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Author Topic: Best class in 25 years!!  (Read 20389 times)

MR.HAYWARD

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Best class in 25 years!!
« on: July 07, 2008, 11:30:02 AM »
Mark Miller made the following comments:
The 2009 class of Erik Williams, Jerone Maymon, Junior Cadougan and Dwight Buycks would rank, at least in my opinion, with the 1990 class of Damon Key, Jim McIlivaine, Robb Logterman and Charles Brakes and the 2004 class of Jerel McNeal, Dominic James, Wesley Matthews and Dwight Burke as the best at Marquette since the post-Al era.

Well Mark has it in his top 3 I will put it at the top and here is why...

1990 class was good but it severly lacked athleticism...the only truly athletic player, Brakes, was soon gone.  Key was a wonderful player, and McIlvaine a dominant defender like we may never see again, but much of this classes success was a prodcut of the next year's class which added athleticism and playmaking ability.

2004 class while talented was very small and despite being small couldnt shoot straight.  Unlike Oneill did, the next class did not fill the holes and this group was doomed to what could have been with a sniper and talent in the paint.


chapman

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Re: Best class in 25 years!!
« Reply #1 on: July 07, 2008, 11:39:39 AM »
We'll see when they get on the court.  It looks to be a very talented, balanced group.  If the 2008 class we had coming (Nick Williams, Taylor, Otule, Fulce) managed to get nationally ranked by some sources, I would think this class will be in many top 20s.

ChicosBailBonds

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Re: Best class in 25 years!!
« Reply #2 on: July 07, 2008, 01:52:18 PM »
We'll see when they get on the court.  It looks to be a very talented, balanced group.  If the 2008 class we had coming (Nick Williams, Taylor, Otule, Fulce) managed to get nationally ranked by some sources, I would think this class will be in many top 20s.

We also have to see if they all even get to the court.  It's a wonderful class today, it will be even better in September of 2009 assuming they are all there.

I'd rank this class third this decade so far (the 2000's), with the potential to get better (can't judge that until they leave MU). 

2004 class #1 (James, McNeal, Burke, Matthews)
2000 class #2 (Wade, Merritt, Sanders, Blankson)

The 1990 class was terrific as were a couple of others in the early 80's.


THEGYMBAR

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Re: Best class in 25 years!!
« Reply #3 on: July 07, 2008, 01:59:20 PM »
KO's first class was better than this one. They three WI kids and IL kid was a good class. Making that class better was we really did not have a great chance at those three prior to Kevin getting hired.

jce

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Re: Best class in 25 years!!
« Reply #4 on: July 07, 2008, 02:26:19 PM »
KO's first class was better than this one. They three WI kids and IL kid was a good class. Making that class better was we really did not have a great chance at those three prior to Kevin getting hired.

I don't think that can make the class better...just that O'Neal had to do a better selling job.

MU Chi_IL

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Re: Best class in 25 years!!
« Reply #5 on: July 07, 2008, 02:31:33 PM »
I think it says a lot that Buzz's first recruiting class is in the conversation.  I am slowing stepping back from the ledge...

esotericmindguy

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Re: Best class in 25 years!!
« Reply #6 on: July 07, 2008, 02:33:43 PM »
We also have to see if they all even get to the court.  It's a wonderful class today, it will be even better in September of 2009 assuming they are all there.

I'd rank this class third this decade so far (the 2000's), with the potential to get better (can't judge that until they leave MU). 

2004 class #1 (James, McNeal, Burke, Matthews)
2000 class #2 (Wade, Merritt, Sanders, Blankson)

The 1990 class was terrific as were a couple of others in the early 80's.


Well, if you have to wait until they get on the court how can you rank the 2004 class first?  They have accomplished very little on the court, unless you consider a 4th place finish in the Big East a great accomplishment.  They are 1-3 in the post season.
« Last Edit: July 07, 2008, 02:35:21 PM by esotericmindguy »

ChicosBailBonds

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Re: Best class in 25 years!!
« Reply #7 on: July 07, 2008, 03:14:15 PM »
Well, if you have to wait until they get on the court how can you rank the 2004 class first?  They have accomplished very little on the court, unless you consider a 4th place finish in the Big East a great accomplishment.  They are 1-3 in the post season.

