New RSCI for 2009, pre-summer edition

[Pakuni]

This is the pre-summer list, so I'd expect Maymon and Cadougan to move up by the fall. It's early, so there are some pretty large discrepancies among the "gurus" (i.e. HoopScoop has Cadougan #37, Telep and Rivals don't rank him at all or Gibbons ranking E. Williams #48, but HoopScoop doesn't have him a top 100 player).
Regardless, per the early RSCI Buzz has landed three top 100 players in about three months' time. Last time MU had three top 100s was 2005 with the Three Amigos.

Junior Cadougan #70
Erik Williams #78
Jeronne Maymon #85

http://home.nc.rr.com/rsci/RSCI_100_PreSummer_2009.htm

[ChicosBailBonds]

This is the pre-summer list, so I'd expect Maymon and Cadougan to move up by the fall. It's early, so there are some pretty large discrepancies among the "gurus" (i.e. HoopScoop has Cadougan #37, Telep and Rivals don't rank him at all or Gibbons ranking E. Williams #48, but HoopScoop doesn't have him a top 100 player).
Regardless, per the early RSCI Buzz has landed three top 100 players in about three months' time. Last time MU had three top 100s was 2005 with the Three Amigos.

Junior Cadougan #70
Erik Williams #78
Jeronne Maymon #85

http://home.nc.rr.com/rsci/RSCI_100_PreSummer_2009.htm

Very true, though those 3 amigos were a little bit higher ranked.  Last year we would have had two I believe before the transfers.

Nice class by Buzz.....now it's time to see how the young man coaches. 

[downtown85]

Regardless, per the early RSCI Buzz has landed three top 100 players in about three months' time.

Junior Cadougan #70
Erik Williams #78
Jeronne Maymon #85

http://home.nc.rr.com/rsci/RSCI_100_PreSummer_2009.htm

Has Cadougan committed? 

[downtown85]

Has Cadougan committed? 

I see it now.... ...never mind. 

[Pakuni]

Very true, though those 3 amigos were a little bit higher ranked.  Last year we would have had two I believe before the transfers.

Nice class by Buzz.....now it's time to see how the young man coaches. 

For some reason, there's no final RSCI for 2008 on the RSCI site. But in the fall rankings, only Nick Williams (#95) made the top 100. Taylor moved up most rankings toward the end of the year, so it's likely he'd have made it. On the other hand, Williams slipped (fell from Scout's #35 to unranked, was #146 on Rivals) as the year went on, so there's a good chance he would not have made the final rankings.

[MR.HAYWARD]

exactly....thanks for the actual facts...hopefully chicos read that...truly sad that a Big East team coached by a coach that saw him self as one of the top coaches in the country could not land a concensus top 100 player in his 9th season and had only signed a total of 2 in his last 3 years!!  i said it before if Crean did not sign the 3 amigos he would have been run out of town his recruitng has been so bad.  I will forever feel so bad for the big 3, such ability and talent was not only misutilized by Crean, but he never had the ability to surreound them with a sevicabel bigman aprt from OOze and he barely qualifies.  Such a tradegy that Mu had the worst front court in the BE the last 3 years, what those 3 could have accomplished.  One more chance for those kids i really hope they break through sort of like the kids in 1994, they deserve it. 

So in other words...Buzz has landed 50% more concensus top 100 kids in 75 days than Crean landed in his last three years.  Folks like chicos need to remember that 90% of success in BBAll is talent on the floor.  As a BBall coach myself i will tell you that as will anyother coach worth his salt.  the only people that dont realize that dont know anything about the game and coaches that wont admit it are egomaniacs.  example was Mike Deane all of a sudden a terrible coach his last year or did Oneills talent run out?   Was oneil a terrible caoch before his talent arrived on campus and matured?  Was mcGurie a terrible coach before he got his talent pipeline established?  You now calhoun was a terrible coach before he got the talent flowing into Uconn too!

Please this...can Buzz coach? tagline ad nauseum is pathetic.

I have said it since day 1, in short order people will be glad Crean is gone...not only was he an A-hole but he had underperformed since 2003.  5 years and 5 top 100 recruits, 1 ncaa tournement win and many recruiting whiffs and signing of non d1 type players.

