Baseball Pissing Match

[Mayor McCheese]

Good weekend. Took 3 of 4. Aramis, Guz & Reed return on Monday.

As bad as the Cubs have been and all the problems wadesworld has documented, they still have the best chance to take the division.

How do you come to this conclusion.. based off of one weekend?

I'll still take my preseason pick of the Cardinals.

[🏀]

How do you come to this conclusion.. based off of one weekend?

I'll still take my preseason pick of the Cardinals.

Based off of the best ERA in the division. Based off of the Cubs have played terrible ball and tied in the loss column. Based off of that Bradley & Soriano are drastically under their career averages, which will correct itself in the second half. Based off of the fact that the bullpen has shown strong signs of stabilization. Based off of the contribution of our minor league players, something our teams have lacked. Based off of that our most valuable player is coming back after two months on the DL.

The Cubs went through two terrible months, are 2.5 games back in the division, and just took it to the Brewers 3 out of 4. There is nothing that could be worse, and things are only getting better.

[wadesworld]

Based off of the best ERA in the division. Based off of the Cubs have played terrible ball and tied in the loss column. Based off of that Bradley & Soriano are drastically under their career averages, which will correct itself in the second half. Based off of the fact that the bullpen has shown strong signs of stabilization. Based off of the contribution of our minor league players, something our teams have lacked. Based off of that our most valuable player is coming back after two months on the DL.

The Cubs went through two terrible months, are 2.5 games back in the division, and just took it to the Brewers 3 out of 4. There is nothing that could be worse, and things are only getting better.

I love how Cubs fans act as though 1/2 the season is a 2 week stretch.  Like they are just cold.  I hope you realize that teams rarely have half a season worth of flukes and that teams usually aren't having "terrible months" and then just get hot and turn it on.  And that coming back from a separated shoulder isn't exactly the same as coming back from a blister on a finger.  It took Dwyane Wade almost a full season after he separated his shoulder in order to get back to his normal form.  You could be right, the Cubs could win the division in the end, but I'm really thinking that the Cubs haven't just had "2 terrible months," but instead, are just not a good baseball team.

[🏀]

I love how Cubs fans act as though 1/2 the season is a 2 week stretch.  Like they are just cold.  I hope you realize that teams rarely have half a season worth of flukes and that teams usually aren't having "terrible months" and then just get hot and turn it on.  And that coming back from a separated shoulder isn't exactly the same as coming back from a blister on a finger.  It took Dwyane Wade almost a full season after he separated his shoulder in order to get back to his normal form.  You could be right, the Cubs could win the division in the end, but I'm really thinking that the Cubs haven't just had "2 terrible months," but instead, are just not a good baseball team.

So you're going on record saying that no team has ever had a bad two months? Are you sure?

[wadesworld]

So you're going on record saying that no team has ever had a bad two months? Are you sure?

Hah there are, but they are bad teams.  I just think it's funny that Cubs fans never think they have a bad team, it's just that "everything that could go wrong has gone wrong."  Even if the team is awful.

[Mayor McCheese]

Based off of the best ERA in the division. Based off of the Cubs have played terrible ball and tied in the loss column. Based off of that Bradley & Soriano are drastically under their career averages, which will correct itself in the second half. Based off of the fact that the bullpen has shown strong signs of stabilization. Based off of the contribution of our minor league players, something our teams have lacked. Based off of that our most valuable player is coming back after two months on the DL.

The Cubs went through two terrible months, are 2.5 games back in the division, and just took it to the Brewers 3 out of 4. There is nothing that could be worse, and things are only getting better.

I am going to go in a different direction then Wade did with this one.

Looking at your reasons the Cubs are most likely the frontrunners to win the division, almost every single one I could say about the Brewers, and I could switch some of the others with other fantastic things to say about the team.

Are the Cubs the only team in the division that have players vastly under performing?  The Brewers could use a normal performance from Hart, Hardy, Cameron, Kendall(although he is picking it up as of late)... and Ill take a little bit more from Hall, although that is unlikely.

The Cubs the only team dealing with injuries?  Don't think so.

The Brewers bullpen have shown signs of stability.

We have had minor league players stepping it up (McGehee anybody?)

The Brewers haven't been playing particularly good ball as of late too, something that apparently just be smoothed out, the same way you figure Cubs ball will be smoothed out.

Just understand that when you prove your broad statement such as "having the best chance to take the division", and you use very broad statements that really could be said about ANY team in the majors, you aren't fooling anybody.

[MUfan12]

As much as it pains me to say it, I agree with PTM on the Cubs.  

The Cubs are getting healthier, and thanks to "McBurns," now Lee is heating up. Their pitching has been excellent. I still think they win the division by 5 games.

On to the Brewers. Since May 17th, when Weeks was hurt, the Brewers have gone 20-25. That's a pretty significant chunk of games in which to look at. Without a major move, I can't see them doing much better than 500 ball.