Three of the four will finish in the top 20 in points, steals, etc.  They will be the first 4 NCAA appearance team in 25+ years.  Three of the four will play pro ball (maybe not in the NBA, but pro ball).  All three teams finishing ranked in the top 25 (hasn't happened in 25+ years at MU).  Etc, etc. 

I believe you judge a team based on non-conference, conference and post-season.  I don't put all my eggs in one basket of the post season because it's a crapshoot.  To suggest these kids have accomplished very little I believe sums it up well as to crazy that logic is.  These kids have accomplished a lot and will continue to do so.


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Re: Best class in 25 years!!
« Reply #8 on: July 07, 2008, 03:38:48 PM »
Three of the four will finish in the top 20 in points, steals, etc.  They will be the first 4 NCAA appearance team in 25+ years.  Three of the four will play pro ball (maybe not in the NBA, but pro ball).  All three teams finishing ranked in the top 25 (hasn't happened in 25+ years at MU).  Etc, etc. 

I believe you judge a team based on non-conference, conference and post-season.  I don't put all my eggs in one basket of the post season because it's a crapshoot.


Agreed again today. Those are some pretty good accomplishments.

MR.HAYWARD

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Re: Best class in 25 years!!
« Reply #9 on: July 07, 2008, 03:45:54 PM »
Chicos says one thing and then says another...I believe you judge a team based on non-conference, conference and post-season.  I don't put all my eggs in one basket of the post season because it's a crapshoot....

If you honestly beleive that then how can you possibly say that 2004 was better?  How many conference titles did the 2004 team win?  How many conference title games did they play in?  Final 4's, Undefeated home slates, out of conference success, etc.  2000 class out shone them in every single manner.  Pure babble

ChicosBailBonds

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Re: Best class in 25 years!!
« Reply #10 on: July 07, 2008, 04:09:02 PM »
Chicos says one thing and then says another...I believe you judge a team based on non-conference, conference and post-season.  I don't put all my eggs in one basket of the post season because it's a crapshoot....

If you honestly beleive that then how can you possibly say that 2004 was better?  How many conference titles did the 2004 team win?  How many conference title games did they play in?  Final 4's, Undefeated home slates, out of conference success, etc.  2000 class out shone them in every single manner.  Pure babble

Sigh

Look at what you just wrote...if I did value post season more then I would have put 2000 ahead of 2004.  But I didn't...did I?  Nope.  I look at the entire class and the entire tenure.  So I'm following EXACTLY what I said.  DOH.

Blankson only played 2 years.  Wade only 2 years.  Those bring down the ratings for that class IMO

Plus, but not exclusively, one class will go to 4 NCAAs (which is based on your SEASON OF WORK) while the 2000 class went to TWO NCAAs (again, based on your SEASON OF WORK).   What they do once they get to post season I treat separately.

Of course the 2000 class did more in the post season then the 2004 class...5-2 in the NCAAs in 2 appearances.  The 2004 class is 1-3 with one year to go.  But in terms of what the 2004 class did all 4 years, it's stronger then the 2000 class all 4 years in aggregate.  The 2004 class will play 4 years in the Big East.  The 2000 class played none in that high level.  The 2004 class ultimately had 4 very good years, the 2000 class had one unbelievable year and one very good year.

So your comments that the 2000 class outshone them in every way, sorry...I don't buy it at all. 
« Last Edit: July 07, 2008, 04:11:49 PM by ChicosBailBonds »

Murffieus

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Re: Best class in 25 years!!
« Reply #11 on: July 07, 2008, 04:56:00 PM »
Can't tell the quality or rank of this class until 3-4 years from now----possible academic liabiliites, transfers for perceived greener pastures, underachieve expectations, overachievement of expectations all have yet to
be established.

Therefore can't compare this class to any other class because of the unknowns here vs everything being known from prior classes!

RawdogDX

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Re: Best class in 25 years!!
« Reply #12 on: July 07, 2008, 05:10:33 PM »
 isn't there 4 recruiting classes involved everytime we go to a post season? Why would the post season success of the team be the lone yard stick for a recruiting class?  If crean would have picked up a good big man and they go to a final four then the big three are better players then they are now?  How does that make sense?