Buzz has signed 3 top 100 players, a player that some have said maybe the 31 juco player in the country and a 7 footer.  Additionally he has added an outsatnding staff including an old veteran that has been successful as the sage that many said Crean always needed.  and more importantly he will actaully take his advise as opposed to the whole Pannagio debacle. 

Crean leaving at the perfect time was the best thing to happen to Mu bbal in 25 years.  mark it down.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

exactly....thanks for the actual facts...hopefully chicos read that...truly sad that a Big East team coached by a coach that saw him self as one of the top coaches in the country could not land a concensus top 100 player in his 9th season and had only signed a total of 2 in his last 3 years!!  i said it before if Crean did not sign the 3 amigos he would have been run out of town his recruitng has been so bad.  I will forever feel so bad for the big 3, such ability and talent was not only misutilized by Crean, but he never had the ability to surreound them with a sevicabel bigman aprt from OOze and he barely qualifies.  Such a tradegy that Mu had the worst front court in the BE the last 3 years, what those 3 could have accomplished.  One more chance for those kids i really hope they break through sort of like the kids in 1994, they deserve it. 

So in other words...Buzz has landed 50% more concensus top 100 kids in 75 days than Crean landed in his last three years.  Folks like chicos need to remember that 90% of success in BBAll is talent on the floor.  As a BBall coach myself i will tell you that as will anyother coach worth his salt.  the only people that dont realize that dont know anything about the game and coaches that wont admit it are egomaniacs.  example was Mike Deane all of a sudden a terrible coach his last year or did Oneills talent run out?   Was oneil a terrible caoch before his talent arrived on campus and matured?  Was mcGurie a terrible coach before he got his talent pipeline established?  You now calhoun was a terrible coach before he got the talent flowing into Uconn too!

Please this...can Buzz coach? tagline ad nauseum is pathetic.

I have said it since day 1, in short order people will be glad Crean is gone...not only was he an A-hole but he had underperformed since 2003.  5 years and 5 top 100 recruits, 1 ncaa tournement win and many recruiting whiffs and signing of non d1 type players.

Buzz has signed 3 top 100 players, a player that some have said maybe the 31 juco player in the country and a 7 footer.  Additionally he has added an outsatnding staff including an old veteran that has been successful as the sage that many said Crean always needed.  and more importantly he will actaully take his advise as opposed to the whole Pannagio debacle. 

Crean leaving at the perfect time was the best thing to happen to Mu bbal in 25 years.  mark it down.

Buzz has landed a nice class.

It has nothing to do with Crean's ability or inability to recruit.

Thanks.

[Ready2Fly]

The three amigos may have been ranked higher, but this is a much more well-rounded class.  I can't believe how much Buzz has done is his short tenure to make me change my tune about him.  We should be in the top half of the Big East for years to come now, which all but guarantees a tourney appearance.  That is the floor for this program, and I couldn't be happier.  If either Otule or McMorrow pan out, the sky is the limit for this class.

[MR.HAYWARD]

Re: New RSCI for 2009, pre-summer edition
« Reply #6 on: Today at 11:00:27 AM » Quote 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Quote from: MR.HAYWARD on Today at 10:46:27 AM
exactly....thanks for the actual facts...hopefully chicos read that...truly sad that a Big East team coached by a coach that saw him self as one of the top coaches in the country could not land a concensus top 100 player in his 9th season and had only signed a total of 2 in his last 3 years!!  i said it before if Crean did not sign the 3 amigos he would have been run out of town his recruitng has been so bad.  I will forever feel so bad for the big 3, such ability and talent was not only misutilized by Crean, but he never had the ability to surreound them with a sevicabel bigman aprt from OOze and he barely qualifies.  Such a tradegy that Mu had the worst front court in the BE the last 3 years, what those 3 could have accomplished.  One more chance for those kids i really hope they break through sort of like the kids in 1994, they deserve it. 

