NCAA ball inflation

[TallTitan34]

I said "around here." I don't recall this being such an outrage on Scoop until Marquette shot poorly. Usually the Scoop collective blames the refs, but I guess this time its the balls.

You do realize it may have helped Marquette as well?  Colorado is a much better three point shooting team and couldn’t make anything in the first half against us.

This isn’t some conspiracy against only Marquette. It hurts all teams and makes for lower quality basketball.

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

At no point have I mentioned 4/31, nor do I find it at all central to the discussion at hand.

Whether it's Marquette, or Duke, or LSU, or whomever, going to one ball year-round across the sport would take the talking point away. The only reason you're debating it is because they haven't created an equipment standard. I don't blame a ball, or overinflation, or whatever. We had a crap game. But the mere existence of this talking point is stupid and something that could be pretty easily addressed.

And as the original debate began with a video posted before the tournament even started, it's clearly not a new issue.

The bolded is false. The equipment standard is laid out in the NCAA rulebook.

Section 16. The Ball

Art. 1. The ball shall be spherical. Spherical shall be defined as a round body
whose surface at all points is equidistant from the center, except at the approved
black rubber ribs (channels and/or seams).

Art. 2. The ball’s color shall be Pantone Matching System (PMS) Orange 151,
Red-Orange 173 or Brown 1535.

Art. 3. The cover of the ball shall be leather, or a composite material, and shall
consist of tiny raised protrusions densely spaced over the entire surface of each
panel so as to form a pebbled appearance.

Art. 4. The ball shall have the traditionally shaped eight panels, bonded tightly
to the rubber carcass. The eight panels are defined by two channels and/or seams
dissecting the ball’s circumference in opposite directions and two panels that,
when laid flat, shall have the shape of a figure eight.

Art. 5. The width of the black rubber rib (channels and/or seams) shall not
exceed 1/4 inch.

Art. 6. When dribbled vertically, without rotation, the ball shall return directly
to the dribbler’s hand. Small electronic chips/devices are permitted to be affixed
inside the ball as long as there is no perceptible effect on the ball when dribbled,
passed or shot.

Art. 7. The ball shall be inflated to an air pressure such that when it is dropped
to the playing surface from a height of 6 feet, measured to the bottom of the
ball, it will rebound to a height, measured to the top of the ball, of not less than
49 inches when it strikes its least resilient spot, nor more than 54 inches when it
strikes its most resilient spot. The air pressure that will give the required reaction
shall be stamped on the ball.

Art. 8. The circumference of the ball shall be within a maximum of 30 inches
and a minimum of 29½ inches.

Art. 9. The weight of the ball shall not be less than 20 ounces nor more than
22 ounces.

[rocky_warrior]

The bolded is false. The equipment standard is laid out in the NCAA rulebook.

Right...
https://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=66063.msg1648385#msg1648385

I know I was pretty sarcastic with my "common sense" reply earlier.  But common sense is the NCAA would love it if everyone used the same ball.  The member institutions instead wanted to make a more general specification for what the ball should be so that they could say they were compliant.  And that's common sense we're at.

From The Athletic on last year’s tournament:

“They need to take some air out of the ball. It’s too much and I think everyone’s shot has been off lately. "

Again...covered by the specifications.

Art. 7. The ball shall be inflated to an air pressure such that when it is dropped
to the playing surface from a height of 6 feet, measured to the bottom of the
ball, it will rebound to a height, measured to the top of the ball, of not less than
49 inches when it strikes its least resilient spot, nor more than 54 inches when it
strikes its most resilient spot. The air pressure that will give the required reaction
shall be stamped on the ball.

[TallTitan34]

I understand that’s what the standard says but just watching the games the ball appears extra bouncy.

Dribbles higher than normal, rebounds kicking out farther and faster. I think I saw more balls bounce over the backboard in the tournament than I did all season.

I know, I know, anecdotal tin-foil nonsense.

[cheebs09]

I doubt much changes as it all comes down to money. MU isn't changing from Nike and I'm sure the NCAA has a nice deal with Wilson to use the ball.

[Tyler COLEk]

The variation in ball performance during the most important games of the college basketball season is a (small) stain on the game. Get it fixed. This should be in the vested interest of every competitive program. I don't particularly care whether it's the NCAA, conferences, or schools themselves that need to act.

[brewcity77]

The bolded is false. The equipment standard is laid out in the NCAA rulebook.

No it's not. You've read enough of my posts and are just feigning ignorance. Everyone plays with the same ball. Period. That's what I mean, you know it, and you're trying to obfuscate.

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

No it's not. You've read enough of my posts and are just feigning ignorance. Everyone plays with the same ball. Period. That's what I mean, you know it, and you're trying to obfuscate.

You want them to play with the same brand of ball. That's not going to happen because the schools don't want it to happen.  Or they don't think its that big of a deal.

So I don't know why WE think its that big of a deal. There is zero evidence that it actually makes a difference anyway.

[MuggsyB]

You want them to play with the same brand of ball. That's not going to happen because the schools don't want it to happen.  Or they don't think its that big of a deal.

So I don't know why WE think its that big of a deal. There is zero evidence that it actually makes a difference anyway.

Why the hostility Fluffy?

[wiscwarrior]

As mentioned earlier, maybe it's as simple as having the tournament teams practice with the tournament ball during Madness and then only use balls in the game that have been used for a week in practice ala the NBA.

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

Why the hostility Fluffy?