It seems to me that the best way to judge a class are things that THEY do: Stats they put up and accolades (1st, 2nd team all conf, roy, ect).  If we win a championship this year can I then make an argument that 2005 was better than 2000?  I just don't see how you can compare success when comparing classes when there are 4 classes out there.

ChicosBailBonds

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Re: Best class in 25 years!!
« Reply #13 on: July 07, 2008, 06:02:15 PM »
isn't there 4 recruiting classes involved everytime we go to a post season? Why would the post season success of the team be the lone yard stick for a recruiting class?  If crean would have picked up a good big man and they go to a final four then the big three are better players then they are now?  How does that make sense?

It seems to me that the best way to judge a class are things that THEY do: Stats they put up and accolades (1st, 2nd team all conf, roy, ect).  If we win a championship this year can I then make an argument that 2005 was better than 2000?  I just don't see how you can compare success when comparing classes when there are 4 classes out there.

Absolutely and excellent point, which is why simply putting all the eggs in the post season basket is completely silly.

detroitwarrior

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Re: Best class in 25 years!!
« Reply #14 on: July 07, 2008, 06:05:20 PM »
Agreed.
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bilsu

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Re: Best class in 25 years!!
« Reply #15 on: July 07, 2008, 06:28:55 PM »
It is very difficult to compare classes for various reasons. O'Neals first class had a losing record until they got he Miller the next year. I think that alone makes McNeal, James, Matthews and Burke a better class than Key, McIlvanie and Logterman. Add in the competition factor of the Big East vs Great Midwest and I think this further strengthens the three amigos claim to a better class. How do you rate Wade's class? Is down graded because Wade only played two years and blankson transferred out. In Wade's two years ( sophomore and junior years) we won 26 and 27 games. The three amigos won 24 and 25 games in their sophomore and junior years aginst tougher competition. i do not think you can say how good a class is until it is done playing.

detroitwarrior

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Re: Best class in 25 years!!
« Reply #16 on: July 07, 2008, 06:42:55 PM »
Irrespective of the coach, I think everyone can agree that this is a very nice recruiting class and may be ranked in the top 20 nationally .  It is amazing to me that it was put together so well in such a short time given the circumstances. Based on the statements of some of the kids, it does seem that they all think highly of the current coach and his staff and the university and they all seem to have given verbals shortly after spending time with the coaching staff, our current team and at the university. This bodes well for the future since it seems that the pitch given to recruits may be come and play at a great university rather than "I coached Dwayne Wade".
Once a warrior always a warrior.

MR.HAYWARD

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Re: Best class in 25 years!!
« Reply #17 on: July 07, 2008, 06:50:14 PM »
do yu think that statemnt is why we except for the rarity only signed guys 6'5 and less?

1 player 6'10 or taller in the top 100 in 9 years!!!  dreadful

Pakuni

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Re: Best class in 25 years!!
« Reply #18 on: July 07, 2008, 07:01:14 PM »
I don't see how there's much debate on this one. The 2000 class is the best, by a pretty decent margin.
The simple fact it included the best player to ever wear a MU uniform AND two starters on the only Final Four team in the post-Al era should be enough. But wait ... there's more. Odartey Blankson was a fantastic player who, unfortunately, left too soon. Scott Merritt was a three-year starter whose primary fault was that he didn't live up to (perhaps too) lofty expectations. Sanders was a solid role player easily comparable to, say, Dwight Burke or Charles Brakes.
I suppose if one wants to do mental backflips and argue that the strength of a class should be determined by cumulative production rather which had the best players, one could try to make a case for another class. But in terms of sheer talent, 2000 was the best.

Pardner

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Re: Best class in 25 years!!
« Reply #19 on: July 07, 2008, 07:06:24 PM »
More so to some of these points, this may potentially be the best back to back classes in 25+ years--especially if the JUCO's/transfers work out.  TC had his best team he had the 2000 class and then added Diener and Novak in subsequent years--throwing in RJax.  Al was the master of stringing together great classes with his philosophy of getting one blue chipper per year.  Buzz and staff are now free to go full out for 2010 and still be in play with Wilson if someone doesn't work out academically.   Back to back to back top classes will get us to a championship level.