So in other words...Buzz has landed 50% more concensus top 100 kids in 75 days than Crean landed in his last three years.  Folks like chicos need to remember that 90% of success in BBAll is talent on the floor.  As a BBall coach myself i will tell you that as will anyother coach worth his salt.  the only people that dont realize that dont know anything about the game and coaches that wont admit it are egomaniacs.  example was Mike Deane all of a sudden a terrible coach his last year or did Oneills talent run out?   Was oneil a terrible caoch before his talent arrived on campus and matured?  Was mcGurie a terrible coach before he got his talent pipeline established?  You now calhoun was a terrible coach before he got the talent flowing into Uconn too!

Please this...can Buzz coach? tagline ad nauseum is pathetic.

I have said it since day 1, in short order people will be glad Crean is gone...not only was he an A-hole but he had underperformed since 2003.  5 years and 5 top 100 recruits, 1 ncaa tournement win and many recruiting whiffs and signing of non d1 type players.

Buzz has signed 3 top 100 players, a player that some have said maybe the 31 juco player in the country and a 7 footer.  Additionally he has added an outsatnding staff including an old veteran that has been successful as the sage that many said Crean always needed.  and more importantly he will actaully take his advise as opposed to the whole Pannagio debacle. 

Crean leaving at the perfect time was the best thing to happen to Mu bbal in 25 years.  mark it down.


Buzz has landed a nice class.

It has nothing to do with who Crean ability or inability to recruit.

Thanks.

gee thanks for your insight 2002alum

I never said it did.  it was simply a response to certain posters who feel the need to add the tagline "well we'll see if he can coach" to every positive that happens for Coach buzz!!   Not only is it a constant neagtive but it is a joke, give me the worst coach in the world and the best talent and i like my chances.  The Crean "legacy" will soon be overshadowed by that of Buzz and i think alot of Crean lovers will continue to struggle with that.   The same fans that beleive Crean made MU cannot beleive that Buzz might be more successfual for 'he has never proven himself as a good coach"....well when did crean ever prove himself as a good coach?...when he had Dwade?!?!.  Since then he proved himself a poor coach and a mediocre at best recruit.  the success he had was becuase of Marquette not the other way around.  Mu made Crean, Crean did not make MU! 

[ChicosBailBonds]

Sigh...first off, this is pre-summer Hayward, not the FINAL.  So perhaps you should be the one reading. 

Typically, MU signees FALL in the rankings because of the politics that involved.  We'll see what the FINAL rankings reveal.

[ChicosBailBonds]

For some reason, there's no final RSCI for 2008 on the RSCI site. But in the fall rankings, only Nick Williams (#95) made the top 100. Taylor moved up most rankings toward the end of the year, so it's likely he'd have made it. On the other hand, Williams slipped (fell from Scout's #35 to unranked, was #146 on Rivals) as the year went on, so there's a good chance he would not have made the final rankings.

I emailed Jeff at RSCI for the final 2008 rankings (you are correct they aren't listed there).  I'll see what he comes up with. 

[MR.HAYWARD]

Typically, MU signees FALL in the rankings because of the politics that involved.  We'll see what the FINAL rankings reveal.....

Mybe typicall for the last coach...meanwhile Maymon's rankings have skyrocketed,  erik willimas has moved back up and cagougan appears to be moving up too...

it's a new era...like it or not....


Marquette made Crean...that is something he never understood.

[NCMUFan]

Buzz has done a great job recruiting and I believe Buzz realizes Marquette is a great branded basketball school.  For us to snag Cadougan over the likes of Memphis, Louisville, Texas, etc. needs a basketball program with as strong a reputation as any of the afore mentioned.  I can hardly wait for the 2008-09 season to start and see our team under Buzz.  Future looks so bright I need shades!  Go Marquette!

[MR.HAYWARD]

You better relax NCMUFan....remember what chicos says...we have an unproven coach and usually Mu's recruits ranking fall.  so you better just shut up and start worrying...tommy's not here to lead us anymore....you know to lead us to a double digit loss season and a first round flameout. 

[🏀]

Mr. Hayward,

Agreeing with Chicos here. After a kid commits his rankings start a trend downward. It has been rather apparent for the last couple of years. Whether or not it's the kid protecting himself throughout the summer, or letting go a little bit and relaxing after he made his big decision, kids that haven't committed move up while the others push down.

