It's Not 1989, But It Seems Like 1989

[ChicosBailBonds]

I'm shocked those around the now departed were shocked by his departure. Hell, he was dying to leave to leave MU from the moment he got off the plane from New Orleans.

Pretty much what the last three coaches were doing at MU....that should tell you something.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

Go ahead and drink the Kool-Aid. 

Even if MU made a "run" at Bennett or Miller (and with Miller, I'm convinced he would have taken the job had MU been willing to pay part/all of his buy-out), I'm never going to believe that the "search" went any further.  Nor will I believe that coaches with better credentials than Buzz would have turned down a Top-20 program with a cupboard that was hardly bare. 

Either MU panicked or they went bargain-basement.

It's all just speculation. No point in everybody arguing about it... or telling somebody that they are "drinking the kool-aid".

Personally, I don't think there is a chance in hell that Miller wanted to come to MU, but that's just my opinion.

I really think the Buzz hire is like the Mike McCarthy hire for the Packers (and I'm NOT a Packer fan). Packer fans went crazy because the guy didn't have a proven track record, etc. etc. But, SOMEBODY at the Packers knew SOMETHING, because he has done a great job.

I'm not saying everybody at MU is a genius... but there is a reason why Cottingham is the AD and why we all post on message boards.

Let's have a little faith.

[BrewCity83]

I really think the Buzz hire is like the Mike McCarthy hire for the Packers (and I'm NOT a Packer fan). Packer fans went crazy because the guy didn't have a proven track record, etc. etc. But, SOMEBODY at the Packers knew SOMETHING, because he has done a great job.

I'm not saying everybody at MU is a genius... but there is a reason why Cottingham is the AD and why we all post on message boards.

Let's have a little faith.

+1

[ChicosBailBonds]

It's all just speculation. No point in everybody arguing about it... or telling somebody that they are "drinking the kool-aid".

Personally, I don't think there is a chance in hell that Miller wanted to come to MU, but that's just my opinion.

I really think the Buzz hire is like the Mike McCarthy hire for the Packers (and I'm NOT a Packer fan). Packer fans went crazy because the guy didn't have a proven track record, etc. etc. But, SOMEBODY at the Packers knew SOMETHING, because he has done a great job.

I'm not saying everybody at MU is a genius... but there is a reason why Cottingham is the AD and why we all post on message boards.

Let's have a little faith.

Yes, that "somebody" was Ted Thompson....he had been in pro football for 37 years.  10 as a player and 27 as a scout, Director of Scouting, Director of Pro Player Personnel, VP of Operations, etc.  He also had been with the Packers for 7 years before going to Seattle.  So that someone is a well seasoned person with great experience in the NFL.

Now, for MU we had Steve Cottingham....attorney for MU....no athletic department background other then as a cross functional role between departments....never hired a coach in his life at this level...etc.

It may work out spendidly.  I hope like hell it does, but you can certainly understand some of the concern as well....I would think.

Yes, yes....I know Bill was involved as well...that's the one thing that makes me feel a touch better.  A little faith is there, but not a lot right now and with next year's team, I don't think much more will be learned.

[HarveysWallbangers]

I think it's a lot more comparable to another NFL analogy...the Bears letting Lovie Smith hire Bob Babich as their defensive coordinator because Lovie didn't like Ron Rivera.

Rivera leaves and the Bears defense, under Lovie's inexperienced coordinator (who was an assistant at Tulsa about 3 years ago) goes from Super Bowl to Stinker Bowl!

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

I think it's a lot more comparable to another NFL analogy...the Bears letting Lovie Smith hire Bob Babich as their defensive coordinator because Lovie didn't like Ron Rivera.

Rivera leaves and the Bears defense, under Lovie's inexperienced coordinator (who was an assistant at Tulsa about 3 years ago) goes from Super Bowl to Stinker Bowl!

You certainly could be right. There is no way to know right now.

Listen, I can't say that Buzz is going to work out and Cottingham is a genius.

I'm just saying, people need to admit that maybe people at MU know some things that we don't.

Also, as far as the Ted Thompson stuff, you're right Chicos, Ted does appear to know what he is doing and has a good track record.

