Good Teams Find Ways to Win

[MuggsyB]

That is all.  I thought we were at a C level at best.  Great to get a week off to work out some kinks before UCLA. 

[GB Warrior]

Hard fought game. Refs let everyone slug it out and MU rose to the challenge. Lots to clean up, but a lot more fun off a tough, tough win

[1SE]

Yep - not a statement of dominance but a road win against a ranked veteran team is worth its weight in gold.

[Herman Cain]

That is all.  I thought we were at a C level at best.  Great to get a week off to work out some kinks before UCLA.

Road win against a well coach team, with incredible size.  Love our intensity all game long.

[MuggsyB]

We do need Jop, Stevie, and Chase to find their games in Maui.  They're much better players than we saw tonight. 

[Herman Cain]

We do need Jop, Stevie, and Chase to find their games in Maui.  They're much better players than we saw tonight.

They played as hard as they could and had some moments when needed. The opponent had real talent. Shannon is Filthy and nothing but a team effort could stop him . Illini have size and hard to will your way to points against that , had to have TyKo doing his thing to have a chance and he did.

MU =Whole is Greater Than Sum of Parts Team.

[Goose]

IMO, this might end up being this years Baylor win. This win was based off of experience, poise and a will to win. This is the type of win that you build season on. Last year against Baylor they learned what they were capable of and tonight they learned that they can win in a tough environment with their C game.

Again, IMO, this game showed me how far a program has come in two years and three games. Big win for the program.

[JakeBarnes]

IMO, this might end up being this years Baylor win. This win was based off of experience, poise and a will to win. This is the type of win that you build season on. Last year against Baylor they learned what they were capable of and tonight they learned that they can win in a tough environment with their C game.

Again, IMO, this game showed me how far a program has come in two years and three games. Big win for the program.

Same. Lots of mental mistakes and some off nights for a few of our players and they still won. Also, Tyler is special.

[MuggsyB]

IMO, this might end up being this years Baylor win. This win was based off of experience, poise and a will to win. This is the type of win that you build season on. Last year against Baylor they learned what they were capable of and tonight they learned that they can win in a tough environment with their C game.

Again, IMO, this game showed me how far a program has come in two years and three games. Big win for the program.

Goose,
.
Having Tyko and Jones thr Elder in the backcourt is a solid security blanket.  But we all know we can step it up. 

[Goose]

Jake

Tyler Kolek will go down as one of the all time greats in program history. He was the key recruit in building this program and truly a joy to watch. I am 100% biased, but he is one of my all time favorite MU players and climbing the list on a regular basis.

[GB Warrior]

I have thoroughly enjoyed having a guy that every other program has loved to hate.

[Goose]

GB

I said two years ago that Kolek will become public enemy #1 and he has earned that badge. Best part, he is an assassin on top of being a villain.

[MuggsyB]

GB

I said two years ago that Kolek will become public enemy #1 and he has earned that badge. Best part, he is an assassin on top of being a villain.

Yes.  Being a public enemy and sucking like Flopison isn't particularly good for a program. 

[panda]

Illinois is going to drive their fans crazy this year. Two awesome shooters, an incredible slasher and Coleman Hawkins shooting as many deep threes as possible.

[RubyWiscy]

It is fun to hear the announcer ask, "How did he do that?" on plays by TKO and KJ.

[GB Warrior]

GB

I said two years ago that Kolek will become public enemy #1 and he has earned that badge. Best part, he is an assassin on top of being a villain.

I actually thought the broadcasts did not lean into his crap talking nearly enough. He has not yet had a nationally televised JP Macura moment

[Goose]

GB

Best part about Kolek is he does with his play. His attitude, engaging with the fans is a bonus. He cuts other teams heart out and they have no idea how it happened.

[pbiflyer]

Jake

Tyler Kolek will go down as one of the all time greats in program history. He was the key recruit in building this program and truly a joy to watch. I am 100% biased, but he is one of my all time favorite MU players and climbing the list on a regular basis.

