shot clock golf

[rocket surgeon]

http://www.golf.com/tour-news/2018/06/08/european-tours-shot-clock-masters-debuts-rave-reviews


  being a big fan of golf and an avid participant, i'd love to see some version of this adapted.  with golf having some of the most arcane rules you've never heard of, setting a strict amount of time for each golfer to get his/her shot off is intriguing.   supposedly there is a time allowance, but you would never know it from watching some of these guys play.  i understand each shot is important, but these guys are pros.  30 seconds to tee off, 30 seconds to play 2nd shot once your ball is recognized, etc...maybe 45 seconds to putt.  give them 2 timeouts per round where they may be allowed an extra 30 seconds.  1 warning, then 1 shot penalties. 

  just wondering what anyone else may think?

[🏀]

I don't disagree, but a shot clock is obnoxious.

Certain players, that are constantly slow (Na, Cantlay, Crane) should be on the clock from the first tee shot.

Enforce the rules you have now, target the habitual offenders and the problem goes away.

[🏀]

Side note, I love, love, love the new rules.

[rocket surgeon]

I don't disagree, but a shot clock is obnoxious.

Certain players, that are constantly slow (Na, Cantlay, Crane) should be on the clock from the first tee shot.

Enforce the rules you have now, target the habitual offenders and the problem goes away.

 i think na has improved, cantalay is ridiculous.  but that's the thing-how much time is too much?  if one guy is playing slow, it does affect the others in the group.  i know i feel the pressure when we are behind.  one guy keeps duffing, losing his ball and he's lining up his shot, doing the pga shuffle only to miss...again, but we are a hole and a half behind,,,

the new rule changes are mostly for casual play i believe.  can't imagine the pga playing "dead pin" when all are on the green

2019 Rule: Under Rule 13.2a(2):                 

There will no longer be a penalty if a ball played from the putting green hits a flagstick left in the hole.
Players will not be required to putt with the flagstick in the hole; rather, they will continue to have the choice to have it removed (which includes having someone attend the flagstick and remove it after the ball is played).

[MUEng92]

i know i feel the pressure when we are behind.  one guy keeps duffing, losing his ball and he's lining up his shot...

Have we played together?

[🏀]

i think na has improved, cantalay is ridiculous.  but that's the thing-how much time is too much?  if one guy is playing slow, it does affect the others in the group.  i know i feel the pressure when we are behind.  one guy keeps duffing, losing his ball and he's lining up his shot, doing the pga shuffle only to miss...again, but we are a hole and a half behind,,,

the new rule changes are mostly for casual play i believe.  can't imagine the pga playing "dead pin" when all are on the green

2019 Rule: Under Rule 13.2a(2):                 

There will no longer be a penalty if a ball played from the putting green hits a flagstick left in the hole.
Players will not be required to putt with the flagstick in the hole; rather, they will continue to have the choice to have it removed (which includes having someone attend the flagstick and remove it after the ball is played).

Oh yeah, new rules should help the weekend rounds, not the PGA. No round should ever take more than 4 hours.

I want rangers explaining the maximum score rule to everyone teeing off and those behind pace. Check some score cards too.

We played in a 3-man scramble at Hawk's View recently with 8" cups. It took us 52 minutes to play 13 & 14, our first two holes. The ranger was waiting for us on 15 to let us know the group in front carded double bogies on their first two holes. He let us know they were told to pick up after par was reached, and then we got back to pace.

[augoman]

ban practice swings altogether, kneeling behind the ball to line up putts, etc.  walk up to the ball, take your friggin shot and move on!  I suck at the game, but have no patience for players as bad as me acting like theyre in the masters.  Every stroke should count-practice or not.

[MUEng92]

There should V6 engines in golf carts. People should stop wasting time looking for their ball. Drive straight from the tee for 10 secs, drop a ball, hit it without watching where it goes, drive, drop, hit, drive, 1 putt.