But, let's be honest, I live in Wisconsin and I hear Packer fans constantly question every move Thompson has ever made. Does anybody stop to think that maybe people who get paid to do this stuff (Thompson, Cottingham, Cords, etc) for a living actually know what they are doing?

I'm not saying every AD or GM is infallible, but why does every sports fan think they are an expert because they watch TV and read stuff on the internet?

(sorry, for the rant).

[ToddPacker]

You have to love those who, despite a wealth of evidence to the contrary, think we could have nabbed Bennett or Miller easily.  They are probably the same people who whined and moaned about TC's contract.  I am sure they could have been had, but should the administration have been willing to pay them what it would have taken?  What if Bennett said 5 years at $3M per, would you have gone for that?  Everyone has a price, and I am sure MU could have gotten TB or even SM if they were willing to pay for it. Would that have been a responsible use of athletic department resources for which the season ticket holders and fans pay?

Nobody here is saying who we should have hired instead, outside of the big names who were obviously not interested for what we were willing to pay.  Nobody is saying why they would not fail like so many other mid-major coaches do.  Why did Gonzo fail at SHU after having a proven track record at Manhattan?  How about Welsh at PC after a successful run at Iona?  Who's to say Lowery would not have likewise failed?  This country is littered with has-been D1 coaches who ascended the ladder and then failed once they got their first major job.  Why are they less of a risk than an assistant who is widely respected in the coaching fraternity?

There is a reason why coaches cannot wait to get the hell out of Milwaukee--I think MU fans are some of the most unrealistic fans I have ever seen.  Even with all of his warts, TC had MU at a level not seen around here in a long time, and yet, some fans wanted to run the guy out of town.  KO could not stand the environment here and took the first chance he could to get out of here.  With friends like these...

[ChicosBailBonds]

You have to love those who, despite a wealth of evidence to the contrary, think we could have nabbed Bennett or Miller easily.  They are probably the same people who whined and moaned about TC's contract.  I am sure they could have been had, but should the administration have been willing to pay them what it would have taken?  What if Bennett said 5 years at $3M per, would you have gone for that?  Everyone has a price, and I am sure MU could have gotten TB or even SM if they were willing to pay for it. Would that have been a responsible use of athletic department resources for which the season ticket holders and fans pay?

Nobody here is saying who we should have hired instead, outside of the big names who were obviously not interested for what we were willing to pay.  Nobody is saying why they would not fail like so many other mid-major coaches do.  Why did Gonzo fail at SHU after having a proven track record at Manhattan?  How about Welsh at PC after a successful run at Iona?  Who's to say Lowery would not have likewise failed?  This country is littered with has-been D1 coaches who ascended the ladder and then failed once they got their first major job.  Why are they less of a risk than an assistant who is widely respected in the coaching fraternity?

There is a reason why coaches cannot wait to get the hell out of Milwaukee--I think MU fans are some of the most unrealistic fans I have ever seen.  Even with all of his warts, TC had MU at a level not seen around here in a long time, and yet, some fans wanted to run the guy out of town.  KO could not stand the environment here and took the first chance he could to get out of here.  With friends like these...

Actually, the nobody statement is incorrect....many people offered alternatives, realistic ones as well.

Yes, this country is littered with DI coaches that didn't make it....and the opposite is also true with many making it just fine. 

No one here wants Buzz to fail, very few here are saying Buzz will fail (I'm not one of them).  Many people here felt Buzz could still have been hired a few days or a week later, after a few more options were exhausted.

Very few people thought we would get Miller or Bennett....very few.  Most were realists.


As for the comment about "widely respected in the coaching fraternity"....well, what do you base that on?  Quotes from other coaches?  I'm not trying to be cute, just asking.   I'd ask a follow-up question, can you find quotes from any coach in America in the last 10 years where they are ripping on a coach's qualifications after just being hired?  Or saying the coach isn't qualified?  I doubt it.  Coaches do coach speak in those interviews and for media guides.  "Such and such was my best recruiter, etc, etc".  That's how it works.  You never hear someone say "Oh my God, this guy is in totally over his head".  At least not publicly, behind the scenes another story sometimes.  So take those comments with a huge grain of salt.  With the egos on some of these guys, they don't respect their mothers let alone some coaches in the fraternity, but they'll say that because they're trained to say that.