This, a thousand times this!
(Not at all related, but I am now starting to call my son, who is named Travis, Tyler now. )

[warriorchick]

This, a thousand times this!
(Not at all related, but I am now starting to call my son, who is named Travis, Tyler now. )

Don't let Diener find out!

[Goose]

Pbi

I remember when people on here laughed about about comparisons with Diener. I will officially say, Travis Diener is no Tyler Kolek and this is coming from a guy that loved Diener. Different players, but I will say Kolek has an even higher ball IQ than Deiner and that is saying an awful lot.

[oilcan]

Goose you nailed it again. MU could have easily lost that game. If not for their determination tonight I would be wondering if Smart was going to win this game with Sean Jones. Nothing against Sean, but we all feel don't we that Tyler is special? And if he's not there involved in everything that's something's missing?  Everyone is fighting. I was impressed tonight. These players will play better than they did in this game. The ankle is good.

[JakeBarnes]

Jake

Tyler Kolek will go down as one of the all time greats in program history. He was the key recruit in building this program and truly a joy to watch. I am 100% biased, but he is one of my all time favorite MU players and climbing the list on a regular basis.

Yep. I agree wholly on this

Goose you nailed it again. MU could have easily lost that game. If not for their determination tonight I would be wondering if Smart was going to win this game with Sean Jones. Nothing against Sean, but we all feel don't we that Tyler is special? And if he's not there involved in everything that's something's missing?  Everyone is fighting. I was impressed tonight. These players will play better than they did in this game. The ankle is good.

This team is what we always wanted: a team better than it's parts. And the parts all seem to be pretty damn good.

[brewcity77]

GB

Best part about Kolek is he does with his play. His attitude, engaging with the fans is a bonus. He cuts other teams heart out and they have no idea how it happened.

Ever since that steal and layup the last time we saw Illinois, he's just grown more and more into himself. His attitude, game, and swagger is just a joy to watch.

[CAGASS24]

Kolek was the MAN but last four mins Kam and Oso delivered as well - good teams ….

[Dickthedribbler]

A true team win tonight. Led by our stars TK and Kam Jones. Everyone else contributed something at key points. Everyone worked hard. Impressive because you beat a top 25 team on the road by bringing something less than your "A" game. Good building block

My game ball, however, goes to Coach Smart.

[Lennys Tap]

Jake

Tyler Kolek will go down as one of the all time greats in program history. He was the key recruit in building this program and truly a joy to watch. I am 100% biased, but he is one of my all time favorite MU players and climbing the list on a regular basis.

Goose

Tyler was really good (A10 freshman of the year) when he got here, but his development since has been remarkable. Kudos to Shaka, mega kudos to Kolek.

[JakeBarnes]

A true team win tonight. Led by our stars TK and Kam Jones. Everyone else contributed something at key points. Everyone worked hard. Impressive because you beat a top 25 team on the road by bringing something less than your "A" game. Good building block

My game ball, however, goes to Coach Smart.

Yes. The lineups were something tonight. And really effective.

[Lennys Tap]

A true team win tonight.

I disagree. Kolek carried a lot of guys who were sub standard. Ross did nothing, Joplin less than that. Stevie really struggled, Gold was meh. Kam was very good for a half. Sean and Oso had moments but weren’t great.

But the effort, will and D were there. That’s why I loved this win. It showed me that we can beat good teams in hostile environments without anything close to our A game. Look out when we bring it!

[MuggsyB]

Nm

[JakeBarnes]

I disagree. Kolek carried a lot of guys who were sub standard. Ross did nothing, Joplin less than that. Stevie really struggled, Gold was meh. Kam was very good for a half. Sean and Oso had moments but weren’t great.

But the effort, will and D were there. That’s why I loved this win. It showed me that we can beat good teams in hostile environments without anything close to our A game. Look out when we bring it!

I know you mean on O. Stevie and Chase made sure you didn't hear much about TSJ today.

[Elonsmusk]

I disagree. Kolek carried a lot of guys who were sub standard. Ross did nothing, Joplin less than that. Stevie really struggled, Gold was meh. Kam was very good for a half. Sean and Oso had moments but weren’t great.