Wait until you are off the 18th green before marking 3's on the scorecard for each hole. Go straight to your car without stopping at the bar and go home.

18 holes in about 25 minutes.

[tower912]

I like it for the PGA tour.     Just hit the ball guys.    You know the exact yardage, exact carry, wind conditions.    Hit the ball.   
For weekend golfers:
Don't start drinking until after the round.
Pick up your putt for an 8.    Don't plum bob it.
Play the appropriate tees for your game. 
Keep extra tees, balls, ball repair tools in your pocket.   
Take a lesson.
Play ready golf. 
If you have good yardage numbers, share them freely and quickly. 
No more than two practice swings.     Take them while your playing companions are playing their shots so you can step right up and hit. 
If you are playing a golf cart-only course and are restricted to cart paths, take multiple clubs with you to the ball.     
Then hit one more than you think you need.   
Don't stand there tellling awesome stories while the group behind you waits.   
If you are unwilling to do any of these things, use proper ettiquette and allow faster groups to play through.   

In Great Britain, they consider carts and rounds that take more than 3 hours heresy.    American golf architecture is frequently not walker friendly.    Walk whenever you can anyway.   I know that I can walk a round in 2:45 easily.    Now that I, and most of my friends are in our 50's, fewer want to walk. (I like to mock their age and infirmity, but they don't care)  But I know that my favorite foursome, with no one in front of us, can play 18 in 3:20 routinely.   

[warriorchick]

What they need is a pitch clock in baseball.

Maybe make it like chess, where the clock stops after each pitch.  Warming up a new pitcher in the middle of an inning and trips to the mound count against the clock.

[Goose]

Tower

Spot on. I agree with everything you noted. I would play a lot more golf if weekend golfers followed your advice. It is hard enough to focus for four hours, but playing behind idiots makes it unbearable. I really miss country club golf.

[tower912]

I don't play golf on weekends, unless it is an outing.  5 hour rounds are one of the few things in all the world that make me homicidal.

[rocket surgeon]

Then ya see guys with their extended ball scoopers out at the water hazards lookin for pro v’s or sitting there eye’in up the beverage cart babe ordering up brewskis thinking they got a chance...

[rocket surgeon]

I don't play golf on weekends, unless it is an outing.  5 hour rounds are one of the few things in all the world that make me homicidal.

The legends clubs adhere to the 4 hour rule and not a minute longer, week days or weekends.  I remember takin the turn at 2:02 and the ranger-rob told us to pick it up

[🏀]

Carts massively slow down the game.

[tower912]

Carts massively slow down the game.

Yes and no.  Golf architecture makes carts a requirement sometimes.   Age contributes.  Without carts, some courses would be impossible.  The able bodied should walk whenever possible.   But some people treat golf as an excuse to drink, and carts are much better than carry bags to transport beer.

[#UnleashSean]

Carts massively slow down the game.

You aint ever seen me golf.

[warriorchick]

You aint ever seen me golf.

You ain't never seen me drive a golf cart.

[🏀]

You aint ever seen me golf.

Even if you're crap, a cart slows you down.

Yes and no.  Golf architecture makes carts a requirement sometimes.   Age contributes.  Without carts, some courses would be impossible.  The able bodied should walk whenever possible.   But some people treat golf as an excuse to drink, and carts are much better than carry bags to transport beer.

Excuse to drink, excuse to worry about music, excuse to watch everyone's shots, ugh, it's just the worst.

[WarriorFan]

I was a 3x per week golfer who basically quit because it just takes too long.  When I lived in England, a long round was 3 hours.  That was great (of course, there's rarely 3 full hours between rain showers, so English golf still sucks) timing wise.  On an empty course, alone, I can play two balls and finish 18 walking with a caddy in 2.5 hours.  I despise 5 hour buggy rounds. 