Their rotation is thin, the bullpen will be soon spent, and the lineup isn't producing. They have a bunch of all or nothing hitters outside of Counsell, Braun, Fielder, and as of now, McGehee. But people will figure out how to pitch Casey, and it's reasonable to think his numbers will drop.

But guys like Cameron, Hart, and Hardy are not guys we can expect to produce consistently. They can't even be counted on to make productive outs (see Hart in the Mets game Wednesday). Those three, with Kendall and Hall, make it very difficult for the Brewers to score runs on a consistent basis.

[muwarrior87]

the brewers need two things to be in the picture for the division. One is another starting pitcher. Whether that come through a trade, Capuano or Parra miraculously coming back from injury/mental issues when getting behind, or some other way, they need someway of boosting the rotation. The other is a contact hitter. Anyone to change up the lineup a little (preferably lefty bat) so it isn't one guy after another trying to go yard/pull the ball.

As long as Albert stays healthy, he will probably carry the Cards to the Division title but with Aramis coming back as well as the others ptm listed, chances are the Cubs will be getting better before they get worse.  It doesn't help that Lee is heating up from the plate now either.  Still think it will most likely be a three team race by the end of August with the Reds finding a way to sink back to mediocrity.

[Mayor McCheese]

the brewers need two things to be in the picture for the division. One is another starting pitcher. Whether that come through a trade, Capuano or Parra miraculously coming back from injury/mental issues when getting behind, or some other way, they need someway of boosting the rotation. The other is a contact hitter. Anyone to change up the lineup a little (preferably lefty bat) so it isn't one guy after another trying to go yard/pull the ball.

As long as Albert stays healthy, he will probably carry the Cards to the Division title but with Aramis coming back as well as the others ptm listed, chances are the Cubs will be getting better before they get worse.  It doesn't help that Lee is heating up from the plate now either.  Still think it will most likely be a three team race by the end of August with the Reds finding a way to sink back to mediocrity.

Dave Bush coming back from injury won't hurt the Brewers, no need for a miracle, just a fashionable beard.

[Brewtown Andy]

with the Reds finding a way to sink back to mediocrity.

I already found it.

[NavinRJohnson]

The Cubs have been my pick and have remained my pick, but I am starting to waiver a bit. For the cubs its pretty simple...it comes down to ARam and Marmol. The starting pitching is solid (although I would argue it is also a bit fragile when you consider Harden and Zambrano, for different reasons being candidates to hurt you more than they help you at any time), and that's the biggest advantage they have right now. If Ramirez cannot come back and be effective, and if Marmol does not turn back into Marmol, the Cubs have no shot. They are only going to get worse. If they do come back and perform up to their standards in the second half, the Cubs will win the division.

If the Brewers do manage to pull of a trade for some starting pitching and another bat (preferably a lead off hitter), I may rethink this, as I think that could put them right there, but until then, its the Cubs.

[muwarrior87]

Dave Bush coming back from injury won't hurt the Brewers, no need for a miracle, just a fashionable beard.

that will at least get Seth back into the mid-innings bullpen roll but I still think we need a little more pitching help as you can never have too much.  The main thing though is our offense is way too one dimensional.  Up and down the lineup are power bats or guys that try to pull the ball way too much.  Hart and Hardy need to focus on hitting to contact more and stop trying to pull every pitch they get. The frustrating thing with that is Hart has one game every week or two where he does this and goes 4-4 or 4-5 but then has an 0-20 streak.  Consistency is something this club needs more of to push for the division in the second half of the season.

[robmufan]

Looks like the brewers are starting to feel the heat!

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=4308312

[TallTitan34]

With the pitching staff the Brewers have, it is hard for me to worry about them.

I will give you Gallardo but after that theres nothing of quality.  The Brewers need to go out a get a starter.

Also the sale of the Cubs was finalized (just needs MLB owners approval which it will get) so we should find out shortly if money will be available for the Cubs to spend in a mid-season trade.

[LON]

Looks like the brewers are starting to feel the heat!

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=4308312

Braun should be calling out Hart, Hardy and Cam too if he's going to call out pitching.

What would the reaction be if Gallardo called out the offense for the 1-0 loss he took...

I'd welcome it.

[wadesworld]

Looks like the brewers are starting to feel the heat!

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=4308312

Oh no !

Also, "Teammate Ryan Braun, who has become a terrific left fielder in no time, is another worthy candidate."  From SI's list of mid-season awards.  Weird, I keep reading that Ryan Braun has become a great left fielder from sites like ESPN and SI, but Cubs fans continue to say he is one of the worst defenders in the league.

[robmufan]

Funny,

My post had nothing to do with the quality of ryan braun...

I was just posting that it looks as if Braun sees the Brewers going no where if they don't make a move!

Name one person besides gallardo that is better than someone on the cardinals and the cubs starting rotation.

[wadesworld]

Funny,

My post had nothing to do with the quality of ryan braun...

I was just posting that it looks as if Braun sees the Brewers going no where if they don't make a move!

Name one person besides gallardo that is better than someone on the cardinals and the cubs starting rotation.