I am very impressed how well thought out the recruiting strategy was and how it played out.  Buzz filled out gaps with some JUCO's and transfers to avoid the drop-off in experience and talent after next season.  He went taller and longer which fits his style of play.  He also protected the playing time for the current guys who stayed.  He has a couple of projects at the 5, but aren't they all, I guess.  

ChicosBailBonds

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Re: Best class in 25 years!!
« Reply #20 on: July 07, 2008, 07:33:46 PM »
I don't see how there's much debate on this one. The 2000 class is the best, by a pretty decent margin.
The simple fact it included the best player to ever wear a MU uniform AND two starters on the only Final Four team in the post-Al era should be enough. But wait ... there's more. Odartey Blankson was a fantastic player who, unfortunately, left too soon. Scott Merritt was a three-year starter whose primary fault was that he didn't live up to (perhaps too) lofty expectations. Sanders was a solid role player easily comparable to, say, Dwight Burke or Charles Brakes.
I suppose if one wants to do mental backflips and argue that the strength of a class should be determined by cumulative production rather which had the best players, one could try to make a case for another class. But in terms of sheer talent, 2000 was the best.


In terms of sheer talent, I'd agree with you...the 2000 class.  Wade was so much better than any player we've had at MU in decades plus two other very good players with him and Sanders was certainly a player to hold his own. 

In terms of 4 year production, I'd go with DJ class.

I'll wait to judge Buzz's first class as best in 25 years for at least another 3 years if not 4 or 5.   ;)

Henry Sugar

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Re: Best class in 25 years!!
« Reply #21 on: July 07, 2008, 07:53:25 PM »
I think it says a lot that Buzz's first recruiting class is in the conversation. I am slowing stepping back from the ledge...

This is probably the most salient point from the conversation... totally agree
A warrior is an empowered and compassionate protector of others.

Pardner

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Re: Best class in 25 years!!
« Reply #22 on: July 07, 2008, 07:56:04 PM »

I'll wait to judge Buzz's first class as best in 25 years for at least another 3 years if not 4 or 5.   ;


Which class do you consider Buzz's first class?  Is it McMorrow, Butler, Fulce, Otule?  Or, the '09 class?  I think you have to give Buzz the '08 signees.  In three months, Buzz has locked up two classes.  In six, we may have three years signed up.

bilsu

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Re: Best class in 25 years!!
« Reply #23 on: July 07, 2008, 08:59:00 PM »
It has occurred to me that the class of McMorrow, Otule, Fulce and Butler might be better than the class of Buycks, Cadougan, Williams and Maymon. First of all the 2008 class is on campus. Second Williams had a broken ankle and Cadougan had a broken foot. There is a concern about Maymon qualifying. Buycks will only have two years. The 2008 class might be all practice players or could develope into some really good players as there is both size and athleticism. On paper 2009 is better, but we may find in the end that 2008 is the better class.

The Lens

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Re: Best class in 25 years!!
« Reply #24 on: July 07, 2008, 09:17:30 PM »
Isn't the premise of this exercise to decide the best class upon entering / completion of recruiting season?  Seems to me, these guys might win that arguement.

The fact that they're in the discussion is an amazing testament to Buzz's potential.
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Pakuni

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Re: Best class in 25 years!!
« Reply #25 on: July 07, 2008, 09:52:46 PM »
Which class do you consider Buzz's first class?  Is it McMorrow, Butler, Fulce, Otule?  Or, the '09 class?  I think you have to give Buzz the '08 signees.  In three months, Buzz has locked up two classes.  In six, we may have three years signed up.


I agree the '08 class is a Buzz Williams class. Without Buzz, MU almost certainly doesn't get Fulce or Otule and quite possibly (likely?) both back out of their commitments if someone else were hired to replace. Butler and McMorrow obviously are Buzz recruits, having committed after his hiring.

bma725

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Re: Best class in 25 years!!
« Reply #26 on: July 07, 2008, 10:09:31 PM »
Isn't the premise of this exercise to decide the best class upon entering / completion of recruiting season?  Seems to me, these guys might win that arguement.