But the effort, will and D were there. That’s why I loved this win. It showed me that we can beat good teams in hostile environments without anything close to our A game. Look out when we bring it!

Very good analysis...spot on.

[Daniel]

I know you mean on O. Stevie and Chase made sure you didn't hear much about TSJ today.

And Ben had 7 rebounds and hit an important 3.  Jop had 5 rebounds  The offense was off tonight that’s all.  And we won!

[lake]

Defense was excellent all night. Kenpom gains reflecting that

[MUfan12]

The things that went wrong tonight weren't big foundational things. Some overhelping, a few poor closeouts. Botched transition opportunities. All stuff that can be easily called out and fixed. They got the shots they wanted and just missed more than usual. Made great decisions with the ball, only 8 turnovers.

Look at the difference between the Purdue game last year, and this game when Illinois' second half run happened. That's the progression, the maturity showing.

Yes, I think there's another level this team can hit. But this narrative that MU played poorly is kinda lazy. They were well prepared, and guarded like hell for most of that game. I'm very happy they could overcome a poor outside shooting night and win in a tough gym.

[Shooter McGavin]

They played as hard as they could and had some moments when needed. The opponent had real talent. Shannon is Filthy and nothing but a team effort could stop him . Illini have size and hard to will your way to points against that , had to have TyKo doing his thing to have a chance and he did.

MU =Whole is Greater Than Sum of Parts Team.

What????? You were trolling with your pre season picks.  You sly dog.  Love the enthusiasm Herm. 

[WellsstreetWanderer]

The guys “who did nothing” left it all on the court in the defensive end

[Shooter McGavin]

Pbi

I remember when people on here laughed about about comparisons with Diener. I will officially say, Travis Diener is no Tyler Kolek and this is coming from a guy that loved Diener. Different players, but I will say Kolek has an even higher ball IQ than Deiner and that is saying an awful lot.

People laughed at comparisons to NBA points guards too and that may come back as short sighted as well. 

[BM1090]

The things that went wrong tonight weren't big foundational things. Some overhelping, a few poor closeouts. Botched transition opportunities. All stuff that can be easily called out and fixed. They got the shots they wanted and just missed more than usual. Made great decisions with the ball, only 8 turnovers.

Look at the difference between the Purdue game last year, and this game when Illinois' second half run happened. That's the progression, the maturity showing.

Yes, I think there's another level this team can hit. But this narrative that MU played poorly is kinda lazy. They were well prepared, and guarded like hell for most of that game. I'm very happy they could overcome a poor outside shooting night and win in a tough gym.

I think this is accurate. I’ve been saying they didn’t play great but it’s more accurate to say they didn’t finish well or shoot well. The rest was pretty damn good.

[HutchwasClutch]

I disagree. Kolek carried a lot of guys who were sub standard. Ross did nothing, Joplin less than that. Stevie really struggled, Gold was meh. Kam was very good for a half. Sean and Oso had moments but weren’t great.

But the effort, will and D were there. That’s why I loved this win. It showed me that we can beat good teams in hostile environments without anything close to our A game. Look out when we bring it!

The difference tonight is we had the best player on the floor who was dominant in stretches. 

[MU82]

Pbi

I remember when people on here laughed about about comparisons with Diener. I will officially say, Travis Diener is no Tyler Kolek and this is coming from a guy that loved Diener. Different players, but I will say Kolek has an even higher ball IQ than Deiner and that is saying an awful lot.

Lots of those comparisons were made in the first month of last season. And at that time, Diener simply had the better body of work ... and it really wasn't particularly close.

Obviously, I agree with you that Kolek has surpassed Diener now. I mean, BEast POY and All-American - Tyler's just a stud. He was so good tonight.

But there's even a little asterisk in Kolek surpassing Diener ...

Tyler carried us into the second weekend of the 2003 NCAA tournament. Wade was terrible in the opener and we'd have lost to Holy Cross if Diener hadn't been incredible; and we needed another huge performance from Diener to beat Mizzou in the next game. No incredible Diener, no run to the Final Four. Period.

Unfortunately, injury kept Kolek from being at his best in the NCAAT last March. Hopefully, Tyler will be healthy this time around and will be able to match - or better yet, beat - that part of Diener's legacy.

