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Author Topic: EV's  (Read 13220 times)

Uncle Rico

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Re: EV's
« Reply #50 on: February 23, 2023, 12:45:05 PM »
We do it all the time with lawnmowers, snowblowers, drills, etc.     When we had this converation 5-6 years ago, I said the future of EV's was a battery back that would be on a charger at the Shell/Marathon/BP/Speedway.    Pop out your suitcase sized battery back, put it on the charger for the next guy, grab a charged one off of their rack, pay them $20 and go drive for another 250 miles.      Technology has evolved in a different direction, so that prediction may not pan out.   
    Now I see the battery technology evolving to the point that 500 miles (in warm weather) is the norm.    And recharge for another 500 miles is 30 minutes on a high speed charger.   But that is 10-15 years out.     

Long-term planning and investing in that technology 😬
Tis a shame, 'tis a rotton shame, for if ye can enjoy the walkin’ ye can probably enjoy the other times in yer life when ve're in between. And that's most o' the time; wouldn't ye say?

jficke13

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Re: EV's
« Reply #51 on: February 23, 2023, 02:20:32 PM »
The environmental "cost" of resource extraction is subject to weird analytical biases. Don't have the materials at hand, but it was something like we extract 15 billion tons of fossil fuels/year, and the ramped up target for rare earth extraction is 150 million tons/year. Rare earth extraction is not a zero cost endeavor, but it's significantly lower cost than recurrent fossil fuel extraction.

Anyone who says the EV transition is going to be free of environmental impact is lying. But anyone who says it's equivalent to maintaining ICE use is also lying.

IMHO, the tradeoffs are, generally speaking, worth it.

rocket surgeon

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Re: EV's
« Reply #52 on: February 23, 2023, 02:48:50 PM »
if this is the cost of transitioning to EV, then i want no part of it.  if this going on with other aspects of our economical development and/or technological advancements, something needs to stop.  does this mean i am throwing out my cell phone? let's be real and any reasonably thinking person knows what i mean here.  if we are to continue our evolution of the EV, is it too much to ask that children aren't exploited as such?

https://chrissmith.house.gov/news/documentsingle.aspx?DocumentID=410044
don't...don't don't don't don't

panda

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Re: EV's
« Reply #53 on: February 23, 2023, 03:02:52 PM »
Anyone go hybrid ? I could see myself using gas for longer trips and flipping over to electric for driving around the hood/running errands.

dgies9156

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Re: EV's
« Reply #54 on: February 23, 2023, 03:37:41 PM »
We do it all the time with lawnmowers, snowblowers, drills, etc.     When we had this converation 5-6 years ago, I said the future of EV's was a battery back that would be on a charger at the Shell/Marathon/BP/Speedway.    Pop out your suitcase sized battery back, put it on the charger for the next guy, grab a charged one off of their rack, pay them $20 and go drive for another 250 miles.      Technology has evolved in a different direction, so that prediction may not pan out.   
    Now I see the battery technology evolving to the point that 500 miles (in warm weather) is the norm.    And recharge for another 500 miles is 30 minutes on a high speed charger.   But that is 10-15 years out.     

Brother Tower

The problem with portable batteries is that most electric cars are a passenger compartment wrapped around batteries with an electric motor. Unless battery technology evolves dramatically in the next decade, the chance that we're going to have anything more than incremental growth from today is modest. I'd like to think we're going to get there as the positives of driving a high-powered Tesla are substantial. I really liked the car. I just didn't like the slow recharge.

I'm hopeful but I think for the near term, I'll have at least one internal combustion engine powered automobile.

tower912

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Re: EV's
« Reply #55 on: February 23, 2023, 03:44:44 PM »
Brother Dgies, I am not trying to turn this into a scoop argument.    I want people to talk about their experience and about their needs.   For me, I think the questions, range issues, cold issues, charging issues are still too much for me the trigger on this generation of EV's. I can definitely see a hybrid, however.     

But I want guys to keep sharing.    Without anger or vitriol.    Because, eventually, EV's are going to be the norm.       
Luke 6:45   ...A good man produces goodness from the good in his heart; an evil man produces evil out of his store of evil.   Each man speaks from his heart's abundance...

It is better to be fearless and cheerful than cheerless and fearful.

🏀

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Re: EV's
« Reply #56 on: February 23, 2023, 04:38:53 PM »
Infrastructure is drastically underfunded, so you want to fund it less?

jesmu84

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Re: EV's
« Reply #57 on: February 23, 2023, 04:55:52 PM »
My old car had the battery in a side compartment in the truck.  I replaced it fairly easily and I'm not a gearhead and it wasn't some dangerous high voltage endeavor.  And that was just a standard old school car battery.  Swappable batteries are the future and they will be handled by civilians, not sure why that is such an absurd thought, other than mocking the poster for previous claims.

