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Author Topic: Mc-Dammit  (Read 35894 times)

The Sultan of Semantics

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Re: Mc-Dammit
« Reply #200 on: February 19, 2020, 10:00:01 AM »
If there was anything that gave me concern about Wojo this season, it is this. I thought with the Hausers leaving and Jayce coming in, we would have to change into a much more paint oriented team. I thought the additions of Greg, Jayce, and Koby, along with improvement from Sacar, Jamal, and Theo would lead to more slashing, post ups, and passing out of the paint. I give Wojo credit for taking guys like Bailey, Cain, Sacar, and Elliott and turning them into solid three point shooters, but the lack of slashing ability is really concerning. Wojo's offensive system is effective for sure, but I wonder if the pieces we have would have been better suited in a different approach.

Will be interesting if Karim Mane does come on board. My impression of him is that he is an okay shooter but an elite slasher.

This has been an ongoing problem with Wojo's offense since he has been here.  When we have Rowsey, Sam and Markus hitting, all is good.  But it always looks like our wing players are slow to attack.  Sacar, Jamal, etc. look tentative and slow.
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21rooster

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Re: Mc-Dammit
« Reply #201 on: February 19, 2020, 10:15:52 AM »
If I recall correctly, we actually did slash quite a bit.  Creighton’s game plan seemed to be to all collapse on the slasher.  This generally led to turnovers or wide open threes on kick-outs, which is exactly what you want.  That is particularly true in a game like last night, when the officials decided to generally let the kids play through contact on both ends of the court, particularly in the first half.   They effectively used the drive and kick against Butler.  In the Butler game, the open shots went in.  That didn’t happen last night. 

Jockey

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Re: Mc-Dammit
« Reply #202 on: February 19, 2020, 10:20:24 AM »
I don't really know how to explain it, but Creighton just looked "smarter." Backdoor cuts, knowing when/where to pass, etc.

They have a collectively higher "bball IQ."

Anyway, no shame losing to an overall better team. If we were hitting the open shots yesterday, McD would have adjusted.

We play this Creighton team 100 times, they win 89 times.

I had the same thoughts. When they struggled with hitting 3s early on, they went to both mid-range shots and driving to the basket. And they had numerous players who could do that. Besides being our best 3 point shooter, unfortunately, MH is also our best mid-range player and best driver.

Creighton was clearly the better team (I also said to a friend while watching the game that they would beat us 8 times out of 10, so we're on the same wavelength there).

Elonsmusk

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Re: Mc-Dammit
« Reply #203 on: February 19, 2020, 10:30:30 AM »
In most cases, a team with the nation's leading scorer / a top NPOY candidate, loaded with upperclassmen and in the top 10 for 3pt shooting would be expected to be pretty dominant, don't you think? Wouldn't expectations be a little higher than just spending a week or two in the rankings and hoping for a 7 seed?

Lots of wisdom here.

GoldenDieners32

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Re: Mc-Dammit
« Reply #204 on: February 19, 2020, 10:47:23 AM »
@ DePaul will never be a good win. Agree to disagree. My standards are higher.
Loss would be better?

lurch91

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Re: Mc-Dammit
« Reply #205 on: February 19, 2020, 11:04:34 AM »
@Butler would be a good win.

H/A against the top 3, A vs similar teams are good wins IMO.
So for the best team in any conference, there are no good wins? Seton Hall had no good wins when they were undefeated in conference?  At that point they were head and shoulder better than the rest of the conference - so no one was similar to them.

Windyplayer

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Re: Mc-Dammit
« Reply #206 on: February 19, 2020, 11:20:33 AM »
Folks, we can all agree that the Big East is a whale of conference this year leaving even the top tier teams bloodied and bruised. Butler and SHU square of tonight - both with 7 losses - with one joining us with 8 losses after the final whistle (yes, the Pirates could have 8 losses after tonight's game). First place Villanova has 6 losses.

Everyone is taking their lumps. Let's try to take it as well as the players.

tower912

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Re: Mc-Dammit
« Reply #207 on: February 19, 2020, 11:22:51 AM »
Fie upon you and your 'big picture perspective'!   This is a place for mindless mewling only!   
Luke 6:45   ...A good man produces goodness from the good in his heart; an evil man produces evil out of his store of evil.   Each man speaks from his heart's abundance...

It is better to be fearless and cheerful than cheerless and fearful.

Shooter McGavin

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Re: Mc-Dammit
« Reply #208 on: February 19, 2020, 11:31:33 AM »
If you look at it this way, one if not the worst shooting game of the season and we only lost by 8

This.  But unfortunately it is an L and we are moving backwards offensively again at the wrong part of the season.

The only season the offense started clicking on all cylinders at the end of the year was JJs last year. Unfortunately we ran into a physical SC team in the tournament and they wore us down.   That was Wojos best “year end” offensive team to date.

21rooster

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Re: Mc-Dammit
« Reply #209 on: February 19, 2020, 11:40:07 AM »
This.  But unfortunately it is an L and we are moving backwards offensively again at the wrong part of the season.

