WI Supreme Court Takes McAdams' Case

[Blue Horseshoe]

In other words they crafted an opinion to get the result they wanted. As I said, it was political.

Politics, plain & simple.

[GGGG]

Politics, plain & simple.

Exactly. Thanks for reasserting  my point.

[rocket surgeon]

4 verified cases in 2016 out of over a hundred million ballots cast. Generally speaking, it's not a thing.

It is. Proof of citizenship or voter ID is a violation of the 24th Amendment that prohibits a poll tax. A photo ID costs money. The government is illegally collecting money in exchange for your right to vote. Voter ID laws are unconstitutional.

Yeah...sadly true.

  re:voter fraud-i guess that would depend on your source-over 1100 proven cases with almost 100 convictions, etc.  if you care to look, here is a map where you can click on a state and it will list each person one by one.  go ahead, it's user friendly-

    https://www.heritage.org/voterfraud

  and these are just the ones they've caught and you know, like bull murray and harold ramis...convicted? no never convicted...

[reinko]

  re:voter fraud-i guess that would depend on your source-over 1100 proven cases with almost 100 convictions, etc.  if you care to look, here is a map where you can click on a state and it will list each person one by one.  go ahead, it's user friendly-

    https://www.heritage.org/voterfraud

  and these are just the ones they've caught and you know, like bull murray and harold ramis...convicted? no never convicted...

1100 people, over a 20+ year, across 50 states, tens of thousands of elections, with over a BILLION ballots cast.

Do you know what kind of "fraud rate" that is?

.0000007%

Methinks voter fraud ain't the problem when the powers that be are passing laws that cut down on early voting, close voting precincts in suspiciously democratic geographic areas, and require new forms of ID.

[GGGG]

1100 people, over a 20+ year, across 50 states, tens of thousands of elections, with over a BILLION ballots cast.

Do you know what kind of "fraud rate" that is?

.0000007%

Methinks voter fraud ain't the problem when the powers that be are passing laws that cut down on early voting, close voting precincts in suspiciously democratic geographic areas, and require new forms of ID.

Gee. Whatever. Could. It. Be????

[TSmith34, Inc.]

1100 people, over a 20+ year, across 50 states, tens of thousands of elections, with over a BILLION ballots cast.

Do you know what kind of "fraud rate" that is?

.0000007%

Methinks voter fraud ain't the problem when the powers that be are passing laws that cut down on early voting, close voting precincts in suspiciously democratic geographic areas, and require new forms of ID.

Facts.  You'd like to think facts would have some effect, but people like rocket are immune to facts that disagree with what they want to be true.

[Jay Bee]

Facts.  You'd like to think facts would have some effect, but people like rocket are immune to facts that disagree with what they want to be true.

Nope. Rocket is speaking facts.

[MU Fan in Connecticut]

1100 people, over a 20+ year, across 50 states, tens of thousands of elections, with over a BILLION ballots cast.

Do you know what kind of "fraud rate" that is?

.0000007%

Methinks voter fraud ain't the problem when the powers that be are passing laws that cut down on early voting, close voting precincts in suspiciously democratic geographic areas, and require new forms of ID.

If only we could be that accurate in manufacturing anything. 

[warriorchick]

If only we could be that accurate in manufacturing anything.

Saying we can reduce verification procedures on voting eligibility because voter fraud is so rare is like saying I don't need to lock my doors anymore because my house has never been robbed.

[Spotcheck Billy]

Nope. Rocket is speaking to very trivial facts.

 

[naginiF]

Nope. Rocket is speaking facts.

Facts about the #'s?  Yes.  But the implication is that voter fraud is an issue - that is not the case and where the word "want" comes in.  Certain people want voter fraud to be an issue and something people are afraid happens on a large scale.

[WarriorDad]

  re:voter fraud-i guess that would depend on your source-over 1100 proven cases with almost 100 convictions, etc.  if you care to look, here is a map where you can click on a state and it will list each person one by one.  go ahead, it's user friendly-

    https://www.heritage.org/voterfraud

  and these are just the ones they've caught and you know, like bull murray and harold ramis...convicted? no never convicted...

Your numbers are off, your link says almost 1000 convictions, not 100.  Still small in the grand scheme of things.  I have found over the years the right thinks this number is huge, the left thinks this number is zero (or 4), it is certainly in the 1000's. 

We have to ask is it enough to care?  When some elections are decided by less than 50 votes (city, county, district) we should care.  If one vote one person is important, then integrity of each vote is critical to a democracy.  However, not to the point it prevents someone from voting altogether.  Need to find a way that prevents fraud and doesn't prevent voting.

