RIP Marquette 2025-2026 Men's Basketball Season

[brewcity77]

Certainly not that you need to give every player on your roster money. It's up to the school to distribute it how they want.

I do think at high majors all scholarship players will get something, but there will probably more of a "pay 2-3 stars a lot & pay the role players less" model.

[muwarrior69]

Certainly not that you need to give every player on your roster money. It's up to the school to distribute it how they want.

So when they sign their LOI with the school, the amount "distributed" in not in that LOI and in subsequent years when scholarships are renewed, or is that a "separate" contract? I cannot imagine what revenue share a player will get is not in writing. So I doubt players will not receive no payments.

[Pakuni]

Except for the pay part, that has happened in all sports above Jr. High forever.

If Shaka can't be the heavy, but fair and honest, with his players, MU has to move on right away.

The pay part is pretty important.
You're free to disagree, but I just don't think Shaka would cut one of "his" guy's income to zero then expect/encourage him to stay.
If your boss told you the company was laying you off, but you were welcome to keep coming and working for free, I suspect you'd pass, no matter how much you like your co-workers or the office.

[The Sultan]

nm

[Mu8891]

Trash - Shaka sure as hell can't be the
" heavy " ..

I'm convinced he ( almost ) runs it back
w/ maybe two additions.  Zaide and hopefully Sean's spots. 

[#UnleashThePortal]

So when they sign their LOI with the school, the amount "distributed" in not in that LOI and in subsequent years when scholarships are renewed, or is that a "separate" contract? I cannot imagine what revenue share a player will get is not in writing. So I doubt players will not receive no payments.

You're a bit off with what wades is saying. It's up to the school to distribute the money how they see fit.

Imagine a pool of 20 million, the school will divide that up to its players, but one guy might get 5 million, while another gets 1 million, and another 100,000. These numbers are known to the players, and the players will negotiate their pay before signing.

[Vander Blue Man Group]

Missing the tournament, given this season, would qualify. Regardless, if he can have another season that would warrant dismissal, then he's coaching for his job, thus he's on the hot seat.

Yeah, that's ridiculous. It's not cut-and-dry.

[Vander Blue Man Group]

How do you define sh#tshow? That's a subjective term that means different things to different people, including the decision makers.

Another condescending response to a legitimate, fair question.  By the way, "sh#tshow" is much less subjective than "underwhelming".

And what's the point of having data points if each season is it's own, unique data point?

Is this a serious question?

I think we know from program history that no coach will survive back-to-back losing seasons. So we can start there with the minimum Shaka needs to do to avoid firing. If we're on the wrong side of .500 this time next year, Shaka's seat is more likely to be empty than hot.

Yeah, that would probably be the case unless there are extenuating circumstances (IE injuries)

From there, I'd say it depends. Making the tournament should be the expectation, but whether failure to do so gets him fired depends on injury luck, how the schedule shakes out, etc. If MU wins 17 games but  doesn't make the tournament because Nigel and Royce each missed a few weeks, that's a mitigating factor in Shaka's favor. If we're playing in the Crown next year with a 17-16 record despite a healthy roster and the promised portal additions, it may be the end of the road. If we win 19-20 games but end up just on the wrong side of the bubble, he's likely safe.

I don't disagree with any of this.

I've read a whole lot here in recent weeks about how this team has three young studs to build around, at least one high-end freshman coming in, three promising redshirts joining the active roster, and Shaka ready and willing to add key pieces through the portal.
How are we thinking/accepting anything other than "Tournament or bust"?

The goal and the expectation for next season should be a tourney berth, at minimum.  If that goal is not achieved, it should not result in an automatic firing, which you essentially detailed above.

[Billy Hoyle]

So when they sign their LOI with the school, the amount "distributed" in not in that LOI and in subsequent years when scholarships are renewed, or is that a "separate" contract? I cannot imagine what revenue share a player will get is not in writing. So I doubt players will not receive no payments.

