Cancel student debt

[rocket surgeon]

In your view today's Repubs are to the LEFT of Kennedy?

And you wonder why you are laughed at.

"but today's republicans MAY not even meet the standards of the old kennedy democrats.  i call today's republicans, democrat-lite.  the middle is long and strong=the independents

your attempts to twist my comment into something you can turn around and then try to humiliate me with is so damn shallow-
     this message board has been absolutely hijacked by the good ole boys club.  listen smith, if it's you and your ilk that are laughing at me, that makes me smile.  you guys are so alinsky-like.  personalize, polarize and attack.  i've tried to have some decent, civil conversations and anytime a mistake is made, a different opinion is had, some light hearted comment is made that is misunderstood, you guys(and you know who you are) attack.  with the exception of a few still here, you guys are accomplishing what you set out to do-own this board.  congratulations on creating your little circle jerk

[dgies9156]

A few quick thoughts

3. Student loan debt is a huge problem. Arguably one of the largest facing Americans today. It needs to be addressed. The solution however won't be as simple as "cancel all student loan debt." It also won't be as simple as "cut university employee salaries by 30%". It's somewhere in the middle and will require cuts from both "sides." I think there is room for some student loan forgiveness as well as some restructuring by colleges and universities to lower the cost of tuition.

4. The real long term solution to this problem is education. 17 and 18 year olds are expected to pick colleges, decide majors, and sign loans without a true understanding of the debt they are taking on and what it will take to pay it back. Theoretically, the parents should be guiding them but the parents are often lacking the understanding as well. I was fortunate enough to have two parents who went to college and took out student loans to help me understand what I was signing up for. My wife? She was the first in her family to go to college. They had no idea what the implications were when she decided to go to a small liberal arts college that no one had ever heard of. High schools need to offer education on student loans in home ec and economic classes (and require them). Or at very least have college advisers who are trained on student loans. I know my high school didn't have anything like that.

Brother TAMU, a couple of points:

1) I was on the Dad (and Mom) consignment plan to Marquette. I was fortunate, not just that my parents could afford college for us but also that my parents understood the value of what they gave me and my brothers and sisters -- all while maintaining a strong giving commitment to Marquette and other agencies. They knew that for their children to be successful, college was essential. Marquette was selected because my Dad went to MU and had an incredible experience.

2) I'm not a big fan of cancelling student debt. But if you're going to do it, think about a social service commitment, such as the Peace Corps or VISTA, as a requirement. Yeah, affluent clowns could avoid this but doing the social service thing for many would expose them to things many haven't seen and make dent in some of America's social and political problems.

3) The world needs poets, philosophers, writers, sociologists, artists, musicians and whole lot of people who don't know the difference between software in their linen closets and software in their iPhones. But going into debt big enough to equal what one incurs to own a home is absurd. I don't care what your major is, taking on 50% of your probable first year salary in debt payments is not reasonable economic behavior and it means you're not going to be part of the middle class until you are 40. I agree, Brother TAMU, that counseling needs to address this.

4) I have an undergraduate Journalism major. Before I went off to try to be the next Woodward or Bernstein (Catholic style, of course), my father pulled me into our study and told me what a noble profession Journalism was. He then pointed to his and Mom's house, which was pretty nice (he did reasonably well) and asked, "do you want this?" He made it clear that while I would never want for day-to-day expenses (obviously, he had no clue what was coming in journalism), he also made it clear that I wasn't going to be rich. Six years after I was graduated Marquette, I enrolled in an MBA program and 11 years after I was graduated from Marquette, I left Journalism forever. Dad was right on the money and I'd rather eat than, as one Journalism professor called it, "pursue the truth!" Too many people don't have a Dad as wise as mine, though in fairness, my Dad never understood that Journalism could be a platform into something else.

[TSmith34, Inc.]

"but today's republicans MAY not even meet the standards of the old kennedy democrats.  i call today's republicans, democrat-lite.  the middle is long and strong=the independents

your attempts to twist my comment into something you can turn around and then try to humiliate me with is so damn shallow-

Then what ARE you trying to say if not that?  I'll admit, I have a difficult time trying to understand your posts 90% of the time.

[Jay Bee]

Workhouse for those who do not pay their debts!

[WarriorDad]

Political post of the year on scoop. I agree with what you say

Thank you.  Apparently my comments touched a nerve with some here, which is surprising.  Anyone that is my age knows the GOP has gone far right and our party to the left, especially in the last few years. 