[muwarrior87]

While Maymon's has risen, expect it to fall off. He already said he isn't playing AAU this summer but rather focusing on getting qualified academically.  And after the top 20 kids or so, there's a lot of discrepancy from one report to another and can many people tell a dramatic difference between the 50th ranked kid and the 110th ranked one? It matters how they fit into the system mostly and where they are in their learning curve. A top 50 recruit may not improve his game much from his sr yr of hs to his sr year of college whereas a recruit around 100-150 could continue to improve and end up better than the other recruit by the time they are both juniors.  God given talent only goes so far and after that, you need the passion and drive to continue to improve.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

Re: New RSCI for 2009, pre-summer edition
« Reply #6 on: Today at 11:00:27 AM » Quote 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Quote from: MR.HAYWARD on Today at 10:46:27 AM
exactly....thanks for the actual facts...hopefully chicos read that...truly sad that a Big East team coached by a coach that saw him self as one of the top coaches in the country could not land a concensus top 100 player in his 9th season and had only signed a total of 2 in his last 3 years!!  i said it before if Crean did not sign the 3 amigos he would have been run out of town his recruitng has been so bad.  I will forever feel so bad for the big 3, such ability and talent was not only misutilized by Crean, but he never had the ability to surreound them with a sevicabel bigman aprt from OOze and he barely qualifies.  Such a tradegy that Mu had the worst front court in the BE the last 3 years, what those 3 could have accomplished.  One more chance for those kids i really hope they break through sort of like the kids in 1994, they deserve it. 

So in other words...Buzz has landed 50% more concensus top 100 kids in 75 days than Crean landed in his last three years.  Folks like chicos need to remember that 90% of success in BBAll is talent on the floor.  As a BBall coach myself i will tell you that as will anyother coach worth his salt.  the only people that dont realize that dont know anything about the game and coaches that wont admit it are egomaniacs.  example was Mike Deane all of a sudden a terrible coach his last year or did Oneills talent run out?   Was oneil a terrible caoch before his talent arrived on campus and matured?  Was mcGurie a terrible coach before he got his talent pipeline established?  You now calhoun was a terrible coach before he got the talent flowing into Uconn too!

Please this...can Buzz coach? tagline ad nauseum is pathetic.

I have said it since day 1, in short order people will be glad Crean is gone...not only was he an A-hole but he had underperformed since 2003.  5 years and 5 top 100 recruits, 1 ncaa tournement win and many recruiting whiffs and signing of non d1 type players.

Buzz has signed 3 top 100 players, a player that some have said maybe the 31 juco player in the country and a 7 footer.  Additionally he has added an outsatnding staff including an old veteran that has been successful as the sage that many said Crean always needed.  and more importantly he will actaully take his advise as opposed to the whole Pannagio debacle. 

Crean leaving at the perfect time was the best thing to happen to Mu bbal in 25 years.  mark it down.


Buzz has landed a nice class.

It has nothing to do with who Crean ability or inability to recruit.

Thanks.

gee thanks for your insight 2002alum

I never said it did.  it was simply a response to certain posters who feel the need to add the tagline "well we'll see if he can coach" to every positive that happens for Coach buzz!!   Not only is it a constant neagtive but it is a joke, give me the worst coach in the world and the best talent and i like my chances.  The Crean "legacy" will soon be overshadowed by that of Buzz and i think alot of Crean lovers will continue to struggle with that.   The same fans that beleive Crean made MU cannot beleive that Buzz might be more successfual for 'he has never proven himself as a good coach"....well when did crean ever prove himself as a good coach?...when he had Dwade?!?!.  Since then he proved himself a poor coach and a mediocre at best recruit.  the success he had was becuase of Marquette not the other way around.  Mu made Crean, Crean did not make MU! 

Hold on, questioning whether buzz can coach or not really isn't a Crean issue either.

For the record, I like Buzz... and I'm excited about him. I think he's a young, up and coming.

However, let's just admit that his resume isn't the most impressive. Therefore, saying something like "We'll see if he can coach" is certainly a little pessimistic, it's not inaccurate. Buzz is still somewhat of an unknown (got some good things going so far though)

I know you are a pro-buzz guy... and I think that's great, I like the optimism.

