One Major Issue

[nyg]

Not a portal discussion.

Last year's team was exciting and I thought the loss to NCST was devastating and much more hurt than this year.  Yes, the team shot 4 for 31 from three and well, that's just MU's offense.  But, that team was beat up with injuries in the NCAAT and the only ones off the bench for the last two games were Ross and Gold. That brings me to the major issue. Shaka's recruiting class of Norman, Lowery, Amadou and Hamilton (red shirt).

In the last two NCAAT games last year, Norman,Lowery and Amadou did not even play a minute. All with MU being beat up and in foul trouble.  They had been at MU for year and a half with the team and yet Shaka showed no confidence of playing them.

This year comes around and during the course of the year, their performances were beyond underwhelming.

Norman: Probably the worst shooting guard in the BE. Two years at 19% from three and 50% from the free throw line. Thats not going to work in Shaka's offense of three ball.  At one point in the year, he had almost the same amount of fouls as he did points.  Shaka put him in for Mitchell after the four minute mark, played like three minutes and mostly sat after that.

Lowery: He didn't get much time all year until the end.  In two years, I believe he scored in double digits twice.  He has a big upside and should play a big role next year, but was he under utilized this year?

Amadou:  No clue, hardly played last year, redshirted this year.

Hamilton: Project this year and didn't show anything except a good passer of the ball. Remember Kam saying Hamilton going to be a problem?  How did that work out.


So, the issue again is this class of four did not turn out to be very good.  The only one who provided anything was Lowery, mainly later on in the season and did in fact help the team.  Norman would get in the game before Lowery. This class was to help MU's bench play and it did not work out.  One player was good, three were terrible, having Shaka to turn to the freshmen, Parham and Owens.  Parham was ok and Owens is a stud in the making, just now now.  Add it all up and no one from that class was really a force, great six man off the bench, providing scoring. Missing out on this class hurt the team.  I am glad freshman Parham helped out.  Shaka preaches the growth, development theme, but maybe I am wrong, but this class consisting of four players, with exception of Lowery at the end, didn't grow and develop.

[BCHoopster]

Your points are right on.  Parham showed today he is not a very good defender. But should we blame him or the coaching how to defend the pick and roll.  To many layups off that set, even Ben defending 30 feet from the basket is confusing. Both Parham and Gold are not centers physically and 8 months are really going to change that? The sophomore class was not very good nor was the junior class.  Ross can not finish his drives, and his outside shot was sporadic. Shaka knows the issues, can he fix it with development, not next year

[Hards Alumni]

In the last two NCAAT games last year, Norman,Lowery and Amadou did not even play a minute. All with MU being beat up and in foul trouble.  They had been at MU for year and a half with the team and yet Shaka showed no confidence of playing them.

They were freshman?  What kind of nonsense argument is this?

[joparks]

They were freshman?  What kind of nonsense argument is this?

Freshman aren't expected to contribute? 

[#UnleashSean]

You labeled a guy who's a redshirt.

[BCHoopster]

Freshman aren't expected to contribute? 

They better next year!

[Hards Alumni]

Freshman aren't expected to contribute? 

I'd love to respond to you, but I am not sure you can understand more than rudimentary English.

I've seen some really dumb crap on this board, but this literally takes the cake.

[MUJunkie]

Yea if you're going to go all in on the high school recruiting (non transfer portal) route, then you better actually be able to recruit well. It's been somewhat of a bust so far but hoping we can start landing some top 50 players.

[PointWarrior]

Freshman aren't expected to contribute? 

The CoS believes no freshman can ever be expected to contribute meaningful minutes.

[panda2.0]

They were freshman?  What kind of nonsense argument is this?

Very relevant with the way Shaka supposedly wants to run his program, especially this year. Freshman need to contribute if he won't entertain the idea of transfers.

[willie warrior]

They better next year!

They will have to.

[joparks]

I'd love to respond to you, but I am not sure you can understand more than rudimentary English.

I've seen some really dumb crap on this board, but this literally takes the cake.

Hey moron, perhaps take a little lesson from yourself in terms of understanding English.  The previous post, that you responded to mentioned the Freshmen not getting any PT down the stretch of last season, to which you responded they were Freshmen?  So, not sure if that was an excuse you were providing for why they weren't playing (that They didn't play because they were Freshmen) or if with the question mark, you were questioning if Lowery and Norman were actually Freshman in 23-24 - they were. 

Either way, throughout this tournament, we have seen Freshmen players contribute for other teams so they do contribute and thus, there can be an expectation that they will if they see the floor.  Just dismissing their lack of PT because they were Freshmen is idiotic and assumes that even if they were better than upperclassmen, they shouldn't get more PT than them. The point being previously made is that players need PT to develop and our guys weren't getting any at the very end of last season which may potentially have slowed their development into this season. Now, for perspective, the roster was different last season and these two got a lot more PT down the stretch of last season as Freshmen because Kolek was out the last few games of the season and the whole BET.  When Kolek came back in the tourney, he played because he was our best player. The point I'm making is if Freshmen see the floor, they are expected to contribute and chaining them to the bench simply because they are Freshmen is a dumb play.  Now if they are on the bench because they are not better than the starter, then that's a reasonable take but not something that can be assumed in all cases as there are several Freshmen making contributions to their teams throughout this tournament.