The Washington Post, perhaps no better paper on US politics, wrote of this late last year using Pew data compiled since the mid 1990's.  The charts show the pull to the right and left by both parties, what is there to argue?  Shrug.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2017/10/05/the-remarkably-fast-liberalization-of-the-democratic-party/?utm_term=.3ba814bad8e6

Nate Silver led a discussion on this last month on five thirty eight. Neither party holds the same tolerance for the positions they held in the 70's when I began to vote.  It used to be both parties were very closely aligned, now they are as polarized as they have been in nearly 100 years as each has moved further from the center.  I didn't realize this was a controversial statement, let alone anything short of what political experts appear to agree on.   I will remain a Democrat until I die, but it isn't the same party I registered for and that isn't necessarily a bad thing, but it is different.  My Rockefeller Republican friends say the same of their party.    At Christmas my daughter upon her return from school explained some of today's issues, times have changed more than I can ever remember.

[#UnleashSean]

Thank you.  Apparently my comments touched a nerve with some here, which is surprising.  Anyone that is my age knows the GOP has gone far right and our party to the left, especially in the last few years. 

The Washington Post, perhaps no better paper on US politics, wrote of this late last year using Pew data compiled since the mid 1990's.  The charts show the pull to the right and left by both parties, what is there to argue?  Shrug.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2017/10/05/the-remarkably-fast-liberalization-of-the-democratic-party/?utm_term=.3ba814bad8e6

Nate Silver led a discussion on this last month on five thirty eight. Neither party holds the same tolerance for the positions they held in the 70's when I began to vote.  It used to be both parties were very closely aligned, now they are as polarized as they have been in nearly 100 years as each has moved further from the center.  I didn't realize this was a controversial statement, let alone anything short of what political experts appear to agree on.   I will remain a Democrat until I die, but it isn't the same party I registered for and that isn't necessarily a bad thing, but it is different.  My Rockefeller Republican friends say the same of their party.    At Christmas my daughter upon her return from school explained some of today's issues, times have changed more than I can ever remember.

I wish there was more of a middle then a Libertarian. If I vote rep now I have to not believe in birthcontrol or health care. If I vote Dem I have to be for PC safe spaces and gun control.

[jesmu84]

Thank you.  Apparently my comments touched a nerve with some here, which is surprising.  Anyone that is my age knows the GOP has gone far right and our party to the left, especially in the last few years. 

The Washington Post, perhaps no better paper on US politics, wrote of this late last year using Pew data compiled since the mid 1990's.  The charts show the pull to the right and left by both parties, what is there to argue?  Shrug.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2017/10/05/the-remarkably-fast-liberalization-of-the-democratic-party/?utm_term=.3ba814bad8e6

Nate Silver led a discussion on this last month on five thirty eight. Neither party holds the same tolerance for the positions they held in the 70's when I began to vote.  It used to be both parties were very closely aligned, now they are as polarized as they have been in nearly 100 years as each has moved further from the center.  I didn't realize this was a controversial statement, let alone anything short of what political experts appear to agree on.   I will remain a Democrat until I die, but it isn't the same party I registered for and that isn't necessarily a bad thing, but it is different.  My Rockefeller Republican friends say the same of their party.    At Christmas my daughter upon her return from school explained some of today's issues, times have changed more than I can ever remember.

Do you have any qualms with the fact that it's your generation that led our nation to this political climate?

[#UnleashSean]

Do you have any qualms with the fact that it's your generation that led our nation to this political climate?

The generation after mine eats tide pods, mine created safe spaces and SJW. Am I to blame?

[Hards Alumni]

Thank you.  Apparently my comments touched a nerve with some here, which is surprising.  Anyone that is my age knows the GOP has gone far right and our party to the left, especially in the last few years. 

The Washington Post, perhaps no better paper on US politics, wrote of this late last year using Pew data compiled since the mid 1990's.  The charts show the pull to the right and left by both parties, what is there to argue?  Shrug.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2017/10/05/the-remarkably-fast-liberalization-of-the-democratic-party/?utm_term=.3ba814bad8e6

Nate Silver led a discussion on this last month on five thirty eight. Neither party holds the same tolerance for the positions they held in the 70's when I began to vote.  It used to be both parties were very closely aligned, now they are as polarized as they have been in nearly 100 years as each has moved further from the center.  I didn't realize this was a controversial statement, let alone anything short of what political experts appear to agree on.   I will remain a Democrat until I die, but it isn't the same party I registered for and that isn't necessarily a bad thing, but it is different.  My Rockefeller Republican friends say the same of their party.    At Christmas my daughter upon her return from school explained some of today's issues, times have changed more than I can ever remember.

You're Chicos.   Why won't you address this you sociopath?

You could not be more obvious.

[jesmu84]

The generation after mine eats tide pods, mine created safe spaces and SJW. Am I to blame?

Mature, "professional", career-politicians vs teenagers or coming-of-age young adults. Seems like a solid comparison.

Though, I will grant that perhaps I am making statements too early. Should wait to judge generations vs each other at the same time in their lives.