MU fans can be unrealistic, but I'd argue not nearly as bad at the places I've been.  Not close.  Do you think 2 NIT appearances and 2 NCAA first round losses after a Final Four would stand at UNC, UK, KU, UCLA, or for that matter even schools on a step below?  There would be some hand wringing, but MU fans by and large didn't (attendance up, donations up, etc....sure some were vocal, but by and large they weren't voting with their pocket book or boycotting games). 

But if you want to see fans be upset, well let's just say Crean (for all his foibles) did some things that haven't been done around here in 30 years and fans remember.  If Buzz has trouble keeping pace with that track record, then fans will be clamouring why.  That's the nature of the beast.

KO said we were a Sweet 16 school at best.  Mike Dean said we were a NIT school with occasional NCAA appearances.  Maybe they were right.  I think the last guy proved that not to be the case, can Buzz continue it?

[3Mer]

You have to love those who, despite a wealth of evidence to the contrary, think we could have nabbed Bennett or Miller easily.  They are probably the same people who whined and moaned about TC's contract.  I am sure they could have been had, but should the administration have been willing to pay them what it would have taken? 

Well, I guess we know now that, at least for Bennett, it would have taken $1M/year (i.e., 37% less than what MU had been paying Crean).  ... So where is that "wealth of evidence to the contrary" now?

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

Well, I guess we know now that, at least for Bennett, it would have taken $1M/year (i.e., 37% less than what MU had been paying Crean).  ... So where is that "wealth of evidence to the contrary" now?

You mean Tony Bennett would have come to MU for 1mil?

Seriously? I don't know about that.

Can anybody confirm this?

[bma725]

You mean Tony Bennett would have come to MU for 1mil?

Seriously? I don't know about that.

Can anybody confirm this?

Tony Bennett wouldn't have come to MU for 1mil, he wouldn't have come to MU for 2mil, he had no interest in MU period.  No amount of money was going to change that.

[3Mer]

Tony Bennett wouldn't have come to MU for 1mil, he wouldn't have come to MU for 2mil, he had no interest in MU period.  No amount of money was going to change that.

... so your sources tell you that Bennett would turn down $2 million at MU to stay at WSU?  Why? Because WSU is such a traditional basketball powerhouse?

[🏀]

... so your sources tell you that Bennett would turn down $2 million at MU to stay at WSU?  Why? Because WSU is such a traditional basketball powerhouse?

If you haven't noticed the commom theme - Bennett isn't leaving WSU.

Not for Marquette, not for Indiana...Indiana..., not for any school.

[bma725]

... so your sources tell you that Bennett would turn down $2 million at MU to stay at WSU?  Why? Because WSU is such a traditional basketball powerhouse?

Bennett and his family actually like Wazzu.  Even with the raise from WSU, he's still getting less money than both MU and IU were offering him.  But he had no interest in either job.  He also pulled his name from the LSU search despite the fact that they too were willing to pay him way more than what WSU does.  

Tony is not your typical power hungry coach, he's not out there for the money and fame.  Nothing MU could have offered would have changed his opinion that he wants to be at WSU.

[BrewCity83]

I heard that Bennett actually feels loyalty toward WSU for grooming him for the job and then taking over from his pop.  Imagine that.

[THEGYMBAR]

Chico----Dead on on your post. I think that us, the fan base, are often confused on what we are and what we want to be. I think KO and ND were right on their appraisal of the programs for what they were capable of accomplishing. The Al years made many older fans, like myself, place the bar to be higher than ever. The younger fans have seen some success and might have different bar than others.

Basically I believe that MU has every chance to be a Top Ten program that 50 other schools have. If you want to be elite you have to have elite expectations. TC was smart and knew what expectations were at MU. NOt going to NCAA after 2003 FF was a big blow to the program. Going there and winning a game or two would have raised the bar.

MU can be a Top Ten program if that was their focus. To get there you take your time and hire the best coach, not the easiest coach (not bashing Buzz and pulling for him). You need to recruit the best players possible and not settle for top 75-100 players. You can win with those players if coach can coach. But if coach is recruiter you need to recruit better players.

It would be great if all MU fans and the school had the same goals. They charge ticket prices like we are elite program and then are happy with modest success. The Al years and the Dwade year made the school a ton of money. That should be the standard not the once every three decades.