1100 people, over a 20+ year, across 50 states, tens of thousands of elections, with over a BILLION ballots cast.

Do you know what kind of "fraud rate" that is?

.0000007%

Methinks voter fraud ain't the problem when the powers that be are passing laws that cut down on early voting, close voting precincts in suspiciously democratic geographic areas, and require new forms of ID.

Your numbers may be off, too, but your point is well taken.  If you click on some of the cases that Rocketsurgeon provided, people  are convicted for voting illegally 18 times, 13 times, 15 times.  Those each count as one conviction, but those people defrauded many others of their vote for each infraction they committed.  Also, looked to me that most of the cases happened in the last 6 to 8 years.

In my opinion voter fraud isn't out of control, but it exists and every vote should count.  Because both sides have been caught cheating, both sides should want to make sure the vote is secure.

[WarriorDad]

It is. Proof of citizenship or voter ID is a violation of the 24th Amendment that prohibits a poll tax. A photo ID costs money. The government is illegally collecting money in exchange for your right to vote. Voter ID laws are unconstitutional.

The gov't produces IDs today for drivers, citizenship, social security already, how would those be considered a poll tax when the IDs core purpose is to facilitate services or grant of privileges that are not related to voting? 

In my view if we go to a national ID card some day, where everyone must have one for Universal Healthcare, social security, driving, air travel, and all the rest, that will be used for voting validation, too.

[TSmith34, Inc.]

Nope. Rocket is speaking facts.

Yes, 1100 cases in 20 years.  .0000007% rate.

Meanwhile https://www.thenation.com/article/wisconsins-voter-id-law-suppressed-200000-votes-trump-won-by-23000/

But again, I've long realized that facts are simply ignored by some people if they conflict with their fragile worldview.

[WarriorDad]

Yes, 1100 cases in 20 years.  .0000007% rate.

Meanwhile https://www.thenation.com/article/wisconsins-voter-id-law-suppressed-200000-votes-trump-won-by-23000/

But again, I've long realized that facts are simply ignored by some people if they conflict with their fragile worldview.

Politifact says false. 

http://www.politifact.com/wisconsin/statements/2016/dec/07/tweets/were-300000-wisconsin-voters-turned-away-polls-201/

Both sides, wild claims. 

[brewcity77]

  re:voter fraud-i guess that would depend on your source-over 1100 proven cases with almost 100 convictions, etc.  if you care to look, here is a map where you can click on a state and it will list each person one by one.  go ahead, it's user friendly-

    https://www.heritage.org/voterfraud

  and these are just the ones they've caught and you know, like bull murray and harold ramis...convicted? no never convicted...

Dude really? The Heritage Foundation again? An organization that exists to overturn Roe v Wade, make money for corporations, and restrict voting rights?

You're right, it depends on your sources. And Heritage is the right wing partisan extreme. You may as well quote Info Wars or Breitbart.

[muwarrior69]

Back to the McAdams case...

The most disturbing thing to me about this ruling is that the court effectively ruled that students have zero expectation of privacy with regard to their personal information, and its use and dissemination by their university, faculty members, and other students.

The crux of this case was not the conduct of the student, academic freedom, etc., but the posting of personal information of a student without consent in a method that made it extremely likely to be used for harassment, unwelcome contact, and bullying. Marquette, correctly, viewed this behavior as unethical/unprofessional and deserving of disciplinary action.

As someone who works in the data privacy sphere, this court's ruling is extremely alarming to me. Consent should always be obtained prior to collection and dissemination of personal information. The fact that the personal information was also placed elsewhere, such as a university directory, DOES NOT CONSTITUTE CONSENT.

This outcome is yet another indication that our views of privacy in this country are so ridiculously ass backwards.

Even the Washington Post reveals the names of college students. In the electronic age we live in, no one should expect any privacy be it in a national News Paper or a Faculty member blog.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/powerpost/wp/2018/06/26/congressional-intern-suspended-after-yelling-obscenity-at-president-trump-at-the-capitol/?utm_term=.5063b3e9d158

[forgetful]

Politifact says false. 

http://www.politifact.com/wisconsin/statements/2016/dec/07/tweets/were-300000-wisconsin-voters-turned-away-polls-201/

Both sides, wild claims.

No.  Politifact does not say false.  You are linking a report on a different claim.  The claim was that turnout was reduced by 200,000 by the strict voter ID law.  That analysis was different than saying 300,000 were turned away from the polls, which politifact ruled on. 