I'm just not sure that bashing Crean over the head really helps your cause.

You don't have to hate Crean to like Buzz, right? I liked Crean and I like Buzz. That's legal, right?

[ChicosBailBonds]

Mr. Hayward,

Agreeing with Chicos here. After a kid commits his rankings start a trend downward. It has been rather apparent for the last couple of years. Whether or not it's the kid protecting himself throughout the summer, or letting go a little bit and relaxing after he made his big decision, kids that haven't committed move up while the others push down.

Shhh....don't confuse him with the reality of the situation.  There's only about 25 years of data showing this, but that's ok.  It doesn't always happen, but usually does.  Kids that sign with Duke, Memphis, etc that are ranked below our guys will suddenly be ranked ahead of them, whether they are better or not. It's the name on the front of the jersey that causes this along with the "experts" improperly inflating those that haven't committed so early.

[ChicosBailBonds]

Hold on, questioning whether buzz can coach or not really isn't a Crean issue either.

For the record, I like Buzz... and I'm excited about him. I think he's a young, up and coming.

However, let's just admit that his resume isn't the most impressive. Therefore, saying something like "We'll see if he can coach" is certainly a little pessimistic, it's not inaccurate. Buzz is still somewhat of an unknown (got some good things going so far though)

I know you are a pro-buzz guy... and I think that's great, I like the optimism.

I'm just not sure that bashing Crean over the head really helps your cause.

You don't have to hate Crean to like Buzz, right? I liked Crean and I like Buzz. That's legal, right?

Hayward still has trouble realizing who brought Buzz in and who pressed the administration hard to hire Buzz when he left.  It's ironic as hell because in Hayward's mind, Crean is 100% evil. 

[RawdogDX]

You don't have to hate Crean to like Buzz, right? I liked Crean and I like Buzz. That's legal, right?

Nope, calling the cops as i type.  
We've got a Code 322 : Not agreeing with every nuance of what hayward says.  

a Code 614: Being a fan of the program who doesn't see everything in black and white  

and the most seriously of all Code 489: not classifying coaches(or members of the BOD) as either monsters or gods among men and instead claiming that they have strengths and weakness, selfish and unselfish motivations, as well as qualities that remain unknown until proven.

[4thAndState]

Hold on, questioning whether buzz can coach or not really isn't a Crean issue either.

For the record, I like Buzz... and I'm excited about him. I think he's a young, up and coming.

However, let's just admit that his resume isn't the most impressive. Therefore, saying something like "We'll see if he can coach" is certainly a little pessimistic, it's not inaccurate. Buzz is still somewhat of an unknown (got some good things going so far though)

I know you are a pro-buzz guy... and I think that's great, I like the optimism.

I'm just not sure that bashing Crean over the head really helps your cause.

You don't have to hate Crean to like Buzz, right? I liked Crean and I like Buzz. That's legal, right?

Pretty much the way I feel; but to tell the truth, it's way better than I was feeling in early April about the situation. Some here (me too) were worrying about the program falling into DePaul or St. John's territory. I think that has been disproven, at least by this class of recruits. Like Homer likes to say, I'm cautiously optimistic.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

and the most seriously of all Code 489: not classifying coaches(or members of the BOD) as either monsters or gods among men and instead claiming that they have strengths and weakness, selfish and unselfish motivations, as well as qualities that remain unknown until proven.

Well said.

These guys are just human.

Most of them are very bright, talented and driven... but they are just people.

[mug644]

Well said.

These guys are just human.

Most of them are very bright, talented and driven... but they are just people.

True. I hear they even have to wipe their own butts, just like Queen Elizabeth does.

[mu-rara]

Buzz has landed a nice class.

It has nothing to do with Crean's ability or inability to recruit.

Thanks.

I didn't even look at the author when I read the post, but i just knew it was 2002alum.   Come on, you're really Riley, or maybe Joani...admit it.

[bma725]

While Maymon's has risen, expect it to fall off. He already said he isn't playing AAU this summer but rather focusing on getting qualified academically. 