The only season the offense started clicking on all cylinders at the end of the year was JJs last year. Unfortunately we ran into a physical SC team in the tournament and they wore us down.   That was Wojos best “year end” offensive team to date.

Again, if you DVR’d the game, go back and look at the shots taken and missed.  This was not a matter of a deteriorating offensive system.  The team missed a lot of shots they typically make.  A coach can’t take the shots - he can only design the offense to get open looks.  Let’s check back in on that offense after Providence and Georgetown and see what you think. 

willie warrior

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Re: Mc-Dammit
« Reply #210 on: February 19, 2020, 11:45:50 AM »
Folks, we can all agree that the Big East is a whale of conference this year leaving even the top tier teams bloodied and bruised. Butler and SHU square of tonight - both with 7 losses - with one joining us with 8 losses after the final whistle (yes, the Pirates could have 8 losses after tonight's game). First place Villanova has 6 losses.

Everyone is taking their lumps. Let's try to take it as well as the players.
Excuses.
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Shooter McGavin

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Re: Mc-Dammit
« Reply #211 on: February 19, 2020, 11:56:49 AM »
Again, if you DVR’d the game, go back and look at the shots taken and missed.  This was not a matter of a deteriorating offensive system.  The team missed a lot of shots they typically make.  A coach can’t take the shots - he can only design the offense to get open looks.  Let’s check back in on that offense after Providence and Georgetown and see what you think.

I completely agree with you.  They were wide open shots.  I said as much in an earlier post. Don’t know why the trend is there at the end of seasons though where we start missing.   Conditioning? Style of play? Lack of a boot camp (I kid).  I hope this year is not part of an end of year trend and we win the next 5 games. But we had offensive fire power last year and ran out of gas, missing wide open shots against good competition and we are starting to do it again. 

Let’s win this providence game and hopefully the boys go on a great stretch of offense to end the season strong.

Uncle Rico

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Re: Mc-Dammit
« Reply #212 on: February 19, 2020, 11:58:21 AM »
“This is bar none atrocious.  Mitchell cannot shoot either.  What a pile of dung”

Shooter McGavin

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Re: Mc-Dammit
« Reply #213 on: February 19, 2020, 12:03:16 PM »
I also think the games against the “lesser” competition will give us a very good idea where this team’s mindset is at.  Those bottom half teams are no slouches and we could easily lose any of them if the leadership is not there among the players.  Let’s see how this recent adversity effects the team going forward.  Will hopefully be a fun few weeks.

mu03eng

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Re: Mc-Dammit
« Reply #214 on: February 19, 2020, 12:26:35 PM »
A lot of missing context here (I know, I know, this is Scoop after all). Marquette held Creighton to it's 6th lowest PPP on offense, fully 7 points below their season average (and they are a Top 5 offense) and almost a full point below their season average eFG%. So despite Creighton hitting some really clutch shots, MU's defense was really good and got stops, especially in the second half. The problem was the offense and two key factors, turnovers (again) and shots not going in. MU had at least 15 open looks they didn't convert including 5 from Sacar (who shoots at 40% rate) and 3 or 4 from Koby (who shoots at a less good 30%). The offense was there and if one 3 from Sacar and Koby each goes in MU is leading with  3 minutes to go in the game.

But the shots didn't go in so we think it was garbage offense and we yell and scream at each other while totally ignoring what the defense did. God I love this place.
"A Plan? Oh man, I hate plans. That means were gonna have to do stuff. Can't we just have a strategy......or a mission statement."

Shooter McGavin

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Re: Mc-Dammit
« Reply #215 on: February 19, 2020, 12:32:04 PM »
You are spot on. 

Everyone should rewatch the game and they will come to the same conclusion.

Now hopefully the team doesn’t get down on themselves and wins 4 of the next five and finishes strong.
« Last Edit: February 19, 2020, 12:34:01 PM by Shooter McGavin »

skianth16

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Re: Mc-Dammit
« Reply #216 on: February 19, 2020, 12:40:10 PM »
A lot of missing context here (I know, I know, this is Scoop after all). Marquette held Creighton to it's 6th lowest PPP on offense, fully 7 points below their season average (and they are a Top 5 offense) and almost a full point below their season average eFG%. So despite Creighton hitting some really clutch shots, MU's defense was really good and got stops, especially in the second half. The problem was the offense and two key factors, turnovers (again) and shots not going in. MU had at least 15 open looks they didn't convert including 5 from Sacar (who shoots at 40% rate) and 3 or 4 from Koby (who shoots at a less good 30%). The offense was there and if one 3 from Sacar and Koby each goes in MU is leading with  3 minutes to go in the game.

But the shots didn't go in so we think it was garbage offense and we yell and scream at each other while totally ignoring what the defense did. God I love this place.

7 points below average and 1 point below their efg sound like fairly minor differences. I do think we played pretty good defense, but calling out a 1 point difference in efg doesn't seem like a big win to me.

tower912

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Re: Mc-Dammit
« Reply #217 on: February 19, 2020, 12:47:43 PM »
I have watched Creighton a few times over the last few weeks and marveled at their offensive scheme and efficiency.    MU played them better than anybody else has in the last month.      Wojo tried a few defensive wrinkles.    A zone.   4 guards.   From a '4 guard' perspective, it would have been interesting to see Greg, Symir, Koby, and Sacar all out there and switching everything.    Theo played well enough that there was not a need to go smaller.     
  Lost in all of this is that for the first 30 minutes, Bailey and Cain were having a competition to see who could stink worse. 

