Shaka’s mess

[MuggsyB]

For people who can't grasp the "bad for a year" comments, we are 17-13 in our last 30 games, starting with Dayton last year. 4-12 against kenpom top-70 (aka bubble or better) teams. Sorting T-Rank, we played like the #41 team in the country last year from Dec 13 to the end of the season, this year have played like the #82 team in the country, though that's a small sample size.

Brew,

What are your remedies?  Are we bereft of talent or are there any changes we can immediately make?   I might try 4 guards with Ben or Royce. 

[WhiteTrash]

I get we're all super pissed.  Based on what we've seen, this team is going to have a rough season.  And the "continuity"/not utilizing the portal doesn't make a lot of sense moving forward.  All that said, we can't give up on our guys or Shaka.

Agreed.

Also, Shaka and MU have confidence in each other that allows him the freedom to try the no transfer strategy. Kudos to both Shaka and MU. This season maybe disappointing, but I admire the guts to try it.

[Shooter McGavin]

That so many people are losing their sh@& is beyond funny to me.  Shaka is a great coach, builds a program the university and the Alumni can be proud of, does it right and really connects with the players.  I'm glad we stay out of that portal mess, I don't want a "rent a team".  I'd sign up to have him coach my kids every day of the week.  We are having a down year, things will improve, guaranteed.  Step back and take a breath, enjoy the season.  The sky is not falling.  2025 may not be our year, don't throw out the baby with the bathwater.  Sheeesh

This sentiment is pollyanish.  I agree that the sky is not falling. One really bad year is acceptable, especially if the talent level was gravely miscalculated by Shaka. But, MU fans will get restless with this. The season ticket base will go down. Things like this happen quickly.  Shaka has the ability  to turn this rebuild around in short order if he uses the tools at his disposal and has the stomach for difficult conversations with current players.

It's all about proper player evaluation going forward. He hit the bullseye or at least around it with Kolek, Omax, Joplin and Ross.  Wojo hit the bullseye on the rest.  Cannot afford too many more recruiting misses.  We all want Shaka to succeed.  But he, alone, will have to unearth the talent for the next top 10 run at MU. 

Hope it happens.  TRGV!   

[Daniel]

That so many people are losing their sh@& is beyond funny to me.  Shaka is a great coach, builds a program the university and the Alumni can be proud of, does it right and really connects with the players.  I'm glad we stay out of that portal mess, I don't want a "rent a team".  I'd sign up to have him coach my kids every day of the week.  We are having a down year, things will improve, guaranteed.  Step back and take a breath, enjoy the season.  The sky is not falling.  2025 may not be our year, don't throw out the baby with the bathwater.  Sheeesh

We are six games into the season.    Let's see what happens.    So fa4 we have seen flaws 8n every aspect of the game.  Though rebounding is better.  The team needs to believe in itself, and so far I th8nk they are playing with hesitance and doubt.    That's not how Shaka's teams have played.  It is truly possible that Shaka sees one thing in practice, then these guys take to the court and doubt prevails.  Chase is chase.  He goes after i5 and is confident.  Ben is bette4 and fun to watch and good now for rebounds and defense .  the rest... they need to develop.  Most will.  Some will level off and not get beyond that.  Shaka is a very solid coach, and will make adjustments.  Let's Chill for five and see what happens.  Go Marquette! 

[Vander Blue Man Group]

The only silver lining of our season being over in two weeks is there is absolutely no excuse not to the play the freshmen and sophomores every minute humanly possible.  Enough with the meaningless "well embedded mole" bullshit via Rothstein, it's time to sink or swim.  Play Owens, Clark, Phillips, James, Stevens, Parham as much as you possibly can, and if they prove themselves, bring em back.  If not, then be a highly-compensated college coach and move on to someone more talented.  This isn't a charity, as much as Shaka's loyalty to scrubs is Make-A-Wish lite.