I know, I was just saying that apparently some unbiased people seem to think Ryan Braun is a good left fielder (not just offensive player and terrible defender).

Name 1 team ahead of the Brewers in the standings besides the Cardinals.  The funny thing is that we have had this pitching rotation all year and are only one game out of 1st place, so apparently it's not as bad as people make it out to be.  Or else the Cubs are just that bad (my pick).  It has to be 1 of the 2.

[robmufan]

Yup,

I would put Seth McClung over any pitcher on the cubs or cardinals...

Look at the quote of Braun, he is tired of playing from behind.  Wade, if you think you will win the division or wildcard with your rotation as is, im willing to put some type of bet down on this. 

[🏀]

I know, I was just saying that apparently some unbiased people seem to think Ryan Braun is a good left fielder (not just offensive player and terrible defender).

Name 1 team ahead of the Brewers in the standings besides the Cardinals.  The funny thing is that we have had this pitching rotation all year and are only one game out of 1st place, so apparently it's not as bad as people make it out to be.  Or else the Cubs are just that bad (my pick).  It has to be 1 of the 2.

Funny, because those unbiased people also think the Cubs have a better team than the Brewers. Hell, even Ryan Braun knows the Cubs have a better team than the Brewers, but wadesworld will keep on saying they're bad.


Also to follow up on a separate issue, wadesworld.

Hah there are, but they are bad teams.  I just think it's funny that Cubs fans never think they have a bad team, it's just that "everything that could go wrong has gone wrong."  Even if the team is awful.

Since the Cubs had a bad two months, and went 26-27 in the months of May & June, you have called them a bad team. You also followed up on my comment "So you're going on record saying that no team has ever had a bad two months? Are you sure?" with the above quote stating that any team that has a bad two months is a 'bad' team.

wadesworld, would you trade the Brewers season with any of the following teams from their respective years?

2005 - Houston Astros - 19-32 over a two month span.
2006 - St. Louis Cardinals - 49-59 over a four month span.
2007 - Colorado Rockies - 25-29 over a two month span.
2007 - Boston Red Sox - 26-28 over a two month span.

I'm assuming you're going to call those four teams from the recent past bad teams, correct?

[robmufan]

Wow,

Quality stats you bring up there PTM!

[drewm88]

Funny, because those unbiased people also think the Cubs have a better team than the Brewers. Hell, even Ryan Braun knows the Cubs have a better team than the Brewers, but wadesworld will keep on saying they're bad.


Also to follow up on a separate issue, wadesworld.

Since the Cubs had a bad two months, and went 26-27 in the months of May & June, you have called them a bad team. You also followed up on my comment "So you're going on record saying that no team has ever had a bad two months? Are you sure?" with the above quote stating that any team that has a bad two months is a 'bad' team.

wadesworld, would you trade the Brewers season with any of the following teams from their respective years?

2005 - Houston Astros - 19-32 over a two month span.
2006 - St. Louis Cardinals - 49-59 over a four month span.
2007 - Colorado Rockies - 25-29 over a two month span.
2007 - Boston Red Sox - 26-28 over a two month span.

I'm assuming you're going to call those four teams from the recent past bad teams, correct?

BOOM! Roasted.

[wadesworld]

Funny, because those unbiased people also think the Cubs have a better team than the Brewers. Hell, even Ryan Braun knows the Cubs have a better team than the Brewers, but wadesworld will keep on saying they're bad.


Also to follow up on a separate issue, wadesworld.

Since the Cubs had a bad two months, and went 26-27 in the months of May & June, you have called them a bad team. You also followed up on my comment "So you're going on record saying that no team has ever had a bad two months? Are you sure?" with the above quote stating that any team that has a bad two months is a 'bad' team.

wadesworld, would you trade the Brewers season with any of the following teams from their respective years?

2005 - Houston Astros - 19-32 over a two month span.
2006 - St. Louis Cardinals - 49-59 over a four month span.
2007 - Colorado Rockies - 25-29 over a two month span.
2007 - Boston Red Sox - 26-28 over a two month span.

I'm assuming you're going to call those four teams from the recent past bad teams, correct?

Really?  The Cubs were better than the Brewers for a 4 game series?  Dang, we might as well stop playing our season.  I didn't know the 1/2 season we've played and been 1 game up on the Cubs meant nothing, but just the 4 game series that we played at Wrigley this weekend.  The Cubs are definitely better though, now that I know the criteria.

And wow, congratulations.  You have 20/20 hindsight vision.  So when the 2006 Cardinals were 49-59 you were predicting a World Series for them?  Wow PTM, you're GOOD!  I should listen to you all the time!  Are you a betting man?!  Maybe if you predicted the Cubs would win a World Series, they would!

[robmufan]

Wade,

If the brewers lose 2 of 3 to the cardinals...are you going to admit that there may be a problem?

[Skatastrophy]

Wade,

If the brewers lose 2 of 3 to the cardinals...are you going to admit that there may be a problem?

Why would the crew have a problem?  We can go under .500 for a full half season and not have a problem