball/mens/news/story?id=3482877

[CAINMUTINY]

Can't wait to see this kid on campus; and although he might lack DJ's freakish athleticism, it sounds like his overall game is pretty solid.  I am no longer questioning the future of this program, as I did on april 1st.

[77ncaachamps]

Pic and article for the lazy...



Point guard Junior Cadougan (6'0, 190) from Toronto, Ontario, (Committed Marquette) is as good as advertised. He was terrific at getting to the rim off high ball screens and finishing through contact. Also, he showed the ability to read the defense by making the right decision whether that is shooting the jumper if his defender goes under the screen or finding the open man when his penetration is cut off. Cadougan is excellent at being the coach on the floor as he directs his teammates constantly. He is faster with the ball than without and escapes defenders in transition for layups. Has a good midrange game but must be a more consistent 3-point shooter -- although he is accurate enough to always keep the defense honest. He needs to improve his conditioning -- he looked a little heavy. Cadougan has battled a foot injury that noticeably slowed him from being as explosive with the ball during Tuesday's games. That being said, he was still very impressive.

[Murffieus]

His positves are his competitiveness, handling the ball in transition, and seeing the floor & setting up others particularily off transition----his negatives are lack of PG quickness, athleticism, and perimeter shooting-----not sure he will be able to breakdown BE defenses.

[ecompt]

And you know this because....?

[Murffieus]

ecompt----I have seen several of those "feel good videos" where every shot goes in and every exceptional pass is caught by the camera. Have to factor that out of course, but what;'s left is a gauge of his quickness and athleticism, which seems lacking.

Now I said the same thing about Travis Diener (lack of quickness & athleticism) and he proved me wrong, but TD could shoot treys (43%) and made big improvements in his technique in breaking down defenses begining in his junior year. Whether or not Junior has that type of upside to overcome his athletic & quickness limitations remains to be seen.

[bilsu]

I have no idea how quick he is now. But you have to consider he is reportedly over weight and recovering from a broken foot. It would seem reasonable to me that with the proper conditioning program his quickness would improve. Dwayne Wade and Dameon Mason could not shoot a three either. However, one of the differences between them was the fact that Wade could pass the ball off on a drive to the basket. Mason could not. It sounds like Cadougan can pass the ball off. The key here is to draw the defenses attention and then make them pay for it.

[Nukem2]

And you know this because....?

Murff says he saw a couple of highlight clips from which he can gauge everything.  Of course, this is the same guy that called diener "dime-a-dozen".  Go figure.

[Murffieus]

Wade was superb at dishing off----Mason could make the obvious dishoffs, but not the "eyes behind his head" dishes like DW. But one thing they both had was quickness on the penetration to be able to draw defenders to them ----- not sure if Cadaogan has that type of quickness.

[Nukem2]

Wade was superb at dishing off----Mason could make the obvious dishoffs, but not the "eyes behind his head" dishes like DW. But one thing they both had was quickness on the penetration to be able to draw defenders to them ----- not sure if Cadaogan has that type of quickness.

Mason never made the dishoffs.  He would simply put his head down and barge into the lane usually taking an off-balance shot.  The coaches constantly tried to get DM to keep his head up.  Never did so.  Huge waste of talent.

[madtownwarrior]

I am sure glad Buzz and the coaching staff actually evaluate the recruits and not Murf.     I don't think any recruit in the country is good enough for Murf.     We might as well fold the program now since all of our recruits are flawed - right Murf?

[Murffieus]

  Mason never made the dishoffs.  He would simply put his head down and barge into the lane usually taking an off-balance shot.  The coaches constantly tried to get DM to keep his head up.  Never did so.  Huge waste of talent.

What in the world are you talking about-----Mason averaged 3 apg his last year-----how in the world did he get those assists if he "never" made those dishoffs?????

[Murffieus]

I am sure glad Buzz and the coaching staff actually evaluate the recruits and not Murf.     I don't think any recruit in the country is good enough for Murf.     We might as well fold the program now since all of our recruits are flawed - right Murf?

Wrong----I think Mbakwe, Fulce, Hayward, Dj, McNeal, Mathews are all good recruits. Cadougan may be a good recruit as well, but he has limitations----I like quickness, athleticism, and trey shooting ability in my PG. Of course in all the above cases there were better people available.

[Mufflers]

He sounds like a great four year player.  MU has benefitted greatly the last few years from having players were were on the cusp of the NBA, but not quite there.  We should really reap the benefit this year with McNeal, James, and Matthews as seniors.

[Holy hell all time]

I like quickness, athleticism, and trey shooting ability in my PG. Of course in all the above cases there were better people available.

Sounds like you love Mo Acker hey?  I mean he's as quick as they come, he's like 5'4" (listed at 5'7"...standing next to him definitely not) and can just about dunk the ball, and can shoot the three pointer.  Who needs a point guard who can handle the ball, pass the ball, and run an offense?  And the size and strength of a point guard don't matter, especially in the Big East.