Exiting the recruiting period is a possibility but right now, the 2005 class is higher than this one at the beginning of the recruiting period. At this point in the recruiting season for the 2005 class, Matthews was 40th and James 44th in the class in the 2005 Pre-Summer rankings, McNeal was 85th. 

We'll have to wait and see if they can jump up to that level by the end of the recruiting period this year, or even when the final rankings come out next year.

dwaderoy2004

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Re: Best class in 25 years!!
« Reply #27 on: July 08, 2008, 08:00:38 AM »
i agree.  when ranking recruiting classes, i thought we were basing it off of how highly ranked they were coming into marquette, i.e., who we beat out, how high there potential was.  Buzz only has so much control on how these kids turn out, as well as their legacies in the program.  When ranking past classes against this one, you need to put on the blinders and forget about what they did, but just focus on how highly sought after they were when they committed. 

That being said, i still rank the three amigos class number 1, and this class slightly ahead of the 2000 class, based on the number of guys in the RSCI top 100.  i think only merritt was in the top 100, even though wade and sanders were ranked by certain sites.  i am willing to be corrected on that, however, because i'm only basing it off memory and didn;t bother to look it up.

This is the most balanced class I can remember, however.
« Last Edit: July 08, 2008, 09:41:51 AM by dwaderoy2004 »

MR.HAYWARD

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Re: Best class in 25 years!!
« Reply #28 on: July 08, 2008, 08:47:50 AM »
 Thank you dwaderoy2004 for putting some sensibility back into the string.  Last i knew recruiting classes were ranked before they entered college.  now one can retrospectively go back and see how they panned out but if you go to the Espn, hoops scoop, rcsi or whatever those class rankignn are before they ever step foot on campus.  Now after they leave you can use whatever criteria you want team success, individual acchievement, whether their ranking went up or down, etc. 
But for right now simply looking at the current rankings and the trend I still say it is the best class in 25 years. 

If buycks was eligible for ranking you would have 4 concensus top 100 players.  Mu has not had that in 25 years!!  Additionally while the 2004 class may have had 3 players more higly ranked, although we should not set that in stone as maymon and Junior might just end up ranked higher than James was, we need to remeber Burke was only a two star player.  Also bringing down the 2004 class IMO is we essentially signed 2 players of PG dimensions, another guard and then a role playing big.  This class has much greater balance

dwaderoy2004

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Re: Best class in 25 years!!
« Reply #29 on: July 08, 2008, 09:47:52 AM »
Buycks is the wild card here.  If he ends up next year as one of the top juco players, and the other three hold their spots, this might be the best class.

Either way, it's an awesome haul.

nola03

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Re: Best class in 25 years!!
« Reply #30 on: July 08, 2008, 10:14:47 AM »
Buycks is the wild card here.  If he ends up next year as one of the top juco players, and the other three hold their spots, this might be the best class.

Either way, it's an awesome haul.

I disagree slightly. For me, Maymon remains the wildcard.

Cadougan, Buycks, and Williams is a solid threesome. If Maymon qualifies, his inclusion makes it a very good class and one that you would expect from a top 5 BE team plus it creates a strong base in which to recruit future years.

The key to all of this is the learning curve of the "bit-part" players over the next two seasons. It will be interesting to see what Butler, Fulce, Otule, and McMorrow bring to the team.

RawdogDX

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Re: Best class in 25 years!!
« Reply #31 on: July 08, 2008, 10:38:02 AM »

If buycks was eligible for ranking you would have 4 concensus top 100 players. 

If he was eligible for ranking then all juco players would be and if all juco players were we have no idea how many of them would be in the top 100 which means that they very well could push some of the other three 'concensus top 100 players' (is that even true?  i thought certan sites didn't have some of them in it.) out of the top 100.  If you want to play the 'If' game.