First, there is no more NLI (not LOI), they are Financial Aid Agreements between the school and the student-athlete. It is much easier for a kid to get out of a FA Agreement than it was with the NIL. And, those just cover institutional grants in aid. Revenue Share is a separate contract. More are one-year deals, but schools are starting to have athletes sign multi-year deals. There are also contracts with collectives or other boosters on top of revenue share - see the Darien Mensah situation at Duke. That's how you get to a $7 million number like Dybansta has.

[WhiteTrash]

Trash - Shaka sure as hell can't be the
" heavy " ..

I'm convinced he ( almost ) runs it back
w/ maybe two additions.  Zaide and hopefully Sean's spots. 

If Shaka can't do it, he's not going to survive in major college hoops. Difficult financial decisions are core to pro sports.

[Jay Bee]

First, there is no more NLI (not LOI), they are Financial Aid Agreements between the school and the student-athlete. It is much easier for a kid to get out of a FA Agreement than it was with the NIL. And, those just cover institutional grants in aid. Revenue Share is a separate contract. More are one-year deals, but schools are starting to have athletes sign multi-year deals. There are also contracts with collectives or other boosters on top of revenue share - see the Darien Mensah situation at Duke. That's how you get to a $7 million number like Dybansta has.

#FakeNews #Lies

"Revenue sharing" isn't sharing of revenue. It's spending of money, up to a cap, if schools so wish. MU could spend a ton on men's bball - they choose not to, and will continue to not spend anywhere near that cap.

Traditional NLI absolutely exists, but has more rigor around the deals -- but that could change any second.

 

[Billy Hoyle]

#FakeNews #Lies

"Revenue sharing" isn't sharing of revenue. It's spending of money, up to a cap, if schools so wish. MU could spend a ton on men's bball - they choose not to, and will continue to not spend anywhere near that cap.

Traditional NLI absolutely exists, but has more rigor around the deals -- but that could change any second.

 

We're talking about the National Letter of Intent (NLI, frequently erroneously referred to as LOI), not NIL

[Small Orange Soda]

Certainly not that you need to give every player on your roster money. It's up to the school to distribute it how they want.

I understand this idea for what would previously have been seen as 'walk ons', but have you seen any other team doing this for players that were also getting paid? I'm not sure where you're getting this idea from for players that have been making money. If it's been done elsewhere, fair enough. Seems like a hypothetical of your own otherwise.

[muwarrior69]

First, there is no more NLI (not LOI), they are Financial Aid Agreements between the school and the student-athlete. It is much easier for a kid to get out of a FA Agreement than it was with the NIL. And, those just cover institutional grants in aid. Revenue Share is a separate contract. More are one-year deals, but schools are starting to have athletes sign multi-year deals. There are also contracts with collectives or other boosters on top of revenue share - see the Darien Mensah situation at Duke. That's how you get to a $7 million number like Dybansta has.

Are Financial Aid Agreements considered scholarships and subject to the scholarship limit of 15? Secondly, walk-ons can play garbage minutes but these players do not have scholarships/Financial Aid Agreements. So I guess a school could get around the scholarship limit by offering a walk-on a separate revenue share contract. Since there are no rules anymore I guess that is a possibility to get a high valued player without offering a scholarship?

[The Sultan]

Are Financial Aid Agreements considered scholarships and subject to the scholarship limit of 15? Secondly, walk-ons can play garbage minutes but these players do not have scholarships/Financial Aid Agreements. So I guess a school could get around the scholarship limit by offering a walk-on a separate revenue share contract. Since there are no rules anymore I guess that is a possibility to get a high valued player without offering a scholarship?

Financial Aid Agreements replaced NLIs. It's basically a contract that ties the school and athlete together with some stipulations.

As I understand it, walk-ons aren't really going to be a thing in the future. There will be 15 scholarship players on a team. The current walk-ons just need to get through their eligibility.

[muwarrior69]

Financial Aid Agreements replaced NLIs. It's basically a contract that ties the school and athlete together with some stipulations.

As I understand it, walk-ons aren't really going to be a thing in the future. There will be 15 scholarship players on a team. The current walk-ons just need to get through their eligibility.

Thank for the clarification.