[Holy hell all time]

ecompt----I have seen several of those "feel good videos" where every shot goes in and every exceptional pass is caught by the camera. Have to factor that out of course, but what;'s left is a gauge of his quickness and athleticism, which seems lacking.

Really?  So, you factor out all of the good things a kid does in his highlight videos, and what do you have?  Yeah, probably some negatives, since you've factored out the positives.

[Nukem2]

What in the world are you talking about-----Mason averaged 3 apg his last year-----how in the world did he get those assists if he "never" made those dishoffs?????

What in the world are you talking about. DM had 57 assists in 31 games in his final MU season or an average of 1.8 APG. Nothing significant.  and, those assists were primarily on the perimeter passing to Diener and Novak.  Easy assists.  Otherwise, DM would do as I stated.  How soon you forget.

[ATWizJr]

Murf -Gibbons says that Cadougan is a top 60 player.  He is being compared to Kahlid-el Amin (sp?) from Uconn and other powerfully built Pg's.  Not able to break down defenses in the BE?  We'll see.

[79Warrior]

And you know this because....?

encompt, how dare you question a dime a dozen poster's opinion!!!!!!

[Murffieus]

What in the world are you talking about. DM had 57 assists in 31 games in his final MU season or an average of 1.8 APG. Nothing significant.  and, those assists were primarily on the perimeter passing to Diener and Novak.  Easy assists.  Otherwise, DM would do as I stated.  How soon you forget.

OK 2 apg, but that means he had quite a few more setups where the ball didn't go in and therefore wasn't credited with an assist.

I remember vividly his last year where he would penetrate and kick-----he would go for the finish quite a bit too, but he did work the inside/outside game----i watch for that like a hawk-----that's the most important part of a successful offense.

[Murffieus]

Murf -Gibbons says that Cadougan is a top 60 player.  He is being compared to Kahlid-el Amin (sp?) from Uconn and other powerfully built Pg's.  Not able to break down defenses in the BE?  We'll see.

Well Gibbons has him higher than everyone else-----there are rankings where he's not even in the top 100.

Diener wasn't quick or athletic either but he could hit treys and also the pullup. Most of Cadougan's points come off finishes-----like Diener though he isn't going to get that finish off at the hoop especially in the BE. In camps where defense isn't emphasized it's easy to get inside and finish-----althought the other day I see where Junior Cadougan stopped cold in his dribble penetration by a guy named Bradley!

[Holy hell all time]

Diener wasn't quick or athletic either but he could hit treys and also the pullup. Most of Cadougan's points come off finishes-----like Diener though he isn't going to get that finish off at the hoop especially in the BE. In camps where defense isn't emphasized it's easy to get inside and finish-----althought the other day I see where Junior Cadougan stopped cold in his dribble penetration by a guy named Bradley!

Steve Nash is a good 3 point shooter, but he isn't the quickest player in the NBA (Chris Paul, Allen Iverson, Tony Parker, etc.), and he is definitely not athletic, but he somehow has no problem playing the point guard in the NBA.  He also gets to the hoop, and FINISHES at will despite those things.  But yeah, shooting, quickness, and athleticism are more important than running an offense, having a good basketball IQ, ball handling, and passing ability when it comes to a point guard, so Steve Nash isn't anything special.

[Murffieus]

Steve Nash is a good 3 point shooter, but he isn't the quickest player in the NBA (Chris Paul, Allen Iverson, Tony Parker, etc.), and he is definitely not athletic, but he somehow has no problem playing the point guard in the NBA.  He also gets to the hoop, and FINISHES at will despite those things.  But yeah, shooting, quickness, and athleticism are more important than running an offense, having a good basketball IQ, ball handling, and passing ability when it comes to a point guard, so Steve Nash isn't anything special.

You are talking about a guy with exceptional skills-----all you prove with that example is that it' possible to play PG without quickness and athleticism-----but then again just about anything is possible.

[avid1010]

I agree with Murf...last time we saw a guard with comparable body/speed in the BE it was Lavance Fields or Kahlid Elhamin (sp?).  We surely don't want pg's like that.  They struggle in the BE.

[Holy hell all time]

You are talking about a guy with exceptional skills-----all you prove with that example is that it' possible to play PG without quickness and athleticism-----but then again just about anything is possible.

Yeah that's the point, you can play point guard without quickness and athleticism, which you say are the most important things in a point guard (to go along with 3 point shooting), and I'm saying it's far more important to have good ball handling, a high basketball IQ, the ability to run an offense, and strength in a point guard.  I would argue that you can be a good point guard without being great at any of those 3 areas that you suggest (although to play any D1 guard position you have to have some degree of athleticism and quickness), but to be a good point guard at the D1 level you have to be great in at least 3 of the 4 areas I suggest.