MR.HAYWARD

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Re: Best class in 25 years!!
« Reply #32 on: July 08, 2008, 11:36:57 AM »
Rawdag you are missing the point  I am comparing this incoming class to the 3 other classes that are arguably the best in the last 25 years.  those 3 1990, 2000 and 2004 each had 4 recruits all 4 were from HS and Prep therefore a somewhat quantitave number can be applied althought the ranking are subjective.   My point was not to blow up or question the entire ranking system of "if" jucos were rated and how it would affect all ranking and all classes for all schools, etc etc.  Simply saying that his ranking is kind of a wildcard becuse you cannot use the same system as you could for the other 15 recruits of the 4 years being compared.  Bottom line is the 1990, 2004 and 2009 class will all have 3 concensus top 100 kids...my bet is Buycks is better than Brakes or Burke and if he were now i realize i am using the word if but if he were eligible for the RCSI he might just be higher ranked too.   According to rivals he is a 3 star and Burke was only a 2. no if's in that one

ChicosBailBonds

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Re: Best class in 25 years!!
« Reply #33 on: July 08, 2008, 01:08:46 PM »
Well the other problem in using the rankings which no one has brought up is the inaccuracy of comparing it year to year.


In other words, you may sign the 25th best player in this year's class but that doesn't mean in a previous class he would have been the 25th best player that year.

So saying you have a year where the aggregate rating of your recruits is say 50.  But 4 years later it's 59, that doesn't mean the class rated at 50 is better. It just means that given year with the talent available, those players were rated at that level but in a different year the nation's recruits could be a deeper field and thus a better player is 'pushed down' in the rankings but actually a better player then someone ranked higher in a previous year.

MR.HAYWARD

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Re: Best class in 25 years!!
« Reply #34 on: July 10, 2008, 10:16:53 PM »
bob gibbons just said Junior will be in his top 60 in his new rankings and other scouts have had rave reviews too.  Looks like by the numbers this calss may inded end up the strongest in 25 years...and it looks like Mu recruits are moving on up not down.  Great sense of upside on Buzz!!

ChicosBailBonds

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Re: Best class in 25 years!!
« Reply #35 on: July 11, 2008, 12:06:32 AM »
bob gibbons just said Junior will be in his top 60 in his new rankings and other scouts have had rave reviews too.  Looks like by the numbers this calss may inded end up the strongest in 25 years...and it looks like Mu recruits are moving on up not down.  Great sense of upside on Buzz!!

If I could make heads or tails out of that sentence I would publish a Rosetta Stone software version just for you.  Calss....inded...."great sense of upside on Buzz".   

It's a great get by Buzz.  Looking forward to seeing these kids on the court next year under Buzz's direction.

bilsu

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Re: Best class in 25 years!!
« Reply #36 on: July 11, 2008, 07:57:23 AM »
There has been some discussion on this board about whether rankings drop after MU signs a player or go up when North Carolina signs a player. Maybe Crean could only sign players that other teams were losing interest in. His best recruit (Wade) was not sought after by the big programs. Once a recruit was targeted by North Carolina, Louisville, etc. he could never close the deal. Crean was good at targeting up and coming recruits, but if they got good to fast he would lose them. Their rankings improved because they improved, which resulted in the North Carolina's being interested in them. Buzz appears to be able to close the deal. I think this is because he is selling the Univeristy and not himself or Dwayne Wade. A player that seriously believes he is going to be a pro is going to go to North Carolina, before he is going to go to MU.

NYWarrior

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Re: Best class in 25 years!!
« Reply #37 on: July 11, 2008, 08:35:59 AM »
There has been some discussion on this board about whether rankings drop after MU signs a player or go up when North Carolina signs a player. Maybe Crean could only sign players that other teams were losing interest in. His best recruit (Wade) was not sought after by the big programs. Once a recruit was targeted by North Carolina, Louisville, etc. he could never close the deal. Crean was good at targeting up and coming recruits, but if they got good to fast he would lose them.

Bingo. Buzz is a closer. 

detroitwarrior

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Re: Best class in 25 years!!
« Reply #38 on: July 11, 2008, 09:03:11 AM »
Agreed Bilsu. Most of the comments coming from Erik Wilson ,Jeronne Maymon and Junior Cadougan and those close to them such as family and coaching staff have all indicated they liked the University and Coaching staff, not that they felt that they could use Marquette as a launching pad to a pro career or that they chose MU because DW went here.
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The Lens

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Re: Best class in 25 years!!
« Reply #39 on: July 11, 2008, 09:26:36 AM »
Buzz appears to be able to close the deal. I think this is because he is selling the Univeristy and not himself or Dwayne Wade.