I would love to see him pull Ian's redshirt and see what he's got.  There's no use in redshirting a guy most of us were surprised is sitting when we need to know right now who can hack it at this level.  I'm done with the Caedin Hamilon, Al Amadou, Emarion Ellis, Tre Norman, Keeyan Itejere leeches who stay on the roster when they have no business playing at this level.

Once again, pulling someone's redshirt who is not ready would be objectively stupid and shortsighted and I can't believe multiple people have suggested it.

[The Sultan]

I would love to see him pull Ian's redshirt and see what he's got.  There's no use in redshirting a guy most of us were surprised is sitting when we need to know right now who can hack it at this level. 

It doesn't matter how surprised anyone is. And we don't need to know anything right now. Do you think we vote on the line ups or something?

It would be monumentally stupid to waste a year of eligibility on a down year like this.

[onepost]

You sounded fairly reasonable until your last paragraph.  Also, I was not surprised Ian caught a red shirt.

Speculating on Ian's redshirt is simply an exaggerated portion to a different point: that we need to see which underclassmen can cut it at this level. Clearly he's not ready to play, and I'm fine with he and Sheek redshirting. I'm just saying with our season essentially over, we need to start focusing on who that will be here can excel here. So play the young guys as many minutes as they can handle to see who deserves to play here.

[The Sultan]

To
Speculating on Ian's redshirt is simply an exaggerated portion to a different point: that we need to see which underclassmen can cut it at this level. Clearly he's not ready to play, and I'm fine with he and Sheek redshirting. I'm just saying with our season essentially over, we need to start focusing on who that will be here can excel here. So play the young guys as many minutes as they can handle to see who deserves to play here.

lol. The season isn't "essentially over." Good lord.

[onepost]

When did Marquette fans suddenly think Marquette is North Carolina?

Like I said before, the reaction here is absolutely bonkers. We're not above a down season.

What an asinine strawman argument. Because I expect Marquette to be competitive and in the mix every year I'm saying we're North Carolina? Kinda sad you think so little of Marquette that what I'm saying is deemed unreasonable. Am I supposed to apologize for having high expectations for my alma mater? Good God.

For the umpteenth time, this is not a simple 6-game sample size.

- We were national title contenders in 23/24 when O-Max left, we did nothing to add around the margins.

- Kolek wanted to come back for 24/25 but had guarantees from the NBA, despite our significant offer. It happens. But then we again do nothing to improve, no point guard depth, and our team craters from new year's on cause Kam's 99% usage rate was unsustainable. We flame out pathetically.

- Now we enter 25/26 with CLEAR issues and again do absolutely nothing. And look like the worst team in the Big East: with no obvious reinforcements to make us any better next season.

So yeah, I'm fucking pissed. Pissed that we didn't maximize our title window, do right by Kam, Stevie, Jop, and reload in the slightest when it was clear to the village idiot that this season was gonna be an uphill climb.

[onepost]

lol. The season isn't "essentially over." Good lord.

We're 2 weeks in and have no shot at an at-large bid. And look like a local CYO team. In terms of meaningful, tournament stakes, our season is toast.

Only thing left to play for IMO is Chase impressing NBA scouts and figuring out which freshmen/sophomores are good enough to stay.

[NCMUFan]

We're a nobody until we beat a somebody.

[wadesworld]

For people who can't grasp the "bad for a year" comments, we are 17-13 in our last 30 games, starting with Dayton last year. 4-12 against kenpom top-70 (aka bubble or better) teams. Sorting T-Rank, we played like the #41 team in the country last year from Dec 13 to the end of the season, this year have played like the #82 team in the country, though that's a small sample size.

Good thing there are separate seasons and not a rolling 12 month record.

[wadesworld]

What an asinine strawman argument. Because I expect Marquette to be competitive and in the mix every year I'm saying we're North Carolina? Kinda sad you think so little of Marquette that what I'm saying is deemed unreasonable. Am I supposed to apologize for having high expectations for my alma mater? Good God.

For the umpteenth time, this is not a simple 6-game sample size.

- We were national title contenders in 23/24 when O-Max left, we did nothing to add around the margins.