[Billy Hoyle]

Certainly not that you need to give every player on your roster money. It's up to the school to distribute it how they want.

The 15 is the roster cap; not every player has to get a full scholarship or even any scholarship. Some schools are still budgeting 13 scholarships, with some guys getting partials combined with academic money, much like the equivalency sports used to do. Certainly not every player on a roster is getting revenue share dollars. As you said, it's up to the schools to determine how to distribute it. My guess is MU is around $6 to $7 million in hoops rev share and I would hope that next year Caedin and Clark aren't getting the same amount as Nigel and Royce.

[JTJ3]

The 15 is the roster cap; not every player has to get a full scholarship or even any scholarship. Some schools are still budgeting 13 scholarships, with some guys getting partials combined with academic money, much like the equivalency sports used to do. Certainly not every player on a roster is getting revenue share dollars. As you said, it's up to the schools to determine how to distribute it. My guess is MU is around $6 to $7 million in hoops rev share and I would hope that next year Caedin and Clark aren't getting the same amount as Nigel and Royce.

6 this year.  Going to be A LOT more next year.

[wadesworld]

The 15 is the roster cap; not every player has to get a full scholarship or even any scholarship. Some schools are still budgeting 13 scholarships, with some guys getting partials combined with academic money, much like the equivalency sports used to do. Certainly not every player on a roster is getting revenue share dollars. As you said, it's up to the schools to determine how to distribute it. My guess is MU is around $6 to $7 million in hoops rev share and I would hope that next year Caedin and Clark aren't getting the same amount as Nigel and Royce.

I'm pretty sure Pepperdine, along with maybe other schools, had to vacate wins and even national titles because they were giving both athletic and academic scholarships to student athletes and they can only receive one or the other.

[WhiteTrash]

I'm pretty sure Pepperdine, along with maybe other schools, had to vacate wins and even national titles because they were giving both athletic and academic scholarships to student athletes and they can only receive one or the other.

How else are they going to get athletes onto that $h!ty campus?

[Billy Hoyle]

I'm pretty sure Pepperdine, along with maybe other schools, had to vacate wins and even national titles because they were giving both athletic and academic scholarships to student athletes and they can only receive one or the other.

Pepp was overawarding scholarships (individually and above team limits) by not counting countable academic aid against the limits in equivalency sports. The NCAA eliminated the distinction between countable/noncountable institutional aid a number of years ago (it was based on incoming GPA and could shift yearly depending on a student-athlete's GPA) and all academic or need based aid is non-countable but must be shown to have been awarded within institutional rules.

In equivalency sports, stacking is necessary. For example, Men's Soccer only allowed 9.9 scholarships, so a student who got a $20k academic scholarship could get to full tuition (e.g., $50K) by only costing $30k in athletic money. In headcount sports like basketball, it just came down to cost savings for kids who did qualify for academic money. They still counted as a full scholarship, but that $20K a student got was $20k saved from the scholarship budget.

Now, all sports are equivalency sports, so not everyone has to get a full scholarship, and stacking is helpful, so if a school wants they can give an athletic grant-in-aid to everyone on the team.

[BCHoopster]

Shaka really tries to buy into relationships with his players and there families.  It will be hard to tell juniors to take a hike.  Only person I see leaving is JONES, who might graduate.  One portal transfer is not enough, let's see if Shaka has the balls to get rid of more dead weight

[GoldenEagles03]

Shaka really tries to buy into relationships with his players and there families.  It will be hard to tell juniors to take a hike.  Only person I see leaving is JONES, who might graduate.  One portal transfer is not enough, let's see if Shaka has the balls to get rid of more dead weight

You are drastically underestimating the power of coaching for your job at a P5 level.

[Billy Hoyle]

You are drastically underestimating the power of coaching for your job at a P5 level.

We may also be underestimating the power of Boeker and (especially) President Kim being total Shaka fanboys.

[The Sultan]

We may also be underestimating the power of Boeker and (especially) President Kim being total Shaka fanboys.

The people writing the checks have told them to wake up from their happy little dream.