[jsglow]

I essentially gave up the game about 5-10 years ago.  I was never any good and I found myself more frustrated than relaxed.  Much rather ski and I'm still halfway decent.  Although it has been several years since that watershed moment when the kid 'passed me by' and accidentally left me for dead in the pow at 10,500 feet at Alta. 'Dad, what happened?'  (Didn't mean to hijack, just like that story.)

[rocket surgeon]

I essentially gave up the game about 5-10 years ago.  I was never any good and I found myself more frustrated than relaxed.  Much rather ski and I'm still halfway decent.  Although it has been several years since that watershed moment when the kid 'passed me by' and accidentally left me for dead in the pow at 10,500 feet at Alta. 'Dad, what happened?'  (Didn't mean to hijack, just like that story.)

there ya go...us golfers would never pass by a fellow golfer in dire straits...unless he was the duffer holding us up leading to the dreaded 5 hour round

[jsglow]

there ya go...us golfers would never pass by a fellow golfer in dire straits...unless he was the duffer holding us up leading to the dreaded 5 hour round

Not to overdo this but I didn't leave the incorrect impression.  Passed me by in ability.  He was actually skiing ahead of me on the run and I foolishly tried to follow.   

[mu_hilltopper]

Carts massively slow down the game.

I find this curious .. why would you think that?   

In my youth, I never used a cart .. older, especially with son(s) learning the game, I find having a cart is vital, as they spray their shots all over the place, so having a vehicle that transports them (and me) all over the place saves a crapton of time. ... Not to mention speedier lost-ball searches.

[WarriorFan]

Carts massively slow down the game.

2 bad golfers in a cart together or even two average golfers on a tough course together in a cart or one lazy golfer in a cart slows down the game.  When you walk, you go directly to your ball.  Don't need to worry about the other players and don't need to be driven 250m in the wrong direction while your buddy fishes his ball out of the crick he sliced his into while you need to find your hook in the woods on the other side. 

When I must play with a cart, I use it to get to my drive, take a handful of clubs, and walk the rest of the hole. 

[NorthernDancerColt]

Tower

Spot on. I agree with everything you noted. I would play a lot more golf if weekend golfers followed your advice. It is hard enough to focus for four hours, but playing behind idiots makes it unbearable. I really miss country club golf.

Goose.
Could not agree with you more. Played Bonnie Brook in Waukegan (Jerome Whitehead) today. That course is really nice, but also usually extremely crowded. For some reason, it was a ghost town today, so I managed to play 18 in 1hr 50 minutes on a cart...and, shocking, I shot 76 from the tips. When 18 holes takes even 3.5 hr. I will be in the low 80s. 4hr rounds equate to me shooting mid to high 80s.4.5hr and I'm starting to chop. 5 hr and I will literally walk/drive off the course. It's getting to the point where I only can play weekday mornings at 5am or 6:30p.m Will not go near a course on weekends, with the exception being very early spring or very late autumn when temps are in the high 40s.

I really think there is a market for nice public golf for men AND women who understand that golf is supposed to be played in 3 and a half hours max. Last week I was stuck behind three apparent slow-golf-pace
doppelgangers. Each one literally took 5 practice swings, and then virtually froze over the ball for 2 minutes before violently flailing away and usually topping or chunking the ball. Even bad golfers can play swiftly. Just pick up and take a max of, say 8 strokes. 1 practice swing max, and start your damn backswing!...you'll be surprised how much better you'll play.

[NorthernDancerColt]

Carts massively slow down the game.

For idiots who don't know how to use them. I played 18 as a solo on a cart today in 1hr 50 minutes on an empty 6800 yard course. If I'm walking solo the exact same yardage on the same empty course, I'm done in 2:40.