- Kolek wanted to come back for 24/25 but had guarantees from the NBA, despite our significant offer. It happens. But then we again do nothing to improve, no point guard depth, and our team craters from new year's on cause Kam's 99% usage rate was unsustainable. We flame out pathetically.

- Now we enter 25/26 with CLEAR issues and again do absolutely nothing. And look like the worst team in the Big East: with no obvious reinforcements to make us any better next season.

So yeah, I'm fucking pissed. Pissed that we didn't maximize our title window, do right by Kam, Stevie, Jop, and reload in the slightest when it was clear to the village idiot that this season was gonna be an uphill climb.

Lol. Yes, because I know the history of Marquette basketball, the history of college basketball, and the landscape of college basketball I think little of Marquette. Everything about MU's basketball history says a first round loss as a 7 seed is embarrassing, you are right. Especially following a Big East regular season and Tournament title and 2 seed, and then a Sweet 16 as a 2 seed.

There's a difference between high expectations and unreasonable expectations. Shaka has failed to build a competitive roster this season. He'll have to figure it out going into next season.

Go ask Jop, Stevie, and Kam if Shaka "did right" by them. I've never heard any of them speak anything but with the highest of praise for Shaka.

But you're pissed!

I'll repeat. The response to the first bumpy season in Shaka's 5 years here has been bonkers.

[onepost]

Lol. Yes, because I know the history of Marquette basketball, the history of college basketball, and the landscape of college basketball I think little of Marquette. Everything about MU's basketball history says a first round loss as a 7 seed is embarrassing, you are right. Especially following a Big East regular season and Tournament title and 2 seed, and then a Sweet 16 as a 2 seed.

There's a difference between high expectations and unreasonable expectations. Shaka has failed to build a competitive roster this season. He'll have to figure it out going into next season.

Go ask Jop, Stevie, and Kam if Shaka "did right" by them. I've never heard any of them speak anything but with the highest of praise for Shaka.

But you're pissed!

I'll repeat. The response to the first bumpy season in Shaka's 5 years here has been bonkers.

You're being obtuse to deflect from the very obvious, and frustrating, shortcomings. That's fine, but I certainly won't apologize for having these reasonable expectations and being critical when our coach is purposefully trotting out a worse team than he can, year after year, out of principle.

[wadesworld]

You're being obtuse to deflect   from the very obvious, and frustrating, shortcomings. That's fine, but I certainly won't apologize for having these reasonable expectations and being critical when our coach is purposefully trotting out a worse team than he can, year after year, out of principle.

Yes. The guy wants to put a losing product on the floor. We got to the real point now.   

[onepost]

Yes. The guy wants to put a losing product on the floor. We got to the real point now.   

The guy isn't utilizing a fraction of the resources he can because he's doubling down on being "the smartest guy in the room" ***, yes

[#UnleashNigel]

Realistically the lack of development in 1 senior, 1 junior, and a devastating injury to another junior is why this team is bad right now.

Sometimes you hit on a recruit, other times you get one that make me scream their names in frustration.

[DoctorV]

After reading this thread one thing is certain

Either scoop has a lot of retirees, or a lot of folks that post while they should be working, or both 

[MU82]

You should call some HR departments and do some ratting. That's been a winning play on Scoop for years.

[MuggsyB]

Realistically the lack of development in 1 senior, 1 junior, and a devastating injury to another junior is why this team is bad right now.

Sometimes you hit on a recruit, other times you get one that make me scream their names in frustration.

I think it's a more nuanced discussion and not relegated to Ben & Sean.  It's not about technically being better after 1,2, or 3 seasons.  It's more about whether they become consistent starters on a top 30 team in the country or a NCAA tournament team.  And whether their roles become defined after a full season. 

Chase has gotten better for sure, but he's also primarily played off the ball until this season.  He still struggles creating and shooting off the bounce in the half-court.  And by now he should absolutely have that skill-set.  We also don't know what he would have looked like as a #1 last year. .