It may fall off, but he'll still rise in the RSCI simply because of when these numbers are from.  He was ranked pre-summer by ESPN, now he's #33.  It's very unlikely he'll fall out of the top 100 since the ranking is done by Bob Gibbons and he played well at the Bob Gibbons TOC earlier this summer.  Gibbons tends to favor those guys, just look at Nick Williams for example.  He's also gone up on Rivals without playing since the NBPA camp. 

In fact all three players could rise when the next ranking comes out.  Part of it has to do with the fact that the RSCI usually includes PrepStars rankings, but didn't this time.  Cadougan is #50 on Prepstars, Williams #43.  The other part is that there have been some changes since the pre-summer.  Cadougan has moved up in HoopScoop's ranking, so couple that with Prepstars and he moves up.  Williams has made a major move up HoopScoop's list, and in all likelihood that should put him in the top 50 even without the PrepStars ranking.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

I didn't even look at the author when I read the post, but i just knew it was 2002alum.   Come on, you're really Riley, or maybe Joani...admit it.

Wow... them are fightin' words.

Can you just illustrate to me what Buzz's recruiting is impacted by Crean's recruiting?

[MR.HAYWARD]

BMA states:
It may fall off, but he'll still rise in the RSCI simply because of when these numbers are from.  He was ranked pre-summer by ESPN, now he's #33.  It's very unlikely he'll fall out of the top 100 since the ranking is done by Bob Gibbons and he played well at the Bob Gibbons TOC earlier this summer.  Gibbons tends to favor those guys, just look at Nick Williams for example.  He's also gone up on Rivals without playing since the NBPA camp. 

In fact all three players could rise when the next ranking comes out.  Part of it has to do with the fact that the RSCI usually includes PrepStars rankings, but didn't this time.  Cadougan is #50 on Prepstars, Williams #43.  The other part is that there have been some changes since the pre-summer.  Cadougan has moved up in HoopScoop's ranking, so couple that with Prepstars and he moves up.  Williams has made a major move up HoopScoop's list, and in all likelihood that should put him in the top 50 even without the PrepStars ranking.

Well how could that possibly happen when Chicos says it hasnt happened that way in 25!! years.  Gee maybe now a recruits rankings move up when they sign with Buzz given his respect in recruitng circles.  Bottom line is cadougan and maymon have BLOWN up Baby this summer!! 

[mu-rara]

Wow... them are fightin' words.

Can you just illustrate to me what Buzz's recruiting is impacted by Crean's recruiting?

I just think it's kind of funny how you never let a jab at Tan Tommy go unanswered.  That's all.  Not looking to start a fight.  It's summer time,  time for a little light humor.

[ChicosBailBonds]

BMA states:
It may fall off, but he'll still rise in the RSCI simply because of when these numbers are from.  He was ranked pre-summer by ESPN, now he's #33.  It's very unlikely he'll fall out of the top 100 since the ranking is done by Bob Gibbons and he played well at the Bob Gibbons TOC earlier this summer.  Gibbons tends to favor those guys, just look at Nick Williams for example.  He's also gone up on Rivals without playing since the NBPA camp. 

In fact all three players could rise when the next ranking comes out.  Part of it has to do with the fact that the RSCI usually includes PrepStars rankings, but didn't this time.  Cadougan is #50 on Prepstars, Williams #43.  The other part is that there have been some changes since the pre-summer.  Cadougan has moved up in HoopScoop's ranking, so couple that with Prepstars and he moves up.  Williams has made a major move up HoopScoop's list, and in all likelihood that should put him in the top 50 even without the PrepStars ranking.

Well how could that possibly happen when Chicos says it hasnt happened that way in 25!! years.  Gee maybe now a recruits rankings move up when they sign with Buzz given his respect in recruitng circles.  Bottom line is cadougan and maymon have BLOWN up Baby this summer!! 

Hayward....I said "it doesn't always happen, but usually does" (in terms of the player rankings).  Talk about someone that continues to have a reading comprehension problem.  Good Lord.  Show me where I said it hasn't happened in 25 years?  I said there is 25 years of data showing "USUALLY" MU recruits sign and their stock drops.  Whether it's the RSCI or Gibbons old recruiting top 200 lists.  "it doesn't always happen, but usually does" now equals "it hasn't happened in 25 years".  Wow, you are quite the reader there Hayward.  A real gem.