You are right though. Almost all beginners, and even the majority of seasoned hackers have zero idea how to utilize a golf cart. Golfer A is on the right center of the fairway and 50 yards short of (left-rough positioned) Golfer B. Today's GPS carts make things easy, one would think. Golfer B should drive the cart somewhere to the left of (right-handed) A's tee shot. B should not wait for A to play.  A has already looked up at the yardage, so he hops out, grabs say two clubs and quickly throws up a few blades of grass while B is already driving to his ball. A selects his club and hits his approach while B is already in his pre-shot routine. A walks briskly toward the green while B drives up to him, so A can retrieve his putter & wedge (if he has missed the green). B positions the cart at the most logical/efficient green -exit point and grabs his own putter/wedge while A is now walking up. Guys and gals who drive the ball similar distances should be partnered in a cart, regardless of team/money matches.

[Sheriff]

Last week I was stuck behind three apparent slow-golf-pace
doppelgangers.

Nothing worse than a lollygagging doppelganger

[tower912]

Nothing worse than being stuck behind the Haverkamp foursome when they won't let you play through.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IhknFgI8tJY

[Goose]

Colt

Spot on in regards to score and length of round. My back nine score on 4.5 hour+ rounds are not pretty. My frustration level grows by the minute and I lose complete focus. I see no reason why any round should take even four hours.

[🏀]

Nothing worse than being stuck behind the Haverkamp foursome when they won't let you play through.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IhknFgI8tJY

This is me on league nights.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ejkuUJx7BBc

Minus the cart.

[tower912]

Colt

Spot on in regards to score and length of round. My back nine score on 4.5 hour+ rounds are not pretty. My frustration level grows by the minute and I lose complete focus. I see no reason why any round should take even four hours.

Right there with you, brothers.   If it is just one group, I have been known to (alone or in my group) just drive around the slow group, only play 17 holes, and we all take a bogey for the hole we skipped.      Then we finish up 1/2 hour or more before they do and leave feeling much better.   

[mu_hilltopper]

On Sunday my 11 year old did a PGA Junior event .. best ball, shotgun start. 

Took 3 hours for 9 holes.  In the rain.  Brutal.

(Name drop alert:  Mike Broeker and son was in our group of six (2 kids sit out alt holes) .. Wojo and sons were in the group ahead of us.)

[tower912]

On Sunday my 11 year old did a PGA Junior event .. best ball, shotgun start. 

Took 3 hours for 9 holes.  In the rain.  Brutal.

(Name drop alert:  Mike Broeker and son was in our group of six (2 kids sit out alt holes) .. Wojo and sons were in the group ahead of us.)

Took my 11 year old out for his first 9 of the year today.    Little goat track, he wanted to carry his bag, 9 holes, 75 minutes, he didn't break 60, even with a near ace.    Who cares?    It was fun, we played quick.

[ZiggysFryBoy]

On Sunday my 11 year old did a PGA Junior event .. best ball, shotgun start. 

Took 3 hours for 9 holes.  In the rain.  Brutal.

(Name drop alert:  Mike Broeker and son was in our group of six (2 kids sit out alt holes) .. Wojo and sons were in the group ahead of us.)

Did you hit driver into Wojo?

[mu_hilltopper]

Did you hit driver into Wojo?

Just kids playing.  A couple kids could whack it 150, but it wasn't hitting anyone on the fly.

[ZiggysFryBoy]

Just kids playing.  A couple kids could whack it 150, but it wasn't hitting anyone on the fly.

Did you hit driver into wojo?

[🏀]

Did you hit driver into wojo?

Answer the God damn question, topper. You either go over the top or you don't.

[mu_hilltopper]

Answer the God damn question, topper. You either go over the top or you don't.

Oh, right, I forgot that one of the kids hit Wojo in the chest and we did CPR to bring him around.  Then he invited us to his house for ice cream and beers.  Around 2am, we left the kids there and went to Potowotomi and hit the blackjack tables until dawn. 

10/10 would do that again.

[🏀]

Oh, right, I forgot that one of the kids hit Wojo in the chest and we did CPR to bring him around.  Then he invited us to his house for ice cream and beers.  Around 2am, we left the kids there and went to Potowotomi and hit the blackjack tables until dawn. 

10/10 would do that again.