I'm fairly certain there's a difference in the 12v battery you describe and the high voltage battery in EV currently.

I might be wrong though

jesmu84

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Re: EV's
« Reply #58 on: February 23, 2023, 05:00:22 PM »
1) Yes and I see where we are versus where we've been and am generally pleased.

2) Wrong. I sat there in my Tesla Y while the damn thing charged up to 98 percent. I'll admit it was a cold night in Chicago, but that's real world. It also was pretty new!

1. Good

2. Still wrong on the duration of charging from Libertyville to South Florida. Right now, today, even despite cold temps in the Midwest, it would take me 3 hours of charging from Libertyville to Miami.

Teslas are actually fantastic road trippers with high speed charging, plug and go charging, battery preconditioning and numerous supercharger locations

jesmu84

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Re: EV's
« Reply #59 on: February 23, 2023, 05:01:11 PM »
Anyone go hybrid ? I could see myself using gas for longer trips and flipping over to electric for driving around the hood/running errands.

PHEVs are good compromises and probably better for most people/the general public.

jesmu84

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Re: EV's
« Reply #60 on: February 23, 2023, 05:02:47 PM »
EVs are currently a "new" technology. So early in their infancy that there are MANY pitfalls to owning/using one. Especially when it comes to road trips.

Unless you're the type to dive deeply into something, I would tell anyone to hold off on a purchase until more established.

jesmu84

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Re: EV's
« Reply #61 on: February 23, 2023, 05:05:11 PM »
We do it all the time with lawnmowers, snowblowers, drills, etc.     When we had this converation 5-6 years ago, I said the future of EV's was a battery back that would be on a charger at the Shell/Marathon/BP/Speedway.    Pop out your suitcase sized battery back, put it on the charger for the next guy, grab a charged one off of their rack, pay them $20 and go drive for another 250 miles.      Technology has evolved in a different direction, so that prediction may not pan out.   
    Now I see the battery technology evolving to the point that 500 miles (in warm weather) is the norm.    And recharge for another 500 miles is 30 minutes on a high speed charger.   But that is 10-15 years out.     

IMO, the only way this happens is if batteries become standardized across all vehicles/manufacturers. But that's going to be nearly impossible. Especially with different sized vehicles with different sized batteries

Otherwise you're going to be relying on individual companies to build their own swapping infrastructure.

In either scenario, you're probably looking at a situation where you buy/lease the vehicle and have another buy/lease agreement on the battery.

Could happen. Very complex.

MU Fan in Connecticut

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Re: EV's
« Reply #62 on: February 24, 2023, 07:37:35 AM »
I have an electric leaf blower.  I love it.  It works as good as gas, it's lighter and it's incredibly quiet for a leaf blower.  The only negative is the charge only lasts 30 minutes which is enough to clean up after I finish mowing.  I do need a backup battery.

MU Fan in Connecticut

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Re: EV's
« Reply #63 on: February 24, 2023, 07:38:21 AM »

The Latest EV Battery Announcements and Investments
Feb. 24, 2023
A look into the billions of dollars being invested in new battery plants and expansions in recent years.

https://www.industryweek.com/leadership/media-gallery/21260159/the-latest-ev-battery-announcements-and-investments?utm_source=IY+IW+Daily+Headlines+-+Morning&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=CPS230223197&o_eid=2702C8228856C0V&rdx.ident[pull]=omeda|2702C8228856C0V&oly_enc_id=2702C8228856C0V&id=21260159&slide=1

The Sultan of Semantics

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Re: EV's
« Reply #64 on: February 24, 2023, 07:48:32 AM »
I have an electric leaf blower.  I love it.  It works as good as gas, it's lighter and it's incredibly quiet for a leaf blower.  The only negative is the charge only lasts 30 minutes which is enough to clean up after I finish mowing.  I do need a backup battery.


I have an electric mower, blower, string trimmer and hedge trimmer.  The only issue I have is that I went cheap on the back up battery for the mower so sometimes it runs out when I am maddeningly close to being complete.  But I trim, clean up, and by the time that's done the battery is charged up enough.
“True patriotism hates injustice in its own land more than anywhere else.” - Clarence Darrow

Uncle Rico

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Re: EV's
« Reply #65 on: February 24, 2023, 07:56:43 AM »

I have an electric mower, blower, string trimmer and hedge trimmer.  The only issue I have is that I went cheap on the back up battery for the mower so sometimes it runs out when I am maddeningly close to being complete.  But I trim, clean up, and by the time that's done the battery is charged up enough.