Ding, Ding, Ding, Ding!

Kids may have a DWade poster on their wall, they may enjoy meeting him etc but at the end of the day we're talking about the Top 100 HS basketball players in the US.  After a few minutes of the D Wade lovefest they are ready to hear about themselves. 
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ChicosBailBonds

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Re: Best class in 25 years!!
« Reply #40 on: July 11, 2008, 01:19:42 PM »
I'm just curious how many people here have been on an in home recruiting visit with Buzz or Crean?  Or on a three way call to know these things.

I know I haven't, but just curious.   ;)

Pakuni

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Re: Best class in 25 years!!
« Reply #41 on: July 11, 2008, 03:54:10 PM »
I'm just curious how many people here have been on an in home recruiting visit with Buzz or Crean?  Or on a three way call to know these things.

I know I haven't, but just curious.   ;)

How many people here were in on the meetings, phone calls, interviews and overall process that took place leading up to Buzz Williams' hiring to know things about whether anyone panicked, whether coaches X, Y and Z were contacted (or why they were not contacted), etc.?

I know I wasn't, but just curious.  ;)

I don't think one need to personally view Crean or Buzz recruiting to express an opinion on their recruiting styles and results.
And I say this as one of the remaining few Tom Crean defenders around here.
« Last Edit: July 11, 2008, 04:00:23 PM by Pakuni »

mviale

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Re: Best class in 25 years!!
« Reply #42 on: July 11, 2008, 05:23:16 PM »
Agreed Bilsu. Most of the comments coming from Erik Wilson ,Jeronne Maymon and Junior Cadougan and those close to them such as family and coaching staff have all indicated they liked the University and Coaching staff, not that they felt that they could use Marquette as a launching pad to a pro career or that they chose MU because DW went here.

Just hearing the list makes me shiver - Erik Wilson ,Jeronne Maymon and Junior Cadougan
You heard it here first. Davante Gardner will be a Beast this year.
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ChicosBailBonds

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Re: Best class in 25 years!!
« Reply #43 on: July 11, 2008, 05:26:31 PM »
How many people here were in on the meetings, phone calls, interviews and overall process that took place leading up to Buzz Williams' hiring to know things about whether anyone panicked, whether coaches X, Y and Z were contacted (or why they were not contacted), etc.?

I know I wasn't, but just curious.  ;)

I don't think one need to personally view Crean or Buzz recruiting to express an opinion on their recruiting styles and results.
And I say this as one of the remaining few Tom Crean defenders around here.

More people were privy to those interviews, calls, etc then are in a one on one recruiting session.  In fact, plenty of people were involved in the decision making process that have expressed their concerns or platitudes privately or publicly to other members of the BOT, etc.  Recruiting is a closed process with the coach(es) and player/family.   Far fewer people are involved in recruiting.


The only reason I bring it up is that let's not forget Crean's first recruiting class how many folks thought Crean was a closer or could get it done, etc.  When minutes are available, recruiting is easier.  As Bilsu correctly pointed out, Crean identified players that were up and comers and achieved to such a high level in the end that UNC or someone else swooped in at the end to grab them.  That's always a tough blow (happened to UW-madison football quite often after Alvarez went to the first Rose Bowl).

So far Buzz is kicking tail in the area that his reputation says he will kick tail.  I suspect it will get a little harder when the minutes are harder to sell, however.  So far, so good for the Buzz.  If he's as successful as the previous regime on the court, in the classroom then I'll be a happy camper.  So far so good.
« Last Edit: July 11, 2008, 05:36:20 PM by ChicosBailBonds »

Mufflers

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Re: Best class in 25 years!!
« Reply #44 on: July 12, 2008, 03:31:29 PM »
I'd tend to go with results over pre-Marquette rankings.

Accordingly, I'd go:

1. Wade and co.
2. McIllvaine and co.
3. James, McNeal and Matthews and

I wouldn't rank the current class anywhere until they show results on the court.  Once they win an NCAA Tournament game, they'll compete for top three.

 

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