But yes, looking only at regular-season play, Kolek's the man. Hard to deny that.

[1SE]

Lots of those comparisons were made in the first month of last season. And at that time, Diener simply had the better body of work ... and it really wasn't particularly close.

Obviously, I agree with you that Kolek has surpassed Diener now. I mean, BEast POY and All-American - Tyler's just a stud. He was so good tonight.

But there's even a little asterisk in Kolek surpassing Diener ...

Tyler carried us into the second weekend of the 2003 NCAA tournament. Wade was terrible in the opener and we'd have lost to Holy Cross if Diener hadn't been incredible; and we needed another huge performance from Diener to beat Mizzou in the next game. No incredible Diener, no run to the Final Four. Period.

Unfortunately, injury kept Kolek from being at his best in the NCAAT last March. Hopefully, Tyler will be healthy this time around and will be able to match - or better yet, beat - that part of Diener's legacy.

But yes, looking only at regular-season play, Kolek's the man. Hard to deny that.

Yes, to achieve MU legend status there must be March success. Just look at Markus.

[Dr. Blackheart]

Yes, to achieve MU legend status there must be March success. Just look at Markus.

Ides of March, hey?

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Turns out Diener is a poor man's Kolek. And I Fing love Diener.

[Lennys Tap]

I know you mean on O. Stevie and Chase made sure you didn't hear much about TSJ today.

Correct

[Jockey]

Jake

Tyler Kolek will go down as one of the all time greats in program history. He was the key recruit in building this program and truly a joy to watch. I am 100% biased, but he is one of my all time favorite MU players and climbing the list on a regular basis.

Tyler reminded me of a guy tonight that was kinda unexpected.

I saw it on his many drives to the hoop where he almost always takes the extra dribble(s) to get to the basket. Sam Worthen built his game around doing that. So, two guys who don’t look like similar players but use the same type of move an awful lot.

[tower912]

After the Illinois game two years ago, I said he reminded me of Brunson.

[Goose]

Jockey

Very interesting take on Kolek and Worthen. I agree completely that both guys have the same signature move around the basket. Keeping the ball alive creates opportunities and Kolek is a master of using that extra dribble or two to keep the play alive.

[avid1010]

Pbi

I remember when people on here laughed about about comparisons with Diener. I will officially say, Travis Diener is no Tyler Kolek and this is coming from a guy that loved Diener. Different players, but I will say Kolek has an even higher ball IQ than Deiner and that is saying an awful lot.

I'll never say it...but I don't disagree.  The growth I believe I'm seeing Kam and Tyler make YOY is amazing to me.  I thought they were close to their ceiling... 

Sean impressing me more than expected.

Chase I don't worry about.

Consistency from Stevie and Jop would really benefit this team.

Appreciated Gold hitting the glass a little better than I had seen so far this year.

ABSOLUTELY love this TEAM. 

[Shooter McGavin]

The lineups with Gold and Oso will be more often going forward if Joplin doesn’t play more within himself.  Golds length makes up for the loss of it with Omax gone more than it does with Joplin and his lack of athleticism.  Gold guarded well/better in space as well last night.

Not giving up on Joplin.  Once he learns a good opportunity from a bad one and plays within himself he will be great for this team.  Needs to get the old man game going.  Be crafty instead of trying to dunk.  Kam had to find his groove early last year if people remember and once he did was incredible.  Starting is different than coming off the bench.  He’ll find his groove. In the meantime Gold is ready to contribute.

[tower912]

Joplin is now near the top of the scout.   His release is still slow.    Illinois did not help off him.   He would catch the ball and not have room to get his shot off.   He attempted to create his own shot a few times without success.

Joplin will get his against teams that help to take away the drives of Kolek or Kam.    Illinois was not that team.

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

Pbi

I remember when people on here laughed about about comparisons with Diener. I will officially say, Travis Diener is no Tyler Kolek and this is coming from a guy that loved Diener. Different players, but I will say Kolek has an even higher ball IQ than Deiner and that is saying an awful lot.