Ben has certainly gotten better but he's also wildly inconsistent/streaky.  Yesterday he had a horrific 1st half, but then came alive for the critical stretches in the 2H.  And on both ends of the floor.  That's not good enough and it's somewhat inexplicable.  He also still doesn't use his height inside or look comfortable anywhere near the rim.  Again, not good enough at a program like MU.

Zaide has progressed more than Tre but both are nowhere near where I think Shaka and all of us thought they would be.  Sean has had tough luck but his shot is flat and exactly the same as we saw his Frosh year.  Makes no sense to me.

As for Royce, DO, and Caedin?  I'm beyond dumbfounded with what they've shown us in 6 games.  We have absolutely no idea what we're going to get from this trio. 

Furthermore, and I stated this last night, our rudimentary fundamentals leave a lot to be desired.  And I honestly don't get it from our returning players.  In our three losses, for major stretches, we looked completely lost out there with zero continuity, discipline, intensity, chemistry, poise, or intelligence.  This is a sad fact.

Shaka and our entire roster should be enraged and embarassed, as I know we all are here.  It's on Shaka to figure it out and make some adjustments.  I don't question the effort but we have no identity or confidence on the floor.  I know we have a lot of issues, but do not tell me we're as bad as we've seen.  It's time to man up and ball.

[Superfan]

The fan base, myself included, is really frustrated because this team has very little talent and is currently poorly coached.  Some players we thought would be good have shown no development and have been here for multiple years. I personally think Shaka is going to be forced into using the portal next year. For one, I think, and hope, that a few of our upperclassman will look elsewhere next year and open up some roster spots. What's going to force him to make the move will be a dwindling fan base, a lot fewer tickets sales next year, and playing in front of an unenthusiastic and unfilled arena.

[MuggsyB]

The fan base, myself included, is really frustrated because this team has very little talent and is currently poorly coached.  Some players we thought would be good have shown no development and have been here for multiple years. I personally think Shaka is going to be forced into using the portal next year. For one, I think, and hope, that a few of our upperclassman will look elsewhere next year and open up some roster spots. What's going to force him to make the move will be a dwindling fan base, a lot fewer tickets sales next year, and playing in front of an unenthusiastic and unfilled arena.

I don't think we have any schollies.  So guys would have to announce they're leaving soon after the season. 

[Markusquette]

To echo Muggsy- there's no alpha energy on this team. Not at least exhibited by some of the upperclassmen who you'd expect that from. Seems like Nigel James has more of a 'fearless' mentality than anyone, despite being a Freshman.

No player possesses the same level of intensity or cocky bravado that we got from Kolek and Jones. Chase has been very solid statistically but I think it's more by default. His personality seems very low key, better suited as a Robin to another guy's Batman.

Additionally, O-Max and Stevie were the all-out hustle guys who teammates could really feed off during Shaka's first 4 years. I'm not seeing that core piece yet either. Maybe Stevens someday?

So I think it's harder looking forward when we aren't seeing that same level of natural progression with the current 2nd and 3rd year players. For years it felt like we knew who was ready to take over and lead. Now there's some bigger question marks for the foreseeable future.

[MarquetteMike1977]

To echo Muggsy- there's no alpha energy on this team. Not at least exhibited by some of the upperclassmen who you'd expect that from. Seems like Nigel James has more of a 'fearless' mentality than anyone, despite being a Freshman.

No player possesses the same level of intensity or cocky bravado that we got from Kolek and Jones. Chase has been very solid statistically but I think it's more by default. His personality seems very low key, better suited as a Robin to another guy's Batman.

Additionally, O-Max and Stevie were the all-out hustle guys who teammates could really feed off during Shaka's first 4 years. I'm not seeing that core piece yet either. Maybe Stevens someday?

So I think it's harder looking forward when we aren't seeing that same level of natural progression with the current 2nd and 3rd year players. For years it felt like we knew who was ready to take over and lead. Now there's some bigger question marks for the foreseeable future.

Agree yes maybe Stevens someday

[1SE]