But in the end, against a really good team,  poor shooting = loss.   
Luke 6:45   ...A good man produces goodness from the good in his heart; an evil man produces evil out of his store of evil.   Each man speaks from his heart's abundance...

It is better to be fearless and cheerful than cheerless and fearful.

mu03eng

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Re: Mc-Dammit
« Reply #218 on: February 19, 2020, 01:00:59 PM »
7 points below average and 1 point below their efg sound like fairly minor differences. I do think we played pretty good defense, but calling out a 1 point difference in efg doesn't seem like a big win to me.

They are definitely not insignificant and the PPP was better by 24 compared to the average over the last month and the eFG% was better by 5%.....the defense was solid to very good.
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dgies9156

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Re: Mc-Dammit
« Reply #219 on: February 19, 2020, 01:22:49 PM »
A couple of late thoughts from someone in the Lower Bowl last night:

1) The offensive scheme in the first half by Creighton was magnificent. Moved the center out, rotating Theo with him. Theo was a step slow to get back and cover and too many of our guys were faked out of their jockeys by head-and-shoulder fakes. Our footwork was off a bit.

2) Given their offense, we probably should have switched to a 2/3 zone sooner. Just a thought.

3) The shot selection was generally OK. A few times in the first half, we put some ill-advised shots up, probably out of frustration but mostly we were OK. I agree that if we hit 35 to 40 percent, we win.

4) THEO -- PLEASE CATCH AND SHOOT. STOP DRIBBLING!!!!!@! Every time Theo puts the ball on the floor, he neutralizes his height and strength advantage. Just catch it, turn around or hook it and shoot. At worst, you end up on the free throw line, which was an adventure for you last night!

5) Markus -- welcome to your new world. Big guys shadowing you so close they are sharing your underwear with you. That seems to slow you down a bit. Our coaches are going to have to find fresh schemes to free you up. Period. But as we go into the NCAA, I would expect Markus will have dudes 6'2" or taller all over him.

tower912

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Re: Mc-Dammit
« Reply #220 on: February 19, 2020, 01:26:25 PM »
I liked the zone.   It was effective.   If MU had been able to hit a couple of shots in the two minute window it was being used, Wojo would be hailed as a genius.    I think against Creighton, however, a zone has a limited shelf life, considering how well they dribble, pass, cut, and shoot.     Or not.    We may find out at MSG.

A wrinkle that did not work is that for the first time all year Wojo ran 4 guards out there at the same time.    Markus, Koby, Sacar, Greg.    I suspect part of that is because both Bailey and Cain stunk for the first 30 minutes.   But it was an adjustment.   
Luke 6:45   ...A good man produces goodness from the good in his heart; an evil man produces evil out of his store of evil.   Each man speaks from his heart's abundance...

It is better to be fearless and cheerful than cheerless and fearful.

TSmith34, Inc.

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Re: Mc-Dammit
« Reply #221 on: February 19, 2020, 01:35:54 PM »
4) THEO -- PLEASE CATCH AND SHOOT. STOP DRIBBLING!!!!!@! Every time Theo puts the ball on the floor, he neutralizes his height and strength advantage. Just catch it, turn around or hook it and shoot. At worst, you end up on the free throw line, which was an adventure for you last night!
While I don't necessarily disagree with this statement in general, a game where Theo goes 6-6 from the field with 1 turnover in 31 minutes seems an odd time to make this observation.
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jesmu84

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Re: Mc-Dammit
« Reply #222 on: February 19, 2020, 01:53:34 PM »
I liked the zone.   It was effective.   If MU had been able to hit a couple of shots in the two minute window it was being used, Wojo would be hailed as a genius.    I think against Creighton, however, a zone has a limited shelf life, considering how well they dribble, pass, cut, and shoot.     Or not.    We may find out at MSG.

A wrinkle that did not work is that for the first time all year Wojo ran 4 guards out there at the same time.    Markus, Koby, Sacar, Greg.    I suspect part of that is because both Bailey and Cain stunk for the first 30 minutes.   But it was an adjustment.

BS. Wojo doesn't know how to make adjustments

Bad_Reporter

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Re: Mc-Dammit
« Reply #223 on: February 19, 2020, 01:56:36 PM »
A lot of hope on landing Mane on here.   I wouldn’t count on it.

Dawson Rental

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Re: Mc-Dammit
« Reply #224 on: February 19, 2020, 01:57:37 PM »
I do not like Wojo-ball. Give me some junkyard dogs. The worst era in MU basketball since I’ve been old enough to remember.

Agreed.  Got to figure out how to get to that 1 and 11 DePaul record or Wojo's gone!
You actually have a degree from Marquette?

Quote from: muguru
No...and after reading many many psosts from people on this board that do...I have to say I'm MUCH better off, if this is the type of "intelligence" a degree from MU gets you. It sure is on full display I will say that.