Listings below starting with their verbal commitment to Marquette


Class of 2000 RSCI

Midseason:  Scott Merritt 63.  Final ranking:  Scott Merritt 85.   Net change = -22 ( that means he went DOWN 22 spots)


Class of 2001 RSCI

First RSCI ranking:  Travis Diener 47.  Final RSCI ranking: Travis Dienr 40.  Net change = +7  ( he went up 7 spots)


Class of 2002 RSCI

Post-Summer:  Steve Novak 55.   Final RSCI ranking:  Steve Novak 57.  Net change = -2


Class of 2003 RSCI

Post-Summer:  Dameon Mason 82.  Final RSCI ranking:  Dameon Mason 71.  Net Change +11


Class of 2005 RSCI

Fall:  Wes Matthews 48, Dj 40, Jerel McNeal 55.  Final RSCI ranking:  DJ 36 (+4 net change), Matthews 61 (-13 net change), McNeal 57 (-2 net change)


Class of 2006 RSCI

Summer:  Lazar Hayward 97.  Final RSCI ranking:  Not ranked  (minimum net change -3 and perhaps much more, impossible to tell)


Class of 2007 RSCI

Pre-Summer:  Trevor Mbakwe 55.  Final RSCI rankings:  Trevor Mbakwe 91  (net change -36)


Class of 2008 RSCI

Summer:   Nick Williams  100.  Final RSCI rankings:  Nick Williams 95  (net change +5)




6 guys went down....some of them drastically (-36, -22, -13)

4 guys went up....all mildly except Maseon who went up 11 spots.


I don't disagree with BMA's theory they will go up in the next ranking.  What I'm saying is they will likely go DOWN from there in the final ranking.  We shall see....how's Plymouth?

[MR.HAYWARD]

so out of 10, 6 went down and 4 went up or in other words it's a total crap shoot as to whetehr they go up or down at all...but then you state that over the last 25 years they usually go down....boy do you get sick of taking your shoe out of your mouth? 


Remeber this all started by stating that our recently completed class will probably go down  and that we have still not seen whether buzz can coach or not.  have a nice life.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

I just think it's kind of funny how you never let a jab at Tan Tommy go unanswered.  That's all.  Not looking to start a fight.  It's summer time,  time for a little light humor.

Its a disservice to Buzz to pump his recruiting or performance by bashing Crean.

Crean's success/shortcomings has nothing to do with Buzz's successes.

Again, it's not about loving Crean or hating Crean.

Buzz is Buzz, and bashing Crean to make Buzz look good doesn't make any sense.

Call me any name you want... but my logic is correct.

[ChicosBailBonds]

so out of 10, 6 went down and 4 went up or in other words it's a total crap shoot as to whetehr they go up or down at all...but then you state that over the last 25 years they usually go down....boy do you get sick of taking your shoe out of your mouth? 


Remeber this all started by stating that our recently completed class will probably go down  and that we have still not seen whether buzz can coach or not.  have a nice life.

No junior...that was just a small amount of data (and still supported what I said...60% to 40%) but if you'd like, I invite you to examine more....like the Bob Gibbons lists, or other recruiting services.  I simply went back 8 years because it was easy to do and didn't take much time but will also give you a much larger sample size.

I'm not going to do the work for you....nor am I going to make up statements like you enjoy doing.  Seriously, enjoy Indiana now that your favorite coach is there.  Just knowing how much that will steam your hide makes me laugh.    Have you hung up a Crean in effigy outside your apartment door yet?  How about IU flag upside down to signal distress? 

[ChicosBailBonds]

Its a disservice to Buzz to pump his recruiting or performance by bashing Crean.

Crean's success/shortcomings has nothing to do with Buzz's successes.

Again, it's not about loving Crean or hating Crean.

Buzz is Buzz, and bashing Crean to make Buzz look good doesn't make any sense.

Call me any name you want... but my logic is correct.

+1

[mu-rara]

Its a disservice to Buzz to pump his recruiting or performance by bashing Crean.

Crean's success/shortcomings has nothing to do with Buzz's successes.

Again, it's not about loving Crean or hating Crean.