What?

[MuggsyB]

What?

You seem angry.

[brewcity77]

You want them to play with the same brand of ball. That's not going to happen because the schools don't want it to happen.  Or they don't think its that big of a deal.

So I don't know why WE think its that big of a deal. There is zero evidence that it actually makes a difference anyway.

Which schools have come out to say they are so ardently against it? I assume you can support that with more than just your assumption that because they haven't pushed for it in the past it actually matters significantly to them? I've seen even less commentary from the schools regarding that than I have on the controversy (valid or not).

And there is just as much evidence that it doesn't matter than that it does. So unless you have the supporting evidence (and not just "well they didn't do it yet") there's really no argument against one official NCAA ball that I can see. Certainly none that has been cogently made here.

[MuggsyB]

Which schools have come out to say they are so ardently against it? I assume you can support that with more than just your assumption that because they haven't pushed for it in the past it actually matters significantly to them? I've seen even less commentary from the schools regarding that than I have on the controversy (valid or not).

And there is just as much evidence that it doesn't matter than that it does. So unless you have the supporting evidence (and not just "well they didn't do it yet") there's really no argument against one official NCAA ball that I can see. Certainly none that has been cogently made here.

I trust your expertise Brew. 

[wadesworld]

Schools play with the balls that they have sponsorships with. The answer is always money.

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

Schools play with the balls that they have sponsorships with. The answer is always money.

Bingo. If schools actually cared about this, they would simply use the NCAA ball. The fact that they don’t shows that it’s really not that big of a deal.

[forgetful]

Bingo. If schools actually cared about this, they would simply use the NCAA ball. The fact that they don’t shows that it’s really not that big of a deal.

NBA coaches used to try to manipulate the ball pressure to favor their style of play. NBA teams season game balls in practice (so they handle properly), then at a game inflate them to their desired pressure (between 7.5-8.5) that is validated by the officials. They do this, because it matters.

Coaches and players have complained about this ball every year it has been used in the NCAA tournament (since 2022).

When the NBA switched balls, Spalding to Wilson, they all took a while to adapt, and didn't like them at first. They outright protested the 2006 switch from a leather ball to a microfiber ball to the point that the NBA switched back. So saying the ball can't affect things defies what the actual professionals say.

Regarding the NCAA ball, Wilson does advertise that the technology of this ball makes it different.

"We recommend inflating the Evo NXT basketball to 7 PSI and the Evolution to 8 PSI for optimal performance."

Where to behave similar to the old balls, you should inflate them less. So if a tourney site inflates them all to 8 PSI as most other balls are, they will respond as if they are over-inflated even though they are within specs.

Wilson also says there is new technology that distributes the weight differently that affects shooting.

"The Evo NXT features Extended Range Tech. The super soft core allows for redistribution of the weight and balance of the ball, allowing players to shoot from longer range."

So according to Wilson, it is designed to affect shooting, so that when they adapt to it, it is easier to shoot from longer distances. It is reasonable to assume then, if you haven't adapted to it, you might overshoot at first (which has been seen).

So saying the ball can't affect things is naive. Not saying it is what caused the issues, but it would make a lot of sense to use the same ball everywhere, like all professional leagues do, so there is more consistent game play.

I wouldn't be shocked to see more teams switch to this ball when their contracts with other runs out. A lot of conference tournaments, and teams have already switched.

[MU82]

In that case, it's also common sense to play all the games in identical arenas.  Teams aren't allowed to have unique buildings.

Probably also common sense not to allow fans.  They lead to one team having an advantage over another.

And common sense for all players to have uniform heights and weights.  Wouldn't want any nonsense going on with someone having a physical advantage.

I'm probably missing some other "common sense" changes.

Well, that's all just silliness, but you're allowed.

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

NBA coaches used to try to manipulate the ball pressure to favor their style of play. NBA teams season game balls in practice (so they handle properly), then at a game inflate them to their desired pressure (between 7.5-8.5) that is validated by the officials. They do this, because it matters.

Coaches and players have complained about this ball every year it has been used in the NCAA tournament (since 2022).

When the NBA switched balls, Spalding to Wilson, they all took a while to adapt, and didn't like them at first. They outright protested the 2006 switch from a leather ball to a microfiber ball to the point that the NBA switched back. So saying the ball can't affect things defies what the actual professionals say.

Regarding the NCAA ball, Wilson does advertise that the technology of this ball makes it different.

"We recommend inflating the Evo NXT basketball to 7 PSI and the Evolution to 8 PSI for optimal performance."

Where to behave similar to the old balls, you should inflate them less. So if a tourney site inflates them all to 8 PSI as most other balls are, they will respond as if they are over-inflated even though they are within specs.

Wilson also says there is new technology that distributes the weight differently that affects shooting.

"The Evo NXT features Extended Range Tech. The super soft core allows for redistribution of the weight and balance of the ball, allowing players to shoot from longer range."

So according to Wilson, it is designed to affect shooting, so that when they adapt to it, it is easier to shoot from longer distances. It is reasonable to assume then, if you haven't adapted to it, you might overshoot at first (which has been seen).

So saying the ball can't affect things is naive. Not saying it is what caused the issues, but it would make a lot of sense to use the same ball everywhere, like all professional leagues do, so there is more consistent game play.

I wouldn't be shocked to see more teams switch to this ball when their contracts with other runs out. A lot of conference tournaments, and teams have already switched.

A lot of words to not really address what I said.