Knew it. Wojo seems like a blackjack guy.

[CTWarrior]

Nothing worse than being stuck behind the Haverkamp foursome when they won't let you play through.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IhknFgI8tJY

I caddied in the summer up to through the summer before my senior year at MU (carrying doubles) for many years.  Nothing was worse than caddying for a husband and wife (at the club where I caddied these would generally be older couples as younger guys never played with their wives).  First going back and forth between their balls was a royal pain in the neck, and second, the husband always played poorly and the wife's comments would just keep getting him angrier, especially stuff like "It's only a game."

I always wondered why couples played together, because they actually enjoyed themselves less than 10% of the time.

[tower912]

The scariest thing my wife has said to me in the last year was that she was thinking about taking up golf again so that she could play with my son and I on weekends and when we go on vacations. 

[warriorchick]

The scariest thing my wife has said to me in the last year was that she was thinking about taking up golf again so that she could play with my son and I on weekends and when we go on vacations.

Plus it gives her the excuse to buy a lot of cute golf outfits.   

[ZiggysFryBoy]

The scariest thing my wife has said to me in the last year was that she was thinking about taking up golf again so that she could play with my son and I on weekends and when we go on vacations.

That's when you cut her hamstring or achilles.....not a full slice but enough not play golf....

[🏀]

That's when you cut her hamstring or achilles.....not a full slice but enough not play golf....

There's a life pro tip.

[NorthernDancerColt]

That's when you cut her hamstring or achilles.....not a full slice but enough not play golf....

Same as Spackler's advice to Ty Webb re Judge Smales' weight displacement issue, right?

Just coming to your defense in advance of the Caddyshack illiterate feminists brandishing their pitchfork/wedges..

That said, I must make the point that I have worked in the golf industry for years, and women on the golf course  are generally very conscious of their stereotype as slow players. Most go out of their way to keep pace, and they are almost too acquiescing/apologetic about waving people through. It is almost always middle aged men (who think they are on Tour) who are most culpable for clogging up courses and ruining the pace of play.

[rocket surgeon]

The scariest thing my wife has said to me in the last year was that she was thinking about taking up golf again so that she could play with my son and I on weekends and when we go on vacations.

that's funny!  when my wife took up golf about 15 years ago, it went from me begging-honey, can i join the guys for a round of golf this weekend at...to her telling me-we ARE going golfing tomorrow...and the next day...and the next day...and....BUT, i told her in the beginning, until she changes her swing from something between bowling, hockey and baseball, in order to save out marriage, we best keep our distance.  well, today she has a legit 18-20 handicap and sometimes our "19th hole" ain't the traditional 19th hole

  once she got that hang of the game, learned the basic rules and etiquette, etc etc, i'm telling ya, this is a game we can grow old doing together.  we have a few couples we go on golf weekends with and has allowed me to see places i probably never would have otherwise seen.  she also has her lady friends to golf with as i have my men's leagues and groups as well.  we specifically moved from lake havasu city to surprise because there are so many more golf courses to choose from

[ZiggysFryBoy]

Same as Spackler's advice to Ty Webb re Judge Smales' weight displacement issue, right?

Just coming to your defense in advance of the Caddyshack illiterate feminists brandishing their pitchfork/wedges..

That said, I must make the point that I have worked in the golf industry for years, and women on the golf course  are generally very conscious of their stereotype as slow players. Most go out of their way to keep pace, and they are almost too acquiescing/apologetic about waving people through. It is almost always middle aged men (who think they are on Tour) who are most culpable for clogging up courses and ruining the pace of play.

sad that we have to translate caddyshack references for these god damn youngins.

[tower912]

25 years ago for her birthday, I got her a nice set of clubs and a nice set of lessons.  And she played for a few years.  Then kids and life happened and she found other things to fill her time.  If she decided to play again, I would be fully supportive.   However, a good joke is a good joke.  And I have already said that 'scariest thing' riff to her face.  She laughed.