Cool story, comrade
Tis a shame, 'tis a rotton shame, for if ye can enjoy the walkin’ ye can probably enjoy the other times in yer life when ve're in between. And that's most o' the time; wouldn't ye say?

The Sultan of Semantics

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Re: EV's
« Reply #66 on: February 24, 2023, 07:58:16 AM »
Cool story, comrade


Hey at least I have two gas guzzling automobiles to make up for it.
“True patriotism hates injustice in its own land more than anywhere else.” - Clarence Darrow

Uncle Rico

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Re: EV's
« Reply #67 on: February 24, 2023, 08:18:24 AM »

Hey at least I have two gas guzzling automobiles to make up for it.

Thank you, patriot
Tis a shame, 'tis a rotton shame, for if ye can enjoy the walkin’ ye can probably enjoy the other times in yer life when ve're in between. And that's most o' the time; wouldn't ye say?

LloydsLegs

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Re: EV's
« Reply #68 on: February 24, 2023, 09:21:12 AM »
Anyone go hybrid ? I could see myself using gas for longer trips and flipping over to electric for driving around the hood/running errands.

See my post above.  Hybrid great for commute and errands. 

Dr. Blackheart

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Re: EV's
« Reply #69 on: February 24, 2023, 09:30:26 AM »

Hey at least I have two gas guzzling automobiles to make up for it.

Electric oven and bbq? 

The Sultan of Semantics

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Re: EV's
« Reply #70 on: February 24, 2023, 09:36:20 AM »
Electric oven and bbq? 

No. Gas range and gas dryer.
“True patriotism hates injustice in its own land more than anywhere else.” - Clarence Darrow

muwarrior69

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Re: EV's
« Reply #71 on: February 24, 2023, 09:46:19 AM »
EVs are currently a "new" technology. So early in their infancy that there are MANY pitfalls to owning/using one. Especially when it comes to road trips.

Unless you're the type to dive deeply into something, I would tell anyone to hold off on a purchase until more established.

I bought a Betamax.

muwarrior69

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Re: EV's
« Reply #72 on: February 24, 2023, 09:56:14 AM »
The only issue I have is that people should have the free choice of which vehicle they prefer. I am not so sure that the ban on new ICE sales in CA is constitutional as that affects interstate commerce. I think the market should decide which will prevail. Like I said, I bought a Betamax.

I am 76 and more than likely not to buy a new or used vehicle, so this issue will not affect me. Looks like GM will be all EV very soon and as other manufacturers move in that direction will the move to EVs outpace our electric utilities ability to generate the power to meet the demand.
« Last Edit: February 24, 2023, 10:06:57 AM by muwarrior69 »

Sir Lawrence

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Re: EV's
« Reply #73 on: February 24, 2023, 10:54:47 AM »
[

I am 76 and more than likely not to buy a new or used vehicle
[/quote]

My father in law, may he rest in peace, entered into a 3 year lease when he was 90.  Then a 2 year lease when he was 93.  He gave up the keys when he turned 95  and passed when he was 99.  Keep on trucking, muwarrior69, keep on trucking. 

You are in my oldest brother's class at MU.  His first car was a '66 Mustang.  His last car, or so he says, is the Mach-E he picked up last year.  Nice bracketing.  He loves it. 
Ludum habemus.

dgies9156

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Re: EV's
« Reply #74 on: February 24, 2023, 12:21:35 PM »
Brother Dgies, I am not trying to turn this into a scoop argument.    I want people to talk about their experience and about their needs.   For me, I think the questions, range issues, cold issues, charging issues are still too much for me the trigger on this generation of EV's. I can definitely see a hybrid, however.     

But I want guys to keep sharing.    Without anger or vitriol.    Because, eventually, EV's are going to be the norm.     

Brother Tower:

I don't mind an argument about EVs, as long as it's civil and debates the relative merits of both car types. As you point out, the range, weather and logistics concerns are severe issues for some. I'd add that in the very hot summers here, the issues are just as severe as extreme cold weather.

I'm not a physicist or an electrical engineer, so I can't address the theoretical possibilities in battery technology. I'm hoping though that in time, battery technology and recharge capability is such that we're more efficient and cleaner with EVs than we are with internal combustion engines. The pick-up on that Tesla I drove was off the charts and I know not a single gasoline-powered vehicle that can match it.

For you train buffs out there, the acceleration merits of electricity compared to gasoline or diesel is the reason why virtually all high-speed rail is electric. The performance difference between Amtrak's ACS-642, the old AM-7s or Acelas and the diesel powered GE P42s Amtrak operates now is nothing short of amazing

 

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