However, I didn't make any such comparisons. I simply asked about the results as we know them for the group in charge who has actually led to this situation. Thanks for the "whataboutism" though

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

The generation after mine eats tide pods, mine created safe spaces and SJW. Am I to blame?

What's wrong with safe spaces and SJWs?

[🏀]

What's wrong with safe spaces and SJWs?

It's overdone and used as a crutch or disability instead of it's intended goal.

[MU82]

Brother TAMU, a couple of points:

1) I was on the Dad (and Mom) consignment plan to Marquette. I was fortunate, not just that my parents could afford college for us but also that my parents understood the value of what they gave me and my brothers and sisters -- all while maintaining a strong giving commitment to Marquette and other agencies. They knew that for their children to be successful, college was essential. Marquette was selected because my Dad went to MU and had an incredible experience.

2) I'm not a big fan of cancelling student debt. But if you're going to do it, think about a social service commitment, such as the Peace Corps or VISTA, as a requirement. Yeah, affluent clowns could avoid this but doing the social service thing for many would expose them to things many haven't seen and make dent in some of America's social and political problems.

3) The world needs poets, philosophers, writers, sociologists, artists, musicians and whole lot of people who don't know the difference between software in their linen closets and software in their iPhones. But going into debt big enough to equal what one incurs to own a home is absurd. I don't care what your major is, taking on 50% of your probable first year salary in debt payments is not reasonable economic behavior and it means you're not going to be part of the middle class until you are 40. I agree, Brother TAMU, that counseling needs to address this.

4) I have an undergraduate Journalism major. Before I went off to try to be the next Woodward or Bernstein (Catholic style, of course), my father pulled me into our study and told me what a noble profession Journalism was. He then pointed to his and Mom's house, which was pretty nice (he did reasonably well) and asked, "do you want this?" He made it clear that while I would never want for day-to-day expenses (obviously, he had no clue what was coming in journalism), he also made it clear that I wasn't going to be rich. Six years after I was graduated Marquette, I enrolled in an MBA program and 11 years after I was graduated from Marquette, I left Journalism forever. Dad was right on the money and I'd rather eat than, as one Journalism professor called it, "pursue the truth!" Too many people don't have a Dad as wise as mine, though in fairness, my Dad never understood that Journalism could be a platform into something else.

I really like this post, dg (not that you were polling for opinions).

I very much like the idea of public service in exchange for canceling student debt.

Less fond of Deferment Don's plan to pay for his 9-figure tax cuts for billionaires, fortification of the Military Industrial Complex, wall (that Mexico was supposed to pay for), weak-arse infrastructure package and other schemes on the backs of college students, poor people and local municipalities.

[#UnleashSean]

What's wrong with safe spaces and SJWs?

I don't know how much your in the field compared to office on the Title 9 stuff, but safe spaces and SJW are becoming huge hindrances in young college students ability to perform.

An antedote: In Whitewater last semester a group of 27 students who protested for 3 days because not enough black professors taught in Whitewater asked for an extension on their exams because they didn't have enough time to study. It was granted.

Try that in the real world.

[GGGG]

An antedote: In Whitewater last semester a group of 27 students who protested for 3 days because not enough black professors taught in Whitewater asked for an extension on their exams because they didn't have enough time to study. It was granted.

That didn't happen.

[Eldon]

Huge difference ...

Bankruptcy law is set.  The lender understands this is a possibility going into the loan.

Cancellation is changing the rules after the fact.

Also in bankruptcy, the lender gets the opportunity to take the assets or tell you how to manage them.  Cancellation allows you to walk without consequences.

Nailed it.  This possibility is priced into the interest rate on the loan.  If we allow the possibility to walk away from a student loan, don't be surprised when student loan interest rates increase.

[GooooMarquette]

Do you have any qualms with the fact that it's your generation that led our nation to this political climate?

I always have concern when people try to blame something on a "generation" because every generation is a heterogeneous mix of different people, with different income and education levels, political and social beliefs, ethnic backgrounds and the like. I might strongly disagree with something that happened during my "generation," and may have done everything in my power to oppose it. Should I feel guilty because my "generation" allowed it to occur?

And even though researchers like to put "generations" in handy boxes like Baby Boomers, Gen X, Gen Y, a society is really just a continuous mix of people being born, dying, immigrating and emigrating, with no bright line demarcations.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Brother TAMU, a couple of points:

1) I was on the Dad (and Mom) consignment plan to Marquette. I was fortunate, not just that my parents could afford college for us but also that my parents understood the value of what they gave me and my brothers and sisters -- all while maintaining a strong giving commitment to Marquette and other agencies. They knew that for their children to be successful, college was essential. Marquette was selected because my Dad went to MU and had an incredible experience.