Buzz is Buzz, and bashing Crean to make Buzz look good doesn't make any sense.

Call me any name you want... but my logic is correct.

Dude,   chill....

Hank and Rick were compared to Al for as long as they coached at MU.  It is totally fair to compare TT to Buzz.  Get real.   

I am not yet declaring Buzz as the eternal solution.  I am very happy with what he has done so far.  I think he has shown himself to be as good a recruiter as the Tan One.  I may have a different take on this 2 years from now.

[muwarrior87]

right. I'm not saying he'll plummet out of the rankings, just that the fact he is committed to MU now and is planning on focusing on getting his grades in order means that his name will not be out on the AAU circuits as someone to actively watch which will cause him to fall slightly.

[muball]

Rankings have a place but I am not sure they serve a real value outside of the top 10-20 players in the country. Everything else is so fluid and impacted by hype, AAU sponsor, and school selected. What I do like is MU brought in Maymon, Eric, and Junior who could all turn into high level BEast players. Dwight is one of the best JC players in the country. We now have several tall post players(yes they need to develop) but this ends up laying a very solid foundation for the future.  I prefer this class over the previous one with Nick and Tyshawn (good luck to them) as I feel our length and overall potential is higher.   IMO Buzz has done an A job given the circumstances.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

Dude,   chill....

Hank and Rick were compared to Al for as long as they coached at MU.  It is totally fair to compare TT to Buzz.  Get real.   

I am not yet declaring Buzz as the eternal solution.  I am very happy with what he has done so far.  I think he has shown himself to be as good a recruiter as the Tan One.  I may have a different take on this 2 years from now.

You make some smart ass remarks about my posts... I respond with a restatement of what I originally said... and now you are telling me to chill? What exactly did I do?

I realize that it is common for people to compare one thing to another (are apples better than oranges, is blue better than red, is buzz better than crean, etc.)

However, my point is that bashing Crean to make Buzz's case is silly. Buzz's successes and/or failures will have nothing to do with if Tom Crean was good at his job or not. It will also have nothing to do with if Tom Crean was too tan or not. It also has nothing to do with if Tom was a media whore or not.

Comparing coaching performances is expected, however bashing one coach over the head is getting back into the ex-girlfriend stuff that we had back in April.

Buzz will be given a chance to bring in AT LEAST a few classes of his own players, and then we will see if Buzz is the right man for the job (looking pretty good so far).

That's it. It's pretty simple.

Think about it this way, if you like apples... that's great. However, your enjoyment of apples shouldn't be proven by you telling everybody about the crappy oranges you had yesterday. That's doing a disservice to the apples that you are enjoying today.

If the apples are good... enjoy the apples.

[77ncaachamps]

Buzz has landed a nice class.

It has nothing to do with Crean's ability or inability to recruit.

Thanks.

I disagree. Though he was able to lure big name recruits, he was not consistent. He specifically targeted certain players (i.e., Shumpert) without much of a contingency plan. We signed Blackledge more or less on a whim, and though I liked a few glimpses of what I saw of Trend, he did not pan out.

I think Crean was recruiting for his "system" and that's fine and dandy as long as you get the top-notch recruits - which he wasn't really able to do after the three amigos. I think the DJ/McNeal/Wes class really impacted his recruiting efforts because no recruit saw significant playing time as long as they were there.

[ChicosBailBonds]

Jeff from RSCI contacted me today and said the final rankings for last year were not done because he can't get his hands on the Prepstars final rankings.  So if anyone has them, he's looking for them.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

I disagree. Though he was able to lure big name recruits, he was not consistent. He specifically targeted certain players (i.e., Shumpert) without much of a contingency plan. We signed Blackledge more or less on a whim, and though I liked a few glimpses of what I saw of Trend, he did not pan out.

I think Crean was recruiting for his "system" and that's fine and dandy as long as you get the top-notch recruits - which he wasn't really able to do after the three amigos. I think the DJ/McNeal/Wes class really impacted his recruiting efforts because no recruit saw significant playing time as long as they were there.

I think I'm missing something... What are you disagreeing with?

How does Crean's ability/inability to recruit have anything to do with Buzz?