The stats show that 300,000 registered voters in Wisconsin lack, or do no have access to, the proper ID to be able to vote.  Based on nationwide trends in voting, that is consistent with voter turnout being reduced by 200,000 voters, current analysis linked by TSmith.  A simpler analysis shows that the voter turnout was 66% of all registered voters in WI, so statistically speaking ~66% of the 300k would have been expected to vote...or 200k. 

Both the nationwide statistics, and the simple analysis are consistent with voter turnout being reduced by 200k votes because of the voter ID law in WI.

[TSmith34, Inc.]

Politifact says false. 

http://www.politifact.com/wisconsin/statements/2016/dec/07/tweets/were-300000-wisconsin-voters-turned-away-polls-201/

Both sides, wild claims.

Cheekz, your "both sides" charade is tiresome, but your arguments are the same misleading mishmash they have always been.

Your politifact article is from December of 2016.  Further, it looks at the fact that 300,000 Wisconsin voters lacked the ID necessary to vote.  In then says it is false because  "that number was not a head count of residents who actually did or would have set out to vote on Nov. 8, 2016, only to be turned away." Well, no sh!t, you're telling me not everyone tries to vote?  Incredibly misleading.

The article I linked is from May of 2017, which, if you had bothered to read, doesn't make the claim politifact rated as false.  Further, it looked across all states to determine the effect of voter ID laws on turnout.  So your counter-argument has nothing to do with this point.  Keep up the good work, Chicos.

But here is the money quote, the real reason for voter ID laws, which have nothing to do with the integrity of the vote:

"The lost voters skewed more African-American and more Democrat. For example, Wisconsin’s 2016 electorate was 6.1% more Republican, and 5.7% less Democrat, than the group of ‘lost voters’. Furthermore, the WI electorate was 3.7% more White and 3.8% less African American than the group of ‘lost voters.’ This analysis suggests that the 200,000 lost voters would have both been more racially diverse and have voted more Democratic."

"Voter fraud" is the cover story for selective voter suppression.  One side uses the fact of 1,100 cases of voter fraud over 20 years nationwide as the boogeyman to selectively suppress 200,000 votes in one state in one election.

[Benny B]

Here's a quick Q&A for all y'all pigeon-holers...

Does voter fraud exist?  Of course it does.

Does voter suppression exist? Of course it does.

Does every person who commits voter fraud get caught? Of course not.

What type of voter fraud does Voter ID target? Impersonation.

What's the rarest type of voter fraud?  Impersonation.

Has voter fraud ever swung a major election? No.  (Deliberately ignoring Xavier Suárez case here since that was quickly discovered and rectified.  And besides, Mayor of Miami isn't exactly a concern for the right-wing.)

Has voter suppression ever swung a major election?  Not that any empirical evidence can show.

What is the most effective way to stamp out voter fraud?  Mandatory voting.

What's the most effective way to eliminate voter suppression?  Mandatory voting.

Why are Democrats and Republicans both opposed to mandatory voting?  Because at the end of the day, they really don't care about voter fraud/suppression... they care about getting their people to the polls, and spending millions of dollars to scare people about, what's effectively, BS claims of fraud/suppression is a great way to accomplish the same.

[GGGG]

Even the Washington Post reveals the names of college students. In the electronic age we live in, no one should expect any privacy be it in a national News Paper or a Faculty member blog.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/powerpost/wp/2018/06/26/congressional-intern-suspended-after-yelling-obscenity-at-president-trump-at-the-capitol/?utm_term=.5063b3e9d158

Marquette faculty members have a higher sense of responsibility to Marquette students than the Washington Post does.

[ZiggysFryBoy]

Dude really? The Heritage Foundation again? An organization that exists to overturn Roe v Wade, make money for corporations, and restrict voting rights?

You're right, it depends on your sources. And Heritage is the right wing partisan extreme. You may as well quote Info Wars or Breitbart.

You can make the same argument about Comrad Nichols and the Nation cited above.

[chapman]

You can make the same argument about Comrad Nichols and the Nation cited above.

Priorities USA is a progressive advocacy group and Super PAC that supported Clinton in 2016 and Barack Obama in 2012. The study was conducted by Civis Analytics, a data science firm founded by the chief analytics officer for Obama’s reelection campaign in 2012.

It’s important to note that this study was conducted by a Democratic Party–affiliated group and has not been peer-reviewed or gone through the typical academic vetting process.

Nah, seems legit.

[brewcity77]

You can make the same argument about Comrad Nichols and the Nation cited above.

Not my citation. Also, rocket specifically talked about sources in the post then followed that with a source that exists solely for the purpose of stoking partisan fires in that same post.

[rocky_warrior]

Alright - was letting this go since it was about McAdams, but now it's really not.  So...hope you guys enjoyed!