2) I'm not a big fan of cancelling student debt. But if you're going to do it, think about a social service commitment, such as the Peace Corps or VISTA, as a requirement. Yeah, affluent clowns could avoid this but doing the social service thing for many would expose them to things many haven't seen and make dent in some of America's social and political problems.

3) The world needs poets, philosophers, writers, sociologists, artists, musicians and whole lot of people who don't know the difference between software in their linen closets and software in their iPhones. But going into debt big enough to equal what one incurs to own a home is absurd. I don't care what your major is, taking on 50% of your probable first year salary in debt payments is not reasonable economic behavior and it means you're not going to be part of the middle class until you are 40. I agree, Brother TAMU, that counseling needs to address this.

4) I have an undergraduate Journalism major. Before I went off to try to be the next Woodward or Bernstein (Catholic style, of course), my father pulled me into our study and told me what a noble profession Journalism was. He then pointed to his and Mom's house, which was pretty nice (he did reasonably well) and asked, "do you want this?" He made it clear that while I would never want for day-to-day expenses (obviously, he had no clue what was coming in journalism), he also made it clear that I wasn't going to be rich. Six years after I was graduated Marquette, I enrolled in an MBA program and 11 years after I was graduated from Marquette, I left Journalism forever. Dad was right on the money and I'd rather eat than, as one Journalism professor called it, "pursue the truth!" Too many people don't have a Dad as wise as mine, though in fairness, my Dad never understood that Journalism could be a platform into something else.

I am a big fan of the Public Service requirement for loan forgiveness. In fact, my wife and I have been planning on taking advantage of PSLF (Public Service Loan Forgiveness program). It requires 10 years of public service and on time payments of student loans in exchange for complete debt forgiveness. Unfortunately, it has been in DeVos' crosshairs since she got the job and Trump's current proposal for the 2019 budget eliminates it entirely. This is is the first year that people are set to become eligible to apply for the forgiveness and now after 10 years of working towards this it may be pulled out from under them.

[Jay Bee]

Don't buy stuff you can't afford, hey?

[#UnleashSean]

I am a big fan of the Public Service requirement for loan forgiveness. In fact, my wife and I have been planning on taking advantage of PSLF (Public Service Loan Forgiveness program). It requires 10 years of public service and on time payments of student loans in exchange for complete debt forgiveness. Unfortunately, it has been in DeVos' crosshairs since she got the job and Trump's current proposal for the 2019 budget eliminates it entirely. This is is the first year that people are set to become eligible to apply for the forgiveness and now after 10 years of working towards this it may be pulled out from under them.

Would they not all be grandfathered in?

[Eldon]

I am a big fan of the Public Service requirement for loan forgiveness. In fact, my wife and I have been planning on taking advantage of PSLF (Public Service Loan Forgiveness program). It requires 10 years of public service and on time payments of student loans in exchange for complete debt forgiveness. Unfortunately, it has been in DeVos' crosshairs since she got the job and Trump's current proposal for the 2019 budget eliminates it entirely. This is is the first year that people are set to become eligible to apply for the forgiveness and now after 10 years of working towards this it may be pulled out from under them.

I hope that you haven't made too many plans around this. 

Even before DeVos came to power, people were having problems with the program, e.g., the loan servicer saying "oh, you didn't fill out Document X, it turns out that you have to start all over, i.e., your past three years of payments don't count toward the PSLF."

If I have time later today, I will try to post a link or two (though they should be toward the top of a simple Google search)

[jesmu84]

I hope that you haven't made too many plans around this. 

Even before DeVos came to power, people were having problems with the program, e.g., the loan servicer saying "oh, you didn't fill out Document X, it turns out that you have to start all over, i.e., your past three years of payments don't count toward the PSLF."

If I have time later today, I will try to post a link or two (though they should be toward the top of a simple Google search)

Of course. Just like I'm sure the work welfare requirements ( or other work related assistance programs) will function. Free labor and no cost.

[Benny B]

Question.... how many of you can explain the concept of "moral hazard" without a Google?

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Would they not all be grandfathered in?

Nope. You can only apply after you have completed the 10 years. It was created 10 years ago so this is the first year that people are applying. I have checked recently, but last I heard DeVos had yet to approve any application and has been delaying.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

I hope that you haven't made too many plans around this. 

Even before DeVos came to power, people were having problems with the program, e.g., the loan servicer saying "oh, you didn't fill out Document X, it turns out that you have to start all over, i.e., your past three years of payments don't count toward the PSLF."

If I have time later today, I will try to post a link or two (though they should be toward the top of a simple Google search)

We are aware of all of this. We've been keeping up to date on it and making sure every i is dotted and t is crossed. In the end, it will likely be moot if it gets taken off the books entirely.