Tyler Kolek is the best Marquette player since Wade. And I don't think its particularly close.

[Goose]

Fluff

I agree 100%. He is climbing the ladder of all time greats quickly. He needs some big wins in the NCAA to move into the top tier of all time players and hopefully that is coming. While Shaka is a perfect fit for MU, Kolek found the perfect coach in Shaka.

[The Lens]

Let’s not forget that the first Travis comp was when Tyler committed but before he signed (so Shaka couldn’t comment), Shaka tweeted out a Travis highlight video.

It was the foundation of which this era has been built: accountability.

Lots of coaches: deflections matter
Shaka: 32 is our goal, track with us

Lots of coaches: player will be good
Shaka: he’ll be as good as an NBA point who helped you to a FF

It all starts at the top.

[Dr. Blackheart]

Joplin is now near the top of the scout.   His release is still slow.    Illinois did not help off him.   He would catch the ball and not have room to get his shot off.   He attempted to create his own shot a few times without success.

Joplin will get his against teams that help to take away the drives of Kolek or Kam.    Illinois was not that team.

Yes. Illinois is not a switching team. A lot of 1-1 as a result which benefited Tyler and Oso. Kam adjusted after halftime.

Jop needs to become a lot more consistent. A tough game, tough matchup for him but as Shaka said post game, those who didn't contribute offensively, did defensively and in other ways. Five boards for the Jop

[Shooter McGavin]

Joplin is now near the top of the scout.   His release is still slow.    Illinois did not help off him.   He would catch the ball and not have room to get his shot off.   He attempted to create his own shot a few times without success.

Joplin will get his against teams that help to take away the drives of Kolek or Kam.    Illinois was not that team.

All true.  He was blanketed last night.  Definitely not giving up on Joplin.  Shaka stuck with him for a reason during stretches he looked really bad.  He’s a huge piece for this team.  He’ll have to find a way to work around the scout if teams continue to play him the same way.  Just glad we have other options like Gold playing with Oso against longer more athletic teams like Illinois. 

[MuggsyB]

We definitely need Jop.   He doesn't need to force with the vertical dribble when it'd not there and sometimes I think both he and Oso need to slow things down when there is an opening.  I fully expect Jop, Stevie, and Chase to find their offensive rhythm. 

[StillAWarrior]

Like everyone else, I was disappointed in how several players "finished" last night, but I saw so much that makes me really excited for this team.

• They were aggressively driving to the basket
• They had a ton of good, open looks
• They took very few bad shots
• Overall, the did a really good job helping on defense -- there were a number of times someone on Illinois would be in position that I thought they would drive, but help came and stopped them
• Obviously, Kolek is a stud*
• Gold was aggressive on the boards and grabbed the ball with strength

The things that made me excited for this team overwhelmingly exceeded the things that didn't go well in my mind. I think Jop will be fine. He's really talented and just had a rough night. Hopefully they'll improve their rotations to better defend beyond the three-point line. I think Illinois defended the three point line really well; our shooters will be fine.

*After the Rider game, I commented that Kolek's stats (6-5-6 with one TO) looked more Kolek-like than in the NIU game. I commented that he hadn't scored much, but that he didn't need to and that he had shown he can put the team on his back and score when needed. Just a few days later...

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Only 7 assists last night.  Lots of players creating points for themselves.  Very against our normal mo. But we won.  As Muggsy says,  good teams find a way to win

[goldeneagle91114]

Only 7 assists last night.  Lots of players creating points for themselves.  Very against our normal mo. But we won.  As Muggsy says,  good teams find a way to win

Also feel this is a reflection of the number of open shots we missed.

[Viper]

We do need Jop, Stevie, and Chase to find their games in Maui.  They're much better players than we saw tonight.

yes, especially Jop

[MU82]

Joplin had plenty of bad games last season, but he responded with good ones. The great thing is this team has the depth to mitigate many difficult situations.

[Elonsmusk]

After the Illinois game two years ago, I said he reminded me of Brunson.

One of your best posts and comparisons.  You were early on the comp at a time when it was unclear to most that Tyler had a lot of talent.