On the other hand, if you were questioning the accuracy of whether Lowery and Norman were Freshmen last season with the question mark, then you weren't aware of the roster which in turn is your problem, not mine.

Maybe perhaps provide a little clarity to your point rather than going all high hat by claiming to not even dignify a response when you are questioned next time.

Just because you live on this board doesn't mean you can't be questioned or called out by the peons who drop in from time to time.

[muwarrior69]

They were freshman?  What kind of nonsense argument is this?

Cooper Flag is a freshman. No?

[Hards Alumni]

Cooper Flag is a freshman. No?

Cooper Flag is a lottery pick.  None of our Freshman were or are.  Them playing in the tournament last year would not have changed that.

[Hards Alumni]

Hey moron, perhaps take a little lesson from yourself in terms of understanding English.  The previous post, that you responded to mentioned the Freshmen not getting any PT down the stretch of last season, to which you responded they were Freshmen?  So, not sure if that was an excuse you were providing for why they weren't playing (that They didn't play because they were Freshmen) or if with the question mark, you were questioning if Lowery and Norman were actually Freshman in 23-24 - they were. 

Either way, throughout this tournament, we have seen Freshmen players contribute for other teams so they do contribute and thus, there can be an expectation that they will if they see the floor.  Just dismissing their lack of PT because they were Freshmen is idiotic and assumes that even if they were better than upperclassmen, they shouldn't get more PT than them. The point being previously made is that players need PT to develop and our guys weren't getting any at the very end of last season which may potentially have slowed their development into this season. Now, for perspective, the roster was different last season and these two got a lot more PT down the stretch of last season as Freshmen because Kolek was out the last few games of the season and the whole BET.  When Kolek came back in the tourney, he played because he was our best player. The point I'm making is if Freshmen see the floor, they are expected to contribute and chaining them to the bench simply because they are Freshmen is a dumb play.  Now if they are on the bench because they are not better than the starter, then that's a reasonable take but not something that can be assumed in all cases as there are several Freshmen making contributions to their teams throughout this tournament.

On the other hand, if you were questioning the accuracy of whether Lowery and Norman were Freshmen last season with the question mark, then you weren't aware of the roster which in turn is your problem, not mine.

Maybe perhaps provide a little clarity to your point rather than going all high hat by claiming to not even dignify a response when you are questioned next time.

Just because you live on this board doesn't mean you can't be questioned or called out by the peons who drop in from time to time.

I'm going to trust the coach on which players should play.  Throwing Freshman out on the floor just to 'get them PT' is stupid.  The time for that is the non-conference or against the weaker conference teams.

I don't even know what argument you're trying to make.  "Play Freshman in the tournament, even if they haven't meaningfully contributed to the regular season, because it will somehow make them better players" is a really dumb take.  Even for this board.

[nyg]

They were freshman?  What kind of nonsense argument is this?

Hards, I honestly don't believe it was nonsense.  The four players arrived right out of high school and participated in summer workouts with the team.  Then they went through the entire season of 33 games, practicing and then getting minutes playing in those games.  Maybe we can disagree about the wording of "freshman" but after that long of a timeframe and through 33 games, a lot of analysts, etc. usually say they are over the freshman tenure at that point.  It was not like they had just arrived after high school.

Never stated throwing them out on the floor for PT, leave that for your argument with another poster.  My issue was players were underwhelming and Shaka had no confidence in them to play, even with a beat up, injured team using only two subs.  Then it continued into the last season as sophomores. 

[joparks]

I don't even know what argument you're trying to make.  "Play Freshman in the tournament, even if they haven't meaningfully contributed to the regular season, because it will somehow make them better players" is a really dumb take.  Even for this board.

Actually I wasn't making that point.  I was making the point that blindly saying they aren't playing because they were Freshmen is a spurious argument.  Some Freshmen can contribute but I also said that last year I understand why they didn't play much once we had Kolek back so in our case, no, I wouldn't have wanted to get them PT at the expense of Kolek considering that we needed all of his minutes to make the S16.

So in your case, instead of being a jackass to the original poster, perhaps saying "probably wouldn't have worked since the freshman would have been taking away meaningful minutes from Kolek" would have been better than being a dick about it.

[Hards Alumni]

Actually I wasn't making that point.  I was making the point that blindly saying they aren't playing because they were Freshmen is a spurious argument.  Some Freshmen can contribute but I also said that last year I understand why they didn't play much once we had Kolek back so in our case, no, I wouldn't have wanted to get them PT at the expense of Kolek considering that we needed all of his minutes to make the S16.

So in your case, instead of being a jackass to the original poster, perhaps saying "probably wouldn't have worked since the freshman would have been taking away meaningful minutes from Kolek" would have been better than being a dick about it.

So you did understand, you just wanted to be